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mila kunis posted:am i correct in thinking the labour left deserves this. they had a once in a lifetime opportunity to hijack a major party in a liberal demoracy after the centrists were dumb enough to throw open the doors to the public and they took it with corbyn, and instead of holding firm after the brexit loss and keeping left control of the party they crumbled like morons and voted in someone guaranteed to wreck them I think its that the left on their own didn't have the voting power to swing the leadership and were also demoralised. Plus the really bad attack lines v starmer only materialised after he was already leader. (which was a gently caress up) With Corbyn basically the whole membership saw the writing on the wall regarding centrist nothingmen so voted for the only other option. Whereas kier positioned himself as a unifying figure who would thread the needle between corbynism and the establishment, then just suicidally attacked the left when he got in instead. Probably coz that's what his faction is primarily concerned with.
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May 8, 2021 16:59
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Communist Thoughts posted:I think its that the left on their own didn't have the voting power to swing the leadership and were also demoralised. Plus the really bad attack lines v starmer only materialised after he was already leader. (which was a gently caress up) i posted as such after the brexit loss, but it seemed pretty idiotic to assume any non-left candidate wouldn't immediately attack the left after winning. i remember seeing a bunch of people too depressed to vote in the leadership election. you should keep power instead of ceding it, and one loss isn't the end of the world unless you do something as boneheaded as let someone like sir keir starner take over your party in its wake
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May 8, 2021 17:04
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Communist Thoughts posted:the article from the dude is this one, worth taking with a grain of salt cause hes kinda a melty dude but he seems to be an economic lefty who just wants to end neoliberalism and libertarianism's hold over the UK economy. its also probably the time hes most pissed off with corbyn and he reconciles a little later, though never comes back to advise policy. Aren't points three and four there the kind of thing that was described in the report into the internal sabotage that was going on? Like the leaders office would issue a statement and then the comms dept would lose it down the back of the sofa instead of providing it to the media? I can't remember and it doesn't matter anymore because the right have turned out to even more powerful at sabotaging themselves so who gives a gently caress, and it doesn't change the first point he makes, but still that might not be fair to put on the plate of Corbyn I suppose one could say he should have done a nice big purge but as others have stated more eloquently in recent posts he isn't really the type. Plus even if he had purged Tom Watson & his ilk they would still have been in the newspapers every day except now whining about how Jeremy is pol pot and everyone is going to the gulag and he's going to personally build a skull tower
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May 8, 2021 17:05
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Does nobody remember who it was in labour that championed 2nd ref?quote:Labour's Brexit chief today publicly demanded a second referendum from the party's talks with Theresa May .
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May 8, 2021 17:07
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biden legalized it?
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May 8, 2021 17:08
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mila kunis posted:i posted as such after the brexit loss, but it seemed pretty idiotic to assume any non-left candidate wouldn't immediately attack the left after winning. i remember seeing a bunch of people too depressed to vote in the leadership election. you should keep power instead of ceding it, and one loss isn't the end of the world unless you do something as boneheaded as let someone like sir keir starner take over your party in its wake a lot of people had convinced themselves that 2019 was going to be like 2017 and were incredibly shell-shocked when it wasn't; this was a position they were pretty much forced into by having to constantly justify to the #FBPE set that they were still going for corbynism. corbyn's defeat ensured a deluge of "WE TOLD YOU SO YOU LOONEY LEFTIES" and the feeling was just... bad
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May 8, 2021 17:09
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though, yeah, it really was pretty obvious that starmer was as much of a competence vacuum as he is, but he managed to sort of slip under the radar while everyone was still stunned
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May 8, 2021 17:11
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there wasn't a real left candidate in the post-Corbyn leadership election tbh. people tried to convince themselves long-bailey was a radical but it was pretty sad to watch
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May 8, 2021 17:12
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It's worth remembering the left was so demoralised coz until like the day after the 2019 GE we had been told the party was being internally reorganised and obviously they were gonna not make blairs mistake and make sure there was a successor. It remains to be seen whether any of that was being done but the succession wasn't. Then after the election we get rhe leak report telling us the scale of sabotage was far larger than we'd been told and they'd just been.. I dunno? Taking it on the chin quietly and stacking the NEC? There was an element of the Corbyn administration that just played pretend to the membership quite a bit
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May 8, 2021 17:13
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I held my nose to vote RLB at the time but she's grown on me since
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May 8, 2021 17:14
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laura pidcock was obviously being set up as the heir, but she got eliminated as well which i don't think they saw coming (they should've seen this coming)
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May 8, 2021 17:14
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euphronius posted:do people really say “Boris” or is like a joke name that no one actually uses. it’s real Unusual to find anyone who doesn’t call him Boris
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May 8, 2021 17:31
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killerwhat posted:it’s real except among his friends and family etc
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May 8, 2021 17:32
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ew I bet it’s his chat up line “you lovely lady can call me Alex  “
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May 8, 2021 17:39
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im honestly impressed that the uk labour party found someone to lead them who was worse than hillary
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May 8, 2021 17:44
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oliwan posted:I don't understand this post op, are you saying it's bad to do what voters want? You must be a highly paid Labour strategist.
