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knox posted:Copping a raktajino mug because I drink too much coffee and have the need for a wide-rear end-cup. https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-1984-FELTMAN-LANGER-NO-Spill-Travel-Coffee-Mug-Captain/143688877992?hash=item21748647a8:g:RNYAAOSwcmBfPtEv Wrong kind of captain, but the right shape of cup
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Aug 24, 2020 00:19
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Nessus posted:What would be interesting additional RPG hook would be a civilization which was very well developed, perhaps even doing the Gundam colony thing in their planetary system, but had either not discovered the warp drive or had the invention suppressed or used in some weird way instead of being interstellar FTL. The scenario I've always had in the back of my head is an area of space just a few light years across where warp travel and subspace communications aren't possible. You could have a hugely advanced civilisation there that is effectively cut off from the rest of the galaxy.
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Aug 24, 2020 00:24
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Senor Tron posted:The scenario I've always had in the back of my head is an area of space just a few light years across where warp travel and subspace communications aren't possible. Ancient Omega accident?
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Aug 24, 2020 09:18
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So we learn about halfway into Voyager that the borg, aside from possessing transwarp technology which is faster than the Federation's warp tech, also have a network of conduits they use for travel around the galaxy that is not really commented on. What if instead it the network was left over by some ancient civilization, or even whoever made the Borg? Then you could have a series long arc of Voyager trying to access the network to get home, instead of just the one time?
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Aug 24, 2020 09:28
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knox posted:Copping a raktajino mug because I drink too much coffee and have the need for a wide-rear end-cup. I’ve been noticing them use those on Babylon 5 as well. I have one somewhere with the UFP logo on, and official trek logo. They’re an arse to wash up.
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Aug 24, 2020 09:36
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I always liked these ones a bit better from later in the series. And they look a bit more washable: Star Trek: critiquing science-fiction drinkware since 1966
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Aug 24, 2020 09:41
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Astroman posted:How did they do on the scale though? From what I remember, probably too small but not noticeably so. From the outside it's like an oversized planet that you can't fly around, just a small section around the entrance. From the inside it's like a space zone with a unique skybox, again you can only fly around a small zone, not the whole thing.
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Aug 24, 2020 10:10
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SardonicTyrant posted:So we learn about halfway into Voyager that the borg, aside from possessing transwarp technology which is faster than the Federation's warp tech, also have a network of conduits they use for travel around the galaxy that is not really commented on. the first campaign can be trying to decode the 7th chevron
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Aug 24, 2020 11:04
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I liked thinking of the borg as an infection - nobody 'made' them, (or at least, not intending for them to be what they are) and they don't think so much as try out anything and success is selected for. Building conduits throughout the galaxy is just something that was successful at propagating borgness. (yeah, I know that doesn't mesh with a lot of borg lore). Now that there's a borg queen essentially at the centre of a hive, I'd love if there were wars between borg similar to ants invading other nests.
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Aug 24, 2020 11:10
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It would have been interesting to see an explanation of why the Borg haven't just snowballed across the galaxy, when given what we're shown of their existence they should be able to spread exponentially
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Aug 24, 2020 12:03
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Statutory Ape posted:the first campaign can be trying to decode the 7th chevron
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Aug 24, 2020 12:22
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multijoe posted:It would have been interesting to see an explanation of why the Borg haven't just snowballed across the galaxy, when given what we're shown of their existence they should be able to spread exponentially It seems a bit nonsensical that the Borg only ever seem to have attempted a homeworld assimilation of humans instead of dispatching Cubes to any other world like Romulus or Qo'Nos or Cardassia.
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Aug 24, 2020 12:39
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On the other hand, ask the dominion what happens when you get some of the superpowers to work together
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Aug 24, 2020 12:50
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The Borg are farming, applying survival pressure so their targets will innovate and develop until they're ripe for harvest.
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Aug 24, 2020 13:04
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Based on their original appearance the Federation would have been their ideal target because it is the only big and explicitly multi-species empire in the immediate area. Get them, you get something of everybody. Of course when they basically just became cyborg zombies this is less valid.
