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While the Nazis are gathering clout on Twitter by playing the clown ... Here's two german studies on covid: https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamacardiology/fullarticle/2768916 https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamacardiology/fullarticle/2768914 quote:The first study, published Monday in the Journal of the American Medical Association Cardiology, looked at the cardiac MRIs of 100 relatively young patients who had recovered from COVID-19 and compared them to MRIs of 100 similar people who had not contracted the disease. Two-thirds of the patients recovered at home.
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 13:23 |
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# ? Jun 8, 2024 07:30 |
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AndreTheGiantBoned posted:He mistook Fahr-Spur-Ende for Farhrspurende, as in Flüchtende or Lehrende I... I couldn’t believe that was true.
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 14:03 |
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I can't wait for the slow collapse of society and people's hearts just giving out randomly, just like they did metaphorically already, really poetic no, I am not trying to be funny
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 15:50 |
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Yeah a lot of the long term Covid stuff sounds creepy as hell, like old wounds/scars/broken bones flaring back up and poo poo.
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 18:16 |
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All this new information makes the US' decision to go full Plague Nation slightly questionable
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 19:30 |
MonikaTSarn posted:I find this study questionable. How did they not mention at all the substandard living conditions the workers were in, or the cantina video ? Maybe workers on the same shift together were eating together as well, were being transported in to small vans to their homes together ? Researchers posted:Positive rates were statistically significant only for a single shared apartment and associated carpool (a1 and c3), and a shared bedroom (r5). The fact that 5 of 7 members in a1/c3, and 2 out of 3 members in r5 have fixed work stations within the 8m area (Supplementary Table S3), however, suggests that high infection rates in these units primarily reflect the number of group members who work in close proximity of the index case, rather than resulting from independent infection chains within the units themselves. Researchers posted:Description of housing conditions, work area conditions, and working conditions DTurtle fucked around with this message at 20:05 on Jul 28, 2020 |
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 20:02 |
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I don't want to spend too much time on this post, since I don't really want to spend time on statistics even when I'm getting paid for it, but: the methodology of that study is insanely noisy. I'm not the biggest fan of p-values to begin with, but I hate it when people report "significant" results when n = 3. Like, look at this table: That's the split by apartment / carpool / etc. group. Look at r5, their one "significant" result. That's a sample size of three. Except there are repeated measurements (which makes everything a lot worse, although with a sample size of three it doesn't matter - it's all noise anyway). And you don't even know what the baseline for each group is, because: quote:Similarly, for each shared unit in Fig. 3C and Supplementary Table With sample sizes that low, and overlapping multiple comparisons (that they appear to not even have tried to adjust for), p-values are completely, absolutely meaningless. They always are, but in this specific example, they are straight garbage. My advice, take the raw data (which is mostly meaningless because of the data protection issues - you don't know which positive tests occurs twice or more times in which specific groups) and ignore any significance thresholds. The proximity data from Figure 3a is the one thing in this paper I would say is useful (but it's also something we already knew). Figure 3c is (3b too, but that's such horseshit I didn't even try to parse it)
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 20:52 |
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GABA ghoul posted:All this new information makes the US' decision to go full Plague Nation slightly questionable Millions of people trying to cope with their chronic damage under the conditions of the US healthcare system is going to drive the next wave of deaths of despair.
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 21:00 |
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aphid_licker posted:Millions of people trying to cope with their chronic damage under the conditions of the US healthcare system is going to drive the next wave of deaths of despair. Well, for the moment this is the wall the USA is driving straight at. Not having a house.
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 21:18 |
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Mithaldu posted:Well, for the moment this is the wall the USA is driving straight at. Holy moly I see pitchforks in the future
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 21:41 |
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Can't vote without address, right?
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 21:55 |
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Mithaldu posted:Well, for the moment this is the wall the USA is driving straight at. What's the percentage of renter vs owner households in the US?
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 22:07 |
Smirr posted:That's the split by apartment / carpool / etc. group. Look at r5, their one "significant" result. That's a sample size of three. Except there are repeated measurements (which makes everything a lot worse, although with a sample size of three it doesn't matter - it's all noise anyway). And you don't even know what the baseline for each group is, because: However, 3B doesn't look that bad? Its a comparison of the actual distribution of infection vs distance in comparison to the expected distribution if distance didn't play a role. Mithaldu posted:Well, for the moment this is the wall the USA is driving straight at. Wipfmetz posted:So "37% AK" means "37% of renter households in Alaska are at risk of eviction"? DTurtle fucked around with this message at 22:18 on Jul 28, 2020 |
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 22:15 |
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Wipfmetz posted:So "37% AK" means "37% of renter households in Alaska are at risk of eviction"? Good question. 26.83% - 46.2% according to https://www.move.org/states-with-highest-lowest-owner-occupied-homes/ With a complete Milchmädchenrechnung this gives me 16% of the US population threatened by eviction.
