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One problem with a potential Captain America and Winter Soldier 2 is that they seemed to set up Bucky for a "walking the earth like Kane" kind of future. They could start apart and come together later but it also seems like they could each get their own thing. Also, they have to give Sam a movie.
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Apr 23, 2021 12:07
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The_Doctor posted:
Ah, the classic "bad actors" defense to avoid admitting the system was (and is) broken
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Apr 23, 2021 12:08
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I really didn't like how Sam's public rebuke was all it took to make more progress than Karli ever made.
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Apr 23, 2021 12:10
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Ravel posted:I really didn't like how Sam's public rebuke was all it took to make more progress than Karli ever made. A celebrity making more of an impact than an activist seems pretty realistic.
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Apr 23, 2021 12:13
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live with fruit posted:One problem with a potential Captain America and Winter Soldier 2 is that they seemed to set up Bucky for a "walking the earth like Kane" kind of future. They could start apart and come together later but it also seems like they could each get their own thing. I actually thought the opposite. I could totally see CA4 opening with Bucky going "So I'm dating your sister and moving in..." Also, man imagine even 10 years ago having a black Captain America in the MCU monologuing about how the terrorists have a point, and for that to be generally acceptable to the audience. Thundercracker fucked around with this message at 12:23 on Apr 23, 2021 |
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Apr 23, 2021 12:18
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Much like Ghandi and the Indian Army and MLK and the Black Panthers, Sam wouldn't have been able to make his point without Karli and the Flag Smashers. Because violent resistance isn't only valid but necessary. I appreciate Cap coming out against the word terrorist, even in real life when people use it now everything they say after just starts to sound like fog horn because they're inevitably saying some truly dumb poo poo.
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Apr 23, 2021 12:19
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Makes you wonder why Sam, Bucky and Walker bothered trying to stop them when they were stealing medicines from supply depots.
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Apr 23, 2021 12:25
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Ravel posted:Makes you wonder why Sam, Bucky and Walker bothered trying to stop them when they were stealing medicines from supply depots. Sam and Bucky didn't, their interest was in the serum. And Walker is a government stooge.
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Apr 23, 2021 12:31
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It maybe because I woke earlier than planned and still haven’t had my coffee, but the editing felt brutally tight. Otherwise, I feel like they stuck the landing.
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Apr 23, 2021 12:37
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Well that was a wild ride overall. I do want to see more Bucky/Cap action in the future. Their chemistry was really good in this. Next is Loki in June, correct?
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Apr 23, 2021 12:37
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I just imagined the Wakandians and Shuri going ‘Oh they want a Captain America suit? Time to make the gaudiest American outfit we can.’
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Apr 23, 2021 12:38
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Sharon in this episode was Hayward from WV. Seemingly well intentioned but hints of malice through the season then acts of comical villainy in the final episode so you know they were the big bad (all alooong). Felt just as clumsy. Also everything to do with the episode with the serum doctor makes no sense in retrospect, especially when you remember all the threatening texts sent to Karli from who we now know is Sharon
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Apr 23, 2021 12:39
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BurritoJustice posted:Sharon in this episode was Hayward from WV. Seemingly well intentioned but hints of malice through the season then acts of comical villainy in the final episode so you know they were the big bad (all alooong). Felt just as clumsy. Also everything to do with the episode with the serum doctor makes no sense in retrospect, especially when you remember all the threatening texts sent to Karli from who we now know is Sharon Unless her plan was to get a pardon out of Sam and infiltrate the CIA.
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Apr 23, 2021 12:41
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Sharon definitely needed a Usual Suspects type exposition scene. Like clearly laying out why she did this or that. Otherwise half the things she does is baffling and kinda hand waved in a Keikaku (just as planned) way by the ending. The only thing I can believe is that her position as power broker is actually way less secure than we are initially led to believe and she was acting out of desperation.