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Aug 24, 2020 13:11
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In their original "Q Who?" appearance the Borg didn't give a poo poo about anybody that didn't have some kind of technology they didn't already know. It wasn't until First Contact that they became obsessed with zombifying populations. The Federation has always been portrayed as more technologically advanced than most of its fellow powers. Presumably the Borg didn't think the Klingons or the Romulans would have anything to add to the Collective. Later that dubious honor was reserved for garbage species like the Kazon. By the time they became portrayed as an aggressively hegemonizing swarm, the writers just never bothered to ask the question.
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Aug 24, 2020 13:17
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multijoe posted:It would have been interesting to see an explanation of why the Borg haven't just snowballed across the galaxy, when given what we're shown of their existence they should be able to spread exponentially I think the only way to read them in Voyager is that they are constantly scanning the galaxy and tending their transwarp conduits, but only bother getting active if they find something new and interesting to assimilate. The Borg are well aware of the Kazon's existence, they just don't give a gently caress because there's nothing interesting about them. The Borg would have made more sense if the entire species was just in the one cube (or a handful of cubes, acting independently). It rolls around as this civilisation-ending event for any star system it appears in, but it can only be in one place at a time and because of the Borg motivation isn't just indiscriminately attacking things, they're looking for novel technology or culture to assimilate.
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Aug 24, 2020 13:48
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if you keep assimilating ppl from a dangerous savage child race eventually youll start acting like a dangerous savage child race
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Aug 24, 2020 13:53
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They are not interested in assimilation during Q Who but it was implied in BOBW that they might do that to Earth
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Aug 24, 2020 14:30
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Son of Sam-I-Am posted:The Borg are farming, applying survival pressure so their targets will innovate and develop until they're ripe for harvest. Wasn't this the abandoned ending of Mass Effect?
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Aug 24, 2020 14:31
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FlamingLiberal posted:They are not interested in assimilation during Q Who but it was implied in BOBW that they might do that to Earth Locutus specifically says to Worf that the Klingons will be assimilated, and that they 'seek to improve quality of life for all species'. It's kinda weird, though, because then in I, Borg and Decent, all the Borg seem to be 'native' drones again, not assimilated victims.
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Aug 24, 2020 14:43
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Aug 24, 2020 14:54
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Son of Sam-I-Am posted:The Borg are farming, applying survival pressure so their targets will innovate and develop until they're ripe for harvest. Like how you starve a pepper plant of nutrients to make it spicier. They know Humans are the next carolina reaper.
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Aug 24, 2020 15:25
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Astroman posted:How did they do on the scale though? Eh, okay, I guess. You only fly around a few key zones on them. There's two spheres in the game, the Jenolan Sphere, which is the TNG one and is just a cameo and looks like it did on the show  and the Solanae Sphere, which is where most of the gameplay in the spheres happens and is covered in hundred-mile-tall towers and equipment as part of the omega-harvesting operations of the sphere. (Star Trek Online's approach to plot is just to throw all of the plots in a blender and lean into how ridiculous it gets)   There's an iconian space-gateway from New Romulus to the Solanae Sphere and another one from the Solanae to the Jenolan, (which is currently in the Delta Quadrant after it built up enough omega particles to jump locations to get away from its collapsing star and envelop a new more stable one instead) And the Jenolan Sphere has an open door so we can get out into the Delta Quadrant, which is how they introduced Voyager content into the game. MikeJF fucked around with this message at 15:37 on Aug 24, 2020 |
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Aug 24, 2020 15:31
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the neon pink tradition endures
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Aug 24, 2020 15:35
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Finally watching TAS. Sulu just said he couldn't teach Kirk a karate move because it only works if you're inscrutable. Was not expecting that one. 
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Aug 24, 2020 20:21
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Alchenar posted:I think the only way to read them in Voyager is that they are constantly scanning the galaxy and tending their transwarp conduits, but only bother getting active if they find something new and interesting to assimilate. The Borg are well aware of the Kazon's existence, they just don't give a gently caress because there's nothing interesting about them. Statutory Ape posted:if you keep assimilating ppl from a dangerous savage child race eventually youll start acting like a dangerous savage child race I remember from one issue of the old Inquest magazine, they had a "Who Would Win" fight between the Borg and the Orks from Warhammer 40K. The Borg kept wiping out the Ork hordes but ended up forfeiting the fight after assimilating the Ork warboss. The Borg Queen threatened to "kill the next rust-bucket who adds their imbecility to the Hive!"
