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Tree Bucket posted:And that map there clearly shows a river flowing through a mountain range! That's an inexcusable error, and frankly lazy. Know you're jesting, but it's neat to know it just means the river is older than the mountains.
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 14:07 |
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# ? May 9, 2024 11:11 |
Duodecimal posted:Know you're jesting, but it's neat to know it just means the river is older than the mountains. See also: all the rivers flowing W-E through the Appalachians e: and the Appalachians are ooooooooooollllllld
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 14:55 |
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Faramir calls Sauron "Nameless" fairly regularly, but he's also hiding out in Ithilien at the time so he might be a bit more wary.
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 15:11 |
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Runcible Cat posted:Another question for the loremasters: when Aragorn and co first find the bodies of Isengard orcs they're looking at their S-rune insignia and Aragorn remarks that Sauron doesn't "use his right name, nor permit it to be spelt or spoken". The Encyclopedia of Arda tries to explain this. quote:In The Black Gate Opens, the Mouth of Sauron hails the Captains of the West with an introduction: 'I am the Mouth of Sauron'. This is somewhat problematic, because earlier in The Lord of the Rings, Aragorn says of Sauron that 'Neither does he use his right name, nor permit it to be spelt or spoken...' (The Two Towers III 1, The Departure of Boromir). The Mouth of Sauron, though, uses the name several times without apparent embarrassment. Further complicating this is the fact that, as was mentioned above, Sauron's "right name" was Mairon, though it does make sense for a mouthpiece to introduce himself by his master's most well-known name. I believe, though I'm not sure, that no other servant of Sauron uses the name Sauron, they call him epithets like The Eye, The Master, The Biggest, etc. So two solutions present themselves: either the EoA is correct above, and Aragorn's information is just out of date; or the Mouth and other spokespeople for Sauron have special permission to speak the name.
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 16:23 |
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The lotr is a imperfect source with translation errors so it’s hard to say what he really said at the gate
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 16:29 |
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I don’t think we can say that Mairon was still his “right name”. Original, sure, but not right. There’s nothing admirable about what Sauron has become except to his fellow megalomaniacs. Hell, maybe his original name is a casualty of his inability to take “fair shape” at this point.
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 16:53 |
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Or Tolkien just made a mistake
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 16:54 |
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I thinks it’s clear “Sauron” is not his endonym but a name in the hated colonial language used by the colonialists It’s makes sense he wouldn’t want his people to use it but the pro colonial translators would translate whatever the Mouth of Sauron’s name was to “Mouth of Sauron” or that the ambassador, being Numenorian, used it anyway as a relic of his heritage Or perhaps Saurons endonym isn’t possible in Westron
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 16:57 |
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William Bear posted:The Encyclopedia of Arda tries to explain this. maybe sauron had given him the right to use the s-word
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 17:33 |
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Data Graham posted:Yeah, it's really deceptively difficult to make a "realistic" map because reality isn't very plausible. I mean look at Central/South America, tell me that doesn't look like the work of a hack buenos aires sounds like a town name from a lovely jrpg
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 17:37 |
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Remember too that names hold power in Middle-Earth. When Frodo cries out on Weathertop the name of Elbereth holds real power to harm or frighten the Ringwraiths.
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 17:56 |
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Shibawanko posted:buenos aires sounds like a town name from a lovely jrpg "The town of Good-Air, because... the air is good? And it is the capital of Silvery-Land because they found a lot of silver there? Yeah right, get outta here you loving hack "
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 17:57 |
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System Metternich posted:"The town of Good-Air, because... the air is good? And it is the capital of Silvery-Land because they found a lot of silver there? Yeah right, get outta here you loving hack " the worst one is new zealand though. "north island" and "south island"
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 18:06 |
Data Graham posted:Yeah, it's really deceptively difficult to make a "realistic" map because reality isn't very plausible. I mean look at Central/South America, tell me that doesn't look like the work of a hack The world is full of places where people went "gently caress it, let's use a name again, put the word 'new' in front of it and hope nobody notices."
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 18:13 |
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Or they don't even bother with that, ala Paris, TX, Miami, OK, Lebanon, KS, etc
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 19:11 |
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ChubbyChecker posted:maybe sauron had given him the right to use the s-word Either that or the beam of light Frodo and Sam saw coming from Barad-dur was Sauron noticing and deciding big mouth was getting a nice long stay in the Halls of Lamentation when he got back.
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 19:11 |
perc2 fucked around with this message at 19:17 on Sep 21, 2020 |
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 19:13 |
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sweet geek swag posted:There is some interesting stuff with names in Lord of the Rings. Aragorn, for example, has four names (at least). Gandalf has a lot of names. Yet at no point are any of these names necessarily described as the true name of either Aragorn or Gandalf. Rather they use whatever name is appropriate for the time or place they happen to be in. quote:Then Aragorn entered first and the others followed. And there at the door were two guards in the livery of the Citadel: one tall, but the other scarce the height of a boy; and when he saw them he cried aloud in surprise and joy.
