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Well, I dropped off my ballot yesterday so that's over.
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Oct 15, 2020 10:04
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Class Warcraft posted:Land owners oppose new development because it threatens to undermine their property value, which is usually their largest asset. Why are you assuming renters will act likewise when they have no equity at stake? Building more housing has no direct impact on them beyond making it less scarce and therefore more affordable. Really I think we just need Tokyo's zoning system, American zoning restrictions are far too stringent and in the service of land owners instead of people who just need a place to live.
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Oct 15, 2020 11:18
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Spazzle posted:I know this is making GBS threads into the wind, but I'm going say here that rent control is a bad thing for exactly the same reason that prop 13 is bad. It creates a reactionary class of renters (rather than homeowners in prop 13) who can never move and will reflexively oppose any development. A high development environment has a nonzero chance of kicking them out of their low rent situation, so it becomes opposed on principle. It also fucks over the young for the benefit of those who got in long in the past. Lol
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Oct 15, 2020 12:38
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You gotta be the dumbest fucker in the world to look at the wages vs cost of living graph and determine that actually rent control is bad lol. That's excluding the bajillions of anecdotes, including my very own life lmao
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Oct 15, 2020 12:44
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Smythe posted:You gotta be the dumbest fucker in the world to look at the wages vs cost of living graph and determine that actually rent control is bad lol. That's excluding the bajillions of anecdotes, including my very own life lmao If Smythe isn't complete proof of my point that rent control creates a class of conservative reactionary FYGM renters who cloak themselves in faux populism, I don't know what else is.
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Oct 15, 2020 13:49
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Smythe, tell me, what is your go to complaint when someone proposes building an apartment in your town. Is it that it would bring in "gentrifiers"? Will the housing be too "luxury"? Maybe it will "change the character of our neighborhood"? Will there not be enough parking or the traffic it brings be too much? Maybe the building will be an "eyesore". Tell me, as you stand there blubbering in front of the planning commission, tears streaming from your eyes and snot dripping from your nose, what will your excuse be? I'm sure you have one, and I bet you've practiced your arguments as to why its not loving us over. But hey, you have a rent controlled apartment, so why would you care if people can't afford to move there? gently caress 'em, right?
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Oct 15, 2020 14:20
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Spazzle posted:If Smythe isn't complete proof of my point that rent control creates a class of conservative reactionary FYGM renters who cloak themselves in faux populism, I don't know what else is. Spazzle posted:Smythe, tell me, what is your go to complaint when someone proposes building an apartment in your town. Is it that it would bring in "gentrifiers"? Will the housing be too "luxury"? Maybe it will "change the character of our neighborhood"? Will there not be enough parking or the traffic it brings be too much? Maybe the building will be an "eyesore". peak delusional YIMBY channeled into a single poster
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Oct 15, 2020 15:32
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like log the gently caress off bro Smythe is more leftist than you'll ever be e: even if he does spend too much money on stonks
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Oct 15, 2020 15:36
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Spazzle posted:Smythe, tell me, what is your go to complaint when someone proposes building an apartment in your town. Is it that it would bring in "gentrifiers"? Will the housing be too "luxury"? Maybe it will "change the character of our neighborhood"? Will there not be enough parking or the traffic it brings be too much? Maybe the building will be an "eyesore". Lol, the forums need to start giving out chloe awards for performances like these
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Oct 15, 2020 15:54
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Spazzle posted:Smythe, tell me, what is your go to complaint when someone proposes building an apartment in your town. Is it that it would bring in "gentrifiers"? Will the housing be too "luxury"? Maybe it will "change the character of our neighborhood"? Will there not be enough parking or the traffic it brings be too much? Maybe the building will be an "eyesore". in my city the people who talk like you vote for republican-funded candidates
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Oct 15, 2020 16:21
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When Massachusetts got rid of rent control to gently caress over Boston, rents went up drastically (even on non-rent-controlled units!), evictions skyrocketed, and development didn't increase. But surely we can try the same experiment again but this time in California! Rent control keeps people who are low-income in their homes near their work, and you know who uses public transit? People who are low-income. When you gentrify neighborhoods and push all the people living there out to the periphery so that you can get high-income people closer to their jobs for them to have a shorter commute, you also are removing the backbone of the public transit demand, and a huge chunk the high-income people that move in and replace the low-income people will take uber instead of the bus. Tokyo's zoning system works not because of Tokyo's zoning system but because Tokyo has way less income inequality and way higher inheritance taxes. The US zoning system would work if the lower 3 quintiles of population by income had enough income and wealth for developers to develop housing for.
