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chiasaur11 posted:The first two are basically the same thing. The Moonlight Butterfly is the Turn A's ultimate weapon, a swarm of nanomachines to wipe out all advanced technology in case you're mad at a whole solar system, not just a few people. yeah i guess I meant more, WHY did it happen? the dark history clip show wasn't too enlightening other than getting me to clap like a seal going I KNOW WHAT THAT IS as gundams shooting lasers and zakus flashed by also lol did everyone on the sides just die in interstellar space
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Sep 5, 2020 20:56
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No, the Turn A only used the Moonlight Butterfly on Earth and not in space. There are apparently some supplementary materials that claim it can be used in space and cover a distance equal to that between the Earth and Jupiter, which is a claim commonly attributed to the novels Fukui (of Gundam Unicorn fame) wrote but people who've read the novels say it doesn't contain anything like that, so that idea may be just something the internet amplified through repetition despite having no actual basis at all. If you look at the Turn A's use of the Moonlight Butterfly in the animation it doesn't really seem like something that could affect a vacuum anyway, because when Merrybell uses the Moonlight Butterfly on Earth to test it out the nanomachines end up mixing with the clouds, covering an entire mountain range that is flashing with lightning storms as Corin watches while noting that he recognizes that "ionic smell". Which implies that the way the Moonlight Butterfly works, and the reason it can affect the entire planet is because the nanomachines mix with the atmosphere and propagate through weather. Meaning the Turn A itself doesn't have to cover the planet manually, and can just let the nanomachines literally rain down everywhere. If it does work through atmosphere though, then it's not something that has nearly as much utility in space, since it can't propagate nearly as easily. There is a brief scene during the Black History exposition where Dianna notes that all the people on colony cylinders converted them in to deep space ships and left when they realized that poo poo was going south. So there wouldn't be much left to attack anyway, just the cities on the Moon. Which demonstrably survived. We're never told why the pilot of the Turn A did it, just shown that it did happen. What's weirder is that whoever was piloting the Turn A not only wiped out civilization, but created caches of technology buried in Moonlight Butterfly nanomachines before he wiped out all technology and that those became the Mountain Cycles people were digging Borjarnons, Kapools, nukes, missiles, guns etc. out of throughout the show. The reason that they are so perfectly preserved and can be used immediately is because the Moonlight Butterfly nanomachines kept them in perfect condition, and if you watch any episodes where Sid, Horace etc. are pulling stuff out of the ground you'll see something akin to a cloth that dissolves when they disturb it; which is the remains of the nanoskin that was preserving them throughout their burial. A hibernation so complete that their first time Sid is inspecting one such site he notes that the air smells fresh, despite the fact they're underground at the time. The Moonlight Butterfly is normally known for it's destructive capabilities, but it's really broken as a creative tool too and kept a variety of technology preserved for a few thousand years so perfectly that they could be used without repair or even refueling the minute they were pulled out of the ground. The only work any units pulled from a Mountain Cycle ever needed was to kick-start the Wilgame's engine, because it needed to reach specific temperatures before it could be run or something. Which they managed by the simple expedient of hooking the Turn A up to it and leeching off that. The Turn X needed to be kickstarted after Gym pulled it out of the ground too, and starting it took all the electricity from a city on the Moon for a few seconds. There are apparently some data books related to Turn A that say the Moonlight Butterfly nanomachines are related to the Devil Gundam cells from G Gundam but are an advanced version of them that trades adaptability for control and that some environmentalists got their hands on them and one of their members wiped out all tech on Earth because he was one of those hippie guys that thing everyone should live a simpler life, essentially. I've no idea how true that is either though, so take it with a grain of salt. tsob fucked around with this message at 21:23 on Sep 5, 2020 |
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Sep 5, 2020 21:15
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Ramadu posted:yeah i guess I meant more, WHY did it happen? the dark history clip show wasn't too enlightening other than getting me to clap like a seal going I KNOW WHAT THAT IS as gundams shooting lasers and zakus flashed by
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Sep 5, 2020 21:27
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some of my fav snips i did while watching Turn A    big mood    you guys. how is Turn A so good
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Sep 5, 2020 22:13
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Anis' Cow is legit one of my favourite episodes in Gundam, and the dilemma of moving this old woman off her land because there's going to be battles nearby when she doesn't want to leave because it's her loving land so screw you is far tenser than a lot of actual battles in other shows. The episode with Dianna working in the field hospital is another great one, and all the scenes of the nurses matter of factly operating on screaming soldiers really do a great job selling the whole "war is bad" idea without really focusing in on it or showing lots of gore or anything. Also, I love that shot of Midgard just because I recall his outfit being pajamas with a big silly character or something emblazoned on the chest and it's great. Not quite Harry Ord fashionista levels, but definitely up there all the same.
