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Larryb posted:Speaking of toys, how much did SPoP actually get in terms of merchandise? It got some not great looking dolls. Like, ostensibly they’re ok, but the faces are really off-putting.  
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Jul 11, 2021 11:51
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Geo Fixer posted:So I never knew this before but apparently Hey Arnold! Takes place in Seattle not New York. That's impossible considering a big plot point in the movie is that Arnold's neighborhood was the site of an important protest as part of the prelude to the American Revolution.
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Jul 11, 2021 12:30
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Cattail Prophet posted:The real question here is why Luz doesn't just get her own drat library card. She's a known associate of the Owl Lady, known late book returner.
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Jul 11, 2021 12:38
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Funky Valentine posted:That's impossible considering a big plot point in the movie is that Arnold's neighborhood was the site of an important protest as part of the prelude to the American Revolution. As I said, pretty sure it's not meant to be any one specific location, and the article is a very shallow look that's not taking into account the creators' own words on the topic. On the Owl House notes; I feel like a theme with Amity's siblings is that they've come to like Luz, and seem impressed by Luz being able to stand up for herself and cause entertaining kinds of trouble. They seem to have a measure of respect for Eda too, which probably helps. They're a couple of troublemakers, which I feel is probably an extension of how they deal with their parents; they know how to present the appearance of obedience and just do whatever they want when no one's looking. Ghost Leviathan fucked around with this message at 13:08 on Jul 11, 2021 |
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Jul 11, 2021 13:04
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The_Doctor posted:It got some not great looking dolls. Like, ostensibly they’re ok, but the faces are really off-putting. I believe there were also a handful of comics as well (some with their own unique stories). Come to think of it, why did SPoP get so little merch compared to every other entry in the franchise (including its 80’s counterpart I believe)?
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Jul 11, 2021 14:43
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Netflix really hate doing merch for its shows for some reason (Stranger Things being the exception).
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Jul 11, 2021 14:50
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The_Doctor posted:Netflix really hate doing merch for its shows for some reason (Stranger Things being the exception). Then again, the new He-Man shows will also be on Netflix and they already seem to have a bit of merchandise lined up (plus this franchise has always been a giant toy commercial so you’d think Mattel would have wanted to promote it). Who knows
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Jul 11, 2021 14:53
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From what I've gathered, toy commercial cartoons aren't really a thing anymore, besides like, My Little Pony and Transformers, and I suspect even those are more out of grandfather clause. Or at least, the ones that are tend to be aimed at much younger audiences than the tween/adolescent target audience of She-Ra and such, and more merchandise tends to be based on well established multimedia franchises with multiple demographics in play. (Star Wars, Batman, Pokemon)
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Jul 11, 2021 15:38
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Yeah, 80s She-Ra (and He-Man) existed to sell toys primarily. Modern She-Ra exists to sell Netflix subscriptions.
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Jul 11, 2021 15:59
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I guess after the wave of 80s cartoons that proved that there was a market for high budget cartoons (or at least higher budget than what came before), that opened the way for cartoons that had the production values without necessarily having a premade product line, and then it became exponentially harder for toy commercial shows to gain traction against the competition. So now I guess companies are a lot less willing to gamble on a new product or show by doing multimedia integration right out the gate, and now toylines and shows have to prove themselves first before getting broadened as a franchise. I guess there's less reason to gamble big on debuting both at once since shows are more actively acknowledging older audiences so there's less worry of a show "missing" the window for its target demographic being into it, and when merch comes out late, kids who haven't seen the original source material can just find it on streaming. Although merchandise can still carry franchises. I think that's the main source of Ben10's inertia, or the thing keeping the Despicable Me or Cars series going. And it's probably still the main driver behind a lot of classic franchises still going like Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles and Transformers, although there is some aspect of older fans wanting to consume the newer media or even older fans spearheading franchise revival attempts as a sort of passion project. There are still movies and shows being made out of newer products that were toys first, but I think they tend to be lower-scale and more easily lost in the forest of media out there. And it's harder to notice if it's happening with a toyline that you've never heard of.
