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Seams posted:I hate it when somebody puts on a submission in the middle of the ring and the commentators go "ITS LOCKED IN THEY HAVE NOWHERE TO GO" and then the other wrestler gets to the ropes. Guess it wasn't loving locked in was it idiot. Also not a very good submission if the other wrestler can survive it for ages AND crawl to the ropes. I'm convinced you can make that work if commentary establishes the difference between a simple pain hold and one that will legitimately break ligaments or whatever. Like an STF just hurts but a Kimura will put you on the shelf or whatever. That way you establish a tier of submissions to preserve those spots and also allow other submissions to win matches without making the guy who taps out look like a chump. edit: For a spot I love, I love those fighting spirit moments where someone doesn't fully no-sell offense but kind of just delays the sell. Like you get clobbered with a finisher, kick out at one, beat the gently caress out of the other guy and then fall over half-dead. That poo poo rules.
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Aug 12, 2020 04:11
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JOHN CENA posted:
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Aug 12, 2020 07:21
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davidbix posted:Yes, exactly. Any idea where *they* got them? sadly i haven't been in touch with them in well over a decade and for all i know it was probably secondhand. You had Mike on your podcast though a while ago (mikevsphilly on twitter), he was a guy i bought some tapes from. I'd try him.
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Aug 12, 2020 07:31
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My favorite dumb trope is still when a guy rips off the T-shirt of his faction to reveal the T-shirt of his real allegiance underneath
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Aug 12, 2020 07:54
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JOHN CENA posted:NXT has proven to be something that waters down and actually hurts wrestlers chances to make it to the top of the card in WWE. Look at who WWE actually pushes as main eventers, and who runs around chasing R-Truth for the 24/7 belt. Wrestlers tend to do a lot better on the main roster the less time they spend in NXT. Braun, Roman, Bray, and AJ all effectively skipped NXT and they make up a huge part of the current main event scene. Seth was there very briefly despite being the first NXT champion. Owens did well and got a main event WWE run but he was fast tracked QUICK out of NXT when they saw his ability to make money. Baron Corbin had an abbreviated stay there, and did much better upon being promoted. NXT Lifers that eventually get to the main card always seem to stumble hard, your Roodes, Shinsukes, Andrades, Sami Zayns, Pac, i mean hell its almost like holding the NXT title is a curse that means you're going to be capped at the knees when your callup does come. The best thing to happen to Drew was only spending ~5 months there.
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Aug 12, 2020 08:55
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FCW was a better developmental fed than NXT.
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Aug 12, 2020 08:55
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NXT is really less a developmental territory and more a silo for wrestlers who could make another promoter money
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Aug 12, 2020 08:57
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Corbin’s one good moment happened in NXT when he yelled at Apollo to go back to ROH but that was like 20 years ago
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Aug 12, 2020 09:23
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Seams posted:Corbin’s one good moment happened in NXT when he yelled at Apollo to go back to ROH but that was like 20 years ago I thought Baron Corbin was good on Talking Smack. Although "good" is a relative term, better phrased would be "better than he is presented now".
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Aug 12, 2020 12:18
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As a professional wrestler, how good was Jesse Ventura? It occurs to me I know the name, that he was a big star, but I've never seen a match with him nor heard people talk about him as a wrestler. H'es just a Big Name but I don't know why he was a big name. Great commentator and voice, though. That's all I know of him.
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Aug 12, 2020 13:48
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Generic big guy. Had charisma by the bucket (even if his gimmick was completely aping Superstar Billy Graham) but he never lit the ring on fire
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Aug 12, 2020 14:05
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Benne posted:My favorite dumb trope is still when a guy rips off the T-shirt of his faction to reveal the T-shirt of his real allegiance underneath This guy should enter a Royal Rumble type match at #1 and pull off a shirt and betray every subsequent wrestler with the announcers selling it as a shock each time. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L0eN9LQ05Mc
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Aug 12, 2020 14:13
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NikkolasKing posted:As a professional wrestler, how good was Jesse Ventura? Had a great tag team run with Adrian Adonis as The East-West Connection, holding the AWA World Tag Team Titles.
