Trad Games Chat: squabbled over drafts, forked, and disbanded

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Trad Games Chat: squabbled over drafts, forked, and disbanded

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Megazver: Jan 13, 2006

I understand why people aren't happy, but he did deliver what was advertised. I think he probably shot himself in the foot in terms of fan goodwill, but I don't think you can call this a scam.

Would have probably gone over better if this was, like, a $5 PDF though.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 09:35

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# ? May 23, 2024 10:59

90s Cringe Rock: Nov 29, 2006

Thousand Year OId Vampire.pdf, so it sits next to the original and you open it by accident.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 09:40

drrockso20: May 6, 2013; Has Not Actually Done Cocaine

Honestly this just screams pretentious douche

# ? Aug 10, 2021 09:47

Megazver: Jan 13, 2006

drrockso20 posted:

Honestly this just screams pretentious douche

*fights hard to not make any statements about journaling RPGs*

# ? Aug 10, 2021 09:55

sasha_d3ath: Jun 3, 2016; Ban-thing the man-things.

Oh cool, the SCP RPG is finally out

# ? Aug 10, 2021 11:24

Drone: Aug 22, 2003; Incredible machine

TK_Nyarlathotep posted:

Oh cool, the SCP RPG is finally out

Isnt this thematically just Delta Green

# ? Aug 10, 2021 11:47

Megazver: Jan 13, 2006

Drone posted:

Isnt this thematically just Delta Green

Different mythos.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 11:59

sasha_d3ath: Jun 3, 2016; Ban-thing the man-things.

Drone posted:

Isnt this thematically just Delta Green

[REDACTED]

# ? Aug 10, 2021 12:15

pog boyfriend: Jul 2, 2011

dwarf74 posted:

Anyone have experience with VoiceMod? I would like to speak in scary robot voices for my Lancer campaign and maybe make shotgun noises and whatnot.

if you use beatboxing vocal bass it can sound like a robot with proper inflections, that is mostly what i do for those

# ? Aug 10, 2021 12:51

dwarf74: Sep 2, 2012; Buglord

pog boyfriend posted:

if you use beatboxing vocal bass it can sound like a robot with proper inflections, that is mostly what i do for those

Yeah I have been loving around with Hear Yourself on it and I am finding it 100% impossible to speak normally with my own voice immediately echoed back to me. It's making it hard to know if it's working.

I'll try that one out though - I will probably just have to ask my players their thoughts.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 13:07

BlackIronHeart: Aug 2, 2004; PROCEED

dwarf74 posted:

Yeah I have been loving around with Hear Yourself on it and I am finding it 100% impossible to speak normally with my own voice immediately echoed back to me. It's making it hard to know if it's working.

Oooh yeah, speech jamming is a real thing, better to record yourself and then play it back.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 13:09

Splicer: Oct 16, 2006; from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

TK_Nyarlathotep posted:

Oh cool, the SCP RPG is finally out

Heh

# ? Aug 10, 2021 13:11

SkyeAuroline: Nov 12, 2020

Megazver posted:

*fights hard to not make any statements about journaling RPGs*

They're valid games, and the only solo games I've had much success with. Not using standard resolution mechanics doesn't make them pretentious.

This particular move, however, is. I would be disappointed if I'd bought the book, beyond what was already hinted that buyers would be.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 14:07

Ettin: Oct 2, 2010

TK_Nyarlathotep posted:

Oh cool, the SCP RPG is finally out

Any idea how it is? I was put off by the KS and how soon it went on sale after release but the reviews on DriveThruRPG seem to be pretty good :v:

# ? Aug 10, 2021 14:12

Nuns with Guns: Jul 23, 2010; It's fine.
Don't worry about it.

Foglet posted:

Huh.
I'm confused, is it a sort of an artistic statement like the performance that the author of the Pictures for Sad Children made by burning his books?

The incident around the Pictures for Sad Children book was the artist having a very serious mental breakdown on top of being unable to financially afford mailing out the remainder of the comic collections due to a USPS price hike between the kickstarter money collection and fulfillment time. They played it off like it was "a statement" and have done smaller scale "look I'm being artistic" things since then, but it's all pretty transparently self-destructive behavior born out of some really dark mental states more than anything else.

