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With the various claims like "Smash give you better money! go there!" or "Anvil gives you cheaper heat clear, go there!", I spent a while eyeballing the Cash and Heat mission cost and values in sandbox mode. Island 1 with  incoming.SABRE is bog standard "Good cash and reasonable heat". Making me thank god I just incidentally landed on making them my usual focus. (For some reason their long mission level 3 intel cost, along with Smash, is more expensive than their level 4 cost. But hey, still some of the best cash per heat/time in the game!) Patriot is "Money ranges from terrible (At T3 it's Slow money missions are even worse than Anvil because ???) to average, with an Intel discount". A least their T4 raises back to "That looks pretty nice!" with 10 intel for $800k over an hour and 40 minutes, vs 1 million for 2 hours from Sabre at 20 intel. But their quick cash seems regularly hosed. Seems like a lovely retirement zone if you have enough broadcast power to spam level 4 networks across an entire faction due to the intel discount, but it is a wild ride until then. Anvil is "Look at that Heat discount!" trying to distract you from the fact it has the universally worst cash payouts in the entire game. We're talking $525k vs 1 million at level 4, and level 4 fast cash only worth 100 thousand (Level 3 Sabre gets you $615k in an hour and 30 minutes). Your cash grind will be soul crushing in Anvil. Smash does indeed pay a bit more than Sabre. But this is to distract you from causing so much heat it is a real bastard to have the missions complete before passive heat closes you down. With 40 vs 50 max t T1, 80 vs 100 max at T2, etc. So if you are struggling already, turning to Smash for salvation might just frustrate you even more where even an attitude of "I'll just let the region lock down, who cares" might not get you your money's worth. Could turn out worth chasing if you know what kind of critical mass of heat reduction it takes to counter this. Hammer feels like a big pile of buggy "Who even QA tested this?" starting strong with roided up fast cash at T1. Then a big roller coaster of "Wait it is poo poo now... okay it is decent again?-No wait" I'm just going to take an extra moment to outline the roller coaster of Hammer I've been double checking across every region in it this morning in sandbox. T1: Higher fast cash value than anyone else, for twice the workers. (Same slow cash as Sabre). Worthwhile to check out. No slow cash bonus. T2: Slow cash as terrible as ANVIL, but only needs 5 intel and 3 scientists (Same fast cash as sabre). Fast cash bonus seemed MIA at T2. Now it is terrible. T3: Fast cash is second best in the game ($100k, Sabre gets $120k) for same heat and intel as Sabre. But uses 6 mercs for muscle oriented base builds. Slow cash is identical to Anvil, and thus poo poo. T4: Fast cash is great again! 2nd best in the game at $180k vs Sabre $200k. It is all hitmen, and 3 minutes instead of 5... Their slow cash is still as hosed as Anvils. TL;DR: Whether you want to go wide or focus on a single faction. poo poo seems pretty loving bizarre everywhere but Sabre (Reliable cash, reasonable heat), or PATRIOT (Flip flops across average and poo poo cash, but intel discount). for most of the crime levels. Because the rest of the world looked like a mess of "But it is a trade off!" traps, or clear lack of QA testing. Maybe my mess of notes made some mistakes here and there, but there is no mistaking seeing poo poo like $525k vs 1 million at crime level 4. (Smash was something like 1.25 million for 170 heat out of 200, and maybe 15 minutes longer mission time, on that note). Section Z fucked around with this message at 17:13 on Apr 7, 2021 |
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Apr 7, 2021 16:39
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| # ? May 28, 2024 18:11 |
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friendly tip here if you decide to go for max's endgame achievement to turn the entire world gold be sure to stop when you have about 10 territories left and fully refuel or else you will be waiting a looong time when you get down to one or two territories
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Apr 7, 2021 16:58
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also my final playtime for a max medium on the first island was 65 hours - i got about half the the treasures, filled out my henchman roster, and killed one super agent (symmetry) toward the end. i also spent the last 5 or so hours on fast forward only on the world screen because by then my base was fully self sustaining and could fight off any threat with no intervention from me which made the finale a little boring i have already started again with ivan on hard on the donut island
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Apr 7, 2021 17:00
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Zadda posted:Anyone got a tip where I can find the dog statue and the John Steele statue? I got the unlock codes for them via mail but can't find them ingame, checked the loot tab and they are not there. Neither is horse or whatever the pre-order bonus was it seems. MonsterEnvy posted:You get them via side stories. If I recall correctly, you also have to start a new game after you have the unlock codes entered and select it as active DLC in the new game settings. So, if you started a game without those entered, you won't see them in game.
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Apr 7, 2021 17:13
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Is there any point to having guards/valets once you get mercs/socialites?
