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snergle posted:in the books ... In future can you please put this poo poo behind spoilers? It's was requested early on in the thread, and pretty much everyone has adhered to putting book stuff behind spoiler tags. And let's be honest, while vague, your post still gives the broad strokes of where the show is likely to go over the series. There's a higher chance than usual of people interested in the show having never read the books given how old they are. Hell the last book of the second trilogy is over 30 years old. The source material being used for the current season is almost 80 years old. While Foundation hasn't aged as poorly as other Golden Age "classics", Asimov can definitely be an acquired taste. Dry doesn't even begin to describe his narrative style.
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Oct 5, 2021 08:26
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Proteus Jones posted:In future can you please put this poo poo behind spoilers? It's was requested early on in the thread, and pretty much everyone has adhered to putting book stuff behind spoiler tags. And let's be honest, while vague, your post still gives the broad strokes of where the show is likely to go over the series. Hari Seldon is actually Salvor Hardin as a timelord.
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Oct 5, 2021 14:55
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Are people not reading Foundation/Dune/Hobbits because they are "too old"? Or people are just not reading books because reading is a lost art?
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Oct 5, 2021 15:34
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stephenthinkpad posted:Are people not reading Foundation/Dune/Hobbits because they are "too old"? I read a lot! I just bounced off foundation when I tried it last. I've definitely read dune and hobbits.
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Oct 5, 2021 15:37
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Literally Lewis Hamilton posted:Hari Seldon is actually Salvor Hardin as a timelord. GOD drat IT! 
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Oct 5, 2021 15:38
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stephenthinkpad posted:Are people not reading Foundation/Dune/Hobbits because they are "too old"? Or maybe people are just doing other things. In any case, reading the books is not a requirement for watching the show, so just put book stuff in spoiler text.
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Oct 5, 2021 15:50
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Cojawfee posted:Or maybe people are just doing other things. In any case, reading the books is not a requirement for watching the show, so just put book stuff in spoiler text. Book Knowledge braggers should be exiled to a separate thread.
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Oct 5, 2021 16:20
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etalian posted:Book Knowledge braggers should be exiled to a separate thread. 
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Oct 5, 2021 16:26
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stephenthinkpad posted:Are people not reading Foundation/Dune/Hobbits because they are "too old"? Back in the 90s I found Foundation really hard to read because the language is so old, it really feels like it was something from the 50s. The Hobbit and LOTR feel archaic, but I think that was the intention because Tolkien was taking inspiration from ye olde English for it. Dune I didn't have as much trouble getting into because the prose flows so wonderfully even if the subject matter is impenetrable at times. I swear someone in Foundation says "howdy" to another character.
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Oct 5, 2021 16:28
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Cojawfee posted:Or maybe people are just doing other things. In any case, reading the books is not a requirement for watching the show, so just put book stuff in spoiler text. To be fair the show has already diverged a lot so book knowledge is almost on par with complete speculation. It’s not like Game of Thrones where the first seasons were following the book almost to the letter.
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Oct 5, 2021 16:35
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Yeah by the end of ep 2 you should know book plots means nothing.
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Oct 5, 2021 17:06
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stephenthinkpad posted:Are people not reading Foundation/Dune/Hobbits because they are "too old"? Book sales continue to be extremely high, but people generally prefer to read books about bookshop owners solving mysteries with their cats these days. The need for escapism is also extremely high.
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Oct 5, 2021 17:23
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Literally Lewis Hamilton posted:To be fair the show has already diverged a lot so book knowledge is almost on par with complete speculation. It’s not like Game of Thrones where the first seasons were following the book almost to the letter. We don't know what they are or aren't taking from the books. You never know what might be a spoiler for something that happens later. So just tag book stuff, it's not hard.
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Oct 5, 2021 17:30
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stephenthinkpad posted:Yeah by the end of ep 2 you should know book plots means nothing.
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Oct 5, 2021 17:30
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Genuine question - how are you going to know what spoiler text is for the most recently released episode and what spoiler text is for potential book spoilers? I understand context may help but not always.
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Oct 5, 2021 17:45
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Literally Lewis Hamilton posted:Genuine question - how are you going to know what spoiler text is for the most recently released episode and what spoiler text is for potential book spoilers? I understand context may help but not always. I always context my spoilers. Like this: (last episode) it's a shame Brother Dusk died of Ligma
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Oct 5, 2021 17:47
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twistedmentat posted:I swear someone in Foundation says "howdy" to another character. Is it weird to say "howdy"? I'M NOT WEIRD
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Oct 5, 2021 17:50
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Well at least the whole death ray vaporization retirement plan solves the age old problem of getting the classic "you never call your grandparents' or "you'll miss when i'm gone" shaming....