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Jul 11, 2021 18:00
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Everyone posted:Question: What would you remove from the previous two episodes to make room for some kind of scene/montage of Luz swooning over Amity in front of Gus and Willow? We know what happened towards the end of S2Ep2. We know what Luz is like (stoic and poker-faced - not). We know she's back in school with Gus and Willow. It's not that hard to figure out. This show has a limited "time" budget. It's why you basically had two "A" plots crunched together. I think if Disney had given the show a hard commitment to 3-4 full seasons, things would have a little more room to breath. But this is the last full season plus a few "extra-length" episodes for Season Three and that's it. I'm not arguing that their hands aren't tied by Disney forcing an unexpected time budget on them, just that the shift to "basically everyone knows that Luz has a big ol' crush on Amity" felt abrupt after not even so much as a passing mention about the events of 2x02 in the intervening two episodes. We know Luz's character by now and she wears everything on her sleeve. Even just a quick shot of her doodling about Amity on a notepad or one-off comment from King or Eda would've helped close that gap. All that aside, even the immediate opening with Gus being super bummed about how useless he feels with illusion magic focus and getting Willow hurt felt abrupt and like I'd missed a minute or two of a preceding scene or something.
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Jul 11, 2021 20:16
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Ghost Leviathan posted:On the Owl House notes; I feel like a theme with Amity's siblings is that they've come to like Luz, and seem impressed by Luz being able to stand up for herself and cause entertaining kinds of trouble. They seem to have a measure of respect for Eda too, which probably helps. They're a couple of troublemakers, which I feel is probably an extension of how they deal with their parents; they know how to present the appearance of obedience and just do whatever they want when no one's looking. In addition to all that, they do love Amity and want what they think is best for her. Prior to Luz Amity was a little bit like an Abomination in terms of being almost programmed to focus on school/grades/achievement. Luz is bringing out different sides of Amity. So, it's not just that Amity's siblings like and admire Luz. They like her effect on Amity and think that Luz is very good for Amity.
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Jul 11, 2021 20:25
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Yeah like this isn't some old cartoon where the siblings are all weirdly adversarial. Ed/Em may fool around but they love Amity.
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Jul 11, 2021 21:02
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xeria posted:I'm not arguing that their hands aren't tied by Disney forcing an unexpected time budget on them, just that the shift to "basically everyone knows that Luz has a big ol' crush on Amity" felt abrupt after not even so much as a passing mention about the events of 2x02 in the intervening two episodes. We know Luz's character by now and she wears everything on her sleeve. Even just a quick shot of her doodling about Amity on a notepad or one-off comment from King or Eda would've helped close that gap. Part of the problem is that the Luz/Amity stuff is kind of focused on the school. Then only time I recall Eda encountering Amity directly was in the "Understand Willow" episode (where Amity was the dumbass who deleted Willow's mind). The idea of Luz and Amity having a mutual crush probably doesn't even occur to Eda. Meanwhile, episodes 3 and 4 were completely focused away from school so there wasn't really much of an organic opportunity for what you mentioned. I Am Fowl posted:Yeah like this isn't some old cartoon where the siblings are all weirdly adversarial. Ed/Em may fool around but they love Amity. True. That also puts the Season One "Lost in Language" episode in a weird light. In that one Edric and Emira were going to find Amity's diary and post pages from it all over the school. Even though she didn't like Amity very much at that point, Luz very much opposed them because... well, it was pretty awful thing to do to Amity. Viewed through the lens that they do love Amity and care about her, Edric and Emira trying to do that comes off more as a kind of desperation because they were running out of ideas about how to shake their sister loose from their mother's pressuring control.
