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therattle posted:There was a thread about WW2 I think here on SA where someone was discussing the terrible industrial planning of the Germans. The example was the Luftwaffe, where there were something like 27 different machine guns used across the fleet, and even guns of the same calibre sometimes required different ammo. This was compared to the US, where across the Army and Air Force (and probably Navy and Marines) there were two calibres with standard ammo: .30 and .50 - allowing for much greater efficiency in production, maintenance, supply etc. The German industrial war machine was splintered and competitive, leading to a lot of inefficiency. Yep, and that type of standardization often went across the allies as well. If there is one martial art perfected by America above all others it’s logistics. People complaining about America “showing up late” like that one guy earlier miss the point that the US was involved in the war almost from the beginning and without lend/lease the British and the Soviets would have much more difficult time. For a good period after Dunkirk, Britain was an army with almost no heavy weapons and equipment.
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Jul 20, 2020 19:57
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GolfHole posted:this is a cool story about the nazis getting owned by a retired guy, some kids, and 40-year old torpedos THIS VIDEO IS SPONSORED BY WORLD OF WARSHIPS BLITZ YOU loving LOVE WORLD OF WARSHIPS BLITZ PLAY WORLD OF WARSHIPS BLITZ BUY OUR MICROTRANSACTIONS YOU FUCKERRRRRRRR!
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Jul 20, 2020 19:59
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I don't want to buy world of workshops
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Jul 20, 2020 20:06
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Strumpie posted:THIS VIDEO IS SPONSORED BY WORLD OF WARSHIPS BLITZ YOU loving LOVE WORLD OF WARSHIPS BLITZ PLAY WORLD OF WARSHIPS BLITZ BUY OUR MICROTRANSACTIONS YOU FUCKERRRRRRRR! that was the worst part about ww2
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Jul 20, 2020 20:29
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Derpies posted:The uniform break down was amazing and one of the best things I've read on this forum and just makes you lol at Nazis even more Those are by Cessna in one of the old A/T milhist threads. The general gist is that german uniforms were designed to look good, which is bad for a combat uniform. First of all, they were supremely overengineered. A german uniform took more cloth and vastly more time to sew than anyone else's, with a whole bunch of unneccessary bits that would get in your way and delay you. Secondly, they weren't comfortable in combat, being overly tight and designed to make you look tall and slim where you want something baggy. You also get dumb poo poo like certain accessories (canteen, gas mask holder, etc) worn on your body being bare metal rather than covered in cloth, meaning a german squad on the move sounds like they're wearing a tin-can alarm. German helmets were similar. Allied armies used a single piece of steel, pressed it into a uniform size, and stuck an adjustable liner in it so it would fit most any soldier. Germans required multiple artisanal steps per custom-fitted helmet. Because you see, one-size-fits all might make the particularly short or large soldiers look less good. This runs all throughout the german military. Like, iirc, the turret of the famous Panther: the gunner had no open sights. He only had massive magnification. So instead of acquiring a target and then aiming, the commander has to meticulously guide him onto the target. The driver also has to help, because switching gears is required to rotate the turret, iirc.
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Jul 20, 2020 21:00
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I was listening to an interview of Tom Hanks by Dan Carlin from Hardcore History about Greyhound, the WW2 movie he wrote and starred in. Hanks seemed like a good guy who genuinely loves history, but he said a few things that were really iffy that Carlin never challenged. One thing I remember Hanks saying is that after the fall of France, no one believed that Germany could possibly be stopped until the Battle of Stalingrad. Exactly how many believed that I'm not sure, but by the Battle of Stalingrad the U.S. had officially declared war on the Axis powers and of course the USSR had joined the Allies. Both Churchill and Stalin were assured that Germany would eventually lose. Also, is Greyhound any good?
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Jul 20, 2020 21:26
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yeah but all the germans did look like tall handsome boys whereas the allies looked like dumpy men in sack cloth, literally. can't put a price on being fabulous. 
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Jul 20, 2020 21:26
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I always liked how Red Army guys looked like they were wearing pajamas. Looks comfortable as hell. Ive actually heard Canadian uniforms were the most comfortable. US ones looked pretty functional too. But yea, German uniforms looking good but actually being terrible is pretty par for the course. As I said earlier, Nazism and fascism in general is all about pagentry.
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Jul 20, 2020 21:32
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twistedmentat posted:Yea, but they were saving planes for Barbarossa even then. The Germans never committed their full power against Britain, becuase he was more focused on the USSR. Well I think the date of Well's death is debatable but historians give numerous dates and I think the 1928 date is the one supported by the most evidence. Regardless the German failure to occupy Britain owed far more to their lack of ships to ferry their planes across the English Channel - which yes was partly due to much of the German navy being diverted to the eastern front.
