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WaltherFeng
May 15, 2013

50 thousand people used to live here. Now, it's the Mushroom Kingdom.

wafflemoose posted:

Control is alot of fun but the combat basically devolves into spamming Launch over and over again since the Service Weapon's doesn't do enough damage against the higher level enemies. Feels like Pierce and Charge are the only forms that can keep up with Launch's damage. Not that yeeting stuff at enemies isn't fun mind you, it's just a shame that enemies become bullet sponges later on. Oh, and the number of times I've blown myself up with Surge is embarrassing, especially if you stuck a blast radius mod on it like I did.

Also been playing Ace Combat 7 and I've beginning to come to the conclusion that alot of the missions are way too gimmicky for my tastes, there's not enough missions where you just blow things up without some sort of curveball being thrown at you.

Thats Ace Combat 7 yeah. All the missions have some unique hazard that you need to deal with. I hated it at first especially since I never play flying games but in retrospect I had a lot of fun with the campaign and played in less than a week.

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Captain Hygiene
Sep 17, 2007

You mess with the crabbo...



Man it's tough to go straight from AC Odyssey combat to AC Valhalla combat. The former just feels smooth, you can block and parry all day long if you want. In Valhalla it's all tied to stamina: dodging, heavy attacks, and blocking (for heavy attacks at least?) use it up, and you have to refill it via light attacks. It turns everything much slower and more deliberate, and I feel a lot less capable since I'm now mostly a very close range fighter, which makes dodging/building up stamina tricky sometimes. I'm sure it was a deliberate decision, but I don't know that I could ever prefer it.

wafflemoose
Apr 10, 2009

There's too many games that have AC as it's abbreviation, it could mean either Ace Combat, Assassin's Creed, or Armored Core. It's confusing sometimes.

Captain Hygiene
Sep 17, 2007

You mess with the crabbo...



wafflemoose posted:

There's too many games that have AC as it's abbreviation, it could mean either Ace Combat, Assassin's Creed, or Armored Core. It's confusing sometimes.

Ace Combat Valhalla: the combat is slow and clunky because I'm using 9th century aircraft technology

christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs 🎤of siren 🧜🏻‍♀️songs
To oohs😮 to ahhs😱 to 👏big👏applause👏
With all of my 😡anger I scream🤬 and shout📢
🇺🇸America🦅, I love you 🥰but you're freaking 💦me 😳out
Biscuit Hider
Armored Core: Ace Combat: The Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla: Rising

RareAcumen
Dec 28, 2012




christmas boots posted:

Armored Core: Ace Combat: The Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla: Rising

Armored Core: Ace Combat: The Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla: Rising: Animal Crossing

christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs 🎤of siren 🧜🏻‍♀️songs
To oohs😮 to ahhs😱 to 👏big👏applause👏
With all of my 😡anger I scream🤬 and shout📢
🇺🇸America🦅, I love you 🥰but you're freaking 💦me 😳out
Biscuit Hider

RareAcumen posted:

Armored Core: Ace Combat: The Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla: Rising: Animal Crossing

:The Legend of Curly's Gold

Captain Hygiene
Sep 17, 2007

You mess with the crabbo...



RareAcumen posted:

Armored Core: Ace Combat: The Assassin’s Creed: Valhalla: Rising: Animal Crossing

Let's boil this down to Animal Combat and Assassin's Crossing.

moosecow333
Mar 15, 2007

Super-Duper Supermen!
Anno 2205 has a bunch of really nice quality of life improvements that as a whole kinda drag the game down for me.

Instead of separate islands you now have different sectors and all resources in one sector are shared to every island in that sector. While it is much easier to produce stuff I felt like a huge part of the game was moving stuff from island to island to keep the supply chain going but it’s now basically all handled for you automatically.

The game very clearly tells you how much of each product a building produces or consumes so there is no more guess work involved, but I enjoyed spending the time to make sure my production went well.

It seems like the game has much more focus on you adding moduals to your factories to increase production as opposed to having you build another mine or work building. Again, it means things are easier for you but now you don’t really have to balance having production buildings vs population buildings and you don’t need to expand from your starting island for a good while cause the mining moduals take up no extra space.

All and all each change sounds good on paper but as a whole makes for a much simpler experience.

The Shame Boy
Jan 27, 2014

Dead weight, just like this post.