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Jul 11, 2021 21:34
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Everyone posted:Part of the problem is that the Luz/Amity stuff is kind of focused on the school. Then only time I recall Eda encountering Amity directly was in the "Understand Willow" episode (where Amity was the dumbass who deleted Willow's mind). The idea of Luz and Amity having a mutual crush probably doesn't even occur to Eda. Meanwhile, episodes 3 and 4 were completely focused away from school so there wasn't really much of an organic opportunity for what you mentioned. It doesn't need to be Eda specifically saying anything about Luz having a crush so much as just an off-hand "you're being extra-weird lately"-esque comment, but maybe in this scenario Lillith would've been best positioned to notice anything. She knows Amity - and probably the whole Blight family - from her time with the Emperor's Coven. Regardless, these are just potential ideas and I don't think it'd be all that arduous to take a couple seconds of non-focus episodes to continue what are clearly intended to be long-running narrative/character arcs, even if it's strictly visual and not elaborated on in the moment. That said, it feels a little weird at this point how mostly separated the Hexside kids and Owl House folks still are from each other, considering how important both are to Luz's journey.
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Jul 11, 2021 21:51
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Amity's siblings are pretty adorable, I love that they are kind of the audience stand ins for Luz and Amity's relationship. Loved in the latest episode where Amity goes for the kiss and the twins are watching from the upper window being all "Woah, bold move. Nice!"
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Jul 11, 2021 21:57
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xeria posted:It doesn't need to be Eda specifically saying anything about Luz having a crush so much as just an off-hand "you're being extra-weird lately"-esque comment, but maybe in this scenario Lillith would've been best positioned to notice anything. She knows Amity - and probably the whole Blight family - from her time with the Emperor's Coven. Regardless, these are just potential ideas and I don't think it'd be all that arduous to take a couple seconds of non-focus episodes to continue what are clearly intended to be long-running narrative/character arcs, even if it's strictly visual and not elaborated on in the moment. I think that gets into a little bit of the difficulties the show had in the first season with the over-arching metaplot: It did a really good job of setting up Amity's developing feelings for Luz, but didn't really tie that into the first season's main myth arc. This led to us getting a lot of focus on Amity and Luz interacting with each other and developing a rapport, but in a way that didn't tie into the plot threads that became important for the first season's finale and, presumably, the larger myth arc of the story, I think the writers have improved one their longform storytelling thus far with the second season, but are still running into the problem that their core emotional arc (Luz and Amity's romance) is separate from their core narrative arc (Emperor Belos, the door and Eda's past) and I don't think they have the luxury of enough episodes to keep exploring these as separate plot threads and need to find a way to tie Luz and Amity's romance into the myth arc more directly.
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Jul 11, 2021 23:45
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...do you guys know about the concept of skipping over stuff and then having that referred to later on?
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Jul 12, 2021 07:00
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While I imagine if they had more time you'd see more of those things shown onscreen and fleshed out, it is a funny note that adventures and trials are basically routine to Luz now. Kinda like how in later Gravity Falls the twins have been having adventures and solving mysteries offscreen since they've gotten pretty good at it. Though I'd like to see more of Luz in magic school and actually seeing what she can learn and apply from it with her glyph magic. I think it's really underrated when characters openly experiment and talk about how magic and powers work, theorycrafting and working out mechanics to apply in unusual ways, and they've been just consistent enough with how witch magic works to have a few rules about it. Fun to see that Illusion magic is loving broken if you know how to apply it, even if despite some previous indications it doesn't have any physical effects. Also first case we've seen, I think, of Luz outright giving a bunch of pre-drawn glyphs to someone else, which apparently can be activated by anyone.
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Jul 12, 2021 07:30
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BioEnchanted posted:Amity's siblings are pretty adorable, I love that they are kind of the audience stand ins for Luz and Amity's relationship. Loved in the latest episode where Amity goes for the kiss and the twins are watching from the upper window being all "Woah, bold move. Nice!" You know, in all the discussion I forgot to post my reaction to the kiss SSSSSSSSSSSSQQQQQQQQQQQQQUUUUUUEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Yes, I am a 52 year old man that this show is turning into a 12 year old girl. Stop me before I read Twilight.
