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super sweet best pal posted:Why not just have different rules/stats for mech vs mech and mech vs unmeched characters like they did with the fire plane whales in the sun campaign? Probably because learning a whole new set of rules of how things interact with each other is difficult enough for the GM, but to get your players to do it is usually like pulling teeth. It's not too difficult, you just have to calculate things once per level, which isn't hard. It's a lot of information going into it, and they'll probably streamline it once the playtest is over. The new Nanocyte class looks amazing for Starfinder, and my PF2 Advanced Players Guide just shipped! lots of fun stuff going on.
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Jul 28, 2020 17:32
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Arivia posted:For 1e start with the revised and compiled Rise of the Runelords. For 2e probably Age of Ashes. Pathfinder rotates between one standard and one weird adventure path, so for 2e your options are Age of Ashes (ancient magic, dragons, standard); Extinction Curse (circuses and dinosaurs, weird), and Agents of Edgewatch (play city police, was supposed to be standard but is really really awkward to play with everything going on right now). It's funny how the next two APs are totally breaking that pattern with the next one being a dungeon crawl (normal) followed by a martial arts tournament (weird)
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Jul 28, 2020 20:54
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Blockhouse posted:It's funny how the next two APs are totally breaking that pattern with the next one being a dungeon crawl (normal) followed by a martial arts tournament (weird) Aren't these two also extra unusual in that they're both 3 volume APs instead of 6?
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Jul 28, 2020 21:15
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Starfinder is Very Bad, and without even looking its implementation of mechs is basically guaranteed to suck, with the only thing being that if it had more like this from the beginning it would have at least been more interesting. Now that I have looked, the Starfinder team have really outdone themselves this time, I'm actually amazed at how bad that is
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Jul 28, 2020 22:05
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EVGA Longoria posted:Aren't these two also extra unusual in that they're both 3 volume APs instead of 6? Yeah. Not sure how to feel about that.
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Jul 28, 2020 22:34
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Starfinder's done the three-volume AP a bit and it seems to have been popular. Note the next two are set up so that your characters can do all six in order: the dungeon crawl from 1-10 and then the martial arts tournament from 11-20.
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Jul 28, 2020 22:49
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Arivia posted:and then the martial arts tournament from 11-20. Huh, maybe I should give Starfinder another chance. Starfinder is such a good idea, but after playing Pathfinder 2e (which I love) it seems so much of a missed opportunity mechanically. Still, anything I can pitch as "Mass Effect, but also d&d" is something I can get people to try out if the mood strikes me.
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Jul 30, 2020 04:04
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Lord_Hambrose posted:Huh, maybe I should give Starfinder another chance. We're talking about PF2e with the tournament
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Jul 30, 2020 04:54
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doubleposting because APG is out! Lost Omens Legends isn't yet because they broke the PDF purchasing link look at this loving kobold! 
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Jul 30, 2020 08:36
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APG is rad, Marshal is rad, it's all rad
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Jul 30, 2020 17:50
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Blockhouse posted:doubleposting because APG is out! Lost Omens Legends isn't yet because they broke the PDF purchasing link I'm not a fan of the 2e Kobold look. Too much like brightly colored Gila Monsters and less Dragon-lings.
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Jul 30, 2020 19:33
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Kvantum posted:I'm not a fan of the 2e Kobold look. Too much like brightly colored Gila Monsters and less Dragon-lings.
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Jul 30, 2020 19:40
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Kvantum posted:I'm not a fan of the 2e Kobold look. Too much like brightly colored Gila Monsters and less Dragon-lings. I prefer it to the ones that look like scaly dogs, not sure if that's a recent trend or not. 
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Jul 30, 2020 19:52
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Blockhouse posted:We're talking about PF2e with the tournament Heartbreakering
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Jul 30, 2020 21:34
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GetDunked posted:I prefer it to the ones that look like scaly dogs, not sure if that's a recent trend or not. Yeah I much rather have the PF2e designs than attempts to make them look like tiny dragonborn Blockhouse fucked around with this message at 21:53 on Jul 30, 2020 |
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Jul 30, 2020 21:49
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I like the Pathfinder 2e kobolds because it finally gives them a more distinct look than "like generic lizardmen, but smaller and scrawnier".
