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the holy poopacy
May 16, 2009

hey! check this out
Fun Shoe

CoolCab posted:

no one knows. definitely not the mysteriously fair haired and skinned population of the nearby indigenous people with their crazy tales of "our ancestors actually integrated following rough conditions, I have white great grandparents because we have lived in peace for generations" probably a curse of some kind.

so you're saying they sailed to the Yucatan, accidentally fell through a time portal, and built the "Mayan" pyramids??

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FreudianSlippers
Apr 12, 2010

Shooting and Fucking
are the same thing!

Race mixing?

impossible


obviously it was Aliens from the Hollow Earth

Nessus
Dec 22, 2003

After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!



One of the few things I learned from a Cracked listicle that seems to have been at least kind of valid is that, given the opportunity, tons of white people looked at living in a European resource colony, looked at how the natives lived, and correctly estimated which was the better deal.

Carthag Tuek
Oct 15, 2005

Tider skal komme,
tider skal henrulle,
slægt skal følge slægters gang



Nessus posted:

One of the few things I learned from a Cracked listicle that seems to have been at least kind of valid is that, given the opportunity, tons of white people looked at living in a European resource colony, looked at how the natives lived, and correctly estimated which was the better deal.

Yeah it's easy to racemix when you have the gun

Carthag Tuek
Oct 15, 2005

Tider skal komme,
tider skal henrulle,
slægt skal følge slægters gang



That sounds hosed up.

ChubbyChecker
Mar 25, 2018

Platystemon posted:

The experimental method in this article is lacking, but it’s interesting as a historical document in its own right. The Jungle was published six years before.



This modern article links to studies of specific spices.

huh, cinnamon is a preservative

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011




Edgar Allen Ho posted:

Only took two centuries of asking inuits about it and them going "yeah we saw a bunch of doomed white guys tryna to do a dumb thing, they got hosed, roundabouts here, we tried to talk them into turning back but :shrug:"

John Rae asked some inuits about the expedition in 1854 and they said they'd encountered some white people who had resorted to cannibalism. This caused an outrage in Britain and Charles Dickens was engaged to write a play called The Frozen Deep about how members of the Franklin expeditions in no way had done that and that Rae had been fooled by cunning natives. As an added historical fun fact, Dickens met the eighteen-year-old Ellen Ternan for whom he would leave his wife of 22 years when writing and acting in the play.

It has since been established that members of the Franklin expeditions did resort to cannibalism because of starvation.

3D Megadoodoo
Nov 25, 2010
Probation
Can't post for 5 hours!

ChubbyChecker posted:

i guess it sounds smart if you don't know about the medieval spice and meat prices. it was taught in my school too

It sounds smart if you don't know where meat comes from, i.e. livestock. Livestock.

Bonster
Mar 3, 2007

Keep rolling, rolling

the holy poopacy posted:

When I first heard that you're not supposed to use "Eskimo" I assumed it was bastardized French or something and that's why they don't like it. Nope, it comes from the languages of their southern neighbors who have been oppressing them a lot longer than Europeans (the Inuit weren't living in an arctic wasteland just for funsies.)

The thing that complicates this is that using "Inuit" as a substitute for "Eskimo" is also incorrect. The Inuits are the largest group that were called Eskimo, but so are the Yup'ik and Aleut (Unangan). "Inuit and Yup'ik" is probably a better usage, as a language group, while the Aleuts are unique. Turns out it's way more complicated than swapping one for another!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eskimo
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inuit
https://www.uaf.edu/anlc/resources/inuit_or_eskimo.php
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleut

By the way, did you know the Aleuts were interned by the US government in WWII? Wikipedia kind of makes it sound like it was for their own good - the Japanese had invaded the Aleutian islands and sent the Aleuts to prison camps in Hokkaido - but then the internees were kept in camps for two full years after the Japanese withdraw, and destroyed their villages for good measure. You know, just in case. They were allowed to take one suitcase, and their housing consisted of an abandoned cannery, a herring saltery and a gold mine camp, with no warm winter clothing, sewer system, heat or running water. Some men were forced to harvest fur seals, and threatened with continued detainment if they refused. Tuberculosis and pneumonia ran rampant. 118 of the 881 prisoners died. (ETA: other sources say 85 of 831, regardless it's far, far too many)

https://www.smithsonianmag.com/smart-news/us-forcibly-detained-native-alaskans-during-world-war-ii-180962239/
https://www.nps.gov/aleu/learn/historyculture/unangax-internment.htm

https://www.adn.com/we-alaskans/article/forgotten-internment/2014/11/09/

Bonster has a new favorite as of 13:44 on Aug 28, 2021

Brawnfire
Jul 13, 2004

🎧Listen to Cylindricule!🎵
https://linktr.ee/Cylindricule

ChubbyChecker posted:

huh, cinnamon is a preservative

*gestures widely* cinnamon pickles

Zopotantor
Feb 24, 2013

...und ist er drin dann lassen wir ihn niemals wieder raus...