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Jul 12, 2021 12:21
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I'm sure anything glossed over will be explained in the light novel. https://twitter.com/DisneyAPromos/status/1413656123127877633?s=19
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Jul 12, 2021 17:12
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KingKalamari posted:I think that gets into a little bit of the difficulties the show had in the first season with the over-arching metaplot: It did a really good job of setting up Amity's developing feelings for Luz, but didn't really tie that into the first season's main myth arc. This led to us getting a lot of focus on Amity and Luz interacting with each other and developing a rapport, but in a way that didn't tie into the plot threads that became important for the first season's finale and, presumably, the larger myth arc of the story, I think the writers have improved one their longform storytelling thus far with the second season, but are still running into the problem that their core emotional arc (Luz and Amity's romance) is separate from their core narrative arc (Emperor Belos, the door and Eda's past) and I don't think they have the luxury of enough episodes to keep exploring these as separate plot threads and need to find a way to tie Luz and Amity's romance into the myth arc more directly. I'm not sure if Luz/Amity is the emotional core of the show so much as part of it. When we first meet Luz on Earth at the beginning, she's the goofy screw-up girl with no (apparent) friends or positive relationships outside of her mother. Since coming to the Boiling Isles she's learned new skills, gained friends and a mentor/mother-figure and is on the verging of getting an actual girlfriend in Amity (once they both acknowledge the obvious). I think the real conflict for Luz isn't Belos, the door, Eda and King's past so much as in which world does Luz want to live? One aspect of the Luz clone that could add into that with Luz considering that since her mother has a "better" version of her she should let that version stay
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Jul 12, 2021 18:19
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Mraagvpeine posted:I'm sure anything glossed over will be explained in the light novel. Thinking about it, Owl House is technically isekai.
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Jul 12, 2021 18:27
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Mraagvpeine posted:I'm sure anything glossed over will be explained in the light novel. Insert jokes here about being amazed about Tokyopop still existing in TYOOL 2021
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Jul 12, 2021 18:39
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Electric Phantasm posted:Thinking about it, Owl House is technically isekai. Ehhh. If you mean in the sense of both story types being Portal Fantasy, yeah -- but in the way you're using the term, no.
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Jul 12, 2021 18:41
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Mraagvpeine posted:I'm sure anything glossed over will be explained in the light novel. Huh, usually it's the light novel that gets turned into an anime, not the other way around
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Jul 12, 2021 18:42
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TwoPair posted:Huh, usually it's the light novel that gets turned into an anime, not the other way around However it comes, I'll take more Owl House.
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Jul 12, 2021 18:55
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Open Source Idiom posted:Ehhh. If you mean in the sense of both story types being Portal Fantasy, yeah -- but in the way you're using the term, no. 
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Jul 12, 2021 19:28
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Ghost Leviathan posted:While I imagine if they had more time you'd see more of those things shown onscreen and fleshed out, it is a funny note that adventures and trials are basically routine to Luz now. Kinda like how in later Gravity Falls the twins have been having adventures and solving mysteries offscreen since they've gotten pretty good at it. I feel like what we have learned about illusions in this episode actually... if it does not contradict what has been established beforehand, it sure casts it in a new light. For example, when Gus and Willow tried to fight the basilisk, and Gus gave Willow's carnivorous plant huge buff arms... well, if that was an insubstantial illusion, what was he hoping to accomplish? Psyche the basilisk out? "I wasn't worried about the carnivorous plant, but now that it's got giant arms? MAN, now I'm scared!" And from the detention episode, how is Gus' illusion taking notes for him if it cannot influence the world? And from that same episode, what's with that one student that made his face all smooth (the one that tried their hand at illusions after Em made her legs long and Ed gave himself a fancy makeover, when Gus is showing Luz around the school) and then appeared to really couldn't breathe? Did they trick themselves into thinking they really couldn't breathe? Did they accidentally craft an illusion so good, they tricked themselves??? (The real answer, in all likelihood, is "the rules for magic hadn't been established yet so the writers just did whatever" or even more likely "this isn't the kind of show that cares about these minutiae", but still, it was noticeable to me, and I don't usually notice these things. paradoxGentleman fucked around with this message at 19:51 on Jul 12, 2021 |
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Jul 12, 2021 19:42
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paradoxGentleman posted:
That ohne is actually quite obvious.
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Jul 12, 2021 20:13
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Mraagvpeine posted:I'm sure anything glossed over will be explained in the light novel. My Mom Sent Me To Summer Camp And Now I'm In Love With Katara From Avatar The Last Airbender?!
