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therobit posted:This mentality is exactly the type of thinking that could plunge us into a civil war. "Anything we do to stop them is legitimate" is also what those morons are saying right now, and that's how you get cycles of reciprocal violence that last for generations. Civil war is a terrible idea so long as political options still exist. In NC they just beat up and dispersed with gas and pepper spray a “Souls to the Poles” event.
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Oct 31, 2020 23:41
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Thanatosian posted:It's important to remember that no matter what they do, we never, ever do anything that violates decorum. You guys know that there are other actions available than extralegal violence right? And I have no problem with people arming themselves and responding as an incident is occurring, but forming our own death squads is not the way forward. The fact that this is a controversial position to you probably means you are mentally ill.
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Oct 31, 2020 23:46
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generic one posted:Right-wing domestic terrorists have clearly shown they have zero problem with violence, but I think we’re verging on some mind-boggling scenarios in which they have the collective foresight and organizational skills to coordinate a national civil war type scenario. Hey it sounds like you just woke up from a coma, because you cited something that literally kicked off during the Obama administration. Hope you have a fun time catching up with the actual things that are occurring on the streets this week, I'm sure it will be pretty upsetting!
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Oct 31, 2020 23:50
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Guys guys maybe you shouldn’t be doing this thing you aren’t doing that the right is totally doing out in the open. That’s you. It’s that stupid.
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Oct 31, 2020 23:50
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therobit posted:You guys know that there are other actions available than extralegal violence right? And I have no problem with people arming themselves and responding as an incident is occurring, but forming our own death squads is not the way forward. The fact that this is a controversial position to you probably means you are mentally ill. Name calling isn't helpful. Responding to right wing oppressive violence with violence of your own is a very natural thought process. I think it's an unhelpful one that likely leads to even worse outcomes but the idea of proactive defense very far from crazy.
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Oct 31, 2020 23:52
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therobit posted:You guys know that there are other actions available than extralegal violence right? And I have no problem with people arming themselves and responding as an incident is occurring, but forming our own death squads is not the way forward. The fact that this is a controversial position to you probably means you are mentally ill. Presumably you support doxxing them then, so that public pressure can be brought to bear to force them from public office, out of their jobs, and to isolate them socially.
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Oct 31, 2020 23:52
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therobit posted:You guys know that there are other actions available than extralegal violence right? And I have no problem with people arming themselves and responding as an incident is occurring, but forming our own death squads is not the way forward. The fact that this is a controversial position to you probably means you are mentally ill.  Pictured: the mentally ill
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Oct 31, 2020 23:54
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Unoriginal Name posted:
The Black Panthers never engaged in a campaign of targetted violence against anyone, HTH.
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Nov 1, 2020 00:11
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Thanatosian posted:They're already prepping to throw the election to Trump. Democrats are voting mail-in in droves, and they've hosed the postal service, and have put in place a Supreme Court that will more than happily throw out all ballots received after election day in most swing states. The Democrats are going to be left with the options of go along with it, or risk starting a civil war themselves, and I think we all know how that's going to go. Just because they’re trying to rig the election doesn’t mean they’re going to succeed. I realize 2016 broke all of our brains, but there are legitimate reasons to believe 2020 isn’t going to work out that way. I feel like the reasons for that optimism are better suited for the Polliwonks thread, but suffice to say, things aren’t looking great for Tromp, even with the voter suppression and court shenanigans. Gerund posted:Hey it sounds like you just woke up from a coma, because you cited something that literally kicked off during the Obama administration. Hope you have a fun time catching up with the actual things that are occurring on the streets this week, I'm sure it will be pretty upsetting! I’m fully aware of what’s going on out there right now. The reason for the comparison is once Donald’s sent packing (fingers crossed, Inshallah), the assholes who have gone full megaphone instead of just dog whistling will more than likely gently caress off to whatever caves they emerged from. Sure, there’s a chance they may stick around and do some ad-hoc violence for their big, strong, powerful Daddy Trump, but to imply there’s going to be a civil war if Joe Biden gets elected is on another level.
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Nov 1, 2020 00:35
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Just remember: if you're going to participate in extralegal "proactive defense" against "fascists" in the PNW you better have beautiful shot placement. No reason to be wary about people being just a bit overzealous given the hysterics surrounding the election.
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Nov 1, 2020 00:39
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generic one posted:Just because they’re trying to rig the election doesn’t mean they’re going to succeed. I realize 2016 broke all of our brains, but there are legitimate reasons to believe 2020 isn’t going to work out that way. I feel like the reasons for that optimism are better suited for the Polliwonks thread, but suffice to say, things aren’t looking great for Tromp, even with the voter suppression and court shenanigans. they succeeded in 2000 and 2004.
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Nov 1, 2020 01:08
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The Voice of Labor posted:they succeeded in 2000 and 2004. That’s fair, but I don’t think it’s gonna be close enough for that to happen this year. I’d be willing to do a charity bet on it (PNW charities only, since we’re in the local PNW thread).