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Oct 15, 2020 16:24
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Foxfire_ posted:Ballots are printed with the order of candidates shuffled randomly because otherwise the person at the top wins more. We are not clever apes. Yeah, mine has Trump at the top spot and Biden at the bottom with Kanye in the middle.
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Oct 15, 2020 16:28
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Dirk the Average posted:Yeah, mine has Trump at the top spot and Biden at the bottom with Kanye in the middle. Specifically, California orders candidates by a randomized alphabet created a couple days after the candidate registration deadline (about three months before the election is held). That alphabet is then rotated for each district (i.e. District 1 has I,L,E,O,A while District 2 has L,E,O,A,I). It's the standard of best practices, and ensures everyone gets an equal advantage.
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Oct 15, 2020 16:33
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Eminent Domain posted:I'm extremely torn on the bail prop but I think I fall in the camp of '"if this gets voted down it's going to be along while before cash bail is under threat again" because that's probably what most messaging will seize on. I definitely am pushing for the election of progressive DAs as well to come at the problem at both ends but cash bail is a loving travesty Sydin posted:The hardest No vote I've ever cast: 25. Several posters have made good arguments here for why it is worse than the status quo. And ultimately a) I do not trust the CA Democrats to do anything usefully progressive and fix this broken legislation, and b) if I believed in voting for lovely half measures because they might possibly be better than what we have now if you squint, I wouldn't have this No Joe tag. It loving sucks that a No vote could potentially send a message to the legislature that cash bail is popular, but I'm more worried that 25 passes and the legislature refuses to fix the law under the guise of "reform has already been passed" when in fact "reform" has just further entrenched an incredibly racist system. Just throwing out another recommendation to watch that video that Jaxyon posted last page from JusticeLA, it makes the most clear and convincing argument against 25 that I’ve encountered yet. The whole thing like 80 mins long but if you skip the first 5-10 mins of intro and then just listen to each panelist give their opening statement, you only need to watch like 20 mins. It might not change your vote if you’re already leaning No, but if you’re like me it may help clear your conscience and make it easier to explain to friends why a No vote is good.
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Oct 15, 2020 16:38
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I don't post in this thread often enough to keep track of the multi-year blood feuds some of its posters are harboring, but it's really hilarious to me when some poster will make a random two sentence post and several others will pop out of the woodwork with multi-paragraph meltdowns. Keep on being you California thread.
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Oct 15, 2020 16:40
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Anonymous Zebra posted:I don't post in this thread often enough to keep track of the multi-year blood feuds some of its posters are harboring, but it's really hilarious to me when some poster will make a random two sentence post and several others will pop out of the woodwork with multi-paragraph meltdowns. Keep on being you California thread. Meanwhile there is an SRO (actual affordable housing) that is slated to be torn down for redevelopment a couple blocks over. CopperHound fucked around with this message at 16:51 on Oct 15, 2020 |
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Oct 15, 2020 16:48
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Doc Hawkins posted:in my city the people who talk like you vote for republican-funded candidates Ok, that's nice. I still contend if you justify self serving conservative policies as leftist you still aren't one. I don't care if you mumble some kind of solution that amounts to "full communism now" and "let the cities build free housing". Come up with some theory of how to match the supply of housing with the need for it and we'll talk. In the mean time I'm sure we'll all dunk on each other. And given that this is about CA politics, we should all be aware that there are plenty of democrats who are just republicans who have deserted the clownshow of the CA republican party in order to get elected.