I don't really get the point of the blanked out vampire book. Like the only statement there is that your fans are too trusting and too happy to give you money even when you tell them what they're buying is trash that they'll hate? I guess you can pull that if you want, but I don't see why you'd burn up your professional goodwill like that.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 14:19

moths: Aug 25, 2004; I would also still appreciate some danger.

Nuns with Guns posted:

I guess you can pull that if you want, but I don't see why you'd burn up your professional goodwill like that.

It's a kind of cult-building exercise. The people who gave him $50 for essentially nothing will either leave or double down in their devotion.

It could equally be some dumbass thing where the printer didn't have the font and he didn't order a proof and now he's stuck with three crates of these worthless loving things to sell so BUY MY ART.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 14:37

GetDunked: Dec 16, 2011; respectfully

Ettin posted:

Any idea how it is? I was put off by the KS and how soon it went on sale after release but the reviews on DriveThruRPG seem to be pretty good

I think it was more of a joke about how all the text in the vampire companion book thingy has been replaced with rectangles a la SCP redactions/censor bars. Not to mention that the REDACTED.

Jokes aside, while I do like me some SCP, I do also own and like Delta Green and I'd probably need a stronger motivation than "it has a summary of the setting I've already read a lot of" to get me to pick up a whole new RPG for it, so if someone trip reports/F&Fs it I'd be interested to see what it offers.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 14:42

GetDunked: Dec 16, 2011; respectfully

moths posted:

It's a kind of cult-building exercise. The people who gave him $50 for essentially nothing will either leave or double down in their devotion.

It could equally be some dumbass thing where the printer didn't have the font and he didn't order a proof and now he's stuck with three crates of these worthless loving things to sell so BUY MY ART.

Didn't the Cards Against Humanity folks do something like this? Like offer explicitly nothing in exchange for like $20 or something and they sold a ton of it.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 14:43

moths: Aug 25, 2004; I would also still appreciate some danger.

They did, I think also they sold manure in a box.

I'm more inclined to think it's a situation where he bought a bunch of unusable books and is making lemonade, since a tactical dick move like CAH did is typically more obvious.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 14:49

Halloween Jack: Sep 12, 2003; I WILL CUT OFF BOTH OF MY ARMS BEFORE I VOTE FOR ANYONE THAT IS MORE POPULAR THAN BERNIE!!!!!

The TYOV book is a journal, in spite of claims that it is not a journal. You can get a journal with marbled boards for well under $45.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 15:03

Nuns with Guns: Jul 23, 2010; It's fine.
Don't worry about it.

GetDunked posted:

Didn't the Cards Against Humanity folks do something like this? Like offer explicitly nothing in exchange for like $20 or something and they sold a ton of it.

Yes, it was their Black Friday thing one year. They were very upfront that they were selling you a box with actual poo poo-from-a-bull in it, and prior years they'd done similar joke nonsense. Fans were fine treating it like a donation drive, and they were transparent all the earnings were split among the staff. They did a follow up report of how each person spent their cut and most of them put it towards repaying student loans, though one woman bought a gold-plated dildo. It was goofy, shallow commentary on Black Friday, but much more honest about it.

Cards Against Humanity has a lot of other problems (example) but that stunt was fine.

Halloween Jack posted:

The TYOV book is a journal, in spite of claims that it is not a journal. You can get a journal with marbled boards for well under $45.

It looks like the book has glossy pages that might make it suck to write on, but I guess it depends on exactly how high quality the gloss is and the kind of pens you like journaling with.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 15:15

CitizenKeen: Nov 13, 2003; easygoing pedant

Ettin posted:

Any idea how it is? I was put off by the KS and how soon it went on sale after release but the reviews on DriveThruRPG seem to be pretty good

Do you mean you were put off by how quickly the price dropped? Or by how quickly it was available after Kickstarter release? And why did that put you off?

# ? Aug 10, 2021 15:27

Nessus: Dec 22, 2003; After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!

Drone posted:

Isnt this thematically just Delta Green

Delta Green seems to track with early-period SCPs, but I actually don't know if there's an RPG that deals with more recent SCPs well. Mage, maybe. OG Call of Cthulhu might as well, although ha ha hi Sandy thanks for loving THAT one up.

