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Enigma89 posted:So what happens to poor whites that are stuck baby sitting instead of having sweet heart internships? Prop 16 doesn't do anything for them. Poor white people are already ahead of poor black people by being white. Literally, just by being white, their odds of admissions are higher, their odds of getting a job are higher, their odds of maintaining generational wealth are higher. Check out this chart:  Now are there plenty of poor white people? Sure. But virtually all black people are poorer. And maintaining the current situation doesn't help poor white people, it just continues to hurt poor non-white people (and of course poor white women, since Prop 209 also doesn't let you consider sex/gender in admission or hiring criteria). "We should maintain it because it's more fair to hurt all poor people instead of some poor people" sounds pretty stupid to me. Edit: checked your post history and you defended the police who shot Jacob Blake. You're a terrible person and I hope you leave my state. Wicked Them Beats fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Sep 6, 2020 |
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Sep 6, 2020 20:30
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Enigma89 posted:So what happens to poor whites lol won't someone think of the whites 
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Sep 6, 2020 20:38
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I mean, there was also the part about being a really bad EVE spy.
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Sep 6, 2020 20:58
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My ideal affirmative action program would trigger on wealth, not race, but that's harder to administer and in aggregate right now they're equivalent. Race-based affirmative action isn't perfect, but it's better than nothing.
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Sep 6, 2020 21:24
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sincx posted:The biggest issue is that there's not enough good jobs out there. Thanks for posting this, because this absolutely nails it. Automation, AI advancements, and everything else on the technology front is devaluing labor like crazy. Fewer well paying jobs that require more and more credential-ism and personal connections to access. Work as we know it is on the decline. There isn't enough valuable labor to be done to support people through work, or enough resources to sustain a consumer-centric economy. Something is going to break. Hopefully its not the poor being ground into paste for food.
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Sep 6, 2020 21:46
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Huge swaths of the state are rapidly becoming unlivable for months on end and we’re tinkering around the edges of the meritocracy
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Sep 6, 2020 21:58
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Foxfire_ posted:My ideal affirmative action program would trigger on wealth, not race, but that's harder to administer and in aggregate right now they're equivalent. Race-based affirmative action isn't perfect, but it's better than nothing. I agree. I always feel like entrenching racial classifications into systems only serves to further the development of racialized systems. It's especially problematic when you start to consider how those categories are so flawed or oversimplified to begin with. There are similar problems with gender. By baking in a discrete set of binary options for a reality that's much more complicated, you end up with whole buildings and programs that cater only to those options and disenfranchise the rest. I think the better systems look a bit more like the Texas admissions process (flat automatic acceptance of students in the top 10% of each Texas high school.) Which achieve affirmative action goals without further entrenching socially constructed racial hierarchies and categories into decision-making.
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Sep 6, 2020 22:29
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Huego posted:I agree with this. People don't enter the labor market on equal footing. The only way one 18 year old can have more "merit" than another is by access to opportunities that cost money and require social access. The kid who spends their high school years babysitting so mom can work isn't going to have anything to put on that first resume compared to the kid who got to do lots of extracurriculars. The summer job at Dairy Queen doesn't look nearly as meritorious as the summer job at dad's friend's bank. If a scale is crooked you counterbalance it. It's the only way to bring it back to the center. I'm fine with this, for the most part. A guy I went to school with when I was very young went on to work in the Obama administration, reporting directly to the Secretary of State. He got here largely because he had a fancy education from UCLA. He got into UCLA because his mother was extremely aggressively pushy about putting him at the front of the line for any opportunities and credits etc when he was as young as eight, and his father was a successful attorney who probably had no problem lining him up work at various jobs. I never had a real career partly because I'm a shiftless anticapitalist philosophically opposed to mandatory working, but also because even getting a first job was terribly difficult because you're applying for your first job, with no background and no references, against people who are as young as you are but can list jobs they got because their parents knew a guy who was willing to hire a kid without interviewing multiple candidates and picking based on merit. For example, my best friend will always have more work experience than I do, because his family pushed him into working at a neighbor's video store when he was 18 while I had no such free pass into a job and spent years fighting with automated application systems that subject you to bizarre psychological tests to determine if you're too paranoid or too antisocial to work. I never got any calls back from those systems, but because a bunch of teens are still working at that grocery store over ten years later I'm guessing somebody eventually did. I am "not meritous" but I'm not a minority, either. The thing that bothers me about Prop 16 is that it furthering tilting toward the idea that white people need to use their white privilege to get hired just because that's what some whites do, which is ignorant that white people don't all have identical levels of it. Craptacular! fucked around with this message at 22:37 on Sep 6, 2020 |
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Sep 6, 2020 22:30
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Foxfire_ posted:My ideal affirmative action program would trigger on wealth, not race, but that's harder to administer and in aggregate right now they're equivalent. Race-based affirmative action isn't perfect, but it's better than nothing. My ideal affirmative action program triggers on race because there are a shitload of white racists controlling the levers of power at all levels.
