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Android Apocalypse
Apr 28, 2009

The future is
AUTOMATED
and you are
OBSOLETE

Illegal Hen

Ghost Leviathan posted:

A lot makes sense on the news that it got murdered on the cutting room floor. Seems a theme with WB.

Yeah, and somehow it ends up without even the remotely interesting charm of amateur genre fantasy, which at least tends to show some signs of actual effort and interpretation. 'Fantasy heartbreaker' is used in TG a lot for RPGs that are clearly just the author's attempt to take baby steps outside D&D or whatever their home system is, but even those tend to show some personality and commentary even when they're really bad. (and often are)

I suppose it doesn't help most genre fiction has a reputation of being ridiculously derivative, incestuous and afraid to experiment, but then, you're not going to do much better by going in with only the most shallow knowledge of the genre at all.

Has there ever been any examples of a writer/director talking about how they went into a genre they don't have experience with and the process they took to learn about it and create their own story with it?

Lexi Alexander when she did Punisher: War Zone. She had no idea what the deal was with Frank Castle so she crowdsourced the info from fans & made one of the best Punisher movies IMO.

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Basebf555
Feb 29, 2008

The greatest sensual pleasure there is is to know the desires of another!

Fun Shoe
The director of Freddy vs. Jason(Ronny Yu) was very honest about the fact that he'd never seen a single Nightmare on Elm Street or Friday the 13th movie before he got the gig. And the movie turned out to be a hit with fans.

He'd worked in the genre before though, in a similar circumstance when he directed Bride of Chucky. He was brought in because they wanted to shake things up and go in a totally new direction(and again, it worked).

Yngwie Mangosteen
Aug 23, 2007
There's a huge difference between not being familiar with a specific story/setting but being very experienced with the genre while leaning on fans or shaking things up intentionally and literally not knowing anything about the genre, and/or seeing it as low class drivel and acting like you're god's gift to (sci-fi, fantasy, comic books, whatever) while putting out something hackneyed and trite.

Phy
Jun 27, 2008



Fun Shoe

Both Canada and the US raised their prime interest rates to the high teens to combat the rapid inflation that started with the 79 oil crisis. Great if you've got a lot of money socked away to just let it sit there and roll in the numbers like you're playing cookie clicker, not so great if you're trying to get a mortgage like my parents were at the time

I think that was pretty much done by the late 80s and Die Hard, but contemporary audiences probably would have understood what Hans was talking about

Tunicate
May 15, 2012

Saerdna posted:

Haha yeah Borges and Saramago tried to write fantasy and failed because they didn't take the time to study the collected Tolkien fan fiction

"No, you see, MY novel where there are PROBLEMS because people stop dying, and it turns out it's because the anthropomorphic personification of death isn't killing people, and then death meets a human and falls in love isn't a 'fantasy' book, because (A) I put the name of my death in all lower case letters instead of all upper case, and (B) my death fucks."


(I apologize for the technical inaccuracy of this spoof; saramogo would never write anything that included quotation marks.)

Saerdna
Aug 8, 2004

Tunicate posted:

"No, you see, MY novel where there are PROBLEMS because people stop dying, and it turns out it's because the anthropomorphic personification of death isn't killing people, and then death meets a human and falls in love isn't a 'fantasy' book, because (A) I put the name of my death in all lower case letters instead of all upper case, and (B) my death fucks."


(I apologize for the technical inaccuracy of this spoof; saramogo would never write anything that included quotation marks.)

lmao

i didn't know about this weird grievance against non-realistic fiction that isn't fantasy, have fun with that

Saerdna has a new favorite as of 18:50 on Jul 9, 2021

Yngwie Mangosteen
Aug 23, 2007

Saerdna posted:

lmao

i didn't know about this weird grievance against non-realistic fiction that isn't fantasy, have fun with that

this isn't what's happening, you're just being a weird shitposter for some reason.

Saerdna
Aug 8, 2004

Captain Monkey posted:

this isn't what's happening, you're just being a weird shitposter for some reason.

sure

Ugly In The Morning
Jul 1, 2010
Pillbug
There’s a lot to be said about magical realism but nothing worth saying about it will come in “internet slapfight” format.