To explain the distinction I perceive: A lot of early SCPs are more about 'here is horrible bizarre stuff with high body counts and desperate containment measures, also often with high body counts.' Later stuff tends to be more about cataloguing and perhaps suppressing knowledge/access to various things, and often involves more explicit allusions to artists and wizards (which are, of course, both very Lovecraftian concepts). They also play more explicitly with ideas of history, memory and thought.

There's a lot of SCP pages about the Daeva empire, who would have fit quite neatly into a lot of Mythos games. But there is also this: https://scp-wiki.wikidot.com/scp-6140 -- and I feel like this is something distinct from cosmic horror.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 15:28

Absurd Alhazred: Mar 27, 2010; by Athanatos

90s Cringe Rock posted:

The Thousand Year Old Vampire Companion Volume has started arriving.

Please read the description before this spoiler, which explains why some people are not happy: it's the (very pretty) game book but all the content is blanked out. Some photos here.

This owns.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 15:29

dwarf74: Sep 2, 2012; Buglord

BlackIronHeart posted:

Oooh yeah, speech jamming is a real thing, better to record yourself and then play it back.

It's rad that there's actually a word for it. It's a downright uncanny experience, almost indescribable.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 15:45

MonsieurChoc: Oct 12, 2013; Every species can smell its own extinction.

Still waiting for a Control rpg.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 15:58

CitizenKeen: Nov 13, 2003; easygoing pedant

MonsieurChoc posted:

Still waiting for a Control rpg.

I am very curious what a Control RPG would want than an SCP/DG RPG couldn't deliver, other than stat blocks?

# ? Aug 10, 2021 16:01

Splicer: Oct 16, 2006; from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

CitizenKeen posted:

I am very curious what a Control RPG would want than an SCP/DG RPG couldn't deliver, other than stat blocks?

0 montauk references.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 16:12

Boba Pearl: Dec 27, 2019; by Athanatos

It reminds me of the goon who sold GIP posters a t-shirt with his face on it.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 16:15

Absurd Alhazred: Mar 27, 2010; by Athanatos

Boba Pearl posted:

It reminds me of the goon who sold GIP posters a t-shirt with his face on it.

That was a gag - :mcnally:

sent everyone the actual shirt they ordered, he just worked with another goon to make it seem like he'd sent his own image instead.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 16:39

GimpInBlack: Sep 27, 2012; That's right, kids, take lots of drugs, leave the universe behind, and pilot Enlightenment Voltron out into the cosmos to meet Alien Jesus.

Ettin posted:

Any idea how it is? I was put off by the KS and how soon it went on sale after release but the reviews on DriveThruRPG seem to be pretty good

The basic mechanic is straightforward enough, it's a dice pool system where you take your two highest-rolling dice, add a proficiency, compare to a DC. After that, though, it gets... well. Some highlights from the DTRPG preview:

Attributes are made up of dice, which form the pool that you roll. But the number and size appears to be arbitrary--the example given is that you could have a Strength of "5d8 and 2d10."
Difficulty values are in whole numbers, but skill ranks add decimals to your result (e.g. if you roll a 12 and have 7 points in a skill, you have a result of 12.7).
Dice that explode in an ~~inexplicably counterintuitive~~extremely dumb way (a d8 that explodes adds a new d10 to your dice pool, a d10 adds 2d12, and a d12 adds a d20). The reason you don't just get another die of the same size like every other exploding dice system ever is that these are explicitly added to your dice pool, not the total of the exploding die, and thus are still subject to the "only keep the two highest" rule. Yes, that means that your "exploded" d8 has an 80% chance of being worthless.
Any 1s rolled subtract from your result, continuing the "the more dice you have, the more likely you are to kneecap yourself" trend of Storyteller et al.
A skill list with sixty four skills.

Now, granted, I'm going off of nothing but the basic mechanics overview preview, maybe the full book explains some of these decisions or has extra permutations that make them make more sense, but nothing in the basic rules inspires me with any confidence or desire to spend money on it. The impression I get isn't so much a heartbreaker in the sense of "the author has only ever played D&D and has no conception that there are other ways to design an RPG," but it feels like a designer who is so terrified of being perceived as ripping off other games (or maybe just so focused on being "innovative") that they've made a bunch of frankly bizarre and inexplicable decisions in an attempt at novelty.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 16:55

Leraika: Jun 14, 2015; Luckily, I *did* save your old avatar. Fucked around and found out indeed.

