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froglet posted:I'd say they are related in that WA cannot handle even a "small" delta outbreak. Sure, but even if WA had a state of the art, well under capacity healthcare system that was the envy of Australia, do we think McGowan would shift his policies to "let her rip, we can handle it"
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Sep 1, 2021 23:45
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| # ? May 20, 2024 11:46 |
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rip victoria
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Sep 1, 2021 23:56
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Jesus NSW is actually going for 70% of eligible population, jesus christ, that leterrip is going to be a loving shitshow.
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Sep 2, 2021 00:07
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ShoeFly posted:rip victoria I don't think the message that Dan was hoping to push yesterday (gotta keep going with lockdown to keep it under control) will work. I think people will have just given up and start doing whatever they think they need to to look after themselves. The lockdown fatigue is real and for a lot of people this probably feels like we've wasted all that time for nothing. Dan should "Let 'er rip" and start slamming the feds and NSW over this situation as he'll need to deflect blame for the incoming collapse of the medical system at some point anyway. May as well lay the foundations and get a head of it.
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Sep 2, 2021 00:09
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freebooter posted:Sure, but even if WA had a state of the art, well under capacity healthcare system that was the envy of Australia, do we think McGowan would shift his policies to "let her rip, we can handle it" The only people McGowan is talking to is the over 60s demographic. Most of them want the boarders shut permanently. He is one trick pony, he doesn't know how to fix the health system, and why would he bother, a majority of this state loves him, well until they or their family ends up in hospital.
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Sep 2, 2021 00:14
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Periphery posted:I don't think the message that Dan was hoping to push yesterday (gotta keep going with lockdown to keep it under control) will work. I think people will have just given up and start doing whatever they think they need to to look after themselves. The lockdown fatigue is real and for a lot of people this probably feels like we've wasted all that time for nothing. Well, we did waste all that time! Don't forget that the stated purpose of the lockdowns was to drive cases to 0, or worst case to a manageable figure in the single digits. This worked on multiple occasions, so whatever fatigue was felt could be pushed through in the knowledge that it could work again. That was why this lockdown went ahead with the public's (annoyed) blessing. But cases have only increased since the beginning of this lockdown, and the Andrews government has now said that 0 cases is no longer possible. People are going to feel betrayed and frustrated, and some (impossible now to say how many) will say 'gently caress it then, let's open it all up.' Now, the lockdown has prevented this from blowing up to NSW levels, but that is a consolation prize - one we're likely to throw away once things start to open up, vaccine or no.
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Sep 2, 2021 00:25
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lol Victoria is on the way to catching up to NSW, we're increasing faster than they did and we haven't even got to the protest bloom. That's what Gladys was crowing about saying NSW had done very well, they'd done a gold standard suppression job while exporting Rona round the country. 
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Sep 2, 2021 00:50
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Living, laughing, loving with the plague
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Sep 2, 2021 00:55
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Sierra Madre posted:Well, we did waste all that time! i don't think you're particularly arguing this, but i think the idea that the lockdowns have been wasted time is a bit of an oversimplified one. given where we are now it feels that way for sure, and we're currently enduring some of the most brutal political spin about the benefit-to-cost of lockdowns, but lives have definitely been saved by effectively postponing this nightmare for as long as we can. that makes it worthwhile i think. what absolutely was wasted by the fed libs was the benefit that lockdowns bought us, which was time - time to get on top of vaccination rates, establish decent quarantine facilities, basically do anything.
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Sep 2, 2021 00:59
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Periphery posted:I don't think the message that Dan was hoping to push yesterday (gotta keep going with lockdown to keep it under control) will work. I think people will have just given up and start doing whatever they think they need to to look after themselves. Anecdotally (and I don't know how else you can really measure non-compliance) this has already been the case for weeks. Just comparing my own apartment block to how the same neighbours behaved last year, people are over it.
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Sep 2, 2021 01:19
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yeah they are, and no one can blame them anymore. Melbournites have been told we'll still be in these restrictions until we hit 80% double dosed. which is early November, or very late October. That's a minimum of another 8 weeks of no work for some (like me), no seeing family etc.
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Sep 2, 2021 01:28
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https://twitter.com/AnnastaciaMP/status/1433219317047255049 So basically Palaszczuk is being cautious and correct and the Feds are losing their poo poo.