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Sep 6, 2020 22:37
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El Mero Mero posted:I think the better systems look a bit more like the Texas admissions process (flat automatic acceptance of students in the top 10% of each Texas high school.)
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Sep 6, 2020 22:41
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El Mero Mero posted:I agree. I always feel like entrenching racial classifications into systems only serves to further the development of racialized systems. The University of Texas uses race as a factor in their admissions process for students who don't score within the top 10% of their class. This came after a series of "race-neutral" admissions changes scrapping affirmative action led to sharp enrollment decreases for minority students (African American enrollment dropped by 40% and Hispanic enrollment dropped by 5%). Without factoring race, student enrollment in UT schools under the top 10% admissions policy remained stagnant or worsened in some cases until race was included as part of a holistic review process. Bodhidharma fucked around with this message at 22:57 on Sep 6, 2020 |
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Sep 6, 2020 22:55
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Craptacular! posted:I'm fine with this, for the most part. A guy I went to school with when I was very young went on to work in the Obama administration, reporting directly to the Secretary of State. He got here largely because he had a fancy education from UCLA. He got into UCLA because his mother was extremely aggressively pushy about putting him at the front of the line for any opportunities and credits etc when he was as young as eight, and his father was a successful attorney who probably had no problem lining him up work at various jobs. Hey, I'm also a shiftless anticapitalist philosophically opposed to mandatory working!  Although "writer" is shorter. Your story is all too common, and I think that's why there is no magic bullet for equal access to opportunities. White people do all have white privilege, but there are so many other inequalities that it can be hard to see. A purely economic-based system wouldn't help people who are marginalized for race or gender or orientation or disabilities, but a system that only considers one of those axes wouldn't help any of the others. We need to create more opportunities, by funding more schools and destroying the capitalist system that hates paying for labor more than anything, but in the meantime I think keeping AA and working on additional ways to help people who have other barriers is the best we can do.
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Sep 6, 2020 23:07
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Huego posted:Hey, I'm also a shiftless anticapitalist philosophically opposed to mandatory working! This is horrifically accurate, lol
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Sep 6, 2020 23:13
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Bodhidharma posted:The University of Texas uses race as a factor in their admissions process for students who don't score within the top 10% of their class. This came after a series of "race-neutral" admissions changes scrapping affirmative action led to sharp enrollment decreases for minority students (African American enrollment dropped by 40% and Hispanic enrollment dropped by 5%). Without factoring race, student enrollment in UT schools under the top 10% admissions policy remained stagnant or worsened in some cases until race was included as part of a holistic review process. I didn't know that. I should probably clarify that I'm incredibly opposed to scrapping an existing affirmative action system for nothing at all. I'm also going to vote yes on 16 because having some system in place is better than none at all and the ban is way too much cover for racist shitheads trying to build all-white institutions. I did a bit more reading about 209 and it looks like it had a huge negative impact on minority enrollment and earnings in California for years, until the UC systems started doing holistic reviews that took in life experiences and circumstances and geography. So I guess what I'm saying is that it's possibleto construct inclusive systems without doubling down on racial constructions. I those systems align more to what I'd like the future to look like, but that's probably polyannish/utopian given the existing world we live in. El Mero Mero fucked around with this message at 00:09 on Sep 7, 2020 |
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Sep 7, 2020 00:04
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Centrist Committee posted:Huge swaths of the state are rapidly becoming unlivable for months on end and we’re tinkering around the edges of the meritocracy https://mobile.twitter.com/extremetemps/status/1302739558942023681 
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Sep 7, 2020 00:32
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Centrist Committee posted:Huge swaths of the state are rapidly becoming unlivable for months on end and we’re tinkering around the edges of the meritocracy if we just find the right incentives history will finally end
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Sep 7, 2020 00:42
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gently caress yeah, the numbers must always go up!