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Jul 30, 2020 21:52
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Froghammer posted:APG is rad, Marshal is rad, it's all rad for context, marshal is the new 4e warlord-style archetype with a lazylord ability https://2e.aonprd.com/Archetypes.aspx?ID=66
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Jul 30, 2020 21:53
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The designs deviates from the norm in a way that really appeals to me and definitely makes me want the book more really.
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Jul 30, 2020 21:53
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I do like that combat assessment rewards you for actually having knowledge skills as a fighter.
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Jul 30, 2020 22:37
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Arivia posted:for context, marshal is the new 4e warlord-style archetype with a lazylord ability https://2e.aonprd.com/Archetypes.aspx?ID=66 Wasn't "marshal" the name for warlord in 3.5 (miniatures handbook)?
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Jul 30, 2020 23:48
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Sodomy Hussein posted:Starfinder is Very Bad, and without even looking its implementation of mechs is basically guaranteed to suck, with the only thing being that if it had more like this from the beginning it would have at least been more interesting. I won't weigh on Badness, but I was very bummed to see that Starfinder seemed like PF1 with some space opera stapled on.
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Jul 30, 2020 23:54
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Eastmabl posted:Wasn't "marshal" the name for warlord in 3.5 (miniatures handbook)? All that's not to say that there was nothing in 3. that suggested the 4e warlord, let alone the lazylord. One of the disciplines from Tome of Battle was White Raven which focused heavily on buffing your allies and sometimes even giving them free attacks or charges. *At 1st level the marshal can pick up a minor aura which grants your Charisma mod as a bonus to some secondary rolls within 60'...most of the time. The big standout let you grant +Cha to your party's initiative, so you could just burn one of your levels in exchange for giving the whole party action advantage.
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Jul 31, 2020 00:06
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Eastmabl posted:I won't weigh on Badness, but I was very bummed to see that Starfinder seemed like PF1 with some space opera stapled on. It's fun as hell don't listen to that jerk.
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Jul 31, 2020 01:09
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Hmm Martial Artist now gives a non Monk the option of going full Unarmed. More or less. Opens up a lot of Monk feats like Stances as well. But not sure how well it will work as the Stances at least require being Unarmored and depending on the class you might not have all that good of an Unarmored Proficiency. Dragon Disciple also looks interesting, but one of feats gives a +2 status bonus to unarmored defense, but a max dex mod to defense of +2.
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Jul 31, 2020 01:09
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Eastmabl posted:I won't weigh on Badness, but I was very bummed to see that Starfinder seemed like PF1 with some space opera stapled on. That's exactly what it is. Instead of anything fresh it's just Pathfinder with "Star" instead of "Path" and a generous helping of extra jank revolving around any new system they developed.
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Jul 31, 2020 01:59
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If we're reopening the Starfinder debate, I found it to be unfun. I thought the mechanical simplifications did little to improve the game, the itemization was awful and almost entirely devoid of character, ship combat was tedious and poorly balanced, and class design overall left a lot to be desired. It felt like an overgrown playtest.
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Jul 31, 2020 02:02
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Ryuujin posted:Hmm Martial Artist now gives a non Monk the option of going full Unarmed. More or less. Opens up a lot of Monk feats like Stances as well. But not sure how well it will work as the Stances at least require being Unarmored and depending on the class you might not have all that good of an Unarmored Proficiency. Everyone has just as good an Unamored Proficiency as they do Armored.
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Jul 31, 2020 02:03
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Hmm that might not be bad then, although it does suggest you will need good Dex, or something like Mountain Stance. Trying to figure out what would be the best use of Dragon Disciple, I feel like a Kobold is required. But I feel like you would need a class where you don't really want their class feats. Unless I am misremembering what feat selections can be used on Archetypes.