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Apr 23, 2021 12:52
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I thought Sam's speech felt a little silly given that the flag smashers just tried to murder a bunch of world leaders. How many more chances is he going to give a bunch of cold blooded killer? I must have misunderstood something, I thought the plan was for there to be a new MCU show continuously, I assume there are no plans until Loki premieres in 1½ month.
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Apr 23, 2021 12:52
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BurritoJustice posted:Sharon in this episode was Hayward from WV. Seemingly well intentioned but hints of malice through the season then acts of comical villainy in the final episode so you know they were the big bad (all alooong). Felt just as clumsy. Also everything to do with the episode with the serum doctor makes no sense in retrospect, especially when you remember all the threatening texts sent to Karli from who we now know is Sharon I just realize that WV can stand for WandVision or for Westview.
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Apr 23, 2021 12:56
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I'd loved a new MCU/SW show continuously but I'm just happy we don't have the drought from the first year. During quarantine D+ was basically the Moana and Coco streaming service.
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Apr 23, 2021 12:58
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Thundercracker posted:I'd loved a new MCU/SW show continuously but I'm just happy we don't have the drought from the first year. During quarantine D+ was basically the Moana and Coco streaming service. They probably don't want Loki overshadowing The Bad Batch.
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Apr 23, 2021 13:01
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Oasx posted:I thought Sam's speech felt a little silly given that the flag smashers just tried to murder a bunch of world leaders. How many more chances is he going to give a bunch of cold blooded killer? Maybe that was the plan before COVID hosed up the schedule?
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Apr 23, 2021 13:02
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I think Sam's speech was clunky and went on waaaaay too long, and I don't really get why they included Sharon in the show at all. Like, remove her from the show, and what do you really lose? Either cut her, or actually integrate her into the show. Her random appearances, and then, "Surprise" she's the Power Broker (...okay?) felt really weak and pointless. But overall, I think the show stuck the landing. Love Sam as Cap, love ending on Sam and Bucky just having fun at the party, loved how Sam fights with the shield, wings, and rocket pack. Overall, good stuff.
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Apr 23, 2021 13:06
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It's pretty nuts how long Sam's speech went. I couldn't tell you half of what he said.
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Apr 23, 2021 13:16
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Oasx posted:I thought Sam's speech felt a little silly given that the flag smashers just tried to murder a bunch of world leaders. How many more chances is he going to give a bunch of cold blooded killer? There's a Star Wars show starting on May 4th (because of course there is on that date), Disney probably doesn't want an MCU show getting the attention when they can just spread them out.
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Apr 23, 2021 13:17
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Great episode and great show overall although I feel like the action sequences would've worked better in daylight. Especially the stuff over the hudson was hard to see in parts Stan is really great as Bucky. It really hit me how different he looked after he was done making amends and had made some peace with himself
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Apr 23, 2021 13:21
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Oasx posted:
I think it was based off the assumption that every series would have roughly the same number of episodes as WandaVision (which also put up 2 episodes in its first week).
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Apr 23, 2021 13:23
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Goodnight, sweet Leeeeepair, I will miss you  Finale was okay. Some nice action scenes but I was unsatisfied with how all the Flag Smashers were ultimately dealt with. Sam's speech, while the intent was good, was clunky as hell and the whole scene felt really awkward with that shitheel senator just arguing with him in the street trying to defend the GRC's horseshit. Loved Cap v Batroc and am gutted we won't get another rematch now (gently caress YOU, SHARON) as he's great as a recurring Bond style pre-credits badguy to chump on. The Power Broker stuff was eh, we've all suspected for weeks so no surprises there, it feels half-baked and horrendously out of character (my head canon is that joining the CIA crack-pinged Sharon's brain). And while it was nice that Sam did get Isaiah his much deserved and long overdue recognition, I'm not sure I buy him being pleased about it given everything he said in the previous ep. It just felt too pat. And much as it pains me to admit it given it's Sam's series and all about him accepting he absolutely is the best man for the job my favourite moment of the whole episode was John putting aside his thirst for vengeance to try and save the people trapped in the truck. I'm kinda hype to see where they take him from here because Wyatt Russell has been an unexpected delight in what is a pretty thankless role. Plus Bucky dunking on him never gets old. So yeah, merely an okay end to the series but overall, while far from perfect I really liked the show and would deffo watch a second series if they do one. If I'm honest, I kinda prefer the six episode format, I like that it gives more room to explore the characters, feels like a typical comic book story arc than heavily compressed into a one off cinema experience.
