(Thread IKs:
dead gay comedy forums)
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In the comments someone posted this: https://archive.org/details/CornforthOpenPhil/page/n5/mode/2up Would it be fair to say that part 3 (the part directed at An Open Society of Popper's) is the only part necessary to read to understand the refutation of the maniac that hijacked this thread for a while?
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May 20, 2021 06:29
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| # ? May 23, 2024 10:38 |
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the only ting you need to know about popper is that if you apply his ideas consistently then the only things that actually are science are basically the hard natural sciences, but not for instance a little thing called mathematics which is required to get any useful results out of the natural sciences this is kind of a problem since science is supposed to be a method to acquire reliable knowledge yet here we end up with hardly anything, making popper's ideas fundamentally unworkable in any practical sense
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May 20, 2021 06:49
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all I know about popper is that every dipshit in d&d during the aughts loved him and wanted to kiss him
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May 20, 2021 06:59
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didn’t he do that one cool harmonica solo
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May 20, 2021 07:00
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Pooper more like
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May 20, 2021 07:04
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marx failed to consider godel
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May 20, 2021 07:04
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popper is a loving idiot and his epistemology is the height of abstract idealist bullshit. empiricism proceeds by both verification and falsification, and there's an entire mathematical/conceptual/historical aspect that popper, in his lust to turn marx and freud into cranks, totally obscures. it's not like P went and studied actual lab practices or anything, he just decreed 'science should work this way!' but it doesn't. and if only 'falsifiable' theories count then the sciences actually end up crippled in their scope. like, so much for just about all of contemporary theoretical physics, that poo poo ain't never gonna be falsifiable under capital. and anyways historical materialism has a method, it's called revolutionary praxis, and the theories this practice generates can be falsified in practice. when your theories get falsified you lose. each revolutionary wave got a little bit farther than the previous wave by learning from previously falsified theories. it's messy as hell, but science always is.
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May 20, 2021 07:09
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kuhn is infinitely superior to popper
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May 20, 2021 07:15
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splifyphus posted:popper is a loving idiot and his epistemology is the height of abstract idealist bullshit. empiricism proceeds by both verification and falsification, and there's an entire mathematical/conceptual/historical aspect that popper, in his lust to turn marx and freud into cranks, totally obscures. it's not like P went and studied actual lab practices or anything, he just decreed 'science should work this way!' how does Popper explain phlogiston not being the actual substance, but being an erroneous substance that would accurately describe a process and how to find various elements which exhibit that process?
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May 20, 2021 07:20
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I grow weary of this philosophy nerd poo poo. let us return to political economy nerd poo poo
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May 20, 2021 07:22
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Politics is just applied philosophy, just like math, physics, computer science and medicine. We invented being right about things, bring back philosopher monarchy. I will rule you with all the wisdom of post structural marxist thought
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May 20, 2021 07:30
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was popper the dude max planck took to the woodshed over scientific positivism or was that someone else?
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May 20, 2021 07:31
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tokin opposition posted:Politics is just applied philosophy, just like math, physics, computer science and medicine. We invented being right about things, bring back philosopher monarchy. I will rule you with all the wisdom of post structural marxist thought you know, if you really dig into the origins and sources of all those fields, I think you'll find that they're all actually applied midwifing
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May 20, 2021 07:36
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animist posted:you know, if you really dig into the origins and sources of all those fields, I think you'll find that they're all actually applied midwifing ah, prostitution: the oldest profession
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May 20, 2021 07:42
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Actually philosophers grow asexually, like a brain sponge
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May 20, 2021 07:54
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May 20, 2021 08:03
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old and busted: Karl Popper new hotness: Karl Poggers
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May 20, 2021 08:08
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popper was a clever guy but also extremely primitive and prejudiced as a philosopher, so he gets some good stuff going (the demarcation criterion really is a good rule of thumb for practical science) and then he does stupid poo poo like set that criterion as the sole point of demarcation between science and pseudoscience, eventually having to basically fudge his own theory so he could accept evolution as scientific lol
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May 20, 2021 08:12
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Quine: based or cringe?