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 19:58 |
Alhazred posted:The world is full of places where people went "gently caress it, let's use a name again, put the word 'new' in front of it and hope nobody notices." I uh, didn’t mean place names, I’m talking about shapes. Like how there’s these two gigantic thicc landmasses held together by this ridiculously tiny little umbilical cord like someone was trying to make a deliberately obtuse Risk board
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 21:06 |
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Data Graham posted:I uh, didn’t mean place names, I’m talking about shapes. Like how there’s these two gigantic thicc landmasses held together by this ridiculously tiny little umbilical cord like someone was trying to make a deliberately obtuse Risk board And they didn't bother to put anything on half the globe. Just water! Couldn't they think of something to put there?
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 21:21 |
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antarctica is such a generic final dungeon kinda place
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 21:31 |
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Shibawanko posted:the worst one is new zealand though. "north island" and "south island" Britain has The Highlands and The Midlands. And the Lowlands/Netherlands are just over the Channel.
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 21:32 |
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Yeah, right next to People’s Land
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 21:38 |
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And the North Sea. How could I forget the North Sea? Generic AF!
Runcible Cat fucked around with this message at 22:01 on Sep 21, 2020 |
# ? Sep 21, 2020 21:58 |
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My favorite part of that map was assuming Scotland would be a naval power
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 22:01 |
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"Tonight, on the eve of our setting sail for Darien, I wish most fervently upon a monkey's paw that due to this great endeavour, all Scotsmen shall one day be part of the greatest naval empire in the world!"
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# ? Sep 21, 2020 22:32 |
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Yeah but what did you all thing about Mt Doom literally being a Morgoth sacred place. Likes it’s him. The lava is him
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 01:06 |
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euphronius posted:Yeah but what did you all thing about Mt Doom literally being a Morgoth sacred place. Likes it’s him. The lava is him I don't think much of it.
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 01:08 |
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euphronius posted:Yeah but what did you all thing about Mt Doom literally being a Morgoth sacred place. Likes it’s him. The lava is him Eh, it's not really supported in the text. I know that part of the reason Morgoth is such a wimp at the end of the first age is that he had poured too much of himself into Middle-Earth, but I don't think that meant he became lava.
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 01:25 |
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Not lava in general Wait. No yeah maybe lava in general ??
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 01:31 |
And Fëanor named him Moltar, the Dark Enemy of the World
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 01:41 |
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Mt Doom might have an in-dwelling spirit of some sort. Caradhras does. And I definitely agree that it was made by him, it’s right up his alley. It’s not Morgoth himself though. He’s thrown outside of the universe and no one can commune with him directly. Sauron’s and Pharazon’s religion to him is a deliberate fraud.
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 01:41 |
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skasion posted:Mt Doom might have an in-dwelling spirit of some sort. Caradhras does. And I definitely agree that it was made by him, it’s right up his alley. That's just what those Numenorian colonizers would say.
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 01:42 |
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skasion posted:Mt Doom might have an in-dwelling spirit of some sort. Caradhras does. And I definitely agree that it was made by him, it’s right up his alley. His spirit is still in the world like a horcr...... Phylactery I agree the little, scarred and burnt remains of Melkor are gone
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 01:46 |
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euphronius posted:Yeah but what did you all thing about Mt Doom literally being a Morgoth sacred place. Likes it’s him. The lava is him I like it
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 02:14 |
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euphronius posted:His spirit is still in the world like a horcr...... Phylactery Stick with horcrux. JK Rowling sucks, but that particular piece of her work doesn't have any unfortunate implications attached to it. Contrast that to the word phylactery, which associates a Jewish religious practice with evil and death.
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 02:19 |
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Man, wouldn't that just piss Fëanor off that he gets trumped out of being the Spirit of Fire by a dude who's just constantly lava?
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 02:20 |
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skasion posted:Mt Doom might have an in-dwelling spirit of some sort. Caradhras does. And I definitely agree that it was made by him, it’s right up his alley. Sounds painful
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 03:00 |
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ChubbyChecker posted:maybe sauron had given him the right to use the s-word Maybe, but why? He's a herald, not a fighter.
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 03:24 |
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# ? May 9, 2024 11:11 |
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Safety Biscuits posted:Maybe, but why? He's a herald, not a fighter. Because the Mouth is the closest thing Sauron has to a diplomat, and that's an important job. Using the boss' name in negotiations to intimidate his enemies is different than using it among your pals during water cooler talk.
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# ? Sep 22, 2020 04:08 |