WaltherFeng posted:

Thats Ace Combat 7 yeah. All the missions have some unique hazard that you need to deal with. I hated it at first especially since I never play flying games but in retrospect I had a lot of fun with the campaign and played in less than a week.

Oh cool! A level with lots of ground targets! Lets take out the A-10 for this mission! Haha cannon go brrrrr What do you mean i now have to shoot down a flying fortress that's shooting lasers at me that has 20 fast as hell drones as it's escort :psyduck:

No amount of deflecting damage to an unimportant part of your plane will get you past something like that.

The Shame Boy has a new favorite as of 00:43 on Nov 18, 2020

Boxman
Sep 27, 2004

Big fan of :frog:


wafflemoose posted:

There's too many games that have AC as it's abbreviation, it could mean either Ace Combat, Assassin's Creed, or Armored Core. It's confusing sometimes.

I was playing Doom Eternal while my friend was playing through Disco Elysium and we ran into similar problems.

The mashup of those two games would be real weird though.

The Shame Boy
Jan 27, 2014

Dead weight, just like this post.



Animal Crossing:Valhalla

Captain Hygiene
Sep 17, 2007

You mess with the crabbo...



The Shame Boy posted:

Animal Crossing:Valhalla

peter gabriel
Nov 8, 2011

Hello Commandos
Assetto Corsa: Valhalla

rydiafan
Mar 17, 2009


Boxman posted:

I was playing Doom Eternal while my friend was playing through Disco Elysium and we ran into similar problems.

The mashup of those two games would be real weird though.

I can think of nothing better than Disco Elysium with The Doom Slayer as the main character.

Paper Tiger
Jun 17, 2007

🖨️🐯torn apart by idle hands

rydiafan posted:

I can think of nothing better than Disco Elysium with The Doom Slayer as the main character.

Mr. Evrart is helping me find my gun rocket launcher.

Doctor Spaceman
Jul 6, 2010

"Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."

Boxman posted:

I was playing Doom Eternal while my friend was playing through Disco Elysium and we ran into similar problems.

The mashup of those two games would be real weird though.

As long as it's called Disco Inferno.

SkeletonHero
Sep 7, 2010

:dehumanize:
:killing:
:dehumanize:
Doom Slayer and Kim would be a true unstoppable force/immovable object scenario.

The Lone Badger
Sep 24, 2007

Captain Hygiene posted:

Let's boil this down to Animal Combat and Assassin's Crossing.

Armoured Creed could be fun too.

John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.

wafflemoose posted:

Control is alot of fun but the combat basically devolves into spamming Launch over and over again since the Service Weapon's doesn't do enough damage against the higher level enemies. Feels like Pierce and Charge are the only forms that can keep up with Launch's damage. Not that yeeting stuff at enemies isn't fun mind you, it's just a shame that enemies become bullet sponges later on. Oh, and the number of times I've blown myself up with Surge is embarrassing, especially if you stuck a blast radius mod on it like I did.

Idk, I found Shatter to be consistently strong throughout the game, not even counting the crazy good DLC mod for it.

dracula vladdy AF
May 6, 2011

The Shame Boy posted:

Oh cool! A level with lots of ground targets! Lets take out the A-10 for this mission! Haha cannon go brrrrr What do you mean i now have to shoot down a flying fortress that's shooting lasers at me that has 20 fast as hell drones as it's escort :psyduck:

No amount of deflecting damage to an unimportant part of your plane will get you past something like that.

One of my complaints with Ace Combat 7 is that the A-10 is absolutely a trap option, if there were more air to ground missions with no dogfighting curveballs that would be one thing, but the game just isn't really friendly to the thing at all. In previous games the A-10 was still pretty rough in practice, but there were at least some lower intensity missions where it could really shine.

Dewgy
Nov 10, 2005

~🚚special delivery~📦

John Murdoch posted:

Idk, I found Shatter to be consistently strong throughout the game, not even counting the crazy good DLC mod for it.

A lot of the service weapon forms can get really busted by good mods. Shatter with extra pellets and ammo regen on headshots basically means you never stop firing, and it’s great. The thing dragging it down is that that’s all random and I never got that setup again after starting a new game. :(

Riatsala
Nov 20, 2013

All Princesses are Tyrants

XCOM 2, why the hell do you give me a close combat shotgun class and punish me for being aggressive? I can weigh the risk + reward of charging in to flank vs getting counter flanked, but it feels real fuckin' unfair that you change the calculus on me in a way I can't react to because uh, whoops, while charging in my shotgunner accidentally made eye contact with the hidden pod 50 yards behind his target and now they get a free turn to gently caress him with plasma rifles

Nuebot
Feb 18, 2013

The developer of Brigador is a secret chud, don't give him money

Paper Tiger posted:

Yeah, I've run into the same thing. I've tried getting into Kenshi a few times, and I'd always bounce off when trying to start an outpost. I actually started up again recently and decided to see how far I'd get *without* an outpost, instead buying a building in an existing city and making money to just buy the crafting mats I'd normally mine/farm in an outpost, and it's much less frustrating.