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Oct 15, 2020 16:56
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fermun posted:When Massachusetts got rid of rent control to gently caress over Boston, rents went up drastically (even on non-rent-controlled units!), evictions skyrocketed, and development didn't increase. But surely we can try the same experiment again but this time in California! if anything, rent control shouldn't be tied to residence size or construction dates at all this whole "anything built before 1980 that's over 4 units" or whatever is just plain bullshit, it should protect all renters and no landlord should be exempt
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Oct 15, 2020 17:06
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I found a good article that outlines some of the strongest arguments in favor and in opposition to Prop 25. A lot of this has been echoed in the thread already, but it's still a good read. One issue that I haven't seen brought up with voting no on Prop 25 is that it would constitutionally prohibit the legislature from passing similar legislation, so it could make passing the elimination of bail much more difficult. https://www.courthousenews.com/the-strange-bedfellows-of-proposition-25-and-californias-fight-to-end-cash-bail/
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Oct 15, 2020 17:30
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Anonymous Zebra posted:I don't post in this thread often enough to keep track of the multi-year blood feuds some of its posters are harboring, but it's really hilarious to me when some poster will make a random two sentence post and several others will pop out of the woodwork with multi-paragraph meltdowns. Keep on being you California thread. Another classic Anonymous Zebra post.
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Oct 15, 2020 17:41
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Anonymous Zebra posted:I don't post in this thread often enough to keep track of the multi-year blood feuds some of its posters are harboring, but it's really hilarious to me when some poster will make a random two sentence post and several others will pop out of the woodwork with multi-paragraph meltdowns. Keep on being you California thread. The funniest part is it's not even a blood feud, I don't think they've ever interacted before. That's just how people entrenched in the housing discourse in CA talk to each other.
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Oct 15, 2020 17:45
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Marketing New Brain posted:What kind of justice org focused around people of color is silent on prop 22 on their own ballot recommendation? The kind that specifically focuses on specific justice issues, like 25 and Measure J. They are solidarity partners with BLM and SURJ both of which are vocally No on 22.
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Oct 15, 2020 17:48
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Spazzle posted:Ok, that's nice. I still contend if you justify self serving conservative policies as leftist you still aren't one. I don't care if you mumble some kind of solution that amounts to "full communism now" and "let the cities build free housing". Come up with some theory of how to match the supply of housing with the need for it and we'll talk. In the mean time I'm sure we'll all dunk on each other. SUPPLY AND DEMAND! https://twitter.com/haircut_hippie/status/804186152471265280 Yet your theory of supply and demand has no ability to incorporate a concept such as induced demand. When you gentrify a neighborhood, a lot more high-income people move in, and then they, in turn, eat out more, requiring more demand for low-income restaurant workers, they don't take the bus they take ubers, building more demand for low-income uber drivers, and it goes on and on. Why is your demand always to build market-rate housing in low income neighborhoods and you never try to work with the low-income tenant activists to force low income housing in high-income neighborhoods. Development activists show their true colors by their actions, which is always to try to gentrify and never to try to get affordable housing built in or near high-income neighborhoods. You're justifying conservative policies and your only response is a conservative answer of letting the market forces work.
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Oct 15, 2020 17:51
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Who's ready to ShakeOut?? Duck, cover, hold on, and call in sick to work!
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Oct 15, 2020 18:14
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fermun posted:SUPPLY AND DEMAND!
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Oct 15, 2020 18:18
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CPColin posted:Who's ready to ShakeOut?? Duck, cover, hold on, and call in sick to work! I guess there's a silver lining in my office being closed for a full week for deep cleaning because we had a positive test last Friday after all.