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May 20, 2021 09:05
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tokin opposition posted:Quine: based or cringe? i'm still working on carnap and sellars
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May 20, 2021 10:43
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indigi posted:it has never worked for general anxiety for me, I should say It's more effective for acute episodes, in my experience. Scientific data suggests regular meditation (which involves controlled, abdominal breathing) would probably at least aid in general anxiety, but I never had the discipline to keep it up.
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May 20, 2021 12:24
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I just don't get the cleverness of saying "Ah hah, according to another framework, your framework is incomplete" when both frameworks are unprovable and based on a finite human frame of reference it's like trying to prove that futurism is a more correct painting style than cubism, it's a useless question from the start
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May 20, 2021 12:36
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Good Soldier Svejk posted:I just don't get the cleverness of saying "Ah hah, according to another framework, your framework is incomplete" when both frameworks are unprovable and based on a finite human frame of reference yeah but if you're thinking metaphysically then you attribute your framework with more like. juice than it deserves, you think it's "more real" than the other one, even though they're both just sets of words. I think that's kinda what zizek's whole "sublime object of ideology" schtick is about. You mistake aspects of the sublime -- the fundamental terror of being alive, I think? -- for being aspects of your regime's ideology, and then you have to devote yourself to it, because it seems so massive and important. but really what you're doing there is confusing the power of your generative contradiction with the power of a bunch of words that are currently living in yr head
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May 20, 2021 12:56
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animist posted:yeah but if you're thinking metaphysically then you attribute your framework with more like. juice than it deserves, you think it's "more real" than the other one, even though they're both just sets of words. This is where I think linguistics and Bakhtin come in handy because it forces you to reconcile with the fact that your own understanding of the world is inherently limited by the language/words/concepts you know therefore it becomes useful to learn as much about anything as you can even if it's a concept you don't think you'll adhere to because even a trash concept will expand the scope of your possible understanding Frameworks are just tools in the thinking toolbox, or dictionaries in the thinking library, etc.
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May 20, 2021 12:59
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Good Soldier Svejk posted:I just don't get the cleverness of saying "Ah hah, according to another framework, your framework is incomplete" when both frameworks are unprovable and based on a finite human frame of reference falsifiability is a useful, in that it's very important to have an way to kill your favored ideas. even physics forgot this and crawled up it's own rear end for a while with string theory: if all you are looking for is consistency, you can explain the movement of the sun as Ra's chariot just fine, or it's all strings, or it's all turtles. it's that this kind of tool has an older name, epistemology, and it's a literally ancient field. the scientific method is 'just' one of the things that goes in the box to be deployed when useful. i don't need to invoke godel (although that's cool!) to say trying to always use it in the way popper ment it would be stupid, trying to use it universally is utterly incompatible with trying to say almost anything about history
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May 20, 2021 13:14
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the discussion a few pages back about the origins of ISIS reminded me of something i was reading about recently, which is how Hamas has gained mass support through becoming entwined with social services (i.e. improving material conditions). book was Sara Roy's "Hamas and Civil Society in Gaza": "Many in the United States and Israel believe that Hamas is nothing but a terrorist organization, and that its social sector serves merely to recruit new supporters for its violent agenda. Based on Sara Roy's extensive fieldwork in the Gaza Strip and West Bank during the critical period of the Oslo peace process, Hamas and Civil Society in Gaza shows how the social service activities sponsored by the Islamist group emphasized not political violence but rather community development and civic restoration. Roy demonstrates how Islamic social institutions in Gaza and the West Bank advocated a moderate approach to change that valued order and stability, not disorder and instability; were less dogmatically Islamic than is often assumed; and served people who had a range of political outlooks and no history of acting collectively in support of radical Islam. These institutions attempted to create civic communities, not religious congregations." pretty much a direct counterexample to the idea islamism is created by Crazy Arabs. for hamas the process of creating/becoming civil society reacted on it (dialectically) and moderated it in turn. thus "Hamas’s fundamental impulse is political and nationalist, not religious, which has accounted for its pragmatism and flexibility" it seems like this process didnt happen so much for ISIS, would be interesting to look at why not... perhaps because it was at open & offensive war for most of its existence + because it defined itself not in opposition to a Jewish colonial state but other predominantly-Islamic anti-colonial states... dont really know.