Phanatic
Mar 13, 2007

Please don't forget that I am an extremely racist idiot who also has terrible opinions about the Culture series.

Phy posted:

Both Canada and the US raised their prime interest rates to the high teens to combat the rapid inflation that started with the 79 oil crisis. Great if you've got a lot of money socked away to just let it sit there and roll in the numbers like you're playing cookie clicker, not so great if you're trying to get a mortgage like my parents were at the time

I think that was pretty much done by the late 80s and Die Hard, but contemporary audiences probably would have understood what Hans was talking about

There were junk bond funds in the 80s and 90s that were returning something like 30% annually.

Pilchenstein
May 17, 2012

So your plan is for half of us to die?

Hot Rope Guy
I'd bet you get a way higher interest rate on 600 million dollars too :v:

BiggerBoat
Sep 26, 2007

Don't you tell me my business again.

Captain Monkey posted:

There's a huge difference between not being familiar with a specific story/setting but being very experienced with the genre while leaning on fans or shaking things up intentionally and literally not knowing anything about the genre, and/or seeing it as low class drivel and acting like you're god's gift to (sci-fi, fantasy, comic books, whatever) while putting out something hackneyed and trite.

Iron Man 1 comes to mind.

Eclipse12
Feb 20, 2008

Ah yes, A Very Old Man With Enormous Wings, such an uninspired, predictable story by a man clearly flailing hopelessly because he never read a book about necromancer politics.

Stupid_Sexy_Flander
Mar 14, 2007

Is a man not entitled to the haw of his maw?
Grimey Drawer
Black widow spoilers (big ones):

Did I miss something or did they just forget to load up taskmaster in the chopper thing right after they literally said they were taking them with them? It cuts away where the girl is squatting down to help pick them up, then they shut the door to the jet thing, and it flies off immediately.

Just seemed weird.

Len
Jan 21, 2008

Pouches, bandages, shoulderpad, cyber-eye...

Bitchin'!


Almost done with Naruto.

Rock Lee gets done real fuckin' dirty. He gets sidelined around the time skip and just never comes back

Cowslips Warren
Oct 29, 2005

What use had they for tricks and cunning, living in the enemy's warren and paying his price?

Grimey Drawer
It's been a while since I saw The Avengers, but with Black Widow getting her own movie now, I seriously don't understand why she and Hawkeye are on the team at all.

I mean, maybe they have her as a backup in case the Hulk won't de-Hulk?

Was there seriously something in one of the movies where Black Widow said she wasn't a real woman because she couldn't have kids, or is my movie-freak friend loving with me, because both are equally possible.


edit: Nope my friend is right. Okay, seriously WHY? This feels like the loving Romeo Date Laws from the Transformers movie, something that was pushed in for no real story reason. Same as Stark's joke about First Night.

Cowslips Warren has a new favorite as of 01:35 on Jul 10, 2021

a big egg
Mar 26, 2014
I've always thought the same thing. Especially hawkeye. He just shoots arrows really good. That seems kind of out of place when you're next to actual gods.

oldpainless
Oct 30, 2009

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Uhh she has a scene with Bruce banner at 1:16:42 in Age of Ultron where she says she was forcibly sterilized so she could never be distracted from the mission and expressss regret over it. A real fan would know that

Morpheus
Apr 18, 2008

My favourite little monsters
Just watched The Tomorrow War and hoo boooooy. Pretty sure me and my partner were yelling at how dumb the characters were the entire film.

i think the most egregious thing was Pratt and his wife, at the end figuring out that the aliens 'arrived' earlier, something apparently no one during this entire war had thought to investigate. Not a single person thought 'hey you know we can send people back in time, why not send scientists that can figure poo poo out instead of just throwing bodies at the aliens'

Absolutely wild movie, decent action scenes but jesus everyone in the film is as dumb as a bag of bricks.

a big egg
Mar 26, 2014
There are so many IIMMs with that movie but honestly none of them really bother me, I just like it. Things like "why didn't they make the time travel portals closer to the ground so you don't break the legs of your soldiers" just didn't bother me because it looked cool. Why can chris pratt and father beat the formerly unbeatable queen alien with some knives who cares, it looked cool.