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Apr 7, 2021 17:22
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DJ Dizzy posted:Is there any point to having guards/valets once you get mercs/socialites? i don't think socialites/spin doctors/counter agents staff casino items. at that point you'll probably be mostly using the slot machines, but welcome desks/floor shows/survey stations require valets if you want to keep using them. guards not so much
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Apr 7, 2021 17:29
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DJ Dizzy posted:Is there any point to having guards/valets once you get mercs/socialites?
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Apr 7, 2021 17:30
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Hotfix notes, from their discord:quote:
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Apr 7, 2021 17:38
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Psion posted:Hotfix notes, from their discord: Small fixes but good fixes. Section Z posted:
So would this be to play Tall in SABRE territory with some outposts elsewhere? I've been playing wide so far (all but two regions unlocked and nothing above level 1) but it's getting exhausting dealing with the clicks. It seemed like the "optimal" solution since each new region grants you +20 income but a rank II network only gives +30 so you are spending more antenna points for less payout, but man, it is bleh.
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Apr 7, 2021 17:44
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Comte de Saint-Germain posted:Yep! Though I can't remember what they turn into, I think technicians and valet? Definitely Valets for one of them, I haven't seen technicians yet.
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Apr 7, 2021 17:46
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JerikTelorian posted:Small fixes but good fixes. "Wait, Smash pays extra? gently caress yeah-That is loving 80 heat for a 100 heat cap. Nope, gently caress that for now... Oh, Anvil has better heat schemes? That will make expanding so much smoother-Is that literally half or less money than I'm making in Sabre?" Basically it is reinforcing my  opinion that "Tradeoffs" is a dirty word in game design these days where Devs think they have to punish a +1 bonus with a -5 penalty or else it will be OP/discourage "Build variety".I also only checked this regarding Island 1, so who knows maybe it changes depending on your island? So yeah. Make a save, then shotgun out networks of varied levels across the world to see what they are actually giving you compared to eachother, and reload once you are sure. Section Z fucked around with this message at 18:09 on Apr 7, 2021 |
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Apr 7, 2021 17:49
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I think the biggest thing I want right now is simply for traps to be placeable in the casino. Investigators have been reduced to "who gives a poo poo" until their disguises last 15x as long to allow them access to anything. But soldiers turn the trap corridor between my casino and base proper into a death zone as valet and socialite wander in, one after another, to die and die and die and delay them actually getting to my roomful of guard tables where they can be gunned down efficiently. Or keep soldiers non-aggro until they come across heat-generating equipment, then let them turn berserk. That would let me do the obvious thing and have casino-adjacent rest areas without soldiers bumbling in and killing all my social minions. Despite everything I'm enjoying the game. I think there's something really fun under there that a vigorous application of patches could exhume. So much waiting.
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Apr 7, 2021 17:54
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Section Z posted:So yeah. Make a save, then shotgun out networks of varied levels across the world to see what they are actually giving you compared to eachother, and reload once you are sure. Thanks! Grayshift posted:Despite everything I'm enjoying the game. I think there's something really fun under there that a vigorous application of patches could exhume. So much waiting. This is very true. There's definitely some issues that bother me, or I find annoying, but all of them are very fixable mechanics issues. The core game activity of building a little base and the theme of the game are both really really strong. I'm actually kinda happy this has the "Season Pass" model because I feel that much like a paradox game, it will be buffed into ship-shape with some TLC.
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Apr 7, 2021 18:09
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i'm glad they specifically addressed the pacing as an issue. hoping they also do something to mitigate the constant refrain of poo poo like "something is wrong with either the minions or the training room, boss". Grayshift posted:I think the biggest thing I want right now is simply for traps to be placeable in the casino. Investigators have been reduced to "who gives a poo poo" until their disguises last 15x as long to allow them access to anything. But soldiers turn the trap corridor between my casino and base proper into a death zone as valet and socialite wander in, one after another, to die and die and die and delay them actually getting to my roomful of guard tables where they can be gunned down efficiently. i've gotten decent mileage out of trap corridors that don't lead to my base, if you put a door at the end, investigators will always go all the way through. for soldiers, a guard room at the very front has always been sufficient, combined with a camera on a couple corridor tiles, or i just pull my henchmen up when i know they're inbound.
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Apr 7, 2021 18:11
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Section Z posted:Well I was asking myself "How are people having issues with money or heat when everything seems fine to me where I like building", only to realize nearly everywhere outside of Sabre was a letdown no matter how tempting it sounded on the surface. Patriot seems like it could also be cool if your base can't afford to spam intel computers due to space/initial cash constraints, as long as you are ready to be disappointed with level 3 networks because of what CLEARLY (right? hopefully?) is a bug with it's mission payout at that tier in my grand tour of the sandbox map. It would be even more boring if all the territories were exactly the same. I think it's fine for some territories to be better then others and it's also fine for not all of them to be perfectly balanced at all tiers where 5 intel is always worth $50k or whatever.