Bonster posted:

By the way, did you know the Aleuts were interned by the US government in WWII? Wikipedia kind of makes it sound like it was for their own good - the Japanese had invaded the Aleutian islands and sent the Aleuts to prison camps in Hokkaido - but then the internees were kept in camps for two full years after the Japanese withdraw, and destroyed their villages for good measure. You know, just in case. They were allowed to take one suitcase, and their housing consisted of an abandoned cannery, a herring saltery and a gold mine camp, with no warm winter clothing, sewer system, heat or running water. Some men were forced to harvest fur seals, and threatened with continued detainment if they refused. Tuberculosis and pneumonia ran rampant. 118 of the 881 prisoners died. (ETA: other sources say 85 of 831, regardless it's far, far too many)

IIRC that was a plot point in Snow Crash. The badass antagonist driving around with his personal hydrogen bomb was an Aleut (and still mad about the whole thing).

Fighting Trousers
May 17, 2011

Does this excite you, girl?

the holy poopacy posted:

so you're saying they sailed to the Yucatan, accidentally fell through a time portal, and built the "Mayan" pyramids??

Plus all the mounds in Cahokia.

Sucrose
Dec 9, 2009

Alhazred posted:

John Rae asked some inuits about the expedition in 1854 and they said they'd encountered some white people who had resorted to cannibalism. This caused an outrage in Britain and Charles Dickens was engaged to write a play called The Frozen Deep about how members of the Franklin expeditions in no way had done that and that Rae had been fooled by cunning natives. As an added historical fun fact, Dickens met the eighteen-year-old Ellen Ternan for whom he would leave his wife of 22 years when writing and acting in the play.

It has since been established that members of the Franklin expeditions did resort to cannibalism because of starvation.

I think the jury's still out on what exactly caused the expedition to fail; whether the crew was being hosed up by lead poisoning from tainted supplies, or if they had entirely normal levels of lead poisoning for the era and just got unlucky because it was a particularly cold couple of years, their ships got stuck in the ice, and they couldn't get them out, leading them to attempt a suicidal march south across the Canadian mainland without the requisite skills to survive in such an environment.

Also of course the Northwest Passage they were looking for didn't exist. All the sea-routes west were too choked by ice to ever be navigable at any time of the year.

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011




Nessus posted:

One of the few things I learned from a Cracked listicle that seems to have been at least kind of valid is that, given the opportunity, tons of white people looked at living in a European resource colony, looked at how the natives lived, and correctly estimated which was the better deal.

And then they either robbed the natives or "bargained" at gun point for supplies. John Smith was particularly fond of the latter and always grabbed a hostage before he started bargaining.

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017

by sebmojo
There were some groups that had a lot of poor whites and runaway slaves join up. The Seminole for example.

The south's race hierarchy was invented in response to the fact that a lot of poor white people correctly realized who their real enemy was and kept annoyingly race mixing and teaming up with slaves and natives.

ChubbyChecker
Mar 25, 2018

Alhazred posted:

And then they either robbed the natives or "bargained" at gun point for supplies. John Smith was particularly fond of the latter and always grabbed a hostage before he started bargaining.

he blew his dick off

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017

by sebmojo

ChubbyChecker posted:

he blew his dick off

The more things change, the more chuds taze themselves in the balls to death

3D Megadoodoo
Nov 25, 2010
Probation
Can't post for 5 hours!

ChubbyChecker posted:

he blew his dick off

Strong lungs :eyepop:

Milo and POTUS
Sep 3, 2017

I will not shut up about the Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I talk about them all the time and work them into every conversation I have. I built a shrine in my room for the yellow one who died because sadly no one noticed because she died around 9/11. Wanna see it?

3D Megadoodoo posted:

It sounds smart if you don't know where meat comes from, i.e. livestock. Livestock.

Meat is dead though


Carthag Tuek posted:

That sounds hosed up.

No no, both statements are true

3D Megadoodoo
Nov 25, 2010
Probation
Can't post for 5 hours!