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Aug 12, 2020 14:17
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My favourite trope is when a lackey finally gets fed up with his boss’ poo poo and turns face. Works every time.
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Aug 12, 2020 14:33
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CopywrightMMXI posted:My favourite trope is when a lackey finally gets fed up with his boss’ poo poo and turns face. Works every time. The problem is when they didn't think about anything after that, and their career just kind of dies.
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Aug 12, 2020 14:36
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Red posted:The problem is when they didn't think about anything after that, and their career just kind of dies.
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Aug 12, 2020 14:38
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El Gallinero Gros posted:I could see Tama Tonga doing well. Maybe not world title, but certainly upper midcard. Given how shittily they used Tanga, I wouldn't count on it. I could maybe see Juice getting a spite push if he played up being frustrated at not being pushed by Gedo when negotiating with WWE.
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Aug 12, 2020 15:45
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jesus WEP posted:Doesn’t help that the lackey is usually a talentless turd like Alex Riley or Virgil. Sandow could probably have made it work a bit longer than he did if his big turn wasn’t immediately followed by him getting clowned on by Big Show Who was the last lackey turning on their boss who actually worked out and became/remained a big star? I assume at some point Wardlow is turning face on MJF and I'm sure he'll do fine, but at the moment I'm kind of having a hard time thinking of the last time this succeeded long-term.
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Aug 12, 2020 15:54
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jesus WEP posted:Doesn’t help that the lackey is usually a talentless turd like Alex Riley or Virgil. Sandow could probably have made it work a bit longer than he did if his big turn wasn’t immediately followed by him getting clowned on by Big Show Virgil could have had a little more shelf life if they'd moved DiBiase to Money Inc. sooner, and skipped the Repo Man thing, and just plugged Virgil into a tag team. I mean, Virgil still sucked, but they could've milked that feud a little longer. IRS technically debuted as Virgil won the $$$ belt, so I'm not sure why they didn't just connect those dots earlier than they did. I guess they felt like DiBiase had more time as a singles guy left? Edit: I also can't honestly say if Sandow is a good worker, or just a good actor. He's almost never really gotten a chance to work a long match that I've ever seen. His cash-in with Cena was good for a TV match. Red fucked around with this message at 16:01 on Aug 12, 2020 |
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Aug 12, 2020 15:57
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Tama is not particularly good at playing politics, the dude would probably get fired before the first year of his contract was up. If Jeff Cobb is saying he signed anywhere, it was probably with New Japan, he's talked repeatedly about wanting to have an actual run there for years now. Fale actually has had a WWE offer, he was in the wave of offers that ended up nabbing Nakamura, Styles, and the Good Brothers. Fale turned them down since, uh, he actually owns a business in Tokyo (Toks Coffee, which I think is somewhere tucked away in Shibuya?), he can fly back home easily from Japan, Pieter lives in Tokyo and all of her business is done there, and also he's a dojo boy who clearly still has loyalty to the people that take care of him. poo poo, Fale Dojo is now just the New Zealand Dojo for New Japan, dude is likely a lifer now more than ever. And that dojo's given us Henare, Hikuleo, Gino, Robbie Eagles, and SWITCHBLADE himself. But Jay's probably the sole person who would actually manage to become a star in WWE. He looks like a million bucks, can talk, can do both babyface and heel better than a lot of people (there's a reason every "pundit" who has kept up with NJPW is like "oh when they turn him babyface, watch out", Blue-Eyed Young Lion Jay White was one of the more popular Young Lions the company's ever had, women loved him on like, Devitt levels), he could adjust his ring work to the extremely pared-down, simplified, slowed pace that WWE makes everyone work at - he could just keep the flatliner-german combo, the Kiwi Krusher, and the Blade Runner and he'd be set - and he'd honestly probably be telling the best stories in the company within months. Like Jay's a freakish talent, I feel like you could drop him in any company and he'd just light it all up and be a big deal, fairly quick. He's not even the best guy in New Japan right now, but everyone else better than him is someone where you can see the pitfalls, like Okada would make a funny and that'd be the end of him, they'd look at Hiromu and go "too small, does too much", Tanahashi would be generic as hell and they'd never use his babyface fire, we know they have no loving clue what to do with Ibushi and he'd get bored really, really quickly and want out, they hosed up KENTA already to the point it's clear dude never wants to go anywhere near the company again unless he's visiting buddies, and Will would be treated just like Ricochet is ("slow down, don't do so much!" "... did any of you blokes watch me before I got signed?"). Ishii, well, he'd be a KUSHIDA hire where it's just so that he's not doing something somewhere else. Of course, WWE might want to figure out why Hunter's most trusted talent scout sent his son to train with New Japan and not their own performance center, as well as the company's head trainer encouraging guys frustrated with their lot in the company and an out on their contract coming up to maybe try going to Japan for a bit, he'll put in a call for them...
