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Marx Headroom posted:Thank you king but I think the tenor of this discussion was more "What were the writers/actors trying to accomplish in this trainwreck?" and less "Should we approve of sexism in media?" I'm a woman actually, so thank you *queen*. I think the writers were trying to express that women shouldn't command starships, that's my point. But okay. e: ugh poo poo snipe. Oh, I got my Eaglemoss DS9 model today! Arrived with two pylons broken off so I superglued em back on. It's really nice! Not the XL version, the smaller one. I'm very pleased with it for the price.
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Jun 21, 2021 20:06
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multijoe posted:Some of the best episodes are evil Janeway though... Terror Sweat posted:Which ones? Other than the future museum one She's straight-up unhinged in the Equinox two-parter.
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Jun 21, 2021 20:32
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Powered Descent posted:She's straight-up unhinged in the Equinox two-parter.
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Jun 21, 2021 20:35
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Most unhinged I've seen was the one where Harry got the space STD   like they couldn't leave well enough alone and let her tow the line as the fun police, even though she was absolutely correct regarding quarantine protocols. But for some reason she also has to take weird sadistic glee in her punishment   zero fucks given
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Jun 21, 2021 20:40
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Marx Headroom posted:Most unhinged I've seen was the one where Harry got the space STD Formal punishments for contracting an STD is very much a real world thing.
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Jun 21, 2021 20:48
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You can get administratively separated from the US military if you get HIV.
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Jun 21, 2021 20:52
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Star Trek isn't real.
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Jun 21, 2021 21:02
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LividLiquid posted:Star Trek isn't real. !!!!! Is this true!?!
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Jun 21, 2021 21:15
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A.o.D. posted:!!!!! Doesn't listen to him. He's INSANE!!!!
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Jun 21, 2021 21:19
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Josh Christ posted:I took the plunge and looked it up on wikipedia and the first sentence I read was this one TOS more than any other trek had a strong 'Twilight Zone' vibe to a lot of it, where it almost felt like the starship was just zooming them around to different twilight zone episodes full of ironic reveals. Honestly this is why I think all the nuTrek attempts fail. People argue about "this doesn't feel like trek!" or whatever and get lost in the weeds over ship warp drive placements or whatever, trying to vocalize what they're feeling, when really I think Trek fundamentally has to be new bizarre stories and morality plays, while current producers are trying to treat it like 'Game of Thrones'. Even DS9 at its most serialized points, any given episode had a purpose and point, and is rewatchable. I could drop in and watch 'in the pale moonlight' 'nog loses his leg' or others anytime without needing to rewatch the entire season, something you can't really do with the modern shows. I can't even say which episode any given event in say Picard happened, its all just one long blur, and i'm certainly not going to just toss on "that one where the romulans see clip art and some other stuff i think happens" when i'm bored. So much of old TV episodic stuff was bad because it was rote and nothing happened, I mean you could set your watch to any procedural show. Star Trek though was, especially at its best, more like the Twilight Zone or any anthology, every episode was a brand new mysterious or fantastic scenario and you never knew what was going to happen, or the point that would be made. Horror, comedy, mind bending stuff, philosophical points etc. Long form serialized shows by necessity lend themselves to soap opera type drama because you can't keep one plot going that many episodes based on its own gears. Trying to make Star Trek into 'The Wire' feels like if they brought back the Twilight Zone, but it was a season long arc where the guy who broke his glasses, while fumbling around, gets trapped behind the wall, falling into the dimension of the pig faced people before the little boy with cornfield powers in a dramatic surprise wishes him back when its revealed he's grown up dealing with a drug addiction and they need to stop tiny flying saucer people from invading before they're betrayed by an evil doll come to life. It would be the loving stupidest thing on earth. There are so many contemporary issues that would make great trek episodes. Have picard and his new crew visit a planet wracked by debt slavery where their body parts get repossessed until a dramatic reveal of people reduced to brains in jars trying to scream, or a planet of rampant police violence where they need to do something, ever widening class gaps, or just some crazy far out sci-fi concepts, or a clever mystery. Literally the only rewatchable Star Trek episode since its come back was the Harry Mud one because it was self contained and a fun time bending premise! Maybe the Pike show will break this and have interesting stories, but my gut tells me there will be some galaxy threatening AI terror that involves  s dark past trickled out over the course of the season while the crew deals with a traitor in their midst.
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Jun 21, 2021 21:19
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Powered Descent posted:She's straight-up unhinged in the Equinox two-parter. And yet for as bad as Janeway gets in Equinox that's still like only a 6 out 10 on the Benjamin Motherfucking Sisko scale of unhinged.