Milo and POTUS posted:

Meat is dead though

Yeah but it only starts rotting once it ceases to be alive. Unless medieval people kept pigs on krokodil or something.

Fighting Trousers
May 17, 2011

Does this excite you, girl?

Edgar Allen Ho posted:

There were some groups that had a lot of poor whites and runaway slaves join up. The Seminole for example.

The south's race hierarchy was invented in response to the fact that a lot of poor white people correctly realized who their real enemy was and kept annoyingly race mixing and teaming up with slaves and natives.

In the 1600's, it was actually super common to have both white indentured servants and African slaves living and working together (and yes, sleeping together), and this created a social structure that made the wealthy landowners uncomfortable, so that's where you get poo poo like the one drop rule. Also handy for dealing with the, ahem, issue of all those nonconsensual incidents.

Of course, the upper class was willing to overlook that, to a point, with their own passing-for-white, mixed race cousins. To a point.

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011




CoolCab posted:

no one knows. definitely not the mysteriously fair haired and skinned population of the nearby indigenous people with their crazy tales of "our ancestors actually integrated following rough conditions, I have white great grandparents because we have lived in peace for generations" probably a curse of some kind.

Speaking of, around 80 persons living in Iceland today (possibly more) can trace their ancestry back to four native american women. There's also been found remains of a tribe that was resistent to tuberculosis and it's been speculated that this is because they had gotten genes from vikings. But it is impossible to get dna from their remains.

Alhazred has a new favorite as of 16:34 on Aug 29, 2021

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017

by sebmojo
There's a pretty famous case of two alsatian kids immigrating to New Orleans and then being kidnapped and sold into slavery. In addition the obvious horror, it's a reminder of the horrendous amount of sexual abuse that two lily-white european girls passed as being born slaves for thirty years.

Also her kids were kept enslaved until emancipation, despite her successfully sueing for her own freedom after being recognized by a fellow alsatian immigrant. Truly a great country, sad they are destroying all the statues reminding us of our glorious history. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sally_Miller

hawowanlawow
Jul 27, 2009

The union tried to hire Garibaldi as a general in the civil war:

quote:

[Garibaldi] said that the only way in which he could render service, as he ardently desired to do, to the cause of the United States, was as Commander-in-chief of its forces, that he would only go as such, and with the additional contingent power—to be governed by events—of declaring the abolition of slavery; that he would be of little use without the first, and without the second it would appear like a civil war in which the world at large could have little interest or sympathy.

Samovar
Jun 4, 2011

I'm 😤 not a 🦸🏻‍♂️hero...🧜🏻



Possibly I read this fact in this very thread, but in any case, it's good enough to be brought up again:

In 1964, a French accountant in Beijing, Bernard Boursicot, met with one Shi Pei Pu at a party and fell in love. The affair was discovered by Chinese government, and Boursicot has pressured to pass on French documents to China during the twenty year affair - during an extended period of absence Shi Pei Pu proclaimed to Bouriscot that their trysts had resulted in them having a child.

However, the affair fell apart in 82, when Shi Pei Pu was flown into France because, after interrogation by police, it turned out Shi Pei Pu was actually a man, and Bouriscot had just never known.

3D Megadoodoo
Nov 25, 2010
Probation
Can't post for 5 hours!

Samovar posted:

never knew

Uh-huh.

christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs 🎤of siren 🧜🏻‍♀️songs
To oohs😮 to ahhs😱 to 👏big👏applause👏
With all of my 😡anger I scream🤬 and shout📢
🇺🇸America🦅, I love you 🥰but you're freaking 💦me 😳out
Biscuit Hider

Normally I’d be skeptical, but if the “I’m pregnant and it’s yours” gambit worked then it’s possible he was just very stupid

Imagined
Feb 2, 2007
TBF, they were very pretty.

Samovar
Jun 4, 2011

I'm 😤 not a 🦸🏻‍♂️hero...🧜🏻




If it hadn't been for the fake kid, I could understand Bouriscot trying to kill himself after the news got out for him being outed. The kid part is what puts it into the 'What the hell' category.