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May 20, 2021 13:27
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so what was education in the USSR like? Was "dropping out of high school" a thing? What were the post-secondary options? Was post-secondary placement based more on test scores or personal connections or what? Did university students prank the commissar-dean by rebuilding his lada on the roof? Was there a frat/party culture at university at all? Student athletics surely existed but what sports and to what degree did society care?
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May 20, 2021 13:45
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I remember reading that Marxism was falsifiable, specifically predicting that capitalism cannot exist without a coercive state and therefore the existence of anarcho-capitalism would falsify it. Is there any truth to this?
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May 20, 2021 13:53
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Mr. Lobe posted:It's more effective for acute episodes, in my experience. Scientific data suggests regular meditation (which involves controlled, abdominal breathing) would probably at least aid in general anxiety, but I never had the discipline to keep it up. I’ve been doing 15-20 minutes a day for 18 months and bupkis. actually just gave up on daily practice last week lol chairface posted:Did university students prank the commissar-dean by rebuilding his lada on the roof? Was there a frat/party culture at university at all? idk specifics but I would bet stuff like this is a universal among juvenile humans anywhere at any time. they’re a bunch of 19 year olds, parties and dumb poo poo are statistically guaranteed to occur (although I’d be surprised if there was anything comparable to American frat culture)
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May 20, 2021 13:56
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Cpt_Obvious posted:I remember reading that Marxism was falsifiable, specifically predicting that capitalism cannot exist without a coercive state and therefore the existence of anarcho-capitalism would falsify it. it would also be falsified if liberalism could permanently resolve the contradictions of capitalism
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May 20, 2021 13:57
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bursting into the car forum to inform them that the only explanation for why the mustang is faster than the model t is that the people who made the model t were crazy, and frankly i don't understand whats so controversial about this
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May 20, 2021 13:59
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e-dt posted:the discussion a few pages back about the origins of ISIS reminded me of something i was reading about recently, which is how Hamas has gained mass support through becoming entwined with social services (i.e. improving material conditions). book was Sara Roy's "Hamas and Civil Society in Gaza": A similar thing actually did happen with ISIS. A lot of the areas that it took over in Syria especially had basically been in a state of anarchic chaos for years by that point, and ISIS came in and brought order and stability and enforcement of laws. They were lovely laws that a lot of the population hated, but they still preferred unpleasant stability to violent anarchy. Probably one reason why that didn't last is because it turned out that intentionally antagonizing the entire world, including several regional powers with large professional militaries and the global military hegemon isn't a great way to ensure your temporary unpleasant stability will last, and instead all their cities got bombed into rubble by American air power.
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May 20, 2021 14:03
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Cpt_Obvious posted:I remember reading that Marxism was falsifiable, specifically predicting that capitalism cannot exist without a coercive state and therefore the existence of anarcho-capitalism would falsify it. i suppose, but then again i have seen no examples of functioning capitalist societies without an apparatus of coercion as of yet
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May 20, 2021 14:03
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popper is poo poo but his penguins are pretty cool
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May 20, 2021 14:11
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CYBEReris posted:popper is poo poo but his penguins are pretty cool i'm personally thankful for the good work he's done with jalapenos
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May 20, 2021 14:38
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Popper was an early member of the Mont Pelerin group so that is enough for me to say gently caress off and die
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May 20, 2021 15:15
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CYBEReris posted:popper is poo poo but his penguins are pretty cool As someone mentioned earlier, He's a real wizard with the harmonica.
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May 20, 2021 15:15
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Trash Ops posted:foreign languages press has some good poo poo as pdfs or a few bucks for the print Thanks for this
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May 20, 2021 15:25
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advancing a new philosophical paradigm of rear end loosening
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May 20, 2021 15:34
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| # ? May 23, 2024 10:38 |
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indigi posted:didn’t he do that one cool harmonica solo Hook still slaps
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May 20, 2021 15:53
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