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Jun 21, 2021 21:55
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Mister Kingdom posted:Doesn't listen to him. He's INSANE!!!! I was being cheeky, but I meant it. Just because the US Military can shitcan people for getting STDs doesn't mean our fake idyllic future should be lovely about it too.
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Jun 21, 2021 21:56
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HopperUK posted:e: ugh poo poo snipe. Oh, I got my Eaglemoss DS9 model today! Arrived with two pylons broken off so I superglued em back on. It's really nice! Not the XL version, the smaller one. I'm very pleased with it for the price. If you're not happy with the supergluing, Eaglemoss is really good about replacing broken models no questions asked. I've had two show up with busted parts and they replaced them right away.
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Jun 21, 2021 22:00
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multijoe posted:Some of the best episodes are evil Janeway though... inside every starfleet captain is a struggle between good and evil that cannot be resolved *fade to dream sequence of a maraca-playing queen arachnia dancing on good janeway's grave* i am evil janeway, i am evil janeway
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Jun 21, 2021 22:01
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Grand Fromage posted:If you're not happy with the supergluing, Eaglemoss is really good about replacing broken models no questions asked. I've had two show up with busted parts and they replaced them right away. Thanks for the advice! I emailed em and they asked me to send a pic of the broken model which would be tough because I already fixed it without taking a pic like an idiot. But I think it'll be fine!
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Jun 21, 2021 22:08
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HopperUK posted:Thanks for the advice! I emailed em and they asked me to send a pic of the broken model which would be tough because I already fixed it without taking a pic like an idiot. But I think it'll be fine! Huh, that's weird. I took pics when I contacted them and nobody ever asked to see them. Guess it depends who answers the email.
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Jun 21, 2021 22:12
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Tom Guycot posted:TOS more than any other trek had a strong 'Twilight Zone' vibe to a lot of it, where it almost felt like the starship was just zooming them around to different twilight zone episodes full of ironic reveals. I honestly think that writing is the most expensive/important thing for current media that producers just belittle or under pay. Writing a single story and then milking it for an entire season while also 'breaking (padding) it out' into small sub-stories/"CHAPTERS!" is cheaper than writing 12 good stories. They all think they're writing the next Breaking Bad but instead they're no better than soap opera writers.
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Jun 21, 2021 22:18
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Terror Sweat posted:Which ones? Other than the future museum one Tuvix, evil clown one AND the who where the doctor is getting his memory hosed with are all good ones off the top of my head, and Dragon's Teeth is just funny from how insanely awful she is that episode
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Jun 21, 2021 22:22
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Dragon's Teeth: 1) suffered from being planned as a two parter and 2) should have had a follow up. Voyager just going "well... I guess we'll just head out" after unleashing the frozen commando stay behind team is hilarious
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Jun 21, 2021 22:38
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'The Gang Unleash Ancient Nazi Warlords'
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Jun 21, 2021 22:42
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LividLiquid posted:Her, if you don't mind. My bad!
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Jun 21, 2021 22:43
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Mister Kingdom posted:My bad!
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Jun 21, 2021 22:52
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Joanne Linville, who played the Romulan Commander in The Enterprise Incident, passed away yesterday at the age of 93.  jeeves posted:Writing a single story and then milking it for an entire season while also 'breaking (padding) it out' into small sub-stories/"CHAPTERS!" is cheaper than writing 12 good stories. Agents of SHIELD did this with its fourth season, breaking it into three separate "pods" (oh, Jeph Loeb, you think you're so clever) that ultimately tied together--badly--at the end.
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Jun 22, 2021 00:23
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Timby posted:Joanne Linville, who played the Romulan Commander in The Enterprise Incident, passed away yesterday at the age of 93. In her honor, tonight we watched The Enterprise Incident, which I maintain was a really good episode as long as you don't try to figure out what the hell the Federation's actual plan was supposed to be.
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Jun 22, 2021 04:26
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Powered Descent posted:In her honor, tonight we watched The Enterprise Incident, which I maintain was a really good episode as long as you don't try to figure out what the hell the Federation's actual plan was supposed to be. “Captain Kirk, you are hereby ordered to go gently caress around in the Neutral Zone and see what comes up. Bring me back a cloaking device lmao”
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Jun 22, 2021 04:35
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I remember watching voyager as it came out and janeway was very much a lurking figure of insanity. I remember as a teenager just giving up around season 3 since I really disliked her and neelix.
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Jun 22, 2021 07:44
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At the start of S1 it does seem like they're setting Janeway up to be less buttoned-up than other captains. A lot of her serious captain demeanour feels like a deliberate front she puts up. She slips into a more casual form of command constantly - her relationship with Torres is entirely the two of them excitedly geeking out over science, she occasionally wanders around the ship just seeing whats up, she's happy to threaten insane violence on the Vidiians. If I didn't know better, I'd say they were setting her up to join the Maquis.
