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dogsicle posted:Crunchyroll just put up 0079 today, dub and sub Rewatching episode 1. Still good. One nice thing is that, although Amuro is holding up slightly better than Frau, he's still freaking the gently caress out and breaking down. He's just able to barely keep things together, partially since it's not his family that was brutally murdered in front of him. (Also, I finally realized the gag about Slender, Denim, and Gene a couple days ago. Gundam has had awful pun names from the very first episode.)
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Jan 26, 2021 00:43
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Huh, time to finally watch the dub I guess.
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Jan 26, 2021 03:04
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Hellioning posted:Huh, time to finally watch the dub I guess. The guy who plays Kai has such a weasel-y voice, I love it.
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Jan 26, 2021 04:13
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Edward Mass posted:The guy who plays Kai has such a weasel-y voice, I love it. Richard Ian Cox. I still think Bit Cloud when I hear him though.
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Jan 26, 2021 04:24
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He's Inuyasha. And Lalah was Kikyo. I really don't like the 0079 dub. The voices are great but I think it's a case of bad direction. I'll always remember it was 08th MS Team taht really got me into Gundam as its localization felt so much more natural.
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Jan 26, 2021 04:32
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dogsicle posted:Crunchyroll just put up 0079 today, dub and sub loving finally
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Jan 26, 2021 05:48
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That rocks. Just watched the latest Hathaway trailer (from the Gundaminfo channel 6 days ago), looks sweet! Also I was just reading that Tomino/Anno interview mentioned earlier. Fun stuff, I like how they're just shooting the poo poo, being blunt with if they disagree etc. Also found it funny that neither of them like Lodoss War OVA. I dig it myself. In general I dig their anti-marketing/focus group/etc etc type of stuff, the ol' keeping art raw and varied thing. Sounds good to me.
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Jan 26, 2021 06:57
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tsob posted:I made an post a week or two back about the staff on 08th MS Team and Gundam 0083, and how no-one major on staff had died during production of either. Just a storyboarder on 08th MS Team by the name of Takeyuki Kanda, who only worked on two episodes. Silly boy that I am, while looking through all the staff listings and reading the individual Wiki pages for any staff that had them, the one thing I didn't check was who the series director of either show was. As it turns out, Kanda was the series director of 08th MS Team, and not just a storyboarder. So the director of it did die during production, around about episode 5 or 6 presumably. He left behind notes that the new director worked from, but there was a new series director. So whoever I responded to thinking the show's direction had changed around the midpoint may have had a point, even if I don't agree personally and think all the problems with the show are evident since the start. I haven't read the novel, but in the manga and I think this moment is such a perfect encapsulation of Char and Amuro, in the manga after they go through Axis, Char gets back in the Nightingale before Amuro gets back in the Hi-Nu, and his response is to immediately attack him. And would have killed him if not for Newtype Baby interference. And that was... Char talks about how much he wants to have the "Honorable Duel" with Amuro to prove he's better, but when the chips were down, he'd take a win via sneak attack. I would also say that Char and Amuro represent Tomino's "gently caress adults" mindset. Char is someone who acts like the evil adults Tomino hates, he's manipulative, he's petty, he doesn't care about other people, he uses money and lies. But mentally he's like a child he hasn't grown up. Amuro, on the other hand, is more mature, but he still has a child's innocence. He is honest, he doesn't manipulate people, he might fail if he tries to help but he does try, he's concerned almost entirely for others. Amuro has grown up but not lost connection to his youthful innocence, while Char is immature but acts like the adults Tomino hates.
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Jan 26, 2021 08:13
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Does anyone else think the Wing gundam looks like it has elf ears
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Jan 26, 2021 16:58
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Arcsquad12 posted:Does anyone else think the Wing gundam looks like it has elf ears Wing Zero and EW Wing definitely do have elf ears now that you mention it.
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Jan 26, 2021 18:34
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Probably late to the party but I finally got to read through Volume 15 of the Gundam Thunderbolt manga and hahahaha what the gently caress this poo poo is gonna go off the rails real fuckin' fast, ain't it
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Jan 26, 2021 18:48
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The Ver. Ka illustration of the base Wing Gundam has them too.
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Jan 26, 2021 18:48
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Arcsquad12 posted:The Ver. Ka illustration of the base Wing Gundam has them too. Every iteration of the Wing Gundam has them. Epyon too, though way more pronounced.
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Jan 26, 2021 21:29
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The Exia has them too.