NorgLyle
Sep 20, 2002

Do you think I posted to this forum because I value your companionship?

Cowslips Warren posted:

It's been a while since I saw The Avengers, but with Black Widow getting her own movie now, I seriously don't understand why she and Hawkeye are on the team at all.
In older Marvel comics (the ones that all the movies other than like Winter Soldier are based on) the power levels were super fluctuating and... um... driven by drama more than any actual measured weighting. Spider-Man could (desperately) punch the living poo poo out of a cosmic herald and win, Captain America (who, in the comics at the time, had no superpowers and was just the 'maximum human potential') could smash Iron Man bad guys suits with his chain mail fists and Hawkeye, for example, could use his various 'trick arrows' to randomly knock out guys who otherwise were going toe to toe with Thor ("He may be tough but let's see how his inner ears deal with my sonic tipped arrows!")

It was dumb but that was comics at the time and they were, again originally, written with an audience of literal children in mind so who cares.

You'd get occasional moments where some writer would realize 'hey... with all the powers we've given him Spidey should be able to single-handedly take out the entire 1980s X-Men team!' but mostly everybody just played along with whatever was happening in the stories at the moment.

At one point there was an active Avengers team that was literally Marvel Superman (with Johnny Cage's personality), Iron Man, A Crazy Guy With No Powers, A Sexy Furry and Hawkeye and his equally non-powered wife (before he divorced her for letting her rapist fall to his death without trying to save him).

Megillah Gorilla
Sep 22, 2003

If only all of life's problems could be solved by smoking a professor of ancient evil texts.



Bread Liar
Hawkeye and Black Widow are also the only "professionals" on the team.

Rich narcissist in a metal suit, drunken failson god who's spent a thousand years being a dick, scientist with anger issue and his uncontrollable alter ego. Drugged up ex-weenie who spent 99% of his WWII career doing panto.

With that initial team up, I'd want some professionals, too.

Cowslips Warren
Oct 29, 2005

What use had they for tricks and cunning, living in the enemy's warren and paying his price?

Grimey Drawer
Now I am thinking of Black Widow's other difficulties, IE having menopause in her 20's or so. loving hell as bad as periods are, I don't know if having hot flashes for years while fighting aliens or robots or alien robots would be any better.

Do I want to know who Sexy Furry as an Avenger was? In my mind, without Google, it's a cat lady, right?


edit: How the gently caress is there going to be a sequel to The Tomorrow War?

Cowslips Warren has a new favorite as of 03:57 on Jul 10, 2021

Keromaru5
Dec 28, 2012

Pictured: The Wolf Of Gubbio (probably)

This avatar made possible by a gift from the Religionthread Posters Relief Fund

Cowslips Warren posted:

Do I want to know who Sexy Furry as an Avenger was? In my mind, without Google, it's a cat lady, right?
Yup, that'd be Tigra.

Also, Beast from the X-Men spent a chunk of the 70's and 80's in the Avengers. I'm pretty sure he and Super Johnny Cage were bros.

Morpheus
Apr 18, 2008

My favourite little monsters

Cowslips Warren posted:


edit: How the gently caress is there going to be a sequel to The Tomorrow War?

The Day After Tomorrow War, where they fight the true villain of the movie, climate change.

Cowslips Warren
Oct 29, 2005

What use had they for tricks and cunning, living in the enemy's warren and paying his price?

Grimey Drawer

Keromaru5 posted:

Yup, that'd be Tigra.

Also, Beast from the X-Men spent a chunk of the 70's and 80's in the Avengers. I'm pretty sure he and Super Johnny Cage were bros.

I always liked most versions of Beast. But I never got why he had such an overall poo poo dating life, when Nightcrawler (also covered with blue fur) had to fight people back with a stick.

Now for The Tomorrow War, can they do a prequel called The Yesterday War? The Day Before Tomorrow War?

Tunicate
May 15, 2012

Cowslips Warren posted:

I always liked most versions of Beast. But I never got why he had such an overall poo poo dating life, when Nightcrawler (also covered with blue fur) had to fight people back with a stick.


It's his personality.

Megillah Gorilla
Sep 22, 2003

If only all of life's problems could be solved by smoking a professor of ancient evil texts.