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Aug 24, 2020 20:34
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Lemniscate Blue posted:In their original "Q Who?" appearance the Borg didn't give a poo poo about anybody that didn't have some kind of technology they didn't already know. It wasn't until First Contact that they became obsessed with zombifying populations. The Federation has always been portrayed as more technologically advanced than most of its fellow powers. Presumably the Borg didn't think the Klingons or the Romulans would have anything to add to the Collective. Later that dubious honor was reserved for garbage species like the Kazon. The Borg specifically stole Romulan colonists the first time they hit up the Alpha Quadrant proper. They liked eating them just fine, they just beelined towards humanity proper after they assimilated Picard.
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Aug 24, 2020 23:22
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multijoe posted:It would have been interesting to see an explanation of why the Borg haven't just snowballed across the galaxy, when given what we're shown of their existence they should be able to spread exponentially My pet Borg theory (that works for the most part if you ignore a couple of the most overpowered Borg Queen moments) is that the distance through which a Borg can connect to the collective is relatively short. So drones in the Delta and Beta quadrants may not ever have any direct communication. They appear as one homogenous entity however since they are no hard barriers between them and so differences in local groups are evened out by their neighbours. It explains differences in behaviour between different parts of the collective and why they don't spread as fast as might be expected. Assimilate large populations in one area and they might weaken the collectives voice there too much. So they need to trickle in new additions and once they are in the collective be continually stirring the drones up, to allow new assimilations to spread to the rest of the collective. Alchenar posted:I think the only way to read them in Voyager is that they are constantly scanning the galaxy and tending their transwarp conduits, but only bother getting active if they find something new and interesting to assimilate. The Borg are well aware of the Kazon's existence, they just don't give a gently caress because there's nothing interesting about them. That would be a really interesting Borg strategy, keep on voluntarily feeding them your best technologies so you don't have anything new to offer them.
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Aug 24, 2020 23:45
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Senor Tron posted:
Nah, if you always had new poo poo to offer then they'd assimilate you. They don't bother with the kazon precisely because the kazon never have anything new to offer, and likely have insufficiently unique biology to justify full assimilation.
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Aug 24, 2020 23:55
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SardonicTyrant posted:So we learn about halfway into Voyager that the borg, aside from possessing transwarp technology which is faster than the Federation's warp tech, also have a network of conduits they use for travel around the galaxy that is not really commented on. Naturally, neither they nor the Vaadwaur ever appeared again in Voyager. Strong Convections posted:I liked thinking of the borg as an infection - nobody 'made' them, (or at least, not intending for them to be what they are) and they don't think so much as try out anything and success is selected for. Building conduits throughout the galaxy is just something that was successful at propagating borgness. (yeah, I know that doesn't mesh with a lot of borg lore). The Shatnerverse novel The Return takes this approach to the Borg, imagining that there are other branches of the collective that made more use of biological technology, or one that just converts their targets into energy patterns (V'Ger was a product of that branch). Honestly, that book makes the Borg a whole lot weirder than FC and VOY made them with stuff like a giant tessaract space station inside a transwarp conduit, or the closest thing to a "homeworld" being a sentient machine planet orbiting a neutron star that sends the Borg out to assimilate the galaxy to assuage its own terrible loneliness.
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Aug 25, 2020 00:45
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Lemniscate Blue posted:Presumably the Borg didn't think the Klingons or the Romulans would have anything to add to the Collective. ...can Borg cloak?
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Aug 25, 2020 00:45
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Marshal Radisic posted:Honestly, that book makes the Borg a whole lot weirder than FC and VOY made them with stuff like a giant tessaract space station inside a transwarp conduit, or the closest thing to a "homeworld" being a sentient machine planet orbiting a neutron star that sends the Borg out to assimilate the galaxy to assuage its own terrible loneliness. That actually owns and is a super TOS concept. I'm not sure what that has to do with the Borg.
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Aug 25, 2020 00:49
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The_Other posted:I remember from one issue of the old Inquest magazine, they had a "Who Would Win" fight between the Borg and the Orks from Warhammer 40K. The Borg kept wiping out the Ork hordes but ended up forfeiting the fight after assimilating the Ork warboss. The Borg Queen threatened to "kill the next rust-bucket who adds their imbecility to the Hive!" Huh. Thought I was the only person who remembered Inquest Magazine.