Carthag Tuek
Oct 15, 2005

Tider skal komme,
tider skal henrulle,
slægt skal følge slægters gang



https://twitter.com/archeohistories/status/1434265302561275906

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francesco_Morosini

quote:

During the siege of Athens in 1687 at the Morean War, his artillery turned the Parthenon from a functioning building to a simple ruin, and he personally oversaw the looting of some of the surviving sculptures. The Parthenon was used as a powder magazine by the Ottomans when on September 26, 1687, Morosini's cannon scored a direct hit on the edifice. An attaché of the Swedish field commander General Otto Wilhelm Königsmarck wrote later: "How it dismayed His Excellency to destroy the beautiful temple which had existed three thousand years!". By contrast Morosini, who was the commander in chief of the operation, described it in his report to the Venetian government as a "fortunate shot".

When he conquered Acropolis in early 1688, Morosini tried to loot Athena's and Poseidon's horses and chariots from the west pediment of the Parthenon but the sculptures fell on the ground and smashed.[4][5] This was the first documented attempt to remove sculptures from the pediments.[6] The Ottoman Empire regained possession of the monument in the following year and, having noticed the damage, began to sell souvenirs to Westerners.[7]

Morosini also looted from the port of Piraeus the famous Piraeus Lion which is on display at the Venetian Arsenal.

what a swell guy

Edgar Allen Ho
Apr 3, 2017

by sebmojo
Sounds like this gun bible needs to go to London where it can be safe

CharlestheHammer
Jun 26, 2011

YOU SAY MY POSTS ARE THE RAVINGS OF THE DUMBEST PERSON ON GOD'S GREEN EARTH BUT YOU YOURSELF ARE READING THEM. CURIOUS!

Samovar posted:

If it hadn't been for the fake kid, I could understand Bouriscot trying to kill himself after the news got out for him being outed. The kid part is what puts it into the 'What the hell' category.

I would guess he knew it was fake but couldn’t call the bluff without outing himself, but that makes it a bit darker.

christmas boots
Oct 15, 2012

To these sing-alongs 🎤of siren 🧜🏻‍♀️songs
To oohs😮 to ahhs😱 to 👏big👏applause👏
With all of my 😡anger I scream🤬 and shout📢
🇺🇸America🦅, I love you 🥰but you're freaking 💦me 😳out
Biscuit Hider
Minor pedantry, but I think that’s actually a book of hours, which is marginally less sacrilegious

Brawnfire
Jul 13, 2004

🎧Listen to Cylindricule!🎵
https://linktr.ee/Cylindricule

"Time to say your prayers" BLAM!

Byzantine
Sep 1, 2007
Probation
Can't post for 28 hours!

venetians

nonathlon
Jul 9, 2004
And yet, somehow, now it's my fault ...

Samovar posted:

Possibly I read this fact in this very thread, but in any case, it's good enough to be brought up again:

In 1964, a French accountant in Beijing, Bernard Boursicot, met with one Shi Pei Pu at a party and fell in love. The affair was discovered by Chinese government, and Boursicot has pressured to pass on French documents to China during the twenty year affair - during an extended period of absence Shi Pei Pu proclaimed to Bouriscot that their trysts had resulted in them having a child.

However, the affair fell apart in 82, when Shi Pei Pu was flown into France because, after interrogation by police, it turned out Shi Pei Pu was actually a man, and Bouriscot had just never known.

Later turned into an opera (by David Cronenberg!).

I read somewhere that Boursicot was very sheltered and naive but like the explanation above (that once he'd started going along with it, he was stuck).

EDIT: turns out it was a play: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M._Butterfly

EDIT 2: and wikipedia makes it more complicated - later in their relationship Boursicot was having affairs with other women so he can't have been that naive https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bernard_Boursicot

nonathlon has a new favorite as of 16:10 on Sep 15, 2021

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011




A small fun fact: The dodo wasn't hunted to extinction. Although it was easy to catch it also didn't taste that good. Archaeologists has also found evidence of a flash flood that decimated the population so it was already vulnerable before the humans arrived. What really caused them go extinct was the arrival of rats that ate their eggs.

Beachcomber
May 21, 2007

Another day in paradise.


Slippery Tilde
That's not fun at all!

Platystemon
Feb 13, 2012

BREADS
Lyall’s wren is often said to have been made extinct by a single domestic cat by the name of “Tibbles”.

The reality is that rats did the majority of the work in extirpating the wren from the mainland Aotearoa, and Tibbles’ progeny dealt the final blow.

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Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011




On august 4th 1945 the US ambassador in Soviet received a hand carved wooden plaque of the Great Seal of the United States as a symbol of friendship between the two countries. The ambassador thought it was a lovely gesture and hung it in his office. In 1952 it was discovered that the plaque was bugged.

Alhazred has a new favorite as of 19:07 on Sep 20, 2021

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