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Jan 26, 2021 21:52
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They aren't ears they are cheek guards
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Jan 26, 2021 22:58
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MyushiVerSCOOTY posted:They aren't ears they are cheek guards Maybe they're cat ears like your avatar. Neko Gundam
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Jan 26, 2021 23:14
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Arcsquad12 posted:Maybe they're cat ears like your avatar. Neko Gundam I think that's the GNT-0000SHIA.
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Jan 27, 2021 00:04
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chiasaur11 posted:I think that's the GNT-0000SHIA.  Gundam nyaa.
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Jan 27, 2021 02:13
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In keeping with the theme of the suits, I assume they're meant to evoke a winged helmet.
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Jan 27, 2021 02:20
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a kabuto helmet, actually. that's what the standard gundam head shape is based on, including the v fins.
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Jan 27, 2021 02:24
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Taintrunner posted:Probably late to the party but I finally got to read through Volume 15 of the Gundam Thunderbolt manga and hahahaha what the gently caress this poo poo is gonna go off the rails real fuckin' fast, ain't it What’s happening in volume 15?
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Jan 27, 2021 02:44
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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:a kabuto helmet, actually. that's what the standard gundam head shape is based on, including the v fins. There are kabuto designs with wings, too. Sengoku era samurai were all about that artistic variation.
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Jan 27, 2021 02:54
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In rewatching 0083, I have one question about the last couple of episodes Why did Kou prioritize going after Cima over going after Gato in the last episode (revenge is one thing, but uh... not doing the second part is probably the biggest reason Stardust still succeeded)
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Jan 27, 2021 02:56
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MechaX posted:In rewatching 0083, I have one question about the last couple of episodes Because Kou makes bad decisions.
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Jan 27, 2021 02:59
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DamnGlitch posted:What’s happening in volume 15? For a quick minor-spoiler summary of the last English manga volume of Gundam Thunderbolt: No real action scenes; both factions are basically moving pieces across the board in order to get ready for the next big confrontation, this time on Luna. The old lady in charge of the Foundation basically got fired by ESDF, so she called up Anaheim Electronics and then they screamed at ESDF to put her back in charge again. Anaheim really wants a Psycho Zaku for research & development. Lorenz's old Zeon friends meet up with him again and sign on with the psychic cult. Io Fleming wakes up from his PTSD coma and shoots Cornelius dead before he succeeds in poisoning Io, saved by the psychic twin girls.
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Jan 27, 2021 03:27
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Omnicrom posted:Because Kou makes bad decisions. And even with them, he still could have stopped Stardust if Nina didn't make even worse decisions. I'd ask "What is even her problem?" but top scientists have worked on the problem for decades without even approaching a solution. In more successful studies, though, I've been looking at IBO's fleet counts and comparing to UC numbers, and at a glance? I think Gjallarhorn has the largest fleets of any faction in Gundam. Not insane considering the setting, but kinda impressive. In terms of explicit numbers, we know that Rustal's fleet has 41 battleships. 40 Halfbeaks, 1 Skipjack. We can get that by math (The Mars garrison has 10 Halfbeaks, McGillis had twice as many when he went to war with Rustal, Rustal had twice as many ships as McGillis) and onscreen (McGillis's post-battle display shows 41 icons for Rustal's fleet). Since McGillis has 20, and Rustal has both his and Iok's fleets, we can assume that each of the seven stars has around 20 battleships, giving us 120 overall. That's battleships, though. For cruisers, the show gives us much less. However, we do see a portion of the Arianrhod fleet in season 1, bringing "only" five of their Halfbeaks... in addition to 53 small Biscoe class cruisers. Assuming that's the standard ratio, that gives us 424 Biscoes in the Arianrhod fleet and 1,272 overall. (We didn't see any on either side in the final space battle, but given their small size in comparison, presumably they were either considered irrelevant in large fleet battles or they were unavailable. I can't imagine they'd last long against Halfbeaks, at any rate, even in large numbers, and they might have trouble keeping up with larger ships.) Comparing it to the Federation in the original Gundam, it's said that half the fleet was lost at Loum. Going by the Entertainment Bible, the Federation lost 36 Battleships, 139 Salamis, 114 L144 Minesweepers, and 82 Columbus Class ships in that battle. That means at full strength the Federation had about 72 Battleships, 278 Cruisers, 228 Missile