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Oct 5, 2021 19:00
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Did they specify how long the Cleons (lol jfc Cleon is an anagram of Clone I literally just got this) live? The opening scrawl said it was 19 years later from the events of Episode 2 but either the clones have shorter lifespans or they're being really creative with how people age just to keep reusing the same 3-4 actors.
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Oct 5, 2021 19:10
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Ur Getting Fatter posted:Did they specify how long the Cleons (lol jfc Cleon is an anagram of Clone I literally just got this) live? Well assuming the fat kid in ep1 is 10 year old, 10+19=about 30 year in a cycle. So the old clone gets vaporized when the new clone is born, so I assume the empire always have 3 clones, Brother Dawn (0-30) , Day (30-60), Dust (60-90). BTW I don't get the mural lore. They are not even painting the mural. They are just pushing pigments onto the surface.
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Oct 5, 2021 19:34
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stephenthinkpad posted:Well assuming the fat kid in ep1 is 10 year old, 10+19=about 30 year in a cycle. So the old clone gets vaporized when the new clone is born, so I assume the empire always have 3 clones, Brother Dawn (0-30) , Day (30-60), Dust (60-90). Dawn/Day/Dusk and briefly, Brother Dark.
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Oct 5, 2021 19:54
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stephenthinkpad posted:Well assuming the fat kid in ep1 is 10 year old, 10+19=about 30 year in a cycle. So the old clone gets vaporized when the new clone is born, so I assume the empire always have 3 clones, Brother Dawn (0-30) , Day (30-60), Dust (60-90). Right, the Dawn to Day transformation is a stretch but kinda works (Lee Pace is fit as gently caress but still looks 40 but I could believe that they're going for 30). The Day to Dusk transformation is really weird because Dusk looks closer to late 60's than 50, especially given the übermensch vibes they give Day. Plus Dusk is already showing signs of his age affecting him in the first episode. And then Dark is barely keeping it together at 70? They also have Dark walk down a long line of deceased Cleons, but the reign of the clones has been going on for 400 years, and assuming a 70 year old lifespan, you should have maybe 5-7 rulers? I guess it would make sense to keep their lifespans short to ensure that their lives are about the Empire and not themselves, or something like that. dpkg chopra fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Oct 5, 2021 |
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Oct 5, 2021 20:15
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No you only rule when you are Brother Day, so only 1/3 of your lifespan. 30 year reign X 14 = 420. Did one shot said Cleon 14th? The robot girl also said Cleon II was only born right before OG Cleon's death, so he actually got to rule to the end of his life, and got the Mao treatment. stephenthinkpad fucked around with this message at 20:22 on Oct 5, 2021 |
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Oct 5, 2021 20:19
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stephenthinkpad posted:No you only rule when you are Brother Day, so only 1/3 of your lifespan. 30 year reign X 14 = 420. Did one shot said Cleon 14th? Ah, that's a good point, I forgot about that.
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Oct 5, 2021 20:21
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I thought someone in the Foundation said Cleon XII.
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Oct 5, 2021 20:26
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They showed "Cleon XIV" when showing the newest Brother Dawn at age 14. The Brother Day in episode 1 was Cleon XII. They showed during the pedestals scene that Brother Dust/Dark, "The Painter", was XI.
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Oct 5, 2021 20:41
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stephenthinkpad posted:They are not even painting the mural. They are just pushing pigments onto the surface. What is it you think painting is? Putting pigments on a surface is pretty much what painting is at a fundamental level.
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Oct 5, 2021 21:03
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YOu're not even singing, you're just forcing air through a fleshy tube and squeezing it in weird ways so it makes noises
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Oct 6, 2021 00:11
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Data Graham posted:YOu're not even singing, you're just forcing air through a fleshy tube and squeezing it in weird ways so it makes noises Don't say that kind if poo poo about Mike Patton.
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Oct 6, 2021 00:26
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Literally Lewis Hamilton posted:Genuine question - how are you going to know what spoiler text is for the most recently released episode and what spoiler text is for potential book spoilers? I understand context may help but not always. I like to redact the spoilers, but leave the context. So when talking about the most recent episode I might say: "What was happening on Terminus when Salvor was holding the bird-moth things and what was that supposed to signify?" Or, "Holy crap, I can't believe Brother Dusk just yeeted himself into dust at the end!  "Or if I wanted to speculate on the books: "So we see the battlecruisers coming for Terminus, do you think some book poo poo that hasn't happened yet or will they jump ahead to some different book poo poo." stephenthinkpad posted:No you only rule when you are Brother Day, so only 1/3 of your lifespan. 30 year reign X 14 = 420. Did one shot said Cleon 14th? Yeah, Cleon II probably had Demerzel as a reagent until he became Brother Day and took over while they birthed a new Brother Dawn. So Cleon II would have been the first to vaporize himself...  I was kind of wondering where they kept the other bodies...everyone kept looking at Cleon Prime.