Bread Liar

Cowslips Warren posted:

I always liked most versions of Beast. But I never got why he had such an overall poo poo dating life, when Nightcrawler (also covered with blue fur) had to fight people back with a stick.

Now for The Tomorrow War, can they do a prequel called The Yesterday War? The Day Before Tomorrow War?

Overmorrow War.

oldpainless
Oct 30, 2009

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Infinity War

Armacham
Mar 3, 2007

Then brothers in war, to the skirmish must we hence! Shall we hence?
Threemorrow War

Morpheus
Apr 18, 2008

My favourite little monsters

Cowslips Warren posted:

I always liked most versions of Beast. But I never got why he had such an overall poo poo dating life, when Nightcrawler (also covered with blue fur) had to fight people back with a stick.

Now for The Tomorrow War, can they do a prequel called The Yesterday War? The Day Before Tomorrow War?

It's because Beast is a fuckin' nerd lmao

Wasabi the J
Jan 23, 2008

MOM WAS RIGHT

Morpheus posted:

It's because Beast is a fuckin' nerd lmao

christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs 🎤of siren 🧜🏻‍♀️songs
To oohs😮 to ahhs😱 to 👏big👏applause👏
With all of my 😡anger I scream🤬 and shout📢
🇺🇸America🦅, I love you 🥰but you're freaking 💦me 😳out
Biscuit Hider

Tunicate posted:

The term for that is 'magical realism'

The modern day elves were easily the worst part of One Hundred Years of Solitude

A Worrying Warlock
Sep 21, 2009

christmas boots posted:

The modern day elves were easily the worst part of One Hundred Years of Solitude

Contemplating the concept of humanity in front of the Aleph before the elder gods burst through. Really spiced up the third act.

That Italian Guy
Jul 25, 2012

We need the equivalent of the shrimp = small pastry avatar, but for ambulances and their mysteries now.

Megillah Gorilla posted:

Hawkeye and Black Widow are also the only "professionals" on the team.

Rich narcissist in a metal suit, drunken failson god who's spent a thousand years being a dick, scientist with anger issue and his uncontrollable alter ego. Drugged up ex-weenie who spent 99% of his WWII career doing panto.

With that initial team up, I'd want some professionals, too.

Yeah this, both of them are super-spies. So in theory when you have to rely on subterfuge, training or mental fortitude, they should be above the rest of the team. The first Avengers movie is the only one to do something with this, to be honest (aside from Winter Soldier, but that's a spy movie with super heroes to begin with): Black Widow uses her training to get Loki to reveal his plans by feigning vulnerability, while she is the one in charge; and Hawkeye is on the roofs during the big battle at the end, acting as the team's "eye in the sky" (informing them of enemy movement and so on).

EDIT: actually, Hawkeye is the only one to avoid falling victing to Scarlet Witch's power in Age of Ultron, by using his superior senses and tactical acument - getting the jump on her instead of the other way around. That's quite significant, since everyone else is at that time out of commission due to said mental powers.

That Italian Guy has a new favorite as of 11:52 on Jul 10, 2021

Pope Corky the IX
Dec 18, 2006

What are you looking at?
Wasn’t the “I’m not a woman/I’m a failure as a woman because I can’t have children” thing a Joss Whedon idea?

VanSandman
Feb 16, 2011
SWAP.AVI EXCHANGER

Pope Corky the IX posted:

Wasn’t the “I’m not a woman/I’m a failure as a woman because I can’t have children” thing a Joss Whedon idea?

Yuppppp

Pope Corky the IX
Dec 18, 2006

What are you looking at?
How the gently caress did it take so long for people to realize what kind of person he is?

Android Apocalypse
Apr 28, 2009

The future is
AUTOMATED
and you are
OBSOLETE

Illegal Hen

Pope Corky the IX posted:

How the gently caress did it take so long for people to realize what kind of person he is?

Quippy dialogue worked wonders as a misdirection from his true personality.

Makes me feel :smug: that I never got into the Buffy the Vampire Slayer show. Kristy Swanson will forever be The True Slayer!

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Pope Corky the IX
Dec 18, 2006

What are you looking at?
Isn’t Kristy Swanson an insane chud now?

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