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Aug 12, 2020 16:43
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The Cameo posted:Of course, WWE might want to figure out why Hunter's most trusted talent scout sent his son to train with New Japan and not their own performance center, as well as the company's head trainer encouraging guys frustrated with their lot in the company and an out on their contract coming up to maybe try going to Japan for a bit, he'll put in a call for them... They put a tremendous amount of energy into not figuring out the answers to those questions. And Jay White would probably need a new finisher as the Blade Runner is too close to the Sister Abigail. ChrisBTY fucked around with this message at 17:02 on Aug 12, 2020 |
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Aug 12, 2020 16:59
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i liked it the one or two times when jay finished a match by just elbowing his opponent to death
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Aug 12, 2020 17:07
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Ganso Bomb posted:Who was the last lackey turning on their boss who actually worked out and became/remained a big star? The last one I remember was when Batista was Reverend D-Von's lackey/bodyguard, turning weeks after D-Von accidentally cost Batista a match. Batista was sort of a lackey to Triple H in Evolution as well and ended up turning face after powerbombing Trips through a table.
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Aug 12, 2020 17:58
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jesus WEP posted:i liked it the one or two times when jay finished a match by just elbowing his opponent to death Daniel Bryan, sighing: “well, at least someone is out there doing that finish.” I do miss the Danielson elbowing a guy until he’s a sack of tenderized wrestler and the ref has to stop the match. Of course, in WWE, that’d be a DQ because he was kicking too much rear end! ... man, I remember thinking how NXT was going to continue to be so much different back when Owens powerbombed Sami to death and instead of losing by DQ they did the normal thing a real combat sport would do and gave the win and title to Owens. ChrisBTY posted:They put a tremendous amount of energy into not figuring out the answers to those questions. And Jay White would probably need a new finisher as the Blade Runner is too close to the Sister Abigail. This is true. He’d probably just do the Kiwi Krusher as his finisher in that case. Maybe the Tanahashi Tap-Out as a submission finisher since Vince would see Jay’s greasy hair and decide he’s the missing Hart child or something
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Aug 12, 2020 18:17
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vince would probably be put off by Jay's kiwi accent because it's vince and Jay would just spend 4+ years in NXT anyway before getting to the main roster and trading losses back and forth with *looks at nxt roster of mildly tall guys* kona reeves on Main Event
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Aug 12, 2020 19:11
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In all honesty, I assumed "Tama Tonga would do well in WWE" was a joke about him looking like Roman Reigns.
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Aug 12, 2020 19:17
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Nehru the Damaja posted:In all honesty, I assumed "Tama Tonga would do well in WWE" was a joke about him looking like Roman Reigns. Pretty sure there's a rule that the WWE has to employ someone to be a Samoan at all times. Edit: Serious question: Does Roman Reigns no-sell headbutts?