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Nov 1, 2020 01:22
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The Voice of Labor posted:they succeeded in 2000 and 2004. Nah, Bush won in 2004. They only stole it in 2000.
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Nov 1, 2020 01:29
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therobit posted:Nah, Bush won in 2004. They only stole it in 2000. It's pretty loving amazing when you look at how different the world would be without Bush v. Gore.
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Nov 1, 2020 01:31
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therobit posted:Nah, Bush won in 2004. They only stole it in 2000. there are better sources, but this one is convenient https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Conspiracies#Election_Theft
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Nov 1, 2020 01:40
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The Voice of Labor posted:there are better sources, but this one is convenient So... just based on your bypassing on my reply, guessing that’s a “No” on the bet, then.
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Nov 1, 2020 01:48
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therobit posted:Nah, Bush won in 2004. They only stole it in 2000. There was a devastating article from Harper's which makes it pretty clear 2004 was stolen also. Unfortunately it's paywalled, but you may be able to find it somewhere. It was highly unreported by the media because of the implications.
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Nov 1, 2020 01:58
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generic one posted:So... just based on your bypassing on my reply, guessing that’s a “No” on the bet, then. yeah, I don't consider the odds to really be decisive either way. knowing that the republican party has stolen two of the past five elections isn't some kind of hot insider tip, it's just what they do. if you want to send some money to a good cause don't let a wager over whether the party hates trump enough to not gently caress with vote tallies slow you down.
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Nov 1, 2020 02:33
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generic one posted:I’m fully aware of what’s going on out there right now. The reason for the comparison is once Donald’s sent packing (fingers crossed, Inshallah), the assholes who have gone full megaphone instead of just dog whistling will more than likely gently caress off to whatever caves they emerged from. Sure, there’s a chance they may stick around and do some ad-hoc violence for their big, strong, powerful Daddy Trump, but to imply there’s going to be a civil war if Joe Biden gets elected is on another level. I'd like to apologize for the coma comment, since it looks like the real missing piece you have for the last two posts is that there is a "Lame Duck" period for presidents after an election that goes all the way to January of the next year. This means that no matter what occurs in the next week, the fash running over people at vigils for the extrajudicially murdered are still going to be just as able to operate as they were before in a state with a blue-team governors. While it may get you called mentally ill by some decorum weirdos, this political violence is something people need to organize against with a plan better than "wear a suit & tie".
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Nov 1, 2020 02:34
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The Voice of Labor posted:yeah, I don't consider the odds to really be decisive either way. knowing that the republican party has stolen two of the past five elections isn't some kind of hot insider tip, it's just what they do. I’m already donating cash to good causes, the challenge is to whether or not you feel confident in your opinion that the election is going to be stolen again. The bet still stands, until Monday. Willing to do up to, I dunno, two hundred. Gerund posted:I'd like to apologize for the coma comment, since it looks like the real missing piece you have for the last two posts is that there is a "Lame Duck" period for presidents after an election that goes all the way to January of the next year. I’m not disputing that there there may be an increase in random white supremacist violence in the wake of the election, just like there’s been for the past four years. I just think those right-wing militias, like those we see in the PNW, aren’t gonna commit to their civil war cause like they’ve been telegraphing whenever they get a few minutes on television. As far as the decorum thing is concerned, I think you must have me confused with another poster. I’ve never suggested that decorum, nor wearing a suit and tie, is the answer. I’m a firm believer in punching Nazis.
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Nov 1, 2020 02:59
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President just tweeted video of the CHUDs that tried to run the Biden campaign bus off the road in TX. Therobit that’s what targeted political violence looks like.
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Nov 1, 2020 03:08
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Bar Ran Dun posted:President just tweeted video of the CHUDs that tried to run the Biden campaign bus off the road in TX. I didn't believe you but the tweet is actually better https://twitter.com/realDonaldTrump/status/1322700188624932869?s=20
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Nov 1, 2020 05:32
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Lmao im the guy saying civil war 2 isn't already here.
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Nov 1, 2020 05:35
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If the election goes D, it’ll get worse then stabilize at lovely. If it goes R this is 33 plan accordingly.
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Nov 1, 2020 05:54
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Thanatosian posted:They're already prepping to throw the election to Trump. Democrats are voting mail-in in droves, and they've hosed the postal service, and have put in place a Supreme Court that will more than happily throw out all ballots received after election day in most swing states. The Democrats are going to be left with the options of go along with it, or risk starting a civil war themselves, and I think we all know how that's going to go. They’re early voting in droves, that’s a rather important difference.
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Nov 1, 2020 06:25
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The Oldest Man posted:I didn't believe you but the tweet is actually better
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Nov 1, 2020 09:01
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Nov 1, 2020 19:54
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therobit posted:You guys know that there are other actions available than extralegal violence right? And I have no problem with people arming themselves and responding as an incident is occurring, but forming our own death squads is not the way forward. The fact that this is a controversial position to you probably means you are mentally ill. The point of militias is to combat the state when it oversteps its bounds against the populace. I find it odd to not understand this when the president is heavily hinting that he will not leave office.