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Sep 5, 2020 22:19
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tsob posted:Anis' Cow is legit one of my favourite episodes in Gundam, and the dilemma of moving this old woman off her land because there's going to be battles nearby when she doesn't want to leave because it's her loving land so screw you is far tenser than a lot of actual battles in other shows. The episode with Dianna working in the field hospital is another great one, and all the scenes of the nurses matter of factly operating on screaming soldiers really do a great job selling the whole "war is bad" idea without really focusing in on it or showing lots of gore or anything.  bless u lt. harry 
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Sep 5, 2020 22:30
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tsob posted:Anis' Cow is legit one of my favourite episodes in Gundam, and the dilemma of moving this old woman off her land because there's going to be battles nearby when she doesn't want to leave because it's her loving land so screw you is far tenser than a lot of actual battles in other shows. The episode with Dianna working in the field hospital is another great one, and all the scenes of the nurses matter of factly operating on screaming soldiers really do a great job selling the whole "war is bad" idea without really focusing in on it or showing lots of gore or anything.    sorry for the track line in that one lol I liked those episodes a lot too.
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Sep 5, 2020 22:33
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tsob posted:Anis' Cow is legit one of my favourite episodes in Gundam, and the dilemma of moving this old woman off her land because there's going to be battles nearby when she doesn't want to leave because it's her loving land so screw you is far tenser than a lot of actual battles in other shows. The episode with Dianna working in the field hospital is another great one, and all the scenes of the nurses matter of factly operating on screaming soldiers really do a great job selling the whole "war is bad" idea without really focusing in on it or showing lots of gore or anything. He wears a T-shirt with a cartoon mouse on it because his VA is Ryuji Mizuno.
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Sep 5, 2020 22:40
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Darth Walrus posted:He wears a T-shirt with a cartoon mouse on it because his VA is Ryuji Mizuno. What's the significance of a mouse to Ryuji Mizuno? His IMDB and ANN pages don't show anything obviously mouse related. Does/did he do some Mickey Mouse stuff in Japan, or something? Also, looking at the ANN page reminded me his character's name is Meme Midgard. Which is fantastic.
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Sep 5, 2020 22:47
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tsob posted:What's the significance of a mouse to Ryuji Mizuno? His IMDB and ANN pages don't show anything obviously mouse related. Does/did he do some Mickey Mouse stuff in Japan, or something? Also, looking at the ANN page reminded me his character's name is Meme Midgard. Which is fantastic. 'Mizuno' means 'mouse'.
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Sep 5, 2020 22:51
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What's the context of Midgard sleeping on a table? It's been forever since I've watched Turn A. I assume it's because he refuses to sleep on the floor?
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Sep 5, 2020 23:08
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Argas posted:What's the context of Midgard sleeping on a table? It's been forever since I've watched Turn A. I assume it's because he refuses to sleep on the floor? He's on Earth acting as the handler for Teteth Halley when she's trying to assassinate Dianna, as well as organizing a few other things behind the scenes for Agrippa Maintainer when he's trying to undercut Dianna and as part of his mission with Teteth he infiltrates Keith's bakery as a cover. Since he's officially working in a bakery he has to sleep in the bakery over night to watch the ovens and poo poo, and the table is preferable to the floor presumably. I can't remember exactly what Teteth was doing at the time, but I vaguely recall her charming some rando kid and using him to get in to the Turn A, where Loran fights her and they end up tumbling out of it and fighting on foot. At which point Loran throws her over his shoulder and as he does, Midgard snipes her with a shot that hits her in the forehead. I know she charmed Will Game, Loran, Bruno and Jacop at various other times to further plans to get back to the Moon or kill Dianna, but I can't recall the exact details of her last attempt off hand. Speaking of Teteth though, there's that scene on the Moon around about episode 43 or 44 where Fran is taking pictures of all the people who've been released from cryostasis as they enter the city on the tram with Miashei accompanying her, all the people getting off greeting family there to welcome them etc. and while they're watching a woman gets off and asks "does anyone know a girl called Teteth Halley?" and Fran says that the name sounds familiar before the scene cuts away and it's never mentioned again. The woman who got off was presumably Teteth's mother, and it's kind of heart breaking that she'll probably never know exactly what happened to her daughter, why she was missing (she'd gone to Earth as one of the forwards to check if it was safe to return for the Dianna Counter years before hand, presumably while the mother was in cryostasis) and may not even ever have confirmation that Teteth died. The military might hold that record, and would at least have a record of her being sent to Earth, but still  There's also another woman that gets off and is greeted by a daughter who is older than her, and the younger mother is laughing because her daughter is still just as prone to crying as when she was younger. That scene is really emotive, and gives a nice little insight in to an interesting setting. I really do wish the show had taken as much time to explore the Moon as a setting as it did Ameria in the first half of the show. It couldn't really, not without adding at least another 10 or so episodes but the Moon is such an interesting setting and we see so little of it really. G-Reco had the same problem, and a lot of the show felt like you were on a really fast tour of all these interesting places that you barely got to see in Towasanga, Venus and the Orbital Elevator at the very least. tsob fucked around with this message at 23:26 on Sep 5, 2020 |