Frigates, and 200 Columbus Class transports for a total of about 778 warships. Maybe comparable to Gjallarhorn in tonnage (Biscoes are only about 150 feet long) but in raw number of ships, they're well behind. Moving on to the bodycount, if we assume that Halfbeaks have crew numbers between World War 2 battleships and modern aircraft carriers, there were about 800,000 fatalities in the McGillis Fareed Incident, all combatants. (18 fully crewed Halfbeaks destroyed by Rustal's forces, 2 destroyed by McGillis) Eight times more deaths than in Gundam Wing's conflicts, but still pretty smallscale compared to Gundam's usual. I don't know how this all maps out (and considering that the Mars garrison of Gjallarhorn only had about 40 Mobile Suits, it's likely that the ship to MS ratio is lower in IBO than in most serieses), but it was interesting enough for me while I was looking at the data, and I figured, until an official source says something, someone else might find it worth looking at and going "huh". Edit: Don't know where I got 800K from. Looks like it'd be closer to 80,000, unless Halfbeak crews are 40,000 people, which seems more than a little high. So, probably less than 100,000 dead in IBO overall, depending on how big the farm Hashmal destroyed was. chiasaur11 fucked around with this message at 11:37 on Feb 17, 2021 |
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Jan 27, 2021 06:13
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tsob posted:I made an post a week or two back about the staff on 08th MS Team and Gundam 0083, and how no-one major on staff had died during production of either. Just a storyboarder on 08th MS Team by the name of Takeyuki Kanda, who only worked on two episodes. Silly boy that I am, while looking through all the staff listings and reading the individual Wiki pages for any staff that had them, the one thing I didn't check was who the series director of either show was. As it turns out, Kanda was the series director of 08th MS Team, and not just a storyboarder. So the director of it did die during production, around about episode 5 or 6 presumably. He left behind notes that the new director worked from, but there was a new series director. So whoever I responded to thinking the show's direction had changed around the midpoint may have had a point, even if I don't agree personally and think all the problems with the show are evident since the start. hey that was me! im a pretty good movie watcher so it *felt* noticable but you made a compelling case so i was like sure ill believe you, im just a nobody 
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Jan 27, 2021 08:29
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chiasaur11 posted:Fleet stuff What about the Federation fleet around the time of Operation Star One or Operation Stardust? The fleet destroyed at Loum was a major part of the initial EFSF numbers in the war but by the time they launched the counteroffensive they had recovered their material losses. A Baoa Qu took a huge chunk out of the Federation fleet when Gihren blasted Degwin and and Revill during the ceasefire preparations. But even with that major blow there were still hundreds of ships at the very least for the naval review when Gato nuked the fleet again. I dont have hard numbers but the EFSF being able to shoulder three crippling blows to their fleet and still be able to fight wars gives me the sense that their numbers are huge.
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Jan 27, 2021 10:02
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Arcsquad12 posted:What about the Federation fleet around the time of Operation Star One or Operation Stardust? The fleet destroyed at Loum was a major part of the initial EFSF numbers in the war but by the time they launched the counteroffensive they had recovered their material losses. A Baoa Qu took a huge chunk out of the Federation fleet when Gihren blasted Degwin and and Revill during the ceasefire preparations. But even with that major blow there were still hundreds of ships at the very least for the naval review when Gato nuked the fleet again. According to Entertainment Bible 39 (which tends to go pretty high end), as of Operation Star 1 the Federation had: 18 Battleships 98 Cruisers 4800 Mobile Suits 900 Fighters 110 Assault Boats 84 Columbus class Putting them at 310 ships overall. Considering their initial fleet in that source said they had 92 battleships, 473 cruisers, 620 other combat vessels, and 1340 support vessels, that suggests they got chewed up quite a bit, even if they managed to recover enough to get back in the fight. (Also, that puts their initial totals notably ahead of Gjallarhorn, even if Gjallarhorn still dominates in battleship count) Of course, going by the animation (both in dialogue and in visuals) things seem a bit smaller scale, but if you have a lot of different writers over 40 plus years. Such is life. (For a Victory era figure, Zanscare had about 50 ships, according to the novels. Meanwhile, three of the Federation's fleets put together have about 20 warships and 300 Mobile suits, suggesting a total fleet of around 140 ships and 2000 Mobile Suits. A significant force, but well below the glory days.)
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Jan 27, 2021 12:46
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Worth noting that (a) Arianrhod is Gjallarhorn's hammer, the biggest, nastiest, and best-equipped fighting force in the solar system, and (b) it's only one of a number of fleets Gjallarhorn has. So we can assume that they have many more ships than Rustal's forces, but we also can't use those forces as an indicator of the average size of a Gjallarhorn fleet.
