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Jobbo_Fett posted:Having a fixed sight isn't a bad idea as a backup if the reflector sight breaks for whatever reason. In fact most reflector sights have a little fixed sight next to the optic built in to the body of the sight precisely for this reason.
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Feb 17, 2021 14:51
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One of the striking things about Wages of Destruction and other narratives that reach the end of the war is the raw amount of copium the Nazi High Command and leadership were huffing. Like Speer constantly is like "oh we can still continue the war for "x" number of months/weeks and a bunch of the generals are convinced that the Soviets and Western allies will come to blows anyday now. But otoh at that point almost everyone was true believers as a bunch of the guys who knew the war was lost (after either the failure of Barbarossa or interestingly the devastating bombing of the Ruhr Valley) had already offed themselves.
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Feb 17, 2021 15:12
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Like in some ways Japan could rationally assume that they would at least be able to inflict massive losses on a Soviet/American invasion of the home islands (since they figured out the landing sites) but Germany really was fully delusional.
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Feb 17, 2021 15:15
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Uncle Enzo posted:There's no overstating how evil the Nazis were, but most of their stuff is more or less comparable to other powers stuff. No, just no. Did you not read my posts about their uniforms? I can always post more detail about coats or camouflage smocks and helmet covers or the like, but the fact is that their stuff - ALL of it - was like that, at every level. Badly designed, bad for the people who used it, bad for the innocent people used as slaves to make it. With perilously few exceptions, their stuff WASN'T comparable. The Allies make decent, practical uniforms, the Nazis make tailored crap that restrict their soldier's movement, require more upkeep, and cost vastly more in time and materials. The Allies make a canteen, the Nazis make a smaller one with a bad cover and hooks to put it on their belt so it clangs when they walk. The Allies make a simple button, the Nazis make one made from separate pieces of metal that require paint and special tools to attach the loop on the back, which breaks when you wear it. The Allies make canvas shoulder straps to carry their gear, the Nazis make the same thing out of leather, but also make suspender straps inside their uniforms that require special sewing machines and aluminum hooks - but which can't even carry the gear when the soldier wears a smock. And on and on and on, everywhere. I can think of maybe a handful of things that they made that were passably decent designs when evaluated strictly from an engineering perspective, but even these only brought more evil to the world. And these are more than canceled out by the overwhelming amount of shoddy garbage that the Nazis made, from their crappy tailored-but-ill-fitting uniforms on up. And when you name one "good" Nazi design the Allies came up with dozens of better designs to defeat it. The Nazis weren't "uniquely evil," in that there have been and will be other evil, genocidal regimes. But there's nothing salvageable or good about the Nazis; there's no upside, no "well, at least they made good X." Not only were they evil assholes who killed millions of innocent people, they didn't even make good uniforms or tanks or submarines. Naziism was and is a pathetic death cult that brings nothing good to the world at all. Cessna fucked around with this message at 15:24 on Sep 20, 2022 |
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Feb 17, 2021 16:09
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In particular the late war superweapon stuff looks exactly like you'd expect a weapon that's been designed years-ahead-of-time because you are desperately trying to produce an ace up the sleeve for your wartime leaders and also you are missing all the raw material you'd need to make it properly and also a lot of the parts are being made by slaves. By the end everything looks like a cobbled together first draft design because that's what they were.
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Feb 17, 2021 17:19
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How dare you call the Do-335 anything but majestic.
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Feb 17, 2021 18:04
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Cessna posted:I can always post more detail about coats or camouflage smocks and helmet covers or the like,
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Feb 17, 2021 18:06
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Alchenar posted:In particular the late war superweapon stuff looks exactly like you'd expect a weapon that's been designed years-ahead-of-time because you are desperately trying to produce an ace up the sleeve for your wartime leaders and also you are missing all the raw material you'd need to make it properly and also a lot of the parts are being made by slaves. Everyone should watch downfall btw.
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Feb 17, 2021 18:27
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Jobbo_Fett posted:Having a fixed sight isn't a bad idea as a backup if the reflector sight breaks for whatever reason. Most American fighters up to late 1943 had fixed sights - a ring-and-cross just in front of the windscreen and a ball on a spike further down the nose, both usually offset so the reflector sight was on the centerline - as a back up to the reflector failing in some way. They were removed when aerodynamics became more important and the reflector sights were proving reliable. The P-38 never had them as far as I can tell and P-51D didn't have them, although the earlier turtle-back ones did. It was probably a better back up solution than the RAF, which fitted early-war fighters with three spare bulbs in the cockpit which the pilot was somehow expected to change in flight, possibly in hostile skies! The American Volunteer Group had problems because their P-40s were mostly to RAF spec and intended to have RAF reflector sights and armour-glass behind the windscreen. The AVG were able to get a stock of USAAC-spec reflector sights but they weren't compatible with the armour-glass so they had to jury-rig up some brackets and even then it involved hooking the reflector to the pilot's grab handle so every time they climbed into or out of the aircraft they knocked the sight out of alignment. There also weren't enough reflector sights so the some AVG went into action over Rangoon with only the ring-and-bead fixed sight.