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Jun 22, 2021 07:54
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skasion posted:And of course they have a whole system of assigning captains female yeomen for clerical and administrative duties, pretty obviously inspired by WAVES. Just on this point, they did establish from day one that the Yeoman position was gender-neutral and we just happened to see a bunch of pretty young women in it for Pike and Kirk o how very convenient. (Of course, they established it in a sexist way - Colt was Pike's first female Yeoman and he was uncomfortable with icky girls on the bridge, so basically they dug themselves further down in the process)
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Jun 22, 2021 07:55
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Going back to Omega Glory for a moment, I looked it up on Memory Alpha to see if it was generally considered as bad as I remember (it is), but noticed a bit of probably-accidental continuity. McCoy is quoted as saying that the supposedly life-prolonging biological agents in the planet's atmosphere might actually, at best, cure the common cold. Flash-forward to TNG, and guess what's been cured?  About yeomen: my introduction to the entire concept was from TOS, so the discovery that in the real world military yeomen were, well, men just seemed wrong.
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Jun 22, 2021 10:53
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Strom Cuzewon posted:One of the doctor's companions, an old white dude, has to sit behind Parks to force this to happen. He starts to object about how horrible that is and how he doesn't want to do it, and gets forcefully told "shut the gently caress up, this isn't about you". It kinda owns. It's also one of the rare times that we see Rosa Parks as someone who was already involved in the civil rights movement and protests, instead of the popular portrayal of her as a Normal Woman who one day decided to Take A Stand. Actually, the best part is that the old white dude is a former bus driver, who has strong opinions on how the driver who tried to get Rosa Parks to move to the back of the bus\had her arrested wasn't just a terrible racist, he was the shame of all bus drivers forever. Man, what a glorious trainwreck that episode was.
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Jun 22, 2021 13:32
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I'll say this about Omega Glory: I think presenting the other captain as a 'dark' version of Kirk who ignores his oath and causes a Prime Directive dilemma is pretty well done. But "Yangs" and "Coms" and Shatner yell-quoting the constitution is awful and ridiculous. That sort of flag-waving in Star Trek doesn't sit well with me and makes me really uncomfortable.
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Jun 22, 2021 15:31
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F_Shit_Fitzgerald posted:I'll say this about Omega Glory: I think presenting the other captain as a 'dark' version of Kirk who ignores his oath and causes a Prime Directive dilemma is pretty well done. But "Yangs" and "Coms" and Shatner yell-quoting the constitution is awful and ridiculous. That sort of flag-waving in Star Trek doesn't sit well with me and makes me really uncomfortable. It’s also like one of 5 episodes where there is just an alternate Earth floating out there somewhere. Not even an alien planet, just another Earth. ‘Miri’ is another one of these.
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Jun 22, 2021 15:51
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I mean, the first third or so of the Omega Glory isn't actually that bad - the deserted starship is nicely spooky, the isolated captain breaking his oath to set himself up as a leader in pursuit of immortality feels a bit reminiscent of other episodes, but it's fine as a set up... and then it turns out the planet is post-apocalyptic America and the whole episode goes to hell.
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Jun 22, 2021 15:57
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I think in Roddenberry's head, I think he thought this: It will show the soviets and americans coming together it will be amazing, and never thought of before! That it isn't the soviets at fault but really the americans being hypocritical! it came off as: Let us worship the constitution, the right way, while evil swathy types are defeated via kirk preaching.
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Jun 22, 2021 16:10
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Powered Descent posted:In her honor, tonight we watched The Enterprise Incident, which I maintain was a really good episode as long as you don't try to figure out what the hell the Federation's actual plan was supposed to be. Section 31 wanted a cloaking device 
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Jun 22, 2021 16:28
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FlamingLiberal posted:It’s a very messy episode
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Jun 22, 2021 16:30
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The same precursors who programmed DNA also did terraforming, you can generally tell a real Earth from a secondhand knockoff based on whether or not there's a New Zealand
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Jun 22, 2021 18:41
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Axe-man posted:I think in Roddenberry's head, I think he thought this: It will show the soviets and americans coming together it will be amazing, and never thought of before! That it isn't the soviets at fault but really the americans being hypocritical! I think A Private Little War does the whole 'Cold War in Space' thing a lot better.
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Jun 22, 2021 18:48
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Tunicate posted:The same precursors who programmed DNA also did terraforming, you can generally tell a real Earth from a secondhand knockoff based on whether or not there's a New Zealand  Oh shi-
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Jun 22, 2021 18:51
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MikeJF posted:
Zeon missed Sydney this time
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Jun 22, 2021 19:35
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