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May 8, 2021 17:46
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The fact that a majority of people who voted for Corbyn in 2015 and 2016 voted for Keith's vision of "mild social democracy with better media optics" should tell you how well any purge would have gone. MPs and the membership were just not up for it, people couldn't even get rid of Margaret Hodge ffs. Also obligitary "Labour lost 2 million votes to the Lib Dems even with a second referendum promise" reminder about how well keeping the soft brexit stance would have been. Especially as the 2019 locals and euros were real bad for Labour and big drivers for dropping the soft brexit stance. Not to mention all the Westminster wrangling that showed it was basically impossible to get any kind of soft brexit through especially given that a Labour majority was very very unlikely and none of Labours coalition partners would have gone along with brexit.
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May 8, 2021 17:49
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mila kunis posted:am i correct in thinking the labour left deserves this. they had a once in a lifetime opportunity to hijack a major party in a liberal demoracy after the centrists were dumb enough to throw open the doors to the public and they took it with corbyn, and instead of holding firm after the brexit loss and keeping left control of the party they crumbled like morons and voted in someone guaranteed to wreck them to gain that sort of control permanently the left would've needed a decade in control of labour. the party is incredibly rotten due to the huge number of psycho blairites both as MPs/councillors and just controlling the party machinery the fact is though that teh leaked report and starmer burying the forde report after he fukcing asked for it has probably killed labour. the refrain was always "any labour government is better than a tory one" to justify the left voting for the lovely centrists and then everyone got exposed to just how massive a lie that was then starmer rewarded all of those most heavily involved in creating such a toxic culture
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May 8, 2021 17:54
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Just lmao Labour couldn't even manage to say they supported giving NHS workers a raise after a whole loving year of Covid.
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May 8, 2021 17:57
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there isn’t enough time for electoral politics. oh well
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May 8, 2021 17:57
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CoolCab posted:oh also, as has come up before, some of you might react with "so you think we should pivot now to get those voters back?" loving nooooooooooope. that's how you lost them, i have no loving clue how you win them back. a party that wound up standing for overturning loving democratic votes and betraying the very foundation of our participatory democracy unsurprisingly is a poor strategy for a political party who relies on votes. Very slightly less than half the county voted remain, we should tell them to gently caress off and die forevermore, otherwise we are overturning democracy. Got it. If I was a UK remain voter my choices are: Conservative: Auslander Raus! Full speed ahead! We are willing to do ANYTHING for Brexit, including literally destroying the country. Labour: Half of us are for leave but for completely different and very legitimate reasons. The other half of us are remain but are scared to say so. If you elect us we will be for both sides at once. Lib Dem: You don’t normally like anything in our programme but we are clearly Remain. The last time we formed a government was around the Great War. You can trust us, we would never team up with the Tories. Oops. Plaid: Let’s see if this union with England thing pays off. It’s only been 700 years, give it time. SNP: gently caress you, you loving English fucks. Not only are we Remain, we are an rear end hair from becoming the newest German State.
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May 8, 2021 17:59
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Jose posted:to gain that sort of control permanently the left would've needed a decade in control of labour. the party is incredibly rotten due to the huge number of psycho blairites both as MPs/councillors and just controlling the party machinery I know Formby had alot going on in her personal life bring in recovery from cancer, but it was still very frustrating she just rolled over and gave up and soon as Starmer came into power. McNichol spent years fighting a rearguard action and making GBS threads everything up for Corbyn, and then she just hands over the keys without a single fight. Kind of seems like the difference between the left and right factions in a nutshell
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May 8, 2021 18:03
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"We can't publicly put out a strong statement of support for paying healthcare workers, as we might alienate the absolute loving psychos who think nurses and doctors who just finished a total hell year should get bent! It's an important Labour constituency!!"