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Feb 17, 2021 18:31
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White Coke posted:Wouldn't have mattered much if you'd lived in the Soviet occupation zone. I mean a) we're talking while the war is still going on and b) the Soviet occupation zone was pretty porous for a while after the war anyway. Note the Soviets didnt get super serious about enforcing the internal border until the 50s and the Berlin Wall didn't go up until 1961. Literal millions of people left before then.
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Feb 17, 2021 19:49
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Rockopolis posted:Please do so, that was a very interesting read. I'm not good at extemporaneous comments, it's a lot easier to answer questions. Anything you want to know about German infantry crap?
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Feb 17, 2021 19:53
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Cessna posted:I'm not good at extemporaneous comments, it's a lot easier to answer questions. Anything you want to know about German infantry crap? Were there official army rules for skat
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Feb 17, 2021 20:06
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The Nazi brown coal ramjet was a triumph of German engineering unparalleled until at least the H&K G11. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lippisch_P.13a
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Feb 17, 2021 20:52
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aphid_licker posted:The Nazi brown coal ramjet was a triumph of German engineering unparalleled until at least the H&K G11. If there's ever a Captain Planet remake, I want this thing to show up. 
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Feb 17, 2021 21:00
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Aw poo poo check out this guy: https://twitter.com/myrmekochoria/status/1351284852721643521
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Feb 17, 2021 21:01
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Cessna posted:With perilously few exceptions, their stuff WASN'T comparable. The Allies make decent, practical uniforms, the Nazis make tailored crap that restrict their soldier's movement, require more upkeep, and cost vastly more in time and materials. The Allies make a canteen, the Nazis make a smaller one with a bad cover and hooks to put it on their belt so it clangs when they walk. The Allies make a simple button, the Nazis make one made from separate pieces of metal that require paint and special tools to attach the loop on the back, which breaks when you wear it. The Allies make canvas shoulder straps to carry their gear, the Nazis make the same thing out of leather, but also make suspender straps inside their uniforms that require special sewing machines and aluminum hooks - but which can't even carry the gear when the soldier wears a smock. And on and on and on, everywhere. My understanding is both those guys wore khakis basically instead of whatever ridiculous costumes the Wehrmacht was putting on. The Japanese had those distinctive caps.
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Feb 17, 2021 21:11
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Cessna posted:I'm not good at extemporaneous comments, it's a lot easier to answer questions. Anything you want to know about German infantry crap? Edit And the hats.
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Feb 17, 2021 21:15
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aphid_licker posted:Aw poo poo check out this guy: Well that's much bigger than I would have thought. Was it ever actually worn? Like I wouldn't expect it to be outside of a coronation, but still. Is it intended to fit on top of a helmet or something? E: or maybe Otto I just had a big old head?
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Feb 17, 2021 21:23
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Yes, it's like a lava lamp.
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aphid_licker posted:Aw poo poo check out this guy: According to international law, this guy & his lineage are now the official successors. PittTheElder posted:Well that's much bigger than I would have thought. Was it ever actually worn? Like I wouldn't expect it to be outside of a coronation, but still. Is it intended to fit on top of a helmet or something? Interesting question. HR emperors were probably a bit more fat-headed than Stalin's boys, and probably also had more hair. I would assume there's also some type of liner that goes inside? What was Soviet naval doctrine like in the 1930's? My limited understanding is that with the split between Northern, Baltic, Black Sea and Pacific fleets, and an emphasis on land and air power, the doctrine was defensive? Nenonen fucked around with this message at 21:28 on Feb 17, 2021 |
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Feb 17, 2021 21:24
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Cessna posted:With perilously few exceptions, their stuff WASN'T comparable. Out of curiosity, what would you say some of those few exceptions were?
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Feb 17, 2021 21:29
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There's a guy in the replies to that tweet going off about how that guy is being disrespectful and, more relevantly, that even the Kaisers only wore that thing once in their life, so maybe mostly ornamental
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Feb 17, 2021 21:30
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I cringed when I saw it. You should be respectful towards historical relics.
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Feb 17, 2021 21:32
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fartknocker posted:Out of curiosity, what would you say some of those few exceptions were?