So here's a big thing about Kenshi: where you build your base is almost as important as how you build it since the locale determines who will show up to wreck your poo poo, there are some areas out in the middle of nowhere, where if you build there you won't get anyone but the occasional cannibal raid if you're unlucky. But basically, the general idea is that you either shouldn't base build until you're "ready" or if you're going to base build early you should prep by either building in a safe zone or building somewhere, where you'll have another settlement, and especially their patrols, intercepting for you. Or some deadly rear end wildlife if you can help it.

Making a base is kind of a trap in Kenshi; you really want to do it, but if you go for it as soon as you can you're going to get murdered.

Cythereal
Nov 8, 2009

I love the potoo,
and the potoo loves you.

Riatsala posted:

XCOM 2, why the hell do you give me a close combat shotgun class and punish me for being aggressive? I can weigh the risk + reward of charging in to flank vs getting counter flanked, but it feels real fuckin' unfair that you change the calculus on me in a way I can't react to because uh, whoops, while charging in my shotgunner accidentally made eye contact with the hidden pod 50 yards behind his target and now they get a free turn to gently caress him with plasma rifles

The same reason they made the sniper class also the close range gunslinger class, and added both stealth mechanics and a strict time limit on most maps: XCOM 2 is a bad game.

Snake Maze
Jul 13, 2016

3.85 Billion years ago
  • Having seen the explosion on the moon, the Devil comes to Venus

Cythereal posted:

The same reason they made the sniper class also the close range gunslinger class, and added both stealth mechanics and a strict time limit on most maps: XCOM 2 is a bad game.

To be fair, pod activation and all the weird line of sight manipulation that goes with it is just as bad in XCOM 1.

marshmallow creep
Dec 10, 2008

I've been sitting here for 5 mins trying to think of a joke to make but I just realised the animators of Mass Effect already did it for me

Cythereal posted:

The same reason they made the sniper class also the close range gunslinger class, and added both stealth mechanics and a strict time limit on most maps: XCOM 2 is a bad game.

*clears throat*

Git gud

RenegadeStyle1
Jun 7, 2005

Baby Come Back
I like having to play inside Xcom 2s weird dumb rules. It makes it like a puzzle and a RTS.

Nuebot
Feb 18, 2013

The developer of Brigador is a secret chud, don't give him money

Cythereal posted:

The same reason they made the sniper class also the close range gunslinger class, and added both stealth mechanics and a strict time limit on most maps: XCOM 2 is a bad game.

It's weird that they made any classes in X-COM 2 when like, the ranger class gets to attack like four times after you level it up a bit and blows every other class out of the water. Because it doesn't matter how good a sniper is when your ranger can cross the map and still just shoot three more dudes.

RenegadeStyle1
Jun 7, 2005

Baby Come Back
Yeah especially with war of the chosen. Rangers will rip and tear through everything.

CitizenKain
May 27, 2001

That was Gary Cooper, asshole.

Nap Ghost

dracula vladdy AF posted:

One of my complaints with Ace Combat 7 is that the A-10 is absolutely a trap option, if there were more air to ground missions with no dogfighting curveballs that would be one thing, but the game just isn't really friendly to the thing at all. In previous games the A-10 was still pretty rough in practice, but there were at least some lower intensity missions where it could really shine.

AC series could benefit from being able to bring two planes into a mission, and swap between them. Kind of been an issue in the series since the start actually. Isn't enough reason to bring a ground attack plane when any interceptor or air superiority fighter can do the job.

Always felt like the game story was so far up its own rear end they don't give the game enough room.

WaltherFeng
May 15, 2013

50 thousand people used to live here. Now, it's the Mushroom Kingdom.

CitizenKain posted:

AC series could benefit from being able to bring two planes into a mission, and swap between them. Kind of been an issue in the series since the start actually. Isn't enough reason to bring a ground attack plane when any interceptor or air superiority fighter can do the job.