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Jan 27, 2021 12:51
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Darth Walrus posted:Worth noting that (a) Arianrhod is Gjallarhorn's hammer, the biggest, nastiest, and best-equipped fighting force in the solar system, and (b) it's only one of a number of fleets Gjallarhorn has. So we can assume that they have many more ships than Rustal's forces, but we also can't use those forces as an indicator of the average size of a Gjallarhorn fleet. Fair enough. We do see a number of other fleet deployments (Carta had a dozen or so Halfbeaks, there's ten on Mars, McGillis had twenty, Iok had 7ish when he went after the Turbines), so I was ballparking 20 as an average per (remaining) member of the Seven Stars in season 2. Lower estimates are perfectly reasonable. (I also was leaning a bit higher end since there were enough Halfbeaks around that one could be sold to JPT trust without raising any eyebrows. Corruption covers most of it, but larger numbers would make that kind of sale easier to bury.)
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Jan 27, 2021 13:14
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chiasaur11 posted:Comparing it to the Federation in the original Gundam, it's said that half the fleet was lost at Loum. Going by the Entertainment Bible, the Federation lost 36 Battleships, 139 Salamis, 114 L144 Minesweepers, and 82 Columbus Class ships in that battle. That means at full strength the Federation had about 72 Battleships, 278 Cruisers, 228 Missile Frigates, and 200 Columbus Class transports for a total of about 778 warships. Maybe comparable to Gjallarhorn in tonnage (Biscoes are only about 150 feet long) but in raw number of ships, they're well behind. I don't know if Loum should be taken as the peak of Federation ship numbers really, since it seems like there we see dozens of Magellan and Salamis ships on screen at any one time at both Solomon and A Baoa Qu even just sticking to the animation, and it seems like it's meant to be hundreds of them. When the colony laser is fired you can see dozens of ships being incinerated on screen during any shots of it as another example, and to the extent any are recognisable from their profile it's more Magellans and Salamis class ships. Which are basically the battleships of the Federation during the One Year War, though you appear to be counting battleships as a different thing entirely. Additionally, if you go to Gundam 0083's naval review there are hundreds of what can be presumed to be battleships on screen at several points in what is suggested to be just part of the overall amount and could add up to thousands of ships.  Ramadu posted:hey that was me! im a pretty good movie watcher so it *felt* noticable but you made a compelling case so i was like sure ill believe you, im just a nobody We're all Nemos together 
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Jan 27, 2021 16:29
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So a huge while ago I was talking the Beltorchika's children with someone, and they brought up how much they loved the Nightingale for what it represented. Because on the surface yeah it's this big hulking monster mecha packed to the gills with every weapon imaginable. It's also the fusion dance of The O, the Qubeley and the Zeong. With the Zeong, Char learned that moving the cockpit to the head body made it unlikely to be killed in modern combat (since most would target the torso) and that it opened up more space for more weaponry on the mobile suit. From The O he learned that sufficient enough thrust can completely invalidate the disadvantages of a larger mobile suit, while actually providing a tactical advantage, he also added in the manipulator arms. The Qubeley influence is clear the funnels and the wing binders, providing more space for additional thrusters and sharper turning because of how they could be angled, alongside remote weaponry to make proper use of his Newtype abilities. It kinda makes sense that Char, obsessing over how he's going to beat Amuro, would look to all these different suits that he once fought against or with and just slam them together.
