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Shoehead posted:Learning how Argent Energy is produced is really funny if you play Doom 2016 and E back to back. You have Hayden ensuring you it's clean as gently caress, safe and renewable and then later in Hell he's like "And here is were we crush the bodies, only on the brink of pure suffering can we harvest their souls to power microwaves" It's quite literally the exact same soul economy as the Nine Hells in Dungeons and Dragons.
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Apr 2, 2021 01:20
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haveblue posted:Yeah, like I’ve said before: if you’re making a Doom game, and you find yourself designing a level where you walk down a long hall not shooting anything but being repeatedly interrupted by cutscenes, you need to take a step back and re-evaluate everything that led you to this point This from the same people who gave us doom guy literally punches the plot in the first area only a few years prior. The 2nd dlc is mostly good gameplay but the lore and story is just hilarious that they bothered..
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Apr 2, 2021 02:38
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I think the nu doom plot and setting is okay overall, and I liked the weird fantasy stuff in Eternal. They haven’t always got good moment-to-moment writing and the games are kind of low on character and interest overall for how much time they spend on plot stuff. But they’re not that bad. I feel like Doom guy punching the comm screen at the start of Doom 2016 isn’t a “there is no plot, this game is only about carnage” thing. People (me included) took it that way because that’s what they wanted it to be. It’s supposed to be an over the top badass thing where doom guy punches bad guys even when they are just on the tv screen because he lives to kick rear end. The game has quite many of plot dumping moments. It has not got the same attitude to storytelling as Doom/Quake or even Dusk/Amid Evil.
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Apr 2, 2021 03:04
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yeah i was led to believe that doom 2016 did not have long boring exposition dumps where you have to stand in a room while a hologram talks to you about hell computers or whatever, and i was disappointed to find that it actually has a ton of those
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Apr 2, 2021 03:07
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Weedle posted:hell computers imo this is fine as far as plot and exposition goes, going any further is the problem
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Apr 2, 2021 03:12
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Turin Turambar posted:It reminded me to the Star Wars series. People like the first one all the brief mentions that implied an entire and mysterious mythos of clone wars. The creators, instead of being wise and understanding it worked as long it was small teases implying a big, cool world our there, fell into the trap of focusing on it on the prequels. Too much focus on Anakin Skywalker instead of a simple vengeance story: the Clone Troopers, being in the Midichlorians, the Senate, the Sith Apprentice, the Jedi Council, etc. (yes I'm looking at a wiki to remember this poo poo).
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Apr 2, 2021 03:12
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Lucas doing the Fall of Rome and Anakin as the prequel trilogy had nothing to do with fans wanting to learn what the Clone War was, though. It was just part of his grand design for this dynastic epic he wanted to tell from the very beginning.
Lemon-Lime fucked around with this message at 13:50 on Apr 2, 2021 |
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Apr 2, 2021 03:27
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The Clone wars were super lame since as a kid you expected that Obi-Wan fought legions of mutant clone Jedi or something based on that snippet of conversation. Not an army of Boba Fetties fighting weird beep boops. It ultimately feels very detached, though the main point that "learning the wrong lesson" can poison storytelling is dead on. I'm not really sure what Doom 2016 promised but it sure didn't deliver it in Eternal!
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Apr 2, 2021 03:55
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Shoehead posted:Learning how Argent Energy is produced is really funny if you play Doom 2016 and E back to back. You have Hayden ensuring you it's clean as gently caress, safe and renewable and then later in Hell he's like "And here is were we crush the bodies, only on the brink of pure suffering can we harvest their souls to power microwaves" I do like how this all wraps around at the end of the first DLC though, where you go through all the motions that you're going to restore Hayden/Samur into his body as the Seraphim or whatever the gently caress and then immediately stab him in the back and kill him. After all that, Doomguy didn't forget that this dude is also stupid as gently caress. Dieting Hippo posted:In classic doom, if an Archvile (or multiple) appear during a monster trap, you're instantly looking around at your terrain and monster placement to see where you should murder a path through to get to safety and work out how you're getting to this one priority target in a crowd of chaos and infighting. I just don't get the same satisfaction in Eternal. Eternal doesn't really reach this level of threat and lethality until the first DLC and/or on Nightmare difficulty, but it's certainly there. So many enemies can kill you so swiftly that you have to be able to rapidly identify them and delete them from the arena to buy yourself some space. Kind of like how the base game of Doom 2 doesn't actually go that far with enemy placement (it's more frequently annoying than truly challenging) and it took Plutonia and then 20+ years of fans making maps to tease out all the layers of nuance you can get in classic Doom encounter design. The difference I think is that because the arena fights are staged in waves, there's usually more threats on deck once you clear some out, so it feels like a pointless grind where you're not making progress until suddenly it's over. It took a long time of playing through Eternal and doing it on Nightmare before I finally hit the level of satisfaction that I pulled off something skillful and challenging. It's challenging on UV as well, but it feels more like a Diablo-style slaughter fest. Unfortunately the first DLC on Nightmare is just too hard for me so I had to give up. 