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Jul 31, 2020 02:19
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Martial artist seems like a given for Investigators.
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Jul 31, 2020 02:32
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Oh really? I will need to read the Investigators stuff again, since I haven't read the finalized stuff for it.
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Jul 31, 2020 06:20
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Ryuujin posted:Oh really? I will need to read the Investigators stuff again, since I haven't read the finalized stuff for it. I mean more thematically than ruleswise because I also haven't had a time to really look over things.
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Jul 31, 2020 06:30
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Okay I have a question for those more familiar with PF2, since I haven't had the chance to actually play it. Is there any restriction on precision damage once per turn or anything? Because looking at Investigator and I can actually see it working real well, especially since Martial Artist doesn't have any level 10 feats, and a level 10 feat for Investigator lets them add precision dice on agile/finesse weapon and unarmed attacks even when not using their Devise a Strategem to use Int instead of the normal stat.
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Jul 31, 2020 06:39
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Precision damage is just an element, like fire or poison damage, so it should not be limited.
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Jul 31, 2020 06:50
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Well trying to look on the Paizo forums for some discussion of the book, came across a build thread. And it came out Investigator Assassin. Just laying in wait, watching a target, and every round while setting up your Assassinate, you Devise a Strategem until you get a 20. Then use that 20 for a crit. But yeah Investigator Martial Artist sounds like it could be fun, doesn't get Legendary Unarmored like a Monk obviously, but does eventually get to Master. Oh hmm not sure if Martial Artist gives an agile/finesse unarmed attack or not, if not it won't work with the Investigator class feature/feat. Though some of the Stance Feats can fix that. Tiger would also do slashing damage which opens up the Scalpel feat for more bleed damage on a Devise a Stratagem crit if you go Forensic Investigator and can spare the feat. Ryuujin fucked around with this message at 07:06 on Jul 31, 2020 |
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Jul 31, 2020 06:53
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Unarmed strikes are Agile/Finesse by default.
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Jul 31, 2020 07:10
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Ah okay. I couldn't find anything about that, and was unsure since some of the Monk Stances, that Martial Artist can grab, specifically mention Agile or Finesse while others don't mention them. And now while looking at the official forums I came across a post about another product. Apparently Legendary Games released their Legendary Kineticist for PF2e. Looks interesting so far, definitely has the PF2e feel for the most part. Though I haven't actually gotten to the feats or Infusions yet. Infusions end up being Focus Spells, they get Accept Burn which instead of taking that weird damage that Kineticists had in 1e causes them to have Stunned 2 for a round, and also Gather Power eventually as an action 1/round that lets them use an Infusion with 1 less Focus Point Cost.
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Jul 31, 2020 07:37
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So if an action has the nonlethal tag does that mean Its always nonlethal or does that mean it has the option of being nonlethal? All on monks strikes have nonlethal so I was a little confused
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Jul 31, 2020 20:39
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It does nonlethal by default, but you can deal lethal by taking a penalty to your attack roll. Monks get a class feature that lets them deal lethal damage with unarmed attacks without the penalty.
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Jul 31, 2020 20:50
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Ryuujin posted:Well trying to look on the Paizo forums for some discussion of the book, came across a build thread. And it came out Investigator Assassin. Just laying in wait, watching a target, and every round while setting up your Assassinate, you Devise a Strategem until you get a 20. Then use that 20 for a crit. Maybe I'm reading this wrong but this doesn't really seem to work. You could fish for a crit which would make the initial attack hurt a lot, but the bonus damage and death effect are linked to the enemy making a separate basic Fortitude save. So you getting a 20 can't cause them to critically fail that.
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Jul 31, 2020 23:21
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Elysiume posted:the itemization was awful and almost entirely devoid of character For me, this is the biggest 'ew' factor. The rest is at least functional as 'Pathfinder in space with tier 3 classes', but everything about the weapon and armor systems seems to have been designed to be as painful as possible to work with. Who in the world thought giant tables with 3-5 different versions of every single weapon and armor by level was a good idea?
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Jul 31, 2020 23:38
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