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Jan 29, 2021 10:27
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tsob posted:I don't know if Loum should be taken as the peak of Federation ship numbers really, since it seems like there we see dozens of Magellan and Salamis ships on screen at any one time at both Solomon and A Baoa Qu even just sticking to the animation, and it seems like it's meant to be hundreds of them. When the colony laser is fired you can see dozens of ships being incinerated on screen during any shots of it as another example, and to the extent any are recognisable from their profile it's more Magellans and Salamis class ships. Which are basically the battleships of the Federation during the One Year War, though you appear to be counting battleships as a different thing entirely. I went and dug up some old numbers I had on this from years back. At Solomon, the 3rd Fleet with White Base is only shown to be like a dozen ships, and Tianem's larger fleet is like 30 or so. A Baoa Qu is a bit less consistent with what is shown on screen, since the Federation is said to be attacking in three groups. The one with White Base that hits S-Field is like 25 ships, mostly Salamis. The other groups in the attack have more battleships, and I believe it was implied those groups are larger too, so the floor for their fleet there is about 75-80 ships. The various old source books like Entertainment Bible 39 and Mobile Suit Variations 3, which predictably aren't always consistent between one and other (Or sometimes even within themselves), put the Federation fleet around 100~ warships (Magellan and Salamis classes), give or take a dozen depending on the books, which fits. For Loum, the numbers are even more widely all over the place. EB1 had the Federation fleet pretty small, just 12 battleships and 61 cruisers, while EB39 has upped this to 48 battleships, between 150 and 160 cruisers, and both sources have them with approximately 200 other supply, transports, and smaller ships. Those are the numbers that are most well known and mostly heavily repeated elsewhere, but the problem then becomes is that the old versions of Loum talked about in the print books from the 80's through the early 00's don't match the way Loum is shown in later works like IGLOO and Origin much at all. IGLOO shows numbers very close to what was originally in EB1. Origin has the Federation fleet split up, with Tianem's fleet being 15 battleships and 30 cruisers, while Revil's fleet is twice that size, and IIRC they engage separately. Older sources imply the battle occurred right in the middle of Side 5, and was a bloody slugfest for both sides that annihilated Side 5 in the crossfire (Possibly with nukes getting widely used?). IGLOO has it entirely out in the middle of space without a colony anywhere on screen. Origin has a battle out in space and then Zeon sending ground troops into the colonies to clear them out, while older sources had the colonies getting caught in the crossfire or Zeon just going and nuking/gassing them like the did the other colonies during the first week of the war. Older sources also say Loum was the largest battle in history, so it having more ships that the later war actions makes a bit of sense, but again, older sources. Hell, the whole reason for the battle of Loum at all isn't even clear, ranging from it being a follow up to Zeon's failed attack on Side 5 during the first week of the war (Very old sources, like the MSG novelization and early reference works), to it being an attempt at a second colony drop (Mostly mid-80's source books, but IIRC also later stuff like Gihren's Greed), to a Zeon ruse about a second colony drop attempt entirely to draw the main Federation fleet out into an ambush (IGLOO & Origin, I think?). tl;dr: It's all a loving mess, sources never all worked together, battles large and all numbers subject to change at any time. fartknocker fucked around with this message at 20:48 on Jan 30, 2021 |
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Jan 30, 2021 20:40
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Onmi posted:It kinda makes sense that Char, obsessing over how he's going to beat Amuro, would look to all these different suits that he once fought against or with and just slam them together. I dunno if the entire point about how Amuro got the psycho-frame was different in Beltorchika's Children but I think it would still be in character for Char to completely skip any actual analysis of Amuro in particular and just go straight to "he can have an even more powerful Gundam I guess, I want to make my victory perfect" while Char obsesses over his past defeats in the Zeong and also how badly he got destroyed by Haman and Scirroco. MechaX fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Jan 30, 2021 |
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Jan 30, 2021 20:57
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MechaX posted:I dunno if the entire point about how Amuro got the psycho-frame was different in Beltorchika's Children but I think it would still be in character for Char to completely skip any actual analysis of Amuro in particular and just go straight to "he can have an even more powerful Gundam I guess, I want to make my victory perfect" while Char obsesses over his past defeats in the Zeong and also how badly he got destroyed by Haman and Scirroco. IIRC in Beltorchika's Children, Char and his forces leave behind Glarv's (the novel version of Gyunei) Psycho Doga after Amuro damages it during the Fifth Luna battle at the beginning, Amuro takes the Psycho Doga back to the Ra Cailum and they put its psycho-frame cockpit into the Nu Gundam when Beltorchika delivers it later (and install the leftover psycho-frame material into the Re-GZ afterwards).
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Jan 31, 2021 03:00
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It's still the same 'concept' though, that Glarv believes Char made him leave the Psycho Doga so Amuro would get it. I don't believe he ever says to Amuro that he gave it to him for a proper fight, like he does in the film, but they also don't bicker in the end. Char's last words are being slightly glad he failed because Sayla lives on earth and it means he didn't kill her, while Amuro's is Beltorchika's name. Amuro does bring up to Beltorchika that Char "Let him" have the Psycoframe and knew about the Hi-Nu. But it is interesting to see Amuro's mentality.    I guess Tomino really did want to emphasize Amuro's strength coming from loved ones and Fatherhood. Pity the execs gave the usual, "No one wants to see the hero with a wife and kid." Nonsense stuff. Also, wanted to showcase the "For all Char's talk of a fair fight he attacks Amuro when he can't fight back" in the manga BC     
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Jan 31, 2021 11:17
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He's technically in the Gundam....
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Jan 31, 2021 17:09
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Char could have hit him with like 10x the firepower of a kick. it was one for old times sake
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Feb 1, 2021 04:10
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With the Nightingale in surprised he didn't go for a crotch punt. That thing is massive.
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Feb 1, 2021 04:46
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