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Apr 7, 2021 18:13
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So the way I found to be most effective as far as money making goes was simply to set up as many T2 networks in smash as I could afford, while leaving enough spare network for a quick build up and tear downs as quests required, then gradually expanding out as I built more networks. This works because the south american payouts are so much better, and the best way to play around heat is to literally ignore it, since a country will only send one squad at you at a time, excluding super agents, so you literally don't care how high your heat goes so long as you don't trigger a super agent, lockdown periods are short and reset heat, and payouts are over the entire scheme, so a scheme that goes over the heat limit but gets 75% of the way done still gives you 75% of the gold. Since smash is paying double to triple what the other places are, it's the best money over the shortest period of time. Once you've actually got a bit of a network set up, the passive gold generation does a lot to cover your needs, so late game you can't go wrong doing whatever you want, but early on smash is optimal for the quick cash infusions you need for practically everything to do with your base, and limiting yourself to smash territories keeps squads manageable. The actual downside to them is that they only cover 4 territories, so blue saint is always over something, but he's one of the easiest super agents to deal with so it's a minor annoyance at worst.
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Apr 7, 2021 18:19
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DJ Dizzy posted:Is there any point to having guards/valets once you get mercs/socialites? Guards can man Security Cameras, and they do a better job of spotting intruders than Workers. Valets are the only ones who can man the casino items. Also you need loads of them for promoting/schemes anyway and they’re highly expendable.
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Apr 7, 2021 18:34
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There's the caveat that when Steele triggers they and Blue Saint are going to cover full half of SMASH if you don't spread, so going wide is kinda needed to keep the pressure off those territories. I think SMASH then SABRE are the money-making priorities (absent special schemes from loot and/or henchmen), other places should have valets heat reduction schemes going 24/7 so if you need to run a plot/sidequest mission there the heat is already down. Or use them to refuel the doom weapon in your spare time.
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Apr 7, 2021 18:39
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I cannot comprehend people playing this game on normal speed
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Apr 7, 2021 18:39
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if you recruit fugu she gives you basically free heat reduction schemes, but eventually i just started ignoring heat entirely
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Apr 7, 2021 18:40
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Does every lockdown increase the level/quality of the agents they send? And is a wave only sent when at least one lockdown has happened? Does signal strength in a region affect anything about what is sent? So many questions about basic mechanics
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Apr 7, 2021 18:43
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DarkHorse posted:Does every lockdown increase the level/quality of the agents they send? And is a wave only sent when at least one lockdown has happened? Does signal strength in a region affect anything about what is sent? I don't know how it's calculated when FoJs launch raids, but when they do the quality of the agents depends on how much total heat you have across their combined territories. Lockdowns only matter in that they freeze that territory at max heat until they resolve.
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Apr 7, 2021 18:50
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DarkHorse posted:Does every lockdown increase the level/quality of the agents they send? And is a wave only sent when at least one lockdown has happened? Does signal strength in a region affect anything about what is sent? I'm pretty certain that the punishment of a lockdowns are two things: first, you are locked out from doing any extra missions, and second, your heat is higher than it would be otherwise. The quality of agents sent to you seem to be based on your overall heat in that region, not linked to the number of lockdowns.
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Apr 7, 2021 18:50
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Section Z posted:With the various claims like "Smash give you better money! go there!" or "Anvil gives you cheaper heat clear, go there!", I spent a while eyeballing the Cash and Heat mission cost and values in sandbox mode. Island 1 with You're awesome for doing this! I'd be really interested in seeing your notes if you were taking them in google sheets or something else easily shareable.
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Apr 7, 2021 18:52
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I can tell you if you start by skipping the tutorial the first wave of investigators starts timing immediately. It'll be like absolutely level 0 combined forces or whatever they're called because you literally have not built anything yet, nor been to the map to even get heat in the first place. I assume once you start a new game (or get past the tutorial in a tutorial game) waves just come on some random x minutes based on wherever has the highest heat. You can actually watch the symbol for a wave change in the top right if you like, drop a bunch of SMASH heat and now it switches to ANVIL investigators or whatever as your new highest.
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Apr 7, 2021 18:57
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LLSix posted:You're awesome for doing this! I'd be really interested in seeing your notes if you were taking them in google sheets or something else easily shareable. While I appreciate the vote of confidence, My notes are even less coherent than my posts  I think the main other thing I was obsessing over the other day was "How many goddamned traps does the magnet render agents invincible against, or even negate prior trap damage?" Bees and flamethrowers work properly with them, at least. You would think KO gas would as a damage over time, but every attempt even if they triggered the gas first it was like they never got gassed. Ah yes, unrelated heads up about T5 traps. Giant plant seems legit (at LEAST 100 damage because it killed level 3 investigators), but it is also a 6x6 item. Get ready to bulldoze your traps maze. Section Z fucked around with this message at 19:08 on Apr 7, 2021 |
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Apr 7, 2021 19:01
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i turned off heat gain while i was testing trap effects and pathing in sandbox. all the agents were level 1-2 and came at a constant rate despite me never doing schemes. the surprising part was that about 1 wave out of 10 was soldiers instead of investigators.