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Sep 2, 2021 01:28
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Animal Friend posted:https://twitter.com/AnnastaciaMP/status/1433219317047255049 Good thing that the ALP is backing thehahahhahahahahaha no of course not
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Sep 2, 2021 01:31
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alf_pogs posted:i don't think you're particularly arguing this, but i think the idea that the lockdowns have been wasted time is a bit of an oversimplified one. given where we are now it feels that way for sure, and we're currently enduring some of the most brutal political spin about the benefit-to-cost of lockdowns, but lives have definitely been saved by effectively postponing this nightmare for as long as we can. that makes it worthwhile i think. I won't deny that the lockdown has positive effects. Things would be much worse if we hadn't, or if we had gone with the half-hearted attempts of NSW (and, let's not forget, VIC's first big lockdown last year!). But the Victorian state government has instituted lockdowns where daily case figures were driven back down to 0. By sheer will and persistence, enough Victorians went hikikomori and were able to emerge from that months-long hibernation into a relatively safer environment. That is, I believe, the expectation that the Victorian public had when we entered this new lockdown. We now know that was an impossible dream. Now, even if it meant that only 100 people a day get sick rather than ten times that figure, I think it does damage public trust in lockdowns if they do everything right and it still doesn't work. Call them victims of their own success. It's still early yet but if we do get past this with enough vaccinations, I think Victorians are going to be much more hostile to future lockdowns. Given how this epidemic has been going, I'm pretty sure we're guaranteed another one after this. So when I say that this was a waste of time, I'm not denying that we're better off with the lockdown than without it - but I think that the general perspective of Victorians going forward is 'we've done the right thing and it still all went wrong.' People already feel powerless in the face of this virus, and this makes it so much worse. And I won't argue with you regarding the lack of federal response. That was and is a complete failure to act, shirking their responsibilities and putting it all on the states, and that failure should not be forgotten or forgiven as long as they continue to insist on opening up without ever addressing their inadequate response.
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Sep 2, 2021 01:36
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lol if we hadn't of elected a marketing dad we'd already all be out of lockdown and vaccinated just lol
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Sep 2, 2021 01:50
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Someone needs to run economic cost of these lockdowns since the vaccine became widely available and pin it directly on Scomo, aka the leader of the austerity party
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Sep 2, 2021 01:51
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Every resource chucked at covid would have been better spent on firebombing the entirety of NSW
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Sep 2, 2021 01:52
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Speaking of which, can't wait until a large portion of the population has respiratory conditions and the fire seasons and air pollution continue to get worse every spring/summer! Open her up, let her rip!
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Sep 2, 2021 02:31
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Gladys is an amazing pantomime villain. Seriously, it is a role she is playing so well. With constant sniping of other states, crowing about her "victories" of vaccination targets as new cases top 1200 day after day, and in big brush strokes just the utter lack of accountability. She is a horrible person who has caused a great deal of pain and death. gently caress her. But that said. I am happy that despite the , (most would say justified), anger and hatred towards her she has not copped the pointedly sexist attacks that she could have, or that I would have expected. No-one is calling her a "witch" or a "bitch". She has not been accused of being "hysterical", or "dramatic" or any other dog whistle adjectives. The ICAC stuff is rightfully focussing on what she knew and what she told the developer bloke, and not breathless "The Premier had a boyfriend hehe" stuff etc. Although a lot of this could be due to the fact that she is a Liberal. Unlike Julia Gillard, who copped all of the above and more. Both from the press, and in Parliament. Leads me to ask the question: How is Anna Palaszczuk treated by the Qld. media? Not just Covid stuff, but overall. She is both a woman and Labor. So the notoriously fair minded and progressive Qld. press would surely be attacking her for both of those things yeah? Qld. LNP members are also inclined to use "fruity" language when discussing their cross bench colleagues, so has she copped anything nasty/untoward in Parliament itself?
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Sep 2, 2021 02:49
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Periphery posted:Dan should "Let 'er rip" and start slamming the feds and NSW over this situation as he'll need to deflect blame for the incoming collapse of the medical system at some point anyway. May as well lay the foundations and get a head of it. The medical system is not going to collapse.
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Sep 2, 2021 02:53
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Oh ok that's good to know.
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Sep 2, 2021 02:57
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BrigadierSensible posted:She is a horrible person who has caused a great deal of pain and death. gently caress her. still significantly less death than dan caused fwiw
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Sep 2, 2021 03:03
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Anastasia is, good.
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Sep 2, 2021 03:11
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Centusin posted:still significantly less death than dan caused fwiw gently caress off oval office
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Sep 2, 2021 03:12
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Centusin posted:still significantly less death than dan caused fwiw Vaccines are pretty cool you loving moron
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Sep 2, 2021 03:13
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StrangeThing posted:The medical system is not going to collapse. Thank you, Seymour.
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Sep 2, 2021 03:31
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As an aside though, I'd be interested to hear thoughts from posters about what the most realistic type of "opening" could be. If we don't want to use the Doherty model (or the fed government's interpretation of it), what do we see as the most realistic - realistic - form of returning to some kind of normality? E.g. schools, international travel, and so on. Is it 90% vax? 100% school children vaxxed?