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Jul 20, 2020 22:16
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:Those are by Cessna in one of the old A/T milhist threads. First Gen Tiger Ausf Bs had a fancy turret design that deflected incoming fire downwards into the relatively unarmored deck of the tank  I remember reading a post or article about how Hitler was obsessed with being taken down by a military coup to the point that he intentionally sowed discord in his own army and sabotaged their efficiency in order to prevent it from happening. The example given was that Goring was given 200k ground troops to command - not airborne infantry, not mechanized infantry - just, like, 200k dudes that worked for the air force in an infantry capacity, rather than having them serving in the army where they could fight in a combined arms capacity with the tanks and other support vehicles the army had access to. He did this specifically because he trusted Goring more than any of the generals in the Heer and wanted him to be able to push Hitler's agenda over less the less political guys in the Heer who, while still being Nazis, were still far more likely to say "hey maybe I shouldn't let all my dudes die because it would make for a cool narrative about how noble my dudes were and savage the bad guys are" Also Douglas MacArthur is probably the single most overrated general in modern military history, even more than Rommel maybe, the dude loving sucked and was bad at everything
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Jul 20, 2020 22:35
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Funky See Funky Do posted:Well I think the date of Well's death is debatable but historians give numerous dates and I think the 1928 date is the one supported by the most evidence. Regardless the German failure to occupy Britain owed far more to their lack of ships to ferry their planes across the English Channel - which yes was partly due to much of the German navy being diverted to the eastern front. i'm just glad he finished Citizen Kane before he died. also planes fly over the channel.
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Jul 20, 2020 22:42
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That brings me to a fun little entertainment tidbit. HG Wells actually did pass away before he finished writing the screenplay for Citizen Kane and many of the films most iconic scenes were latter additions by his nephew Orson.
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Jul 20, 2020 22:49
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Kevin DuBrow posted:
Well the US was still an unknown quantity militarily, especially in Europe. The only major US land victory was on Wake Island and there was still the assumption that the Japanese were a second-tier army (because racism). As well the Germans summer offensive was still fairly successful up until Stalingrad. With the benefit of hindsight we can see that obviously the entrance of the US in the war and the slowly stiffening USSR resistance made a German victory highly unlikely, however at the time there was still a lot of uncertainty and fear among the Allies.
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Jul 20, 2020 22:55
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You don't fully realize how awful the Nazis were until you realize that even in the face of an unstoppable Russian avalanche charging toward them with the fury of a thousand suns, they still carefully packed up and moved concentration camps and their inmates further west. They did not for instance go "Oh poo poo, everyone grab military stuff and run back to Germany, just leave the prisoners and stuff here because we have no time! Holocaust schmolocaust! Survival first!" Nope, they deemed it important to pack away the transport their genocide with them even when under existential threat from millions of angry Slavs.
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Jul 20, 2020 22:56
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0ZlMXkzUqI
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Jul 20, 2020 23:03
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Kevin DuBrow posted:I was listening to an interview of Tom Hanks by Dan Carlin from Hardcore History about Greyhound, the WW2 movie he wrote and starred in. Hanks seemed like a good guy who genuinely loves history, but he said a few things that were really iffy that Carlin never challenged. I listened to Hanks being interviewed by Conan O'Brien (definite recommend both are hilarious) and yeah Hanks knows a lot but a few of his facts weren't quite right. He mentioned that same idea that before Stalingrad (concluded in Feb 1943) the Axis hadn't enduring a major defeat, somehow forgetting Midway was in June 1942. Some more stuff that's interesting: -Japan placed a low priority on feeding their troops properly and they were expected to prepare their own rice each day and forage in the field. This led to devastating troop losses from malnutrition especially at Guadalcanal. Contrast to the US supply chain, that even put ice cream making machines on ships. -Hundreds of elephants perished on the Burma campaign where the were used as porters by the British. -Germans greatly preferred fighting American/British troops on the Western front as they didn't commonly use night attacks, as had been routine practice on the Eastern Front.
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Jul 20, 2020 23:05
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Strumpie posted:yeah but all the germans did look like tall handsome boys whereas the allies looked like dumpy men in sack cloth, literally. They actually started subsidizing school lunch because of how malnourished all the WW2 conscripts were.
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Jul 20, 2020 23:09
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It's good that the Russians saved Europe and that America cockblocked them from also conquering Europe
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Jul 20, 2020 23:11
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Chillgamesh posted:First Gen Tiger Ausf Bs had a fancy turret design that deflected incoming fire downwards into the relatively unarmored deck of the tank MacArthur: https://youtu.be/0XZ9-muhi7A
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Jul 20, 2020 23:13
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Zzulu posted:It's good that the Russians saved Europe and that America cockblocked them from also conquering Europe Based on what happened to the countries that did fall under soviet control post war, I don't think that was a bad thing. Also Germans looking fabulous makes me think of Sam Rockwell at the end of Jojo Rabbit.
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Jul 20, 2020 23:33
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No it was a good thing obviously If America hadn't been there to go "heeey there bud, hold yer horsies there bud"  to the soviet union I'm sure they would have seized the moment and just rolled over Europe
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Jul 20, 2020 23:38
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Everyone let's argue about who was good, the US or the USSR
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Jul 20, 2020 23:55
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Edgar Allen Ho posted:Everyone let's argue about who was good, the US or the USSR Obviously the United States and the Soviet Republic were stronger together than after they split up.