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Sep 7, 2020 00:49
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League of Women Voters ballot recommendations are up now too: https://lwvc.org/vote/elections/ballot-recommendations 14: Neutral quote:While the League of Women Voters of California supports ongoing stem cell research, we are neutral on Prop 14 because of the funding mechanism used and because of the requirement for a supermajority vote to amend its provisions. Prop 14 would authorize the use of general obligation bonds to continue funding stem cell research through the California Institute for Regenerative Medicine (CIRM). quote:The Schools & Communities First initiative will raise $12 billion every year for California’s schools, essential workers, and local governments. This will come by ensuring that all corporate properties worth more than $3 million pay their fair share of property taxes – while protecting homeowners and renters, small businesses, and agriculture. This money is needed now more than ever and is critical to California’s recovery and reinvestment. quote:Affirmative action in state hiring, contracting, and education was banned in California by Prop 209 in 1996. Prop 16 will reverse that ban and allow schools and public institutions to take race, ethnicity, color, national origin, and gender into consideration when admitting students to colleges, hiring employees for public jobs, and selecting contractors for public projects. Equal opportunity programs are a time-tested way to fight systemic racism and gender discrimination by leveling the playing field and giving everyone a chance at good public jobs and wages and quality public schools. quote:Restoring voting rights to Californians who have completed their prison term is a matter of justice, equity, and fundamental fairness. Right now, nearly 50,000 people who have been released from prison and are on parole are denied the right to vote - a right that is owed to every citizen and important to successful reintegration into the community. Our neighbors who are working, paying taxes, raising families, and rebuilding their lives deserve a voice in the policy-making that shapes their lives. And including their voices will help California achieve a more representative democracy. quote:Seventeen-year-olds who will be 18 by the next general election should be able to vote in primary and special elections. Prop 18 will give them that right. Young people are significantly underrepresented in California’s electorate. Allowing 17-year-olds to vote in primary and special elections will engage young voters while they are studying the issues in high school and have a strong interest in participation. Once voting begins it becomes a life-... quote:Prop 19 exacerbates an already inequitable property tax system - offering tax breaks to people who do not need them. Providing tax breaks to homeowners over 55 who purchase a replacement home, and allowing them to “transfer” their current tax assessment to a new home anywhere in the state, does nothing to help low-income seniors or families struggling to find housing. This proposition would allow not just one, but three such transfers. Senior citizens are already allowed to keep their current tax assessment when they purchase a home of equal or lesser value. quote:Over the past decade, California has made progress enacting laws that reduce the prison population and create a more effective and equitable public safety system. Prop 20 would roll back many advances in criminal justice reforms and reinstate a “get tough” law enforcement system that believes longer incarceration is a solution to crime. It would make minor theft of some goods worth over $250 punishable as a felony. It allows the state to collect DNA from people convicted of misdemeanors like shoplifting and drug possession. quote:The League supports efforts to help resolve California’s housing crisis. We promote solutions aimed at increasing housing production in a sustainable, accessible, and equitable manner. Rent control policies are one strategy to address California’s housing challenges, offer tenant protections, and prevent displacement. Rent control may be an effective short-term solution but studies suggest that its longer-term impact may, in certain cases, stifle the building of high-density and more affordable housing. 23: Neutral quote:This measure will require operators of chronic dialysis clinics to have a minimum of one licensed physician at the clinic whenever patients are being treated, offer the same level of care to all patients regardless of how payment is being made, and make reports about dialysis-related infections to the state’s health department and the National Healthcare Safety Network (NHSN). There is disagreement about whether the presence of a doctor is always necessary or could exacerbate a doctor shortage, and over whether costs are manageable or prohibitively high. quote:The League of Women Voters supports the protection of consumers’ private data. Prop 24 includes some beneficial elements, but we oppose due to the complexity of a 52-page initiative with impacts and nuances that are difficult for voters to discern and rollbacks to existing protections. Among the troubling aspects of Prop 24 is its expansion of “pay for privacy” through the addition of loyalty and rewards programs, allowing businesses to charge consumers more or provide worse service if they choose to exercise their privacy rights. quote:A YES vote on Prop 25 is a vote to replace the money bail system with the use of pretrial risk assessment tools that focus on safety and flight risk. It is estimated that almost 46,000 Californians, a disproportionate number of whom are Black and Latinx, are being held in jail because of their inability to afford bail. Cash bail both criminalizes poverty and reflects the systemic racism that plagues our criminal legal process.
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Sep 7, 2020 00:54
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I've been temporarily living out of state since August, so when I saw the California Heat Wave of Doom headlines I just figured it was a typical heat wave made worse by the fact that lots of people are trapped at home, probably embellished a bit by the media. Holy poo poo was I wrong. 120 degrees in SLO is completely crazy, and now I'm looking at a bunch of other coastal towns with similarly unlivable temperatures. I can't believe how awful this must be for everyone living in a place without air conditioning, let alone homeless people. Stay safe Cali goons!