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Sep 5, 2020 23:13
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While we're posting gigantic screencaps of great Turn-A bits: https://i.imgur.com/dUZdJ7C.mp4   https://i.imgur.com/hveSNBI.mp4 https://i.imgur.com/Uvvukca.mp4 https://i.imgur.com/UJ5sIgf.mp4 tsob posted:Also, I love that shot of Midgard just because I recall his outfit being pajamas with a big silly character or something emblazoned on the chest and it's great. Not quite Harry Ord fashionista levels, but definitely up there all the same. 
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Sep 6, 2020 00:20
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 bernie....
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Sep 6, 2020 01:12
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A sudden craving for hamburgers.
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Sep 6, 2020 01:24
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Ok so I have seen: 0079 Zeta 08th MS Team Turn A Unicorn Iron Blooded Orphans War in the Pocket What do I watch next
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Sep 6, 2020 01:31
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What did you like about any of them? What are you looking for in your next foray? The answer kind of depends on those things. That said, it's unusual for someone to watch 0079 and Zeta, but not Char's Counterattack. It's not a great film really, in my opinion, but it's only 2 hours long and it has a really strong finale at the very least. It's all just really iconic within the franchise, and anime as a whole to some degree. You could also consider some of Tomino's non-Gundam works like Ideon, Xabungle or King Gainer. Again, depending on what you're looking for, since some of them are more comic in tone and that may not be what everyone wants in a show etc.
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Sep 6, 2020 01:39
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Build Fighters is especially good if you like sports/tournament arcs and since you've seen a lot of the core shows you'll catch more references
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Sep 6, 2020 01:39
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There's always Wing and G Gundam for their respective flavors of crazy.
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Sep 6, 2020 01:45
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I'm going to kick the rear end of anyone who besmirches chars counterattack
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Sep 6, 2020 01:56
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tsob posted:What did you like about any of them? What are you looking for in your next foray? The answer kind of depends on those things. That said, it's unusual for someone to watch 0079 and Zeta, but not Char's Counterattack. It's not a great film really, in my opinion, but it's only 2 hours long and it has a really strong finale at the very least. It's all just really iconic within the franchise, and anime as a whole to some degree. You could also consider some of Tomino's non-Gundam works like Ideon, Xabungle or King Gainer. Again, depending on what you're looking for, since some of them are more comic in tone and that may not be what everyone wants in a show etc. I havent bothered with any of the movies honestly. As far as I understood them they were just abridged versions of the shows. I did try ZZ before and I might try to power through that because people said it gets better but I bounced very hard off its...insane bumbling comedic tone. Especially right after Zeta and watching all my girls die and become space ghosts and my boy turn into a vegetable haunted by war. I've liked different things about all of them. IBO probably made me the most sad out of all of them but I think the Barbados is probably my favorite gundam design outside of the Kampfer in war in the pocket. I guess I like strong characters without too much slapstick. But I'm not really opposed to any of that either.
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Sep 6, 2020 01:59
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I've been told 00 is really good too? I'll probably end up watching them all since I have a lot of free time right now and I do like the shows so far. I will say I like the monoeye suits a lot because I think my first mecha anime I ever saw was VOTOMS and i dig the scopedog (4 lyfe) and I guess the designer is the same between the shows.
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Sep 6, 2020 02:02
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Ramadu posted:I've been told 00 is really good too? I'll probably end up watching them all since I have a lot of free time right now and I do like the shows so far. The first season of 00 is really good. The second is significantly less so because I guess the production committee got cold feet and made it way too conventional gundam, with sloppy tying up of loose ends as well.
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Sep 6, 2020 02:04
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Stairmaster posted:I'm going to kick the rear end of anyone who besmirches chars counterattack I'll hold their arms back and you can work the stomach.