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Jul 12, 2021 20:55
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I'm not persuaded by a redditor who can't pluralise, but surely the complete lack of trucks proves my point?
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Jul 12, 2021 21:15
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Electric Phantasm posted:Thinking about it, Owl House is technically isekai. Amphibia too, actually. And they’re doing a crossover in table read form…
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Jul 12, 2021 21:27
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Funky Valentine posted:My Mom Sent Me To Summer Camp And Now I'm In Love With Katara From Avatar The Last Airbender?! My Surrogate Mom is a Cursed Witch Who Sells Junk?! Trapped in Another World With a Talking House My Little King of Demons Can't Be This Cute
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Jul 12, 2021 21:55
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Oh, apparently Monsters At Work has started up? The first episode was decent enough I suppose, but nothing spectacular. The premise of "What does transitioning your entire energy industry to a new power source actually look like in practice?" is incredibly relevant, but it doesn't seem like the show is very interested in meaningfully engaging with the issue long term. It's going for much more of a standard wacky hijinks workplace sitcom sort of tone. Who knows though, maybe it'll surprise me. Side note: I'd never actually considered interpreting scare energy as a stand in for fossil fuels before and now I feel kind of stupid for having missed it all these years.
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Jul 12, 2021 22:22
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Cattail Prophet posted:Oh, apparently Monsters At Work has started up? The first episode was decent enough I suppose, but nothing spectacular. The premise of "What does transitioning your entire energy industry to a new power source actually look like in practice?" is incredibly relevant, but it doesn't seem like the show is very interested in meaningfully engaging with the issue long term. It's going for much more of a standard wacky hijinks workplace sitcom sort of tone. Who knows though, maybe it'll surprise me. Wow, you really missed Waternoose's breakdown in the original movie didn't you. How did it go again? Oh yeah. "I'll kill a thousand dinosaurs before I see my company die!"
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Jul 12, 2021 22:29
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BioEnchanted posted:Wow, you really missed Waternoose's breakdown in the original movie didn't you. How did it go again? Oh yeah. "I'll kill a thousand dinosaurs before I see my company die!"
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Jul 12, 2021 22:31
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Open Source Idiom posted:I'm not persuaded by a redditor who can't pluralise, but surely the complete lack of trucks proves my point? The Owl House is an isekai. The Last Starfigher is an isekai. That show you like is an isekai.
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Jul 12, 2021 22:33
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The isekai classification's only arisen pretty recently, though, right? And it typically describes works with extremely familiar, almost rigid genre tropes rather than stuff that's analogous to the entire history of portal fantasy. Almost without exception, characters are transplanted into a virtual or fantastical world that is rigidly adherent to the common mores of its genre (whether that genre is fantasy, romance, martial arts, etc.) where they then attempt to thrive. It's important to the genre that the isekai world characters are thrown into is immediately recognisable to the audience, in fact that it draws explicitly on genre cliches, so that minimal setting-building or exposition needs to occur. The character being intuitively familiar with the mores of the setting isn't necessary, but does often follow from that requirement. I'm pretty sure "isekai" has only been used to describe things dating back to the late 2000s, and almost exclusively the things it describes meet that description. Arguably it's a sub-genre of portal fantasy, where the breadth of theme is often much wider and settings are often much more textured, or bizarre. The Owl House possibly is an isekai by this qualification though, yeah, because its cliched genre world where the tropes are immediately recognisable to the audience is "Harry Potter".
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Jul 12, 2021 22:47
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Android Blues posted:The isekai classification's only arisen pretty recently, though, right? And it typically describes works with extremely familiar, almost rigid genre tropes rather than stuff that's analogous to the entire history of portal fantasy. Almost without exception, characters are transplanted into a virtual or fantastical world that is rigidly adherent to the common mores of its genre (whether that genre is fantasy, romance, martial arts, etc.) where they then attempt to thrive. Yeah, I think this summarizes my own thoughts given what I know about the term and its distinction from broader portal fantasy. If isekai is a broad enough concept that it can be applied to all portal fantasy, there's not really much need for it to exist as a term on its own.
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Jul 12, 2021 23:06
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