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Aug 12, 2020 19:25
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JOHN CENA posted:vince would probably be put off by Jay's kiwi accent because it's vince and Jay would just spend 4+ years in NXT anyway before getting to the main roster and immediately blowing out one or both knees This seems more likely.
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Aug 12, 2020 19:27
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CombineThresher posted:This seems more likely. yeah actually it does.
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Aug 12, 2020 19:30
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JOHN CENA posted:vince would probably be put off by Jay's kiwi accent because it's vince and Jay would just spend 4+ years in NXT anyway before getting to the main roster and trading losses back and forth with *looks at nxt roster of mildly tall guys* kona reeves on Main Event Vince hears his New Zealand accent, immediately gives him an Australian gimmck, Bruce Dundee.
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Aug 12, 2020 20:01
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The Cameo posted:Daniel Bryan, sighing: “well, at least someone is out there doing that finish.” Bryan did try to get that spot over as a finish for like 2 weeks before his first heel turn, but I think WWE doesn't like stoppages because it puts too much (read: any) focus on the ref. Like, a bad stoppage in their mind is bad because the ref gets heat, instead of the heel. Similarly, Owens winning by stoppage puts him over as super-tough, but he's a WWE heel, he's only supposed to pretend to be tough until a real tough babyface confronts him, after all, he's not a giant monster, he just a fat guy. *insert Vince flex*
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Aug 12, 2020 20:10
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Why did Scott Hall go into the hall of fame as razor instead of his more well known real name?
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Aug 12, 2020 20:11
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oldpainless posted:Why did Scott Hall go into the hall of fame as razor instead of his more well known real name? WWE controlling the narrative. They'd rather have you remember him for his time in their company than anywhere else, no matter how big a deal it was.
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Aug 12, 2020 20:16
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oldpainless posted:Why did Scott Hall go into the hall of fame as razor instead of his more well known real name? wwe juche revisionism
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Aug 12, 2020 20:35
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Breitbart Is Rightbart posted:
I'm pretty sure this was Spring Stampede 1998. I don't know why I remember this, but that's life.
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Aug 12, 2020 20:53
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you know that is something about old wcw ppvs i do miss, how they'd tie the local city into the show somehow either referencing the geography or any cultural events going on at the time. mostly i remember the great american bash 89 ppv opening and talking about the many horse ranches of baltimore. i'd say i wish AEW would do the same, but their ppv schedule pre-covid looks like it only hits vegas and chicago.
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Aug 12, 2020 21:19
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their just jacking it for the time being
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Aug 12, 2020 21:20
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Gavok posted:WWE controlling the narrative. They'd rather have you remember him for his time in their company than anywhere else, no matter how big a deal it was. It's why even when Nash wrestled under his own name, they'd do poo poo like give him the Diesel horns in his music and have Cole use the Big Daddy Cool nickname instead of Big Sexy or using the NWO music.
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Aug 12, 2020 22:56
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If I wanted to spend money watching Japanese dudes chop the poo poo out of each other, and streaming or DVDs are an option, what's the best bang for my buck?
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Aug 13, 2020 00:15
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Nehru the Damaja posted:If I wanted to spend money watching Japanese dudes chop the poo poo out of each other, and streaming or DVDs are an option, what's the best bang for my buck? Well, the best bang for your buck might be Pro Wrestling NOAH because they stream quite a few shows live on abema.tv (and on demand for 7 days) and other stuff is on Wrestle Universe which they share with DDT and Tokyo Joshi Pro. The other option is that there is a lot of classic NOAH freely available on YouTube, like the very legendary chip battle between Kobashi and Sasaki. Good starting point would be the main event of the NOAH show from Monday which was incredibly hard hitting and might be my match of the year. It's still on Abema and there's a link in the Match of the Year thread. That said with G1 coming up next month it's not a bad time to sign up to NJPW World which is about $9 or $10 a month and you have hundreds of Tomohiro Ishii matches to check out in the archive
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Aug 13, 2020 00:25
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