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Apr 23, 2021 13:25
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Wuxi posted:Great episode and great show overall although I feel like the action sequences would've worked better in daylight. Especially the stuff over the hudson was hard to see in parts Pretty sure that's about hiding the effects. As is, they still weren't movie level.
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Apr 23, 2021 13:29
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lots of 'oh cool' moments, but as soon as I apply any kind of critique to it, the whole thing falls apart. Flag smashers never being truly committed, trying to take hostages? Sam's hokey rebuke of Senator whoever and world bank no one who really had no demonstrated or intended justification for what they were doing but just being a windmill for the smashers to tilt at? Sam didn't actually resolve anything but perpetuating the status quo (loving moralists). This is literally the hire more black prison guards the meme the comic the show.
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Apr 23, 2021 13:31
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When did "dramatic irony" become such a dirty word? What is gained by keeping the Power Broker reveal this late from the audience, versus getting that out of the way quickly and wringing actual suspense out of it still being a secret to the characters?
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Apr 23, 2021 13:31
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Sentinel Red posted:And while it was nice that Sam did get Isaiah his much deserved and long overdue recognition, I'm not sure I buy him being pleased about it given everything he said in the previous ep. It just felt too pat. I think a lot of Isiah's objections were built on the presumption that the United States would never accept a Black Captain America; either the government or the people. Which Sam demonstrated they will, at least when that Captain America forces the issue by taking shield and wearing the uniform with or without their permission, and just doing what he's going to do regardless of the hate that some people will have towards him for it. In terms of recognition for Isiah himself, I'm kind of assuming that Isiah is living under an assumed name with the last few decades. The people who installed that statue and information probably think Isiah is dead, so they're not looking for him or anything. Edit: I really hope that whatever work Sam next appears in that they change his uniform a bit, at least to get rid of that stupid looking headpiece. The googles on their own were much better looking. The half balaclava headsock thing just looks silly, and the fact his ears just poke out some holes in the side just makes it worse. Seeing that pulled me out of the moment when he was giving his big speech to the senators, since I hadn't noticed it till then. tsob fucked around with this message at 13:39 on Apr 23, 2021 |
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Apr 23, 2021 13:36
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I don't know if i'm just imagining things, but I recently re-watched Lodge 49 and the way Walker acted in that last scene reminded me of Dudley a bit.
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Apr 23, 2021 13:40
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So what was the Flagsmasher's plan in this episode? At first thought it was just to take out the GRC leadership, but then they could have just killed them in the building, right? Why move them?
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Apr 23, 2021 13:43
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It was pretty obvious in the previous episode that Sharon was the Power Broker, and it also seems pretty obvious that she intentionally gave the SSS to Karli as a long con to get back into the US government. I think signs point to her being a Skrull.