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Sep 2, 2021 03:35
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Centusin posted:still significantly less death than dan caused fwiw i can't take my son to the park a blooo
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Sep 2, 2021 03:39
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Wrong poster.
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Sep 2, 2021 03:40
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Centusin posted:still significantly less death than dan caused fwiw A) Tommunist posted:Vaccines are pretty cool you loving moron B) Need to append a giant blingee So Far to your post. C) Dan only hosed Victoria
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Sep 2, 2021 03:45
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Gladys Beybladerejiklian
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Sep 2, 2021 03:53
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StrangeThing posted:As an aside though, I'd be interested to hear thoughts from posters about what the most realistic type of "opening" could be. If we don't want to use the Doherty model (or the fed government's interpretation of it), what do we see as the most realistic - realistic - form of returning to some kind of normality? E.g. schools, international travel, and so on. 90% double dose, entire population, a plan in place for boosters, consistent, clear mask rules indoors and finally - a national vaccination tracking app so those that can't get jabbed are protected as much as possible. I'd also argue that we won't get back to "normal" until most places have mandates in place as well.
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Sep 2, 2021 03:53
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Amoeba102 posted:Wrong poster. if it quacks like a duck there's no difference
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Sep 2, 2021 03:54
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If nursing homes didn't have such good vaccine rates NSW would be very bad indeed.
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Sep 2, 2021 04:17
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abigserve posted:90% double dose, entire population, a plan in place for boosters, consistent, clear mask rules indoors and finally - a national vaccination tracking app so those that can't get jabbed are protected as much as possible. This but would settle for 70% or 80% double dose, entire population, a plan in place for boosters, consistent, clear mask rules indoors. Children return to school as they become vaccinated. Also quarantine facilities built and ready for the new variants we should be expecting. State education depts hiring teachers for remote learning deployment. State health departments hiring and building contingency into the hospital system for the increasingly likely ongoing crisis over the coming few years.
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Sep 2, 2021 04:19
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Expanded access to disability for immune condition sufferers so they're not forced to go back into public the second lockdown 'ends' would also be lovely so as to not die horribly even while fully vaxxed, which i understand is a problem for immune condition havers! E: I mean really UBI would be the absolute best result given how well it went when the feds shockingly tried a half-approach to it last year but why would that ever happen again?? meteor9 fucked around with this message at 04:41 on Sep 2, 2021 |
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Sep 2, 2021 04:26
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Animal Friend posted:https://twitter.com/AnnastaciaMP/status/1433219317047255049 I'm generally more on-side with Palasczuk than the feds but she's misinterpreting the modelling here. https://twitter.com/JoshButler/status/1433239415191597060 Of course the modelling itself isn't gospel - not that you'd know it from our media discourse - but 80 a day as a new normal would be 30,000 a year, which is almost as bad as some European countries (per capita) at the height of the unvaccinated era. The flipside is that it will be worse than the flu even under the best case scenarios. Gladys declined to answer a question about the "80 a day" number specifically but segued onto how we usually get 2,500 flu deaths a year - which she declined to point out is only about 7 or 8 a day. The "treat it like any other disease" crowd ignores the fact that, even with vaccinations, it's going to be worse than the flu. It's going to kill more people, more people are going to catch it, more people are going to get sick with it. I think that's something we're ultimately going to have to accept because there's no way to avoid it, but it's not helpful for them to pretend that's anything other than a bad outcome and a lovely new normal.
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Sep 2, 2021 04:37
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kirbysuperstar posted:if it quacks like a duck there's no difference One's a NSW defender, and the other a Viclockdown moaner.
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Sep 2, 2021 05:25
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freebooter posted:The flipside is that it will be worse than the flu even under the best case scenarios. Gladys declined to answer a question about the "80 a day" number specifically but segued onto how we usually get 2,500 flu deaths a year - which she declined to point out is only about 7 or 8 a day. The "treat it like any other disease" crowd ignores the fact that, even with vaccinations, it's going to be worse than the flu. It's going to kill more people, more people are going to catch it, more people are going to get sick with it. I think that's something we're ultimately going to have to accept because there's no way to avoid it, but it's not helpful for them to pretend that's anything other than a bad outcome and a lovely new normal. I don't necessarily disagree, but I'm not sure I see a realistic path forward other than 80% (or 90%) fally vaxxed and regular ongoing health controls. What else can be done? Edit: I missed your last sentence, and yes, I agree. It's not helpful. StrangeThing fucked around with this message at 05:32 on Sep 2, 2021 |
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Sep 2, 2021 05:27
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Forget modelling, just look at the UK to see what's coming. https://www.travellingtabby.com/uk-coronavirus-tracker/ Or Israel *tugs at collar* https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/israel/
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Sep 2, 2021 06:01
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