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Aug 25, 2020 01:04
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Talking about Star Trek again got me interested in doing a rewrite of Voyager, just for fun, and I realized something about the Federation: for all it's faults, it's still a utopia to us in the 21st century. There is no poverty, no hunger, no discrimination of race, probably no discrimination on sex and gender (the writers kept trying to add a gay couple as early as TNG but Berman apparently put his foot down on that, so officially it's just implied). But. But despite all that, this utopia is not enough. As time as advanced, new social problems have emerged, but social progress has stalled. Look at the Doctor. To us in the 21st century, he could easily pass any test we could devise to prove he's a sentient being. To the people of the 23rd century, he's not even a slave, he's a product. And not even a high-quality one; recall his entire product line was discontinued and repurposed to mine asteroids as free labor. A huge chunk of the Doctor's character arc is making people realize he is a person. At some point the Federation stopped in its social advancement (and even culturally it's beginning to stagnate; Julian Bashir offhandedly mentions in one episode of DS9 the great Federation writers of the time are just copying works from other races and giving them a human spin, which could explain why everyone is so interested in the classics of our modern day). TNG and DS9 discuss the fear of the Federation sliding backwards to the older, more barbaric periods of humanity, but no series really hammers on the idea that the Federation could be doing more. tldr fully automated luxury gay space communism now, but also the automations are unionized. SardonicTyrant fucked around with this message at 01:29 on Aug 25, 2020 |
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Aug 25, 2020 01:24
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SardonicTyrant posted:Talking about Star Trek again got me interested in doing a rewrite of Voyager, just for fun, and I realized something about the Federation: for all it's faults, it's still a utopia to us in the 21st century. There is no poverty, no hunger, no discrimination of race, probably no discrimination on sex and gender (the writers kept trying to add a gay couple as early as TNG but Berman apparently put his foot down on that, so officially it's just implied). But. But despite all that, this utopia is not enough. As time as advanced, new social problems have emerged, but social progress has stalled. Look at the Doctor. To us in the 21st century, he could easily pass any test we could devise to prove he's a sentient being. To the people of the 23rd century, he's not even a slave, he's a product. And not even a high-quality one; recall his entire product line was discontinued and repurposed to mine asteroids as free labor. At some point the Federation stopped in its social advancement (and even culturally it's beginning to stagnate; Julian Bashir offhandedly mentions in one episode of DS9 the great Federation writers of the time are just copying works from other races and giving them a human spin, which could explain why everyone is so interested in the classics of our modern day). TNG and DS9 discuss the fear of the Federation sliding backwards to the older, more barbaric periods of humanity, but no series really hammers on the idea that the Federation could be doing more. I think you are basically setting up Discovery season 3 (from what it looks like).
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Aug 25, 2020 01:28
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I mean, the idea behind utopia is that, by definition, it can't exist. We can always do more,, and there are always new problems to face and overcome. If anything, that's the story of Star Trek. It's not that life is perfect or we are perfect. But it's that we're always moving forward, doing better, searching for perfection.
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Aug 25, 2020 01:34
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Epicurius posted:I mean, the idea behind utopia is that, by definition, it can't exist. We can always do more,, and there are always new problems to face and overcome. If anything, that's the story of Star Trek. It's not that life is perfect or we are perfect. But it's that we're always moving forward, doing better, searching for perfection. (actually that trial with Data was profoundly hosed up, because Riker was basically blackmailed to play prosecutor or else the trial would default to judging Data as property)
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Aug 25, 2020 02:11
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SardonicTyrant posted:(actually that trial with Data was profoundly hosed up, because Riker was basically blackmailed to play prosecutor or else the trial would default to judging Data as property) From a realism/plausibility point of view, you're absolutely right. If Riker had wanted the verdict to go that way, she just handed him a magic button to make that happen without any trial at all. From a dramatic and TV-show-producing point of view, it is hugely better to have a plot device force Riker into doing something he hates than to bring in yet another guest star to do the prosecuting.
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Aug 25, 2020 02:29
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Powered Descent posted:From a realism/plausibility point of view, you're absolutely right. If Riker had wanted the verdict to go that way, she just handed him a magic button to make that happen without any trial at all. SardonicTyrant fucked around with this message at 02:50 on Aug 25, 2020 |
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Aug 25, 2020 02:48
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