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Apr 2, 2021 04:25
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I'm currently going through the Clone Wars CGI series and it's actually pretty great. Also Battlefront 1 (the first) where you could play as a droideka to roll around and shoot some clones was also great.
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Apr 2, 2021 04:28
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The Clone Wars 2D cartoon is extremely good and about to go up on Disney+ if it's not there already vvvvvv The Hayden office scene is shorter than the sentinel planet level in Eternal and less obtrusive and doesn't involve Doomguy saying comic catchphrases haveblue fucked around with this message at 04:38 on Apr 2, 2021 |
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Apr 2, 2021 04:31
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skasion posted:I feel like Doom guy punching the comm screen at the start of Doom 2016 isn’t a “there is no plot, this game is only about carnage” thing. People (me included) took it that way because that’s what they wanted it to be. It’s supposed to be an over the top badass thing where doom guy punches bad guys even when they are just on the tv screen because he lives to kick rear end. The game has quite many of plot dumping moments. It has not got the same attitude to storytelling as Doom/Quake or even Dusk/Amid Evil.
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Apr 2, 2021 04:35
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There's a couple smaller places where you have to listen to a little bit of exposition while on an elevator but there's nothing remotely approaching the part in 2016 where you're just locked in a room with Hayden for 5 minutes while he plot dumps at you. All of the cutscenes you can skip, and should because not of a lick of it matters and much of it doesn't make sense.
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Apr 2, 2021 04:37
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Nothing tops the bit where Olivia is monologuing at you from three feet away and the slayer just takes it. Then she sort of waddles away. Actually maybe this happens twice. The Olivia thing is especially weird since they used the same plot device twice if DLC2 spoilers are correct.
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Apr 2, 2021 05:09
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Spiderdrake posted:Nothing tops the bit where Olivia is monologuing at you from three feet away and the slayer just takes it. Then she sort of waddles away. This exact thing happens at the end of the very first level of Eternal and as a result you have to go to a Darksiders level and talk to a ghost king. In Doom.
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Apr 2, 2021 06:33
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Crowetron posted:This exact thing happens at the end of the very first level of Eternal and as a result you have to go to a Darksiders level and talk to a ghost king. In Doom.
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Apr 2, 2021 13:20
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The dumbest thing was giving your new DOOM game the same title as one of the most well known video games of all time. It's like when they called The Thing prequel "The Thing". I wonder if these AAA devs feel like they gotta do cutscenes and tons of plot to justify their budget. Even if I'd liked the games in a gameplay sense the lore and poo poo would've still turned me off even with a skip cutscene button. In relation to things I liked is nuDOOM's version of E1M1 available anywhere as a track? Awhile back I went looking for it but could only find where someone edited the intro (and included the gun cocking sound before the song really hit which was a good touch) to turn it into a track. Groovelord Neato fucked around with this message at 13:44 on Apr 2, 2021 |
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Apr 2, 2021 13:39
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The Kins posted:Eternal has a "skip cutscene" button. 2016 does not. Fair. Groovelord Neato posted:In relation to things I liked is nuDOOM's version of E1M1 available anywhere as a track? Awhile back I went looking for it but could only find where someone edited the intro (and included the gun cocking sound before the song really hit which was a good touch) to turn it into a track. Do you mean this one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jly9qp40rfw
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Apr 2, 2021 14:26
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EDIT: Beaten to it.
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Apr 2, 2021 14:26
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Crowetron posted:Do you mean this one? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jly9qp40rfw Oh so that is the whole song. I assumed since it was so short a "full" track wasn't around.
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Apr 2, 2021 14:58
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The Kins posted:Eternal has a "skip cutscene" button. 2016 does not. Eternal has interminable unskippable "put the battery into the hole" animations and other time wasters. 2016 has two scenes that are barely multi-minute and most importantly, it's actually well written and directed unlike Eternal.
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Apr 2, 2021 15:09
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Sandy Petersen takes 2:25 answering the yes or no question "Was Lovecraft racist?" https://youtu.be/YLL037UiQhk
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Apr 2, 2021 15:36
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That was kinda fun.