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Oct 15, 2020 18:20
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wat https://twitter.com/sfchronicle/status/1316791471173967873?s=21
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Oct 15, 2020 18:39
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Spazzle posted:This your problem Fermun, I've said no such thing, but you're too hopped up on your assumptions about who you think I am and what I believe and advocate. Ok, but you espouse conservative talking points using conservative reasoning so..........?????? What do you believe and advocate for? You've posted that rent control is bad and that people who cry because they're being gentrified and evicted out of their homes are just reactionary whiners, but you are accurate that you've not stated what you believe or advocate for, just that you do not believe or advocate for low income people that are already living in their homes (though it does seem like you might support the right to affordable housing for some future poor people at an undefined time maybe 20-40 years hence?).
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Oct 15, 2020 18:48
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Spazzle posted:This your problem Fermun, I've said no such thing, but you're too hopped up on your assumptions about who you think I am and what I believe and advocate. 
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Oct 15, 2020 19:16
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This is your regular "gently caress Diane Feinstein" post https://twitter.com/sahilkapur/status/1316805807753879555
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Oct 15, 2020 19:46
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GrandpaPants posted:This is your regular "gently caress Diane Feinstein" post I mean, yeah gently caress DiFi, but also she's senile and has no idea what's going on.
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Oct 15, 2020 19:47
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Jaxyon posted:I mean, yeah gently caress DiFi, but also she's senile and has no idea what's going on. She hugged Lindsey Graham so at least her odds of catching the Rona and subsequently entering "early" retirement are looking up.
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Oct 15, 2020 19:58
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Vox Nihili posted:She hugged Lindsey Graham so at least her odds of catching the Rona and subsequently entering "early" retirement are looking up. Look at the optimist over here!
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Oct 15, 2020 20:24
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I hate her so much.
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Oct 15, 2020 20:28
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Vox Nihili posted:She hugged Lindsey Graham so at least her odds of catching the Rona and subsequently entering "early" retirement are looking up. liches are immune to disease unfortunately.
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Oct 15, 2020 20:28
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Jaxyon posted:I mean, yeah gently caress DiFi, but This is where you lost me, my dude.
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Oct 15, 2020 20:45
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ratbert90 posted:
Same here, although I wish I'd looked into LaRiva a little more, I thought the Peace & Freedom party was the one that were secret Nazis/Libertarians but it seems I was thinking of something else. MAKE NO BABBYS fucked around with this message at 20:53 on Oct 15, 2020 |
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Oct 15, 2020 20:49
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Glass of Milk posted:The algorithm is reviewed by the Judicial Council. I suspect that review will be public knowledge. Thank you.
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Oct 15, 2020 20:53
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Kenning posted:I hate her so much.  As someone who was around when she was mayor, I fully agree with that post.
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Oct 15, 2020 21:04
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Spazzle posted:Smythe, tell me, what is your go to complaint when someone proposes building an apartment in your town. Is it that it would bring in "gentrifiers"? Will the housing be too "luxury"? Maybe it will "change the character of our neighborhood"? Will there not be enough parking or the traffic it brings be too much? Maybe the building will be an "eyesore". i don't know what, well, basically anything you wrote up there has to do with rent control. seems to be a lot of empty regurgitated rhetoric painting me as a nimby or something, which has nothing to do with the material conditions of life and the intersection of housing and wages. i dont think rent should be able to go up a million percent year over year with no recourse? i cant imagine living with that kind of instability. take my 10 unit bungalow courtyard in hollywood for example. i rented here 10 years ago, under rent control my rent goes up 3% every year. thats already a lot but i guess if you worked for a good employer that would track with cola. but consider this, when a unit goes vacant and moves to market rate and new peeps move in, you know what the percent difference is between that unit and mine? 72%. more than double rent control. as a personal anecdote, i live and work in the same neighborhood, walk to work etc. take a guess at the totality of raises I've gotten in the 13 years ive been at my company (nonprofit.) 5% i dont think i could raise a family not knowing if my rent would jack up 20% month to month or upon lease expiration/renewal. people should be allowed the dignity of stability. people should not have to live with the looming terror of housing insecurity. it is your home. it is your only sanctuary in this world. Smythe fucked around with this message at 21:07 on Oct 15, 2020 |
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Oct 15, 2020 21:04
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