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Sep 7, 2020 00:54
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Doc Hawkins posted:if we just find the right incentives history will finally end We've found them. It's just a matter of waiting a few more decades now. 
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Sep 7, 2020 00:54
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VikingofRock posted:I've been temporarily living out of state since August, so when I saw the California Heat Wave of Doom headlines I just figured it was a typical heat wave made worse by the fact that lots of people are trapped at home, probably embellished a bit by the media. Wait until you see the air quality numbers
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Sep 7, 2020 00:56
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Centrist Committee posted:Wait until you see the air quality numbers Or the annual toll of homes destroyed by wildfires.
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Sep 7, 2020 01:36
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Oh boy, the heat is causing power outages in the South Bay now 
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Sep 7, 2020 02:26
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Welp. https://twitter.com/russellgold/status/1302781496575627264 I just grabbed a last cold cider in case.
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Sep 7, 2020 02:41
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Centrist Committee posted:Wait until you see the air quality numbers For once the Inland Empire has better air quality than the Bay Area!
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Sep 7, 2020 02:49
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VikingofRock posted:I've been temporarily living out of state since August, so when I saw the California Heat Wave of Doom headlines I just figured it was a typical heat wave made worse by the fact that lots of people are trapped at home, probably embellished a bit by the media. 
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Sep 7, 2020 03:53
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i chose a good weekend to go camping in the desert. wasn't much hotter than anywhere else was! re the affirmative action/prop 16 thing, as someone mentioned, this repeals a ban; it does not establish or enforce a quota. i don't think the UC Regents or w/e are perfect, but they're probably reasonably capable of choosing whether to implement such a program, and how, at least as much as any of the rest of us are. you could make a argument about wanting to address broader class issues, sure, but as the ban in question concerns persons historically de facto relegated to a lower class, i can't really immediately disagree with something that closes off one avenue towards greater social equality entirely.
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Sep 7, 2020 04:06
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didn't all the racist white people get mad when they banned the affirmative action collegiate admissions because there was an explosion of asian admissions
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Sep 7, 2020 04:12
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https://twitter.com/CALFIREBDU/stat...ingawful.com%2F
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Sep 7, 2020 04:48
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H.P. Hovercraft posted:didn't all the racist white people get mad when they banned the affirmative action collegiate admissions because there was an explosion of asian admissions There are a number of lawsuits in progress against Harvard and other schools contending that their affirmative action policies essentially create a quota system that hurts the chances of Asian applicants being accepted.
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Sep 7, 2020 05:07
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again?!
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Sep 7, 2020 05:12
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Gender Reveal Parties were such a huge mistake that the woman who invented/popularized them has publicly apologized. If I ever have a baby I'm going to dress them in greens and yellows and never confirm the gender to anyone who asks. Gonna enjoy the consternation on the faces of many a gender essentialist. Do you call my baby a big strong fighter or a delicate little angel?? Their onesie won't help you!
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Sep 7, 2020 05:16
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Wicked Them Beats posted:If I ever have a baby I'm going to dress them in greens and yellows and never confirm the gender to anyone who asks. Gonna enjoy the consternation on the faces of many a gender essentialist. Do you call my baby a big strong fighter or a delicate little angel?? Their onesie won't help you! I got called out by a stranger on the subway for not dressing my infant daughter in pink. Seriously.
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Sep 7, 2020 05:17
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OF loving COURSE IT WAS
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Sep 7, 2020 05:18
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This fire season is loving absurd. The worst fire season on record was 2018 with 1.98 million acres burned and we were already at 1.83 million acres burned before this heatwave started.
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Sep 7, 2020 05:24
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i am so fuckin' tired
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Sep 7, 2020 05:27
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Foxfire_ posted:My ideal affirmative action program would trigger on wealth, not race, but that's harder to administer and in aggregate right now they're equivalent. Race-based affirmative action isn't perfect, but it's better than nothing. Unfortunately wealth based administration is extremely difficult if not impossible due to all the ways the wealthy and middle-upper class have of nullifying their non-salary income and wealth.
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Sep 7, 2020 05:37
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These people are a strong counterargument to the “abolish prisons” movement
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Sep 7, 2020 06:09
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gently caress them edit: doesn't even look pink or blue, just gray [img]  [/img]
withak fucked around with this message at 06:26 on Sep 7, 2020 |
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Sep 7, 2020 06:22
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Well that explains why I am sweating my rear end off here in Atascadero.
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Sep 7, 2020 06:31
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