GimpInBlack posted:

The basic mechanic is straightforward enough, it's a dice pool system where you take your two highest-rolling dice, add a proficiency, compare to a DC. After that, though, it gets... well. Some highlights from the DTRPG preview:

Attributes are made up of dice, which form the pool that you roll. But the number and size appears to be arbitrary--the example given is that you could have a Strength of "5d8 and 2d10."

Difficulty values are in whole numbers, but skill ranks add decimals to your result (e.g. if you roll a 12 and have 7 points in a skill, you have a result of 12.7).

Dice that explode in an ~~inexplicably counterintuitive~~extremely dumb way (a d8 that explodes adds a new d10 to your dice pool, a d10 adds 2d12, and a d12 adds a d20). The reason you don't just get another die of the same size like every other exploding dice system ever is that these are explicitly added to your dice pool, not the total of the exploding die, and thus are still subject to the "only keep the two highest" rule. Yes, that means that your "exploded" d8 has an 80% chance of being worthless.

Any 1s rolled subtract from your result, continuing the "the more dice you have, the more likely you are to kneecap yourself" trend of Storyteller et al.

A skill list with sixty four skills.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 17:12

zerofiend: Dec 23, 2006

MonsieurChoc posted:

Still waiting for a Control rpg.

Haven't read it but https://mythicgazetteer.itch.io/external-containment-bureau seems to be going for that vibe.

zerofiend fucked around with this message at 17:27 on Aug 10, 2021

# ? Aug 10, 2021 17:15

CitizenKeen: Nov 13, 2003; easygoing pedant

Also, Chamber for Agon seems explicitly Control-themed.

https://johnharper.itch.io/chamber

# ? Aug 10, 2021 17:18

Night10194: Feb 13, 2012; We'll start,
like many good things,
with a bear.

GimpInBlack posted:

The basic mechanic is straightforward enough, it's a dice pool system where you take your two highest-rolling dice, add a proficiency, compare to a DC. After that, though, it gets... well. Some highlights from the DTRPG preview:

Attributes are made up of dice, which form the pool that you roll. But the number and size appears to be arbitrary--the example given is that you could have a Strength of "5d8 and 2d10."

Difficulty values are in whole numbers, but skill ranks add decimals to your result (e.g. if you roll a 12 and have 7 points in a skill, you have a result of 12.7).

Dice that explode in an ~~inexplicably counterintuitive~~extremely dumb way (a d8 that explodes adds a new d10 to your dice pool, a d10 adds 2d12, and a d12 adds a d20). The reason you don't just get another die of the same size like every other exploding dice system ever is that these are explicitly added to your dice pool, not the total of the exploding die, and thus are still subject to the "only keep the two highest" rule. Yes, that means that your "exploded" d8 has an 80% chance of being worthless.

Any 1s rolled subtract from your result, continuing the "the more dice you have, the more likely you are to kneecap yourself" trend of Storyteller et al.

A skill list with sixty four skills.

Now, granted, I'm going off of nothing but the basic mechanics overview preview, maybe the full book explains some of these decisions or has extra permutations that make them make more sense, but nothing in the basic rules inspires me with any confidence or desire to spend money on it. The impression I get isn't so much a heartbreaker in the sense of "the author has only ever played D&D and has no conception that there are other ways to design an RPG," but it feels like a designer who is so terrified of being perceived as ripping off other games (or maybe just so focused on being "innovative") that they've made a bunch of frankly bizarre and inexplicable decisions in an attempt at novelty.

That explosion mechanic is extremely lol combined with that 1 roll rule. Do exploded dice that roll a 1 become negative because if so, extra :psyduck:

# ? Aug 10, 2021 17:21

Hiro Protagonist: Oct 25, 2010; Last of the freelance hackers and
Greatest swordfighter in the world

Chamber is also very good, but that makes sense, because Agon is also good.

The SCP RPG is definitely interesting to me, especially after reading There is No Anti-Memetic Division, but I would need to know more about whether the actual system is usable, especially when it's from a relatively unknown group and their house system.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 17:24

GimpInBlack: Sep 27, 2012; That's right, kids, take lots of drugs, leave the universe behind, and pilot Enlightenment Voltron out into the cosmos to meet Alien Jesus.