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Apr 23, 2021 13:46
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Levels of non-commital status quo bullshit only attainable by Disney when the senator who in the previous episode cackled maniacally as he declared "gently caress the refugees! I'm going to go over your heads and kick them all out with no extra considerations!" (shocking even the other GRC suits) gets hit with a slap on the wrist and quite literally just having to add some minorities onto his board of evil directors I also feel for the Aussie flag smasher who had the "are we the baddies?" moment and no real damage to his name getting merced by relatable psychopath Zemo. it's somewhat uncomfortable how okay people are with Zemo given his history of bombing the UN and killing T'chaka
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Apr 23, 2021 14:08
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BurritoJustice posted:Levels of non-commital status quo bullshit only attainable by Disney when the senator who in the previous episode cackled maniacally as he declared "gently caress the refugees! I'm going to go over your heads and kick them all out with no extra considerations!" (shocking even the other GRC suits) gets hit with a slap on the wrist and quite literally just having to add some minorities onto his board of evil directors I was sorely disappointed they didn't make him Power Broker, it would have fit in perfectly as he would reveal that he only let Karli get as close as she can because he allow it and now that testing has been perfected, he would had the perfect tool to help the GRC carry out their agenda. And honestly I was not okay with the death of the survivors, it really rubs it in the Millennial face that they are ultimately powerless before old world illuminati and the New World Order
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Apr 23, 2021 14:15
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I was so pumped when he gave up the Falcon costume but then they gave him this goofy rear end google version of Captain America. I really wish they’d done literally anything else but the goggle bandana. Perfect costume except for that. Just hits every aesthetic dislike for me, but I guess I can live with it. Interested to see what’s next for these nerds.
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Apr 23, 2021 14:15
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gyrobot posted:I was sorely disappointed they didn't make him Power Broker, it would have fit in perfectly as he would reveal that he only let Karli get as close as she can because he allow it and now that testing has been perfected, he would had the perfect tool to help the GRC carry out their agenda.r I disagree, and don't think it'd have fit at all if Zemo was the Power Broker, because why would someone who hates super soldiers and who has made it his mission in life to eliminate them at every opportunity, including smashing every vial of the serum he came across at the first chance he got, work to not only make super soldiers but employ them? Nor has he ever indicated he gives a single whiff of a poo poo about the GRC or their agenda. Him being the Power Broker is about as far from perfect as I can imagine, and he was the one person I was reasonably confident it wouldn't be, because nothing about it made sense.
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Apr 23, 2021 14:19
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tsob posted:I disagree, and don't think it'd have fit at all if Zemo was the Power Broker, because why would someone who hates super soldiers and who has made it his mission in life to eliminate them at every opportunity, including smashing every vial of the serum he came across at the first chance he got, work to not only make super soldiers but employ them? Nor has he ever indicated he gives a single whiff of a poo poo about the GRC or their agenda. Him being the Power Broker is about as far from perfect as I can imagine, and he was the one person I was reasonably confident it wouldn't be, because nothing about it made sense. The Senator I mean, not Zemo, I didn't word it properly.
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Apr 23, 2021 14:21
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gyrobot posted:The Senator I mean, not Zemo, I didn't word it properly. Ah, sorry. I guess it'd have made sense in a foreshadowing for other shows way, but there was so little of him in the show that it'd have felt unsatisfying for a lot of people in a different way that you find the actual reveal I imagine.
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Apr 23, 2021 14:23
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BurritoJustice posted:Levels of non-commital status quo bullshit only attainable by Disney when the senator who in the previous episode cackled maniacally as he declared "gently caress the refugees! I'm going to go over your heads and kick them all out with no extra considerations!" (shocking even the other GRC suits) gets hit with a slap on the wrist and quite literally just having to add some minorities onto his board of evil directors Everyone has goldfish brains when it comes to the MCU. John Walker literally just murdered a guy two episodes ago for no reason, and are now cheering on his heroic moment.
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Apr 23, 2021 14:31
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BurritoJustice posted:I also feel for the Aussie flag smasher who had the "are we the baddies?" moment and no real damage to his name getting merced by relatable psychopath Zemo. it's somewhat uncomfortable how okay people are with Zemo given his history of bombing the UN and killing T'chaka The Flag Smashers are sympathetic and I would probably get along with them in real life, but they have no personality. Or, let me rephrase, their personality is that they're political. Their backstory is also that they are political. They are characters defined entirely, head to toe, by their politics. That's...I mean, that's boring. It's hard to engage with that, even if you actually do share their politics. Zemo is a dangerous ideologue who absolutely belongs in jail and would probably be kinda annoying to hang out with in real life, but he's stylish and interesting and has a compelling history with our protagonists. It's no wonder that everyone would end up liking him more.
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