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Oct 6, 2021 00:39
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You can see the 400 year or so advancement in technology. In the last episode The imperial bug zapper, presumably built by second emperor, is room sized while in the first episode they use a handheld phaser on the mural technician to do the same thing
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Oct 6, 2021 01:20
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feedmyleg posted:Book sales continue to be extremely high, but people generally prefer to read books about bookshop owners solving mysteries with their cats these days. The need for escapism is also extremely high. I would like to know more about this.
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Oct 6, 2021 01:57
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Beefeater1980 posted:I would like to know more about this. Cat mysteries. Cozy mysteries.
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Oct 6, 2021 02:18
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Is it just me or is the Vault in the show the Atlas from No Man's Sky?
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Oct 6, 2021 04:02
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droll posted:The character that woke up during the FTL jump will never step foot on Terminus. Are you thinking of Salvor? droll posted:You already watched the first two episodes so I haven't spoiled anything for you. Gaal straight up says it in her narration in the beginning of the first episode This is from quite far back in the thread, but this is untrue. Here's the monologue from the first episode: "When I was a child, I told my mother I wanted to learn every planet in the Galactic Empire, beginning in the centre and moving out to Star's End. Each night she told me stories. I travelled light-years, my mind expanding to hold more and more worlds. But I never reached Terminus. Straddling the farthest reaches of civilisation, unsettled by man, it was the end. And its story remained dark to me until many years later. Until it became my story. Until it became the only story." The "light-years travelled" are in Gaal's imagination. Her mother's stories just never got to Terminus because it's an obscure planet. This doesn't preclude Gaal from turning up on Terminus at some point in the show. In fact, I suspect she will as it seems likely she's been frozen and will appear later, as part of show's ways of keeping characters and actors around through multiple time-skips (obviously we've got Hari's holograms to come, but the clone emperors and the robot are obviously other ways to achieve this).
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Oct 6, 2021 15:35
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Actually, speaking of Salvor Hardin, there was one bit around her in the third episode which frustrated me, when she says something like "Let's see what kind of violence we can deal to the Anacreonians." Just flew in the face of the famous Hardin maxim from the books - although I can also see how this whole process is part of her evolving into the mindset of the book-era Hardin (considering I think this is still 15 years before Hardin is introduced in the books).
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Oct 6, 2021 17:06
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Comrade Fakename posted:This is from quite far back in the thread, but this is untrue. Here's the monologue from the first episode: that's a hell of a stretch
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Oct 6, 2021 19:15
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Disagreed, I interpreted it the same way as well.
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Oct 6, 2021 19:38
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snergle posted:then it ties into the irobot universe. i suspect the show may not want to go with that final thread. I've been re-reading the Robot novels and in the third one, Robots of Dawn (published way after the first two), he has a character say something along the lines of "I bet you could predict the behavior of human civilizations, if your math was good enough. Unfortunately I can't do it, but if I did I'd call it psychohistory" (looks at camera meaningfully) Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:Yeah, Cleon II probably had Demerzel as a reagent until he became Brother Day and took over while they birthed a new Brother Dawn. Although Asimov was a chemist, Demerzel probably would have been a regent, not a reagent  Ur Getting Fatter posted:Did they specify how long the Cleons (lol jfc Cleon is an anagram of Clone I literally just got this) live? First, some more pedantry: it's an opening crawl. A scrawl is a piece of crudely-executed handwriting. The fact that Cleon is an anagram of Clone is probably a happy coincidence, because Asimov called the emperors Cleon without making them clones. Of course, it's possible one of the writers mis-read the name in the book, then decided it was actually a pretty cool idea.
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Oct 6, 2021 19:41
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feedmyleg posted:Disagreed, I interpreted it the same way as well. This is a weird debate. Originally a goon claimed that Salvor's ability to withstand the artifact's null field was a product of the FTL travel. Someone corrected him that Salvor had never traveled FTL and that they were probably confusing Salvor with Gaal. A third person quoted that clarification and complained about book-readers posting spoilers. Finally, someone said that this wasn't a spoiler and that Gaal herself told us in the opening narration that she'd never reached Terminus. And now here we are.
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Oct 6, 2021 19:48
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