Always felt like the game story was so far up its own rear end they don't give the game enough room.

Thats actually a really good idea and I want it. Being able to switch in real time between the squadron leader and your wingman for example would be awesome.

John Murdoch
May 19, 2009

I can tune a fish.

Dewgy posted:

A lot of the service weapon forms can get really busted by good mods. Shatter with extra pellets and ammo regen on headshots basically means you never stop firing, and it’s great. The thing dragging it down is that that’s all random and I never got that setup again after starting a new game. :(

Yeah I suspect that just like Bioshock Infinite before it the random nature of the equipment leads to weird variations in difficulty/general efficacy. Made worse because a bunch of mods are exclusively tied to the DLCs, but also some of them can leak through into the main game via board countermeasures if you're lucky but also a bunch of the mods are just insultingly bad anyway.

I managed to get ammo recovery on dodge late in the main game which was fantastic. But I'm pretty sure most of my other attempts to get tier 6 mods were stupid poo poo like "recover ammo when taking damage from X enemy type while under a full moon".

John Murdoch has a new favorite as of 08:30 on Nov 19, 2020

ilmucche
Mar 16, 2016

CitizenKain posted:

AC series could benefit from being able to bring two planes into a mission, and swap between them. Kind of been an issue in the series since the start actually. Isn't enough reason to bring a ground attack plane when any interceptor or air superiority fighter can do the job.

Always felt like the game story was so far up its own rear end they don't give the game enough room.

I feel like the game would be a bit too easy if altair could take his targets out with a laser guided bomb

Red Minjo
Oct 20, 2010

Out of the houses, which is the most blue?

The answer might not be be obvious at first.

Gravy Boat 2k

ilmucche posted:

I feel like the game would be a bit too easy if altair could take his targets out with a laser guided bomb

An Assassin's Creed game where you're an assassin working as a drone operator for the USA and one of your coworkers is a templar.

The Lone Badger
Sep 24, 2007

ilmucche posted:

I feel like the game would be a bit too easy if altair could take his targets out with a laser guided bomb

Remember that killing civilians causes desync.

ilmucche
Mar 16, 2016

Red Minjo posted:

An Assassin's Creed game where you're an assassin working as a drone operator for the USA and one of your coworkers is a templar.

The Lone Badger posted:

Remember that killing civilians causes desync.

Lucky for altair there were no civilians at that wedding

:(

Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

RenegadeStyle1 posted:

I like having to play inside Xcom 2s weird dumb rules. It makes it like a puzzle and a RTS.
I enjoyed the XCOM reboot series more when I realised it's basically an abstract board game rather than a normal tactical strategy game. It probably shouldn't have set the template for tactical RPGs for the following decade though.

Cleretic
Feb 3, 2010
Probation
Can't post for 5 hours!
I love XCOM, but it is a bit of a shame that there isn't really such a thing as 'turn-based strategy' outside of XCOM and XCOM-likes right now. There's 4x and grand strategy, which is totally legitimate and I love it for what it is, but the last thing that could legitimately be called 'turn-based strategy' outside of those molds was... what, the last Heroes of Might and Magic, in 2015? And that wasn't a good HoMM game.

And related to this thread: I don't like that the HoMM games I've played (V and VI) have singleplayer campaigns basically only designed to reward rush strategies. I want to play slow, but there's literally no map in those games where that's a good idea.

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Lunchmeat Larry
Nov 3, 2012

Cleretic posted:

I love XCOM, but it is a bit of a shame that there isn't really such a thing as 'turn-based strategy' outside of XCOM and XCOM-likes right now. There's 4x and grand strategy, which is totally legitimate and I love it for what it is, but the last thing that could legitimately be called 'turn-based strategy' outside of those molds was... what, the last Heroes of Might and Magic, in 2015? And that wasn't a good HoMM game.


I can think of a few, mostly indies and games that lean further towards tactical RPG than strategy - Battle Brothers, Battletech, Fell Seal, Into the Breach off the top of my head. It's hard to fully escape the ubiquity of the XCOM influence completely though, I'm sure even a couple of those I'm thinking of use e.g. the XCOM two-action system

I mean, XCOM played a huge part in turn based becoming cool again so we probably wouldn't have half the options we do without it. I just miss action points and more granular, simulation style mechanics. My kingdom for a new Silent Storm

Lunchmeat Larry has a new favorite as of 13:36 on Nov 19, 2020

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