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May 8, 2021 18:03
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Nieuw Amsterdam posted:Very slightly less than half the county voted remain, we should tell them to gently caress off and die forevermore, otherwise we are overturning democracy. Got it.
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May 8, 2021 18:07
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mrmcd posted:"We can't publicly put out a strong statement of support for paying healthcare workers, as we might alienate the absolute loving psychos who think nurses and doctors who just finished a total hell year should get bent! It's an important Labour constituency!!" lol he said give them the basic raise and then negotiate from there. negotiate with who you absolute loving buffoon you'd be in control
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May 8, 2021 18:28
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if everyone listed here died from the building collapsing labour would mayhbe have a shot at not being poo poo https://twitter.com/ProgressOnline/status/1391064916824571906?s=20
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May 8, 2021 18:30
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Nieuw Amsterdam posted:Biden’s current game plan is to just do whatever has high approval ratings among voters. lol drug warrior biden is not legalizing weed
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May 8, 2021 18:30
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Nieuw Amsterdam posted:You want legal cannabis? Done. I know we Americans post some ignorant poo poo in the UK thread but lmao at this one
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May 8, 2021 18:34
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MikeCrotch posted:The fact that a majority of people who voted for Corbyn in 2015 and 2016 voted for Keith's vision of "mild social democracy with better media optics" should tell you how well any purge would have gone. MPs and the membership were just not up for it, people couldn't even get rid of Margaret Hodge ffs. Though I don't remember anyone prominent in Labour disputing Keith's pitch either. Corbynism without Corbyn, but the media doesn't hate us was obvious bullshit, but RLB didn't make an issue of it as far as I can remember.
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May 8, 2021 18:35
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Raskolnikov38 posted:lol drug warrior biden is not legalizing weed https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/willyakowicz/2021/04/20/president-biden-supports-states-right-to-legalize-cannabis/amp/ Full decriminalization at the Federal level and then states can regulate it on their own like they do with alcohol. Made the announcement on 4/20. I live in a state where it will be fully legal for recreational use in about 60 days (Virginia). Majority Leader Schumer also supports full legalization. “Treat it like alcohol” is the official Democratic position at this point. Real Biden is definitely kicking the rear end of the make believe democrats that live in peoples heads.
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May 8, 2021 18:38
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Lmao forever if Rayner sold out only to instantly be hosed over https://twitter.com/SamCoatesSky/status/1391084949156114433?s=19
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May 8, 2021 18:39
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Imagine describing Joe biden as "kicking rear end" lol
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May 8, 2021 18:39
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Nieuw Amsterdam posted:Very slightly less than half the county voted remain, we should tell them to gently caress off and die forevermore, otherwise we are overturning democracy. Got it. it's telling that you have to make up someone telling you to "gently caress off and die forevermore" in order to lessen the lunacy of publicly scheming to crush a referendum AFTER it was voted on
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May 8, 2021 18:41
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Nieuw Amsterdam posted:https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.forbes.com/sites/willyakowicz/2021/04/20/president-biden-supports-states-right-to-legalize-cannabis/amp/ holy poo poo you're a mark lmao
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May 8, 2021 18:47
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tbh weed legalization seems inevitable in the US and it doesn’t really matter who’s president, unless some neo-con throwback somehow gets elected but that’s probably not going to happen
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May 8, 2021 18:51
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Drunkboxer posted:tbh weed legalization seems inevitable in the US and it doesn’t really matter who’s president, unless some neo-con throwback somehow gets elected but that’s probably not going to happen Oh like Joe Biden?
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May 8, 2021 18:55
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starmer being the former top cop has already said no chance at weed decrim
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May 8, 2021 18:57
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spankmeister posted:Oh like Joe Biden? nah hes pretty conservative but hes not someone like jeff sessions
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May 8, 2021 18:58
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Biden's legalizing weed but criminalizing menthols. Joe giveth and Joe taketh away. Anyway this isn't the thread for US politics, it's for UK politics, a slightly different flavor of imploding neoliberal hellstate.
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May 8, 2021 19:07
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Jose posted:Lmao forever if Rayner sold out only to instantly be hosed over she's gone yeah https://twitter.com/jessicaelgot/status/1391092586362855424
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May 8, 2021 19:12
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