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Nov 2, 2020 01:11
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The National Guard is what really is the militia folks.
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Nov 2, 2020 01:16
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punk rebel ecks posted:The point of militias is to combat the state when it oversteps its bounds against the populace. I find it odd to not understand this when the president is heavily hinting that he will not leave office. I'm totally cool with forming militias as long as they aren't engaged in violence. In the event of Trump losing the election and refusing to leave office, if the military did not remove him forcibly, we would already be in a civil war at that point and my objections to political violence would be mooted. I would be joining said militia at that point if I didn't have a way out of the country.
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Nov 2, 2020 03:49
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therobit posted:I would be joining said militia Whatever you gotta tell yourself to get to sleep at night my guy
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Nov 2, 2020 04:25
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Drove to Seattle and back to Portland today and holy hell, so many bro-dozers on parade between Tacoma and Oly.
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Nov 2, 2020 04:32
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IM DAY DAY IRL posted:Whatever you gotta tell yourself to get to sleep at night my guy How many guns do YOU own? Can you shoot them? If you're so sure that forming militias is the way then which militia do you belong to?
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Nov 2, 2020 04:34
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therobit posted:I'm totally cool with forming militias as long as they aren't engaged in violence. In the event of Trump losing the election and refusing to leave office, if the military did not remove him forcibly, we would already be in a civil war at that point and my objections to political violence would be mooted. I would be joining said militia at that point if I didn't have a way out of the country. The person leaving the restaurant doesn't get to order for the table. You've backpedaled to advocating for nothing but looking for the exit: this is fine, you do you. But the people who aren't bailing on the region have a good reason to organize. No matter what happens, the next three months is going to involve fash out on the streets committing political violence and the extrajudicial murder of our fellows, as seen over the last week. To be glib, there will be loving Around. I, personally, do not think anyone will stop loving Around until it is made clear that they will Find Out. And holy poo poo do not start militia card-checking people on a public forum lol
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Nov 2, 2020 04:37
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Gerund posted:The person leaving the restaurant doesn't get to order for the table. You've backpedaled to advocating for nothing but looking for the exit: this is fine, you do you. But the people who aren't bailing on the region have a good reason to organize. Self defense is perfectly fine. If you decide to go out hunting you're a domestic terrorist and a complete piece of trash. therobit fucked around with this message at 04:42 on Nov 2, 2020 |
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Nov 2, 2020 04:40
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therobit posted:Self defense is perfectly fine. If you decide to go out hunting you're a domestic terrorist and a complete piece of trash. Start engaging with the posters in this thread instead of whatever perceived strawmen you are imagining. As far as I can tell not a single person in this thread has advocated for preemptively hunting down Trump supporters and have explicitly advocated for self-defense.
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Nov 2, 2020 04:48
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In Denver, a fash streetfighter got airholed by a Pinkerton security guard; whether that was self defense or chud-hunting is an academic distinction to be decided by the people who stick around. I would have liked to be able to use the similar Portland case for the closeness for the region. But wouldn't you know, it looks like there was one of those extrajudicial murders, just a little political violence that has become a constant in the region.
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Nov 2, 2020 05:21
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DrNutt posted:Start engaging with the posters in this thread instead of whatever perceived strawmen you are imagining. As far as I can tell not a single person in this thread has advocated for preemptively hunting down Trump supporters and have explicitly advocated for self-defense. I was responding to someone saying that it is ok to target the other side for retributive violence and that if you don't want to participate then you should shut up. And people apparently have a problem with the notion that political violence is bad to engage in even if the other side does it to you first.
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Nov 2, 2020 07:38
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therobit posted:I was responding to someone saying that it is ok to target the other side for retributive violence and that if you don't want to participate then you should shut up. And people apparently have a problem with the notion that political violence is bad to engage in even if the other side does it to you first. Decorum for our time. We will show them decorum when they murder us in cars. We will show them decorum when they come into our homes and murder us without warrants. We will show them decorum when they run buses off the road. We will show them decorum when they attack federal facilities. Decorum when they put children in cages. Decorum when they use tear gas on peaceful protestors. Decorum at any cost.
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Nov 2, 2020 08:27
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pseudanonymous posted:Decorum for our time. We will show them decorum when they murder us in cars. We will show them decorum when they come into our homes and murder us without warrants. We will show them decorum when they run buses off the road. We will show them decorum when they attack federal facilities. Decorum when they put children in cages. Decorum when they use tear gas on peaceful protestors. This seems like an intentional mischaracterization of what I am saying. I agree with arming up for self defense. Going on the offensive is domestic terrorism. We are probably going to win the election and then my ardent hope is that the FBI will be allowed to mop the floor with what they have been saying for 12 years is the greatest domestic threat to national security.
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Nov 2, 2020 08:43
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