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Feb 17, 2021 21:34
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Gaius Marius posted:I cringed when I saw it. You should be respectful towards historical relics. I get it but also if I was that soldier I would drat well pose with my crown.
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Feb 17, 2021 21:36
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Rockopolis posted:What are the boots like? Comfy or not, how much of a pain to make or fix? In the early years of the war the typical boot was the Marschstiefel, also known as Knobelbecher (Dice-shakers):  This design is based, with a few variations on one from 1866. This is one of those "if it isn't broke, don't fix it" designs. Interestingly, they were made from brown leather and individual soldiers blackened them with dye and polish. Yes, they were hobnailed. The whole boot is made from leather, including the sole. (The layers of the sole are held together with wood pegs to keep them from de-laminating.) The hobnails are installed, using a shoemaker's last (form), to reduce wear on the leather and give a little more traction. This didn't work too well in Russia where the metal just made to boots get cold faster. There are also heel irons; these look like a small horse-shoe and go around the heel, also to reduce wear:  The German army loved their boots - there were cobblers at the battalion, sometimes down to the company level - but they used a LOT of leather. In 1943 (roughly, it varied, some appeared earlier) they introduced a low boot with laces and gaiters. Troops were supposed to dye them, but by this point supplies were scarce and most originals are un-dyed brown:  The troops hated these boots; most were very poorly made. The gaiters were also a bad design, held together with little leather belt-straps. I have never seen an original in person where some part of the leather strap isn't broken. The troops called the gaiters "retreat gaiters:"  (Incidentally, these are worn upside-down; there's a little leather reinforcement on the bottom where they wear against the shoe. (Or, this may be a reproduction that left off that little leather strip. The boots are certainly reproductions.) The high boots aren't terrible. They're solid, every pair I've seen is made from thick leather that wears like iron. The low boots vary; I've seen some that were decent, but those are the ones that survived; it seems like most fell apart. As an aside, the German army went through the same process in WWI - start with good high boots, convert to crappy low boots. Rockopolis posted:And the hats. Hats are a big category, there were all kinds of variations. Any specific one you want to hear about? Cessna fucked around with this message at 15:27 on Sep 20, 2022 |
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Feb 17, 2021 21:43
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HookedOnChthonics posted:World War I tanks give me the same vibe, tbh—did anyone else watch that three-part BBC series that was on Netflix that had one standout episode set almost entirely inside one? It really captured how utterly little compromise was made for human bodies to fit and function inside it You're thinking of Our World War (although I prefer episode 2); and, to the contrary, they ensured all mod cons by making it possible to fry eggs on the engine, at the cost of only a 14% increase in one's chance of having an arm taken off by the exposed flywheel, a highly attractive bargain for the average squaddie. Cessna posted:I'm not good at extemporaneous comments, it's a lot easier to answer questions. Anything you want to know about German infantry crap? What's the Wehrmacht's equivalent of the Macadam Shield Shovel?
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Feb 17, 2021 21:46
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Here's an entertaining Finnish milhist YouTube channel, with English subtitles. Note that the author is an amateur (and even says so) and especially pronounciations of foreign names are hilarious (eg. Krohnstadt <> Kronstrand, Tsushima <> Tsuhima), but visualizations are good and I haven't spotted any glaring errors so far. Counterstrike on Leningrad airbases https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRBXq13f9Kk WW1 Russian fortifications around Helsinki https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m58hZD8Gl-w Sisu "Pasi" XA-180 and XA-185 in UN peacekeeping use https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1PPS4BeDWk MiG 21 in Finnish use https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pdFkqPC8q_o
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Feb 17, 2021 21:49
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fartknocker posted:Out of curiosity, what would you say some of those few exceptions were? The "jerry can" has already been mentioned. The MG-42 was a good machinegun. The Panzer IV wasn't great, but it was adaptable. The high boots, mentioned above, are solid (but an older design). The "potato masher" handle for the hand grenade was good, in that it let the thrower throw it further. (The US Army considered copying the design, but when they tested it it turned out to be less effective in American hands. Why? Because most American kids played baseball in the 30s and were more familiar with throwing ball-style objects.) The camouflage patterns used by the SS on their zeltbahn (shelter sections)/helmet covers/smocks - not the construction of the items themselves, just the colors chosen and the patterns - are good for hiding stuff, even if they're too complicated for effective manufacture with the production methods of the time. The "Dot 44"/"Pea Dot" camouflage uniform introduced late in the war was decent, a presage of modern camouflage uniforms. It still had unnecessary vestiges of earlier uniforms, but it wasn't terrible. That's about it. Cessna fucked around with this message at 18:09 on Apr 5, 2023 |
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Feb 17, 2021 21:53
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Trin Tragula posted:What's the Wehrmacht's equivalent of the Macadam Shield Shovel? How about the Krummlauf, a barrel attachment for the Stg-44 that allowed it to shoot around corners? 