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 22:18 |
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DTurtle posted:Hmm, it would be interesting to know the "normal" numbers for that (pre-Corona). I can imagine it was already quite high. https://www.cnbc.com/2020/07/27/how-the-eviction-crisis-will-impact-each-state.html quote:In 2016, there were 2.3 million evictions, Pollock said. “There could be that many evictions in August,” he said. Which, if you guesstimate 4 people per household makes 9.2 million people evicted, which would be 2.5% of the population. Things definitely look worse in that picture than in real numbers i think.
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 22:20 |
Hmm, looking here: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2018/04/07/upshot/millions-of-eviction-records-a-sweeping-new-look-at-housing-in-america.html The highest cities they had there had a eviction filing right of more than 30% and an actual eviction judgment rate of a bit more than 10%.
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 22:27 |
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Wanna hold every smug idiot's face from 2016 who yammered about how it doesn't matter who is president or who controls Congress(~they are all the same~) into that huge pile of poo poo. Probably still dreaming about that sweet gay space communism that they'll get through accelerationism when the much more likely outcome is a decade of semi-apocalypse and then a pivot to open mega-authoritarianism, ultra-corruption and hyper-capitalism like Russia in the 90s. Or even just straight up decent into some hosed up nationalist totalitarianism à la Weimar.
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 22:37 |
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GABA ghoul posted:Wanna hold every smug idiot's face from 2016 who yammered about how it doesn't matter who is president or who controls Congress(~they are all the same~) into that huge pile of poo poo. lots of posters in c spam who refuse to vote for biden
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 22:49 |
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GABA ghoul posted:Wanna hold every smug idiot's face from 2016 who yammered about how it doesn't matter who is president or who controls Congress(~they are all the same~) into that huge pile of poo poo. Take a good look at what the dems are doing right now and say that again lol. The functional difference would've been an earlier moratorium reporting on the protests.
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 22:49 |
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GABA ghoul posted:Wanna hold every smug idiot's face from 2016 who yammered about how it doesn't matter who is president or who controls Congress(~they are all the same~) into that huge pile of poo poo. oliwan posted:lots of posters in c spam who refuse to vote for biden Meanwhile some lefties online: https://twitter.com/HappyShiiba/status/1288060070115176449
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 23:08 |
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Name an evil thing the US does. I guarantee you it will continue under Biden, only with more crocodile tears.
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 23:49 |
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I compared with Germany, in which there are 40 million Haushalte, 47% of which are rented, and read a piece of news where it says that 1.6 million are facing this issue. So about 8%. Lol usa
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# ? Jul 28, 2020 23:50 |
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Mr. Lobe posted:Name an evil thing the US does. I guarantee you it will continue under Biden, only with more crocodile tears. The USA tried to gently caress around with the korean peninsula in massively inept ways. Wouldn't have happened under Biden. The USA worsened relationships with Cuba. Wouldn't have happened under Biden. The USA betrayed the Kurds and singlehandedly kickstarted a genocide. That absolutely wouldn't have happened under Biden. (And i sure hope you wouldn't be the type of person to claim that what the USA did to the Kurds wasn't a massive crime.) If you're curious about such things, hit up @DylanBurns1776. Mithaldu fucked around with this message at 00:36 on Jul 29, 2020 |
# ? Jul 29, 2020 00:32 |
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Note that it would've been Clinton, not Biden, in your examples. Also I think you shouldn't underestimate the ability of any US president to be completely terrible when it comes to foreign policy.
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 08:07 |
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If history had started in 2016 for you this might’ve been surprising, but strategic allies stop being allies when the strategy changes.
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 08:10 |
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elbkaida posted:Note that it would've been Clinton, not Biden, in your examples. Also I think you shouldn't underestimate the ability of any US president to be completely terrible when it comes to foreign policy. Yes, and theoretically i could win the lottery too. Similar probabilities regarding these specific cases. Healbot posted:If history had started in 2016 for you this mightve been surprising, but strategic allies stop being allies when the strategy changes.
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 08:20 |
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Mithaldu posted:Is this your opinion on the Rojava situation? Isn't it accurate? The previous strategy was to contain Assad/Russia by keeping the Kurds semi-independent. Trump loves Russia so the strategy changed, and the Kurds ceased to be strategic allies, so they were left to fend for themselves. I don't think that would have happened under Clinton. This nicely sidesteps the issue whether Clinton would have been fine with genocide in general.
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 08:32 |
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Mr. Lobe posted:Name an evil thing the US does. I guarantee you it will continue under Biden, only with more crocodile tears. And if I do, will you stop doing that bit? Probably not, so what's the point? e: eh, what the hell: Taking the second largest CO2 emitter in the world out of the Paris Climate Agreement
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 08:40 |
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DTurtle posted:However, 3B doesn't look that bad? Its a comparison of the actual distribution of infection vs distance in comparison to the expected distribution if distance didn't play a role. My side beef is "-log10(p-val)" (also in graph 3c) - as far as I can tell, this serves only to turn large downward outliers into even larger upward outliers optically. This might be common practice in their fied, but I find it extremely My main beef is their use of p-values and/or an extremely uninteresting null hypothesis (we know that having someone with covid cough within 1 m of you is more dangerous than within 100 m of you - yes, at some point you do need to show this, but the null hypothesis that distance does not play a role is refutable by eyeball by looking at graph 3a, and by common sense). Specifically, they create the dangerous (and false) at-a-glance takeaway that, since the results for 2-4 m distance are not significant, that those distances are not dangerous. They are, though, it's just that n = 1 for a distance of 2 m. I don't have an issue with the upper part of graph 3b - it shows that covid rates are higher than expected at closer distances. That's interesting information. The lower part of graph 3b only adds the additional information for which distances they have large enough sample sizes for those results to be "significant". But people who are not that used to handling p-values (journalists, for example, or scientists) might see the "significant" arrows and think "most dangerous part". And yes, I'm aware that many researchers jump through p-value hoops because editors ask for them, but this is a pre-print and the authors appear pretty convinced by what they're doing.