Night10194 posted:

That explosion mechanic is extremely lol combined with that 1 roll rule. Do exploded dice that roll a 1 become negative because if so, extra

It's not 100% clear, the rules don't say anything explicit about how exploding dice and the rule of one interact. But since exploding dice are specifically added to your dice pool, and the rule of one says "any dice in your dice pool that rolled a one," and there's a sidebar that specifically says you have to roll all of your exploding dice even if you've already met the difficulty... I'm pretty sure the intention is yes.

So to amend my previous post, that exploded d8 has a 70% chance to be completely useless and a 10% chance to actively gently caress you over. Amazing game design.

# ? Aug 10, 2021 17:32

Night10194: Feb 13, 2012; We'll start,
like many good things,
with a bear.

GimpInBlack posted:

It's not 100% clear, the rules don't say anything explicit about how exploding dice and the rule of one interact. But since exploding dice are specifically added to your dice pool, and the rule of one says "any dice in your dice pool that rolled a one," and there's a sidebar that specifically says you have to roll all of your exploding dice even if you've already met the difficulty... I'm pretty sure the intention is yes.

So to amend my previous post, that exploded d8 has a 70% chance to be completely useless and a 10% chance to actively gently caress you over. Amazing game design.

I think that throws it over into the dumbest exploding dice system I've seen, which is an achievement.

E: Rule of 1 plus that explosion rule actually makes lots of low dice an active detriment, doesn't it? Because they're likely to roll a 1, and also likely to explode and both not necessarily be important to your overall 2 die result pool but get more chances for 1s.

Night10194 fucked around with this message at 17:42 on Aug 10, 2021

# ? Aug 10, 2021 17:39

Splicer: Oct 16, 2006; from hell's heart I cast at thee
🧙🐀🧹🌙🪄🐸

GimpInBlack posted:

[*]Attributes are made up of dice, which form the pool that you roll. But the number and size appears to be arbitrary--the example given is that you could have a Strength of "5d8 and 2d10."

Do you mean or? This is how skills work in deadlands, I might have 3d6 and you 2d8.

GimpInBlack posted:

[*]Dice that explode in an ~~inexplicably counterintuitive~~extremely dumb way (a d8 that explodes adds a new d10 to your dice pool, a d10 adds 2d12, and a d12 adds a d20). The reason you don't just get another die of the same size like every other exploding dice system ever is that these are explicitly added to your dice pool, not the total of the exploding die, and thus are still subject to the "only keep the two highest" rule. Yes, that means that your "exploded" d8 has an 80% chance of being worthless.

I know I've heard of another system that does it this way. Is there any way you can lose dice or you get boosts from doubles or anything?

# ? Aug 10, 2021 17:51

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# ? May 23, 2024 10:59

GimpInBlack: Sep 27, 2012; That's right, kids, take lots of drugs, leave the universe behind, and pilot Enlightenment Voltron out into the cosmos to meet Alien Jesus.

Night10194 posted:

I think that throws it over into the dumbest exploding dice system I've seen, which is an achievement.

E: Rule of 1 plus that explosion rule actually makes lots of low dice an active detriment, doesn't it? Because they're likely to roll a 1, and also likely to explode and both not necessarily be important to your overall 2 die result pool but get more chances for 1s.

I don't think attributes use any dice smaller than a d8, or at least the rules summary doesn't include explosion mechanics for d6s or d4s, but yeah. The only exploding die that might be worthwhile (and I haven't done the math on this in depth) is the d12 to d20: only a 5% chance to dick you over, and a 40% chance of actually being useful. Also, a nat 20 is an automatic critical success, so 5% of that 40% chance is a crit.

...yay?

Splicer posted:

Do you mean or? This is how skills work in deadlands, I might have 3d6 and you 2d8.

I do not.

Splicer posted:

I know I've heard of another system that does it this way. Is there any way you can lose dice or you get boosts from doubles or anything?

If there is, it's not mentioned in the basic rules. If I thought there was any actual mechanical rigor in this game I might say the fact that you can apparently have 5+ dice in your pool but you only ever roll 4 would imply that you can lose dice, but I don't, so I won't.

GimpInBlack fucked around with this message at 17:58 on Aug 10, 2021

# ? Aug 10, 2021 17:53

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Traditional Games > Trad Games Chat: squabbled over drafts, forked, and disbanded

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