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Apr 2, 2021 16:17
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DatonKallandor posted:Eternal has interminable unskippable "put the battery into the hole" animations and other time wasters. 2016 has two scenes that are barely multi-minute and most importantly, it's actually well written and directed unlike Eternal. well written and directed? you stand in one spot while a dumbass yells at you and you learn absolutely nothing and you cant skip it. i have no idea what animations you are even talking about and 2016 has tons of poo poo like that too like having to trigger every gore nest.
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Apr 3, 2021 02:41
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I think the difference between the 2 is like the punch the plot bit at the start of 2016, one game has a plot that you can just ignore and still follow (kill demons on mars, robot man bad, corporations bad) while the other even though it has a skip button actually expects you to care about the plot in a doom game to have any idea what's going on or you quickly run into why am I in darksiders level? who is this guy? why are there ghosts now? etc.
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Apr 3, 2021 03:30
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You know what I don't think belongs in a Doom game? Cooldowns. I'll be fair in that most of what I don't like about them is the direction they took from Brutal Doom. Fight me. Oh yeah, and you can't call it a Doom game when it has pointless/non-existent infighting(you know, where nothing actually dies).
Kazvall fucked around with this message at 04:55 on Apr 3, 2021 |
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Apr 3, 2021 04:51
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Kazvall posted:You know what I don't think belongs in a Doom game? Cooldowns. I'll be fair in that most of what I don't like about them is the direction they took from Brutal Doom. Fight me.
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Apr 3, 2021 04:56
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are we actually at a point where we're going to pretend doom 2016 is not good
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Apr 3, 2021 05:20
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IronicDongz posted:are we actually at a point where we're going to pretend doom 2016 is not good Kazvall posted:You know what I don't think belongs in a Doom game? Cooldowns. I'll be fair in that most of what I don't like about them is the direction they took from Brutal Doom. Fight me. Unless you mean the glory kills, in which case those were in the Call of Doomy version of the game that I think might have preceded BD, except they were annoying-looking "syncronized melee" quick time events. 
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Apr 3, 2021 05:27
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The worst part of the nuDooms is the last three pages of this thread.
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Apr 3, 2021 06:46
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No John, you are the nuDoom
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Apr 3, 2021 07:55
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Yeah OK guys but how do we all feel about Doom 3's shotgun?
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Apr 3, 2021 08:25
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Shoehead posted:Yeah OK guys but how do we all feel about Doom 3's shotgun? Its better than its super shotgun
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Apr 3, 2021 08:40
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Shoehead posted:Yeah OK guys but how do we all feel about Doom 3's shotgun? It’s one of my favorite melee weapons in a FPS!
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Apr 3, 2021 08:58
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Shoehead posted:Yeah OK guys but how do we all feel about Doom 3's shotgun? not as good as the Quake shotgun, tbh. all joking aside; replayed BFG edition last year and was stunned how bad *all* of the weapons felt like garbage except for the plasma rifle, which owns
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Apr 4, 2021 03:59
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Narcissus1916 posted:Can we at least agree that the decision to focus on "Lore" was an awful one? Like jesus christ, who the gently caress cares about that? I don't think it was done for its own sake, that people care about it, so much as they need a way to expand the universe of Doom because the same Mars/Hell/Mars/Hell gets old after awhile, you need more cool crazy metal poo poo. And the idea of, well, Doom 4 was great, lets expand now that we know we can make a good shooter and have a little more story in the world, that's not the worst idea ever. But man is the execution not at all the right fit for Doom. Shoehead posted:Yeah OK guys but how do we all feel about Doom 3's shotgun? We talking with or without the duct tape mod? 
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Apr 4, 2021 04:20
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my fav Plasma Rifle is the one from D64. It looks cool as hell sounds pretty ok but again looks cool as hell i wonder what itd be like if it sounded like OG Doom's Plasma Rifle
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Apr 4, 2021 04:23
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Voodoo Cafe posted:all joking aside; replayed BFG edition last year and was stunned how bad *all* of the weapons felt like garbage except for the plasma rifle, which owns Did you not use the chaingun at all?
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Apr 4, 2021 05:02
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Yeah my entire Doom 3 BFG play through was basically rotating through the machine gun, plasma rifle, and chain gun—mainly for the sake of variety, but they all did the trick. Barely used anything else really.
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Apr 4, 2021 05:17
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The best part of Doom 3 is reloading the plasma rifle and I am not joking in the slightest.
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Apr 4, 2021 07:54
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