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Jul 21, 2020 00:02
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I do like how the Soviets produced more tanks in a month than the Germans produced in the entire war.
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Jul 21, 2020 00:12
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I'm not real sure painting a sign that says 'tank' and making three guys run with it counts
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Jul 21, 2020 00:53
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTBYksnK7N0 i like that hitler is the punchline to every joke in the english language. what would we do without you hitler.
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Jul 21, 2020 00:58
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Still have grandparents probably
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Jul 21, 2020 00:59
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You know what was great about ww2? A lot of nazis died.
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Jul 21, 2020 01:00
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Big Beef City posted:I'm not real sure painting a sign that says 'tank' and making three guys run with it counts Yea the Germans were down to nothing by the end of the war.
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Jul 21, 2020 01:02
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brown shirts? more like brown pants!
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Jul 21, 2020 01:15
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Kinda crazy that we have all these movies about soldiers shooting each other when so many people died from a going to work and having a bomb fall on their head
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Jul 21, 2020 01:17
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Funky See Funky Do posted:Well I think the date of Well's death is debatable but historians give numerous dates and I think the 1928 date is the one supported by the most evidence. Here’s HG Wells talking to Orson Welles in 1940. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=i83IJuaB9DA
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Jul 21, 2020 05:00
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PTSDeedly Do posted:Kinda crazy that we have all these movies about soldiers shooting each other when so many people died from a going to work and having a bomb fall on their head Now now strategic bombing was fairly innacurate it was more like a bomb hit you while you were just existing.
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Jul 21, 2020 05:15
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Kevin DuBrow posted:I was listening to an interview of Tom Hanks by Dan Carlin from Hardcore History about Greyhound, the WW2 movie he wrote and starred in. Hanks seemed like a good guy who genuinely loves history, but he said a few things that were really iffy that Carlin never challenged. i mean its easy with hindsight to say germany was hosed and i am sure some of the upper echelon dudes knew germany was probably hosed even than. but no one was sure. Grape posted:You don't fully realize how awful the Nazis were until you realize that even in the face of an unstoppable Russian avalanche charging toward them with the fury of a thousand suns, they still carefully packed up and moved concentration camps and their inmates further west. its because that was part of their whole war aim. https://www.amazon.com/Black-Earth-Holocaust-History-Warning/dp/1101903473 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Pmgs_CWxMHc
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Jul 21, 2020 05:17
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Dapper_Swindler posted:i mean its easy with hindsight to say germany was hosed and i am sure some of the upper echelon dudes knew germany was probably hosed even than. but no one was sure. I'm aware. But that wasn't the war aim in the late late late hours of the war. The war aim there was RUN, gently caress ME RUN JESUS RUN, FIVE BILLION ANGRY RUSSIANS, gently caress gently caress gently caress poo poo rear end. Generally at that stage of things you don't focus on stretch goals and long term results so much as loving HAUL rear end JESUS gently caress SLAVS EVERYWHERE SON OF gently caress, at that point a rout is occurring and you drop everything not essential to survival and at best hope to fall back to a line or something. Generally, but the Nazis did not forget to keep genociding.
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Jul 21, 2020 05:29
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I think the worst thing about world war 2 was how long it took to respawn and no cool kill streaks. The graphics were pretty poo poo and the game play was... eh. Cold war dlc was lame but what do you expect i guess. IGN still gives it a 9/10.
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Jul 21, 2020 05:42
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Servoret posted:Here’s HG Wells talking to Orson Welles in 1940. The thing is as amateur historians it's easy to be swayed by whatever the most recent bit of evidence you saw was. So sure, it's interesting but what context does it exist in? As I said there are numerous somewhat plausible dates for Wells' death but I think that the preponderance of evidence shows that Wells most likely died in 1928.
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Jul 21, 2020 05:56
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Funky See Funky Do posted:The thing is as amateur historians it's easy to be swayed by whatever the most recent bit of evidence you saw was. So sure, it's interesting but what context does it exist in? As I said there are numerous somewhat plausible dates for Wells' death but I think that the preponderance of evidence shows that Wells most likely died in 1928. What is this bit from?
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Jul 21, 2020 07:44
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Dapper_Swindler posted:i mean its easy with hindsight to say germany was hosed and i am sure some of the upper echelon dudes knew germany was probably hosed even than. but no one was sure. that lecture is eye opening. highly recommend a listen at 1.75 speed. "People can disguise for themselves that it's (a conflict) about survival, when it is in fact a (conflict) about standard of living"
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Jul 21, 2020 07:59
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imagine being a farmer in rural germany 1933 and rolling up to one of hitlers rallies for the first time. hoo boy whats all this excitement about, cant wait to meet this hitler fella. gee thats a lot of red and black, seems a little aggresive huh guys oh no
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Jul 21, 2020 09:56
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