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 08:42 |
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Torrannor posted:Isn't it accurate? The previous strategy was to contain Assad/Russia by keeping the Kurds semi-independent. Trump loves Russia so the strategy changed, and the Kurds ceased to be strategic allies, so they were left to fend for themselves. I don't think that would have happened under Clinton. And as for Healbot's post, they're vague-posting, so it's really really hard to tell what they actually mean, but to respond to your interpretation: I seriously doubt calling what trump was doing a strategy is merited. Also uh, Turkey and Assad were the ones being contained. Russia actually somewhat stepped in to dampen the worst after the Trump decided keeping 50 soldiers in key locations was too much effort. GABA ghoul posted:And if I do, will you stop doing that bit? Probably not, so what's the point?
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 08:48 |
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I'm sure a democrat would've turned 180°, colluded with Iranian hard liners, and scuppered the JCPOA they just negotiated. 100% sure.
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 09:20 |
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Mithaldu posted:The USA tried to gently caress around with the korean peninsula in massively inept ways. Wouldn't have happened under Biden. Not sure why we are doing this in the Germany thread but loving around in inept ways in the Korean peninsula and betraying the Kurds is basically in the job description. Those are some of the worst examples you could pick, because not doing those things would be a departure from longstanding US policy. And what was the supposed problem in Korea? The South tried to get a peace initiative going and Trump got a few photo ops in. Doesn't seem to have gone anywhere, but no one is really worse off for it than before the start of history (2016) and treating it as in anyway equal to the Kurdish betrayal is weird to me. You could have brought up Iran though. That escalation probably wouldn't have happened under Clinton or Biden. Probably, because hostility towards Iran is extremely ingrained in the US security apparatus. Biden also probably wouldn't have advised to drink bleach.
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 09:35 |
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Gotta admit i have the feeling you straightup just didn't grok the flow of the convo. That first sentence alone is just ... nonsensical on its own AND in context. And pretending i treated it as equal is just ... feels like you had a conclusion about my post you wanted to be true really hard. -- In any case, people who think all of the bad stuff trump did will also be done by biden and worse ... they're big 'ol dummies.
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 09:45 |
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Mithaldu posted:And pretending i treated it as equal is just ... feels like you had a conclusion about my post you wanted to be true really hard. Yeah, sorry that was uncalled for and I blame the lack of coffee. But the Korea situation really shouldn't be brought up in a line with the reescalation against Cuba and Iran, and the betrayal of the Kurds. Or the genocide in Yemen that is somehow never brought up. The discourse on this has been utterly deranged. Trump's initial support of the ROK's is literally the only thing in his whole presidency I would give him some limited credit for. (Credit for not getting in the way, but of course as soon as he forgot about it the US went back into sabotage mode.) Yet by the way the Trump-Kim photo op is talked about it's the Molotov-Ribbentrop pact.
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 10:11 |
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Thanks. And in general i agree there, my post mainly was that way because i'm not universally educated in those matters, and sorted some i thought of off the top of my head roughly from dumbest to horriblest.
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 10:46 |
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oliwan posted:lots of posters in c spam who refuse to vote for biden counterpoint: biden would be doing the same poo poo domestically (but rachel maddow would twist herself into knots explaining how it's better because he's not controlled by the perfidious russkies), and in terms of foreign policy he'd probably actually be worse because he'd be trying to rebuild us hegemony instead of destroying it as rapidly as possible like trump
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 11:21 |
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Counter-counterpoint: When your Americanized "leftism" makes you defend Donald Trump you should probably consume less internet for a while.
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 13:58 |
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Biden is garbage + if he hadn't run and the conservative Democrats hadn't gone Voltron, we'd be looking at President Bernie Sanders in November
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 15:07 |
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Mr. Lobe posted:Name an evil thing the US does. I guarantee you it will continue under Biden, only with more crocodile tears. Because they influence what's considered "normal" or "acceptable", and it does induce the cost of maintaining excuses to the "evil things". Wipfmetz fucked around with this message at 18:10 on Jul 29, 2020 |
# ? Jul 29, 2020 17:37 |
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# ? Jun 8, 2024 07:30 |
Sounds like a fair take. For me the most important part of that paper is simply the evidence that there is nothing magical about 2m (or 1.5m in the UK, I think). Depending on the circumstances, Sars-Cov-2 will travel with the air flow, spread with the air flow, and infect with the air flow - even over larger distances.
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# ? Jul 29, 2020 18:45 |