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Feb 17, 2021 21:56
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That was interesting. How doing were they expected to last? They must have really been putting miles on those. Is the blackening thing just to have something you can make soldiers do? I think there was a thing about that with US Army boots a couple years back. As for hats, what about the field cap with the flaps? That's the one they made the most of.
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Feb 17, 2021 21:57
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Cessna posted:I can think of maybe a handful of things that they made that were passably decent designs when evaluated strictly from an engineering perspective, but even these only brought more evil to the world. ... And when you name one "good" Nazi design the Allies came up with dozens of better designs to defeat it. Not that I'm disagreeing with you in general, but https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jerrycan Edit: ...And I'm too late again.
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Feb 17, 2021 21:59
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Rockopolis posted:That was interesting. How doing were they expected to last? They must have really been putting miles on those. The boots? Until they fell apart. Ideally those cobblers would maintain them, replacing hobnails and heel irons, then soles and heels, in order to keep them in service.  Rockopolis posted:Is the blackening thing just to have something you can make soldiers do? Yes, although they ran out of black dye around halfway through the war. Rockopolis posted:As for hats, what about the field cap with the flaps? That's the one they made the most of. The Einheitfeldmütze, which came out in 1943:  It's a decent hat, but nothing special. It's generally made of the same wool as the rest of the uniform, so they come in feldgrau green, panzer black, Luftwaffe blue, etc. You can find some made from camouflage cloth - some sewn together from spare zeltbahns (shelter sections), some made in factories. This hat was essentially the earlier 1942-model Feldmütze with a bill sewn on: 
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Feb 17, 2021 22:13
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The FW-190 was a very effective plane that was designed to be rugged and cheap to build, using surplus air cooled radial engines (since the BF-109 used a liquid cooled engine that was in short supply). It turned out to be a very good fighter and mostly suffered performance wise in comparison to the USAAF fighters due to the Germans not having access to high octane fuel, which limited power. The ME-262 should probably be included as well, given it was basically the only operational combat jet of the war.
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Feb 17, 2021 22:15
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aphid_licker posted:Aw poo poo check out this guy: lmao, don't sleep on the replies  
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Feb 17, 2021 22:20
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Sorry for just crapping tweets into here but this was beautiful and bote dazzle camo is p cool: https://twitter.com/AncientSubHunt/status/1361842224271478788
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Feb 17, 2021 22:20
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MikeCrotch posted:FW-190 Yeah - I have no experience with them, but that should make my list. That said, I'd rather have a P-51.
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Feb 17, 2021 22:20
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The 109 varied from world-beating to competitive throughout the war; the Spitfire was the only other fighter to do this wire to wire for the entire era. The 190 was mostly better than its contemporary 109 equivalent. The DB series engines were the best or near-best inline LC engines throughout the era. The 262, for all its problems, was a remarkable technical achievement and rightly scared the poo poo out of everyone who flew against it. The Ju-88 and its descendants were consistently among the best medium bombers of the era. 88 and Bf-110 (and descendants) night fighters were far and away the most successful types in their respective roles, though a lot of that metric comes down to opportunities. The Flak 18/36 family of guns were consistently excellent in both AA and AT roles throughout the war. I'd argue the Type IX U-boat was the most effective pound-for-pound weapon of the entire war, though serving on one would have sucked serious rear end. Type XXI descendants are still in service, though its service with the Germans was less than spectacular. The Wurzburg radar family were arguably the best systems of their type, and the various tricks and ideas used to try and neutralize them are some of the best stories of the war.
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Feb 17, 2021 22:21
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Why is it that infantry rifles have gone through multiple redesign cycles since WW2, but machineguns like the M2 and MG42 just keep on keeping on with minimal changes?
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Feb 17, 2021 22:28
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bewbies posted:I'd argue the Type IX U-boat was the most effective pound-for-pound weapon of the entire war, though serving on one would have sucked serious rear end. If we're comparing German v. Allies designs, the USN's Fleet submarines - Gato and later - were vastly more effective and efficient than the U-boats.
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Feb 17, 2021 22:29
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Cessna posted:If we're comparing German v. Allies designs, the USN's Fleet submarines - Gato and later - were vastly more effective and efficient than the U-boats. What's your metric for this? The U-boats sank a lot more tonnage in a far less permissive environment despite being less than half the displacement of their American equivalents.
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Feb 17, 2021 22:33
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