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Sep 6, 2020 02:07
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Ramadu posted:I havent bothered with any of the movies honestly. As far as I understood them they were just abridged versions of the shows. CCA is really the cinematic finish to 0079, Zeta, ZZ (though more the former two than the latter, ZZ gets tied off in Unicorn). If you enjoyed the first two, CCA will probably be a hit. Truthfully I think you've hit most of the somber "war is hell" shows. F91 keeps to that theme, though its disjointed from being originally a TV series that got pared down to a movie. Also, there is the Thunderbolt OVAs. They have IBOs penchant for following extremely hosed up people around as their POV characters, but with fewer redeeming qualities. Amazing Jazz-based soundtrack though.
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Sep 6, 2020 02:08
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Ramadu posted:I havent bothered with any of the movies honestly. As far as I understood them they were just abridged versions of the shows. A lot of them are, but Char's Counterattack is a new movie that stars an older Amuro and Char facing off again. I think it's kind of an unnecessary movie that puts more weight on their rivalry than I think it warrants when a lot of the original show was about Amuro moving beyond that rivalry in the first place, and Zeta has them move past it in way that I find much more satisfying personally. It does have a really strong climax though, so it's probably worth it for that alone. There's also Gundam F91, which is the next Gundam project Tomino worked on and is a stand alone movie, but had a rocky production that started with the staff working on what they hoped would be a 50 episode TV show and then morphed in to what they hoped to be the first movie in a larger series of movies but which never got any sequels. It does wrap up all the main points brought up, but some stuff obviously doesn't get any resolution and the pacing is a bit off at times, but again 2 hours. Also, if you like Zeta then you may enjoy the Zeta movies. They're a trilogy of movies Tomino directed in the early 2000s for the show's 20th anniversary, and while they share a lot of the basic premise of the show he used the opportunity to tell a different version of Zeta's story with a happier ending because his attitude about some things had changed in the intervening years (all his shows after Victory have a much happier tone in general). The movies aren't great if you haven't already seen the show since they skip over some parts that are pretty important, and the animation changes haphazardly between reusing the original show's animation and some newly animated scenes. It's 3 movies, and gives you an alternate, happier ending for various characters though. As for TV shows though? I don't really know what to recommend, honestly. If you liked Turn A then you may enjoy G-Reco, since it's Tomino re-doing a lot of the same themes and ideas but with a much more vibrant colour palette and more bombastic cast. The problem is he didn't feel up to a full 50 episodes any more given his age, and ran it at 25 episodes (or maybe it was 26, can't recall) and the show's pacing suffers heavily because of it at times. If you bounced off ZZ because of the comedy though, I think you might enjoy Xabungle or King Gainer, two of his better comic shows, because it won't be making mock of characters you've grown to love or anything and Xabungle especially is a really strong comedy show with a really good adventure vibe running through it as the cast travels around a weird old west type setting filled with low tech mechs, giant transforming battleships and so on. G Gundam is a perennial goon favourite for Gundam, but is really different to the rest of the franchise because it embraces all the super robot silliness that Tomino originally tried to step Gundam away from with 0079. It's basically a shonen show with Gundams, and the whole thing is based around a giant tournament with people shouting attack names as they do giant robot kung fu against absurd caricatures of national stereotypes. It won't suit everyone, but a lot of people love it (me included). I don't think you'll find anything else in Gundam too similar to IBO or Turn A really, but there are still some great shows depending on what you're looking for at any particular moment. tsob fucked around with this message at 02:22 on Sep 6, 2020 |
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Sep 6, 2020 02:19
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Warmachine posted:Also, there is the Thunderbolt OVAs. They have IBOs penchant for following extremely hosed up people around as their POV characters, but with fewer redeeming qualities. Amazing Jazz-based soundtrack though. Having just watched Thunderbolt I recommend Thunderbolt. The first Thunderbolt movie stands on its own as a totally complete story. It's not a happy story, but it is one hell of a story.
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Sep 6, 2020 02:24
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As I often say, you should watch the Thunderbolt movies if you do choose to watch them. The OVAS are just short previews of the finished product. Also, be warned that the second movie is only part one of a fairly large arc, and part two will probably be a little way off.