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Apr 7, 2021 19:08
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giant plant does good damage, but it only attacks a single target. i'm not sure why it worked, but i could place them just fine in 4 width corridors despite the placement markers.
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Apr 7, 2021 19:12
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More thoughts: -I'm a filthy-rich supervillain; let me research additional means of carting minions to the world map to ease the helipad congestion. Fancy yachts; private planes; freakin' submarines; they'd all fit right in an evil island lair. -Please for the love of all that is holy, give players more control over muscle minion weapons and posts. I hate having to delete racks and minions because the pistol stations are still full. -Some automation for idle genius/henchmen would be nice. I'd like to be able to tell Eli to patrol the the casino and sweet talk investigators when he's not selected, or have Max loop between buffing training/the control room and sitting at his desk.
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Apr 7, 2021 19:13
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Just tested it and saboteurs do turn into technicians when they're brainwashed  ChickenHeart posted:-I'm a filthy-rich supervillain; let me research additional means of carting minions to the world map to ease the helipad congestion. Fancy yachts; private planes; freakin' submarines; they'd all fit right in an evil island lair. The donut map even has this cool looking entry that you can never interact with, as far as I know  
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Apr 7, 2021 19:26
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JerikTelorian posted:I'm pretty certain that the punishment of a lockdowns are two things: first, you are locked out from doing any extra missions, and second, your heat is higher than it would be otherwise. The quality of agents sent to you seem to be based on your overall heat in that region, not linked to the number of lockdowns. It also stops passive income I believe
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Apr 7, 2021 19:41
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When we are able to properly open the ASR files stats and things are stored in, that'll be a good day.
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Apr 7, 2021 20:00
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ChickenHeart posted:More thoughts: Why do even level 3 investigators rate a cool speed boat? If they are traveling from across the world in those, we should be able to steal them for a return trip. I am also probably not alone in wishing wish there was a minion cap of at least 400. Even with only a two level island 1 base in sandbox mode 300 can feel stretched thin just loving around. A lot of that is probably down to really awkward minion prioritization. Like how even in sandbox mode where you never need to run missions that consume quantum chemists, I poo poo out a bunch of extra quantum chemists to make up for the fact it kept using them to staff minion care items with plenty of idle scientists and techs.
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Apr 7, 2021 20:21
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Bloodly posted:When we are able to properly open the ASR files stats and things are stored in, that'll be a good day. One of my favorite thing about EG1 was going to the Assets folder and mucking about with the text files. Giving myself a larger minion cap, restoring henchmen's lives, getting access to items and characters not originally available, fixing bugs... it was a hoot and made the game infinitely more playable 
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Apr 7, 2021 20:22
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cheat engine works fine for most of those things. what i'd like from mods is better controls on henchman behavior. the table or useless wandering system really doesn't help the henchmen with non-combat skills.
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Apr 7, 2021 20:27
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gimme the GOD drat candy posted:giant plant does good damage, but it only attacks a single target. i'm not sure why it worked, but i could place them just fine in 4 width corridors despite the placement markers. I believe it's a 4x4 trap, with a 6x6 trigger/target radius. The green squares are like those showing the aura of buff items.
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Apr 7, 2021 21:10
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 Please at least let them all just get on the same helicopter I'm dying
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Apr 7, 2021 21:32
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Danaru posted:
pictures from my base 
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Apr 7, 2021 21:35
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Coupla thoughts- I don't know if I've seen anyone mention it, but the last tier trap cute puppy destroys suspicion/evidence, I think it's unique among the traps with that property. Definitely agree on more unlockable transport modes, speedboats and minisubs and such, same with enemy agents. The agents in EG1 came in all sorts of ways, like different FoJs either paragliding in or frog-manning up out of the ocean(might be imagining that one), stuff like that. Hybridizing rooms is cool and all, like having a patch of powerplant for an incinerator in my prison etc, but I'd really like to be able to place cameras in the casino/control room etc without having to make a 2x2 corridor patch.
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Apr 7, 2021 22:19
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I think my game has softlocked, I need a minion type I haven't unlocked to complete my loot side mission, but I can't unlock that minion type because I'm in a loot side mission. The scheme doesn't seem to be changing either. Edit: this is apparently a fairly common issue. Make sure to keep a backup before starting any side story I guess. MorphineMike fucked around with this message at 22:28 on Apr 7, 2021 |
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Apr 7, 2021 22:21
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