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Sep 6, 2020 02:29
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watch wing
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Sep 6, 2020 02:48
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tsob posted:Also, if you like Zeta then you may enjoy the Zeta movies. They're a trilogy of movies Tomino directed in the early 2000s for the show's 20th anniversary, and while they share a lot of the basic premise of the show he used the opportunity to tell a different version of Zeta's story with a happier ending because his attitude about some things had changed in the intervening years (all his shows after Victory have a much happier tone in general). The movies aren't great if you haven't already seen the show since they skip over some parts that are pretty important, and the animation changes haphazardly between reusing the original show's animation and some newly animated scenes. It's 3 movies, and gives you an alternate, happier ending for various characters though. If you watched Zeta recently save yourself a few hours and just watch the third movie; it has the most new animation and different ending. The first two movies have a comparatively small amount of new animation but are otherwise heavily edited versions of what you already saw in the show. Endorph posted:watch wing Watch Wing after Char's Counterattack since Wing has a character that goes through Char's MSG-Zeta-CCA arc in the show and having that background will provide some fun context. Otherwise I'd suggest Char's Counterattack and Thunderbolt: December Sky, then go to one of Wing, Thunderbolt: Bandit Flower, ZZ, or 00. 00 was influenced by Wing so you may find some value in seeing Wing first.
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Sep 6, 2020 02:55
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chumbler posted:The first season of 00 is really good. The second is significantly less so because I guess the production committee got cold feet and made it way too conventional gundam, with sloppy tying up of loose ends as well. The thing that always confused me is that if you just look at the final battle it serves as a huge repudiation of that forced devotion to old gundam, what with the new main character and his Gundam destroying the RX-78 piloted by Amuro Ray, but that goes against pretty much every other thing they did with that season.
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Sep 6, 2020 03:00
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Gundam fans' souls are weighed down by UC.
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Sep 6, 2020 03:17
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Ethiser posted:The thing that always confused me is that if you just look at the final battle it serves as a huge repudiation of that forced devotion to old gundam, what with the new main character and his Gundam destroying the RX-78 piloted by Amuro Ray, but that goes against pretty much every other thing they did with that season. One theory I've heard suggests it's more resentment than anything else. The ending is so opposed to the original Gundam because everything else was forced to live in its shadow. (And then the movie veers away again.) It's interesting to graph out the "UC-ness" of the series after 00, since it goes hard UC knockoff with AGE before veering back away with G-Reco and IBO. (which was the original intended post-00 series, but... things happened, apparently.) The thing that stands out there is that AGE flopped hard. Meanwhile, Unicorn's success saved Bandai from taking any serious financial damage in the process. Seems possible that the lesson they took was that if they were going to do UC stories, things sell better if they're outright labeled as UC rather than the store brand version.
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Sep 6, 2020 09:01
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Say whatever you want about 00 but that last episode rules start to finish
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Sep 6, 2020 12:08
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Just wanna point out since there was discussion of it earlier: this is clearly an elephant, not a mouse. edit: and while I'm at it: Darth Walrus posted:'Mizuno' means 'mouse'. This isn't true. The japanese word for mouse is 鼠, romanized as "nezumi" Droyer fucked around with this message at 12:28 on Sep 6, 2020 |
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Sep 6, 2020 12:25
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Blockhouse posted:Say whatever you want about 00 but that last episode rules start to finish The final battle of 00 is really well choreographed and has several "hell yeah" moments, even if most of 00 S2 is a little eh.
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Sep 6, 2020 12:41
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Kanos posted:The final battle of 00 is really well choreographed and has several "hell yeah" moments, even if most of 00 S2 is a little eh. Hell, there's still stuff like the Gaga that's just stupid. But goddamn, those final few duels.
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Sep 6, 2020 13:04
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As far as final fights go, December Sky's duel between the Full Armour and the Psyco Zaku has got to be my favourite. Just two desperate guys frantically trying to kill each other and survive each others onslaught. Minimal dialogue, none of that standing around and talking about what just happened in the middle of a life or death fight (looking at you 08th ms team) and really well animated to boot. It ticks all the boxes for me because its one of the few final fights that isn't decided by who has the better psychic powers or OP equipment to carry the day. Its just two pilots in souped up prototypes. The other one has to be the end of War in the Pocket. Bernie is a burger and Christina is best grill.
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Sep 6, 2020 17:13
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00 S1 is one of my favourite series and S2 one of my least favourite but at least S2 has some really solid fights and some of the best kills in the series. Raiser Sword, Seraphim climbing out of Seravee holding someone down so it can blow their brains out, and the entire final battle start to finish are all awesome.
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Sep 6, 2020 19:07
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One of my favorite 00S2 bits is when Katharon shows up to beat the A-Laws with a bunch of regular Flags and then Kati shows up with Patrick to reinforce CB.
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Sep 6, 2020 20:43
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