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So bookstore Alba guy is definitely that guy in formation with Shin in the OP right?
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Oct 11, 2021 00:40
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Mordja posted:Aaaahhhh...a CSPAM poster, it all makes sense now. I feel like "yeah, it's bad that this character used a Nazi slogan" isn't a controversial statement. Do you really think any of my posts in this thread have been rude enough to warrant this? Reik fucked around with this message at 00:51 on Oct 11, 2021 |
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Oct 11, 2021 00:40
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Reik posted:While I agree 86 has been a pretty anti-fascist show so far, a likeable genocide committer saying actual Nazi slogans and has super powers because of her royal blood is definitely not part of their anti-fascist narrative. I don’t think there is any way you can say Frederica committed genocide. As she said the Legion was ordered to invade the rest of the continent 10 years ago. She is 10 years old so she would have been an infant at the time.
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Oct 11, 2021 00:56
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Speaking of that. The Giad royal family must have been in a pretty dire state if an Infant was the best choice for Empress.
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Oct 11, 2021 00:58
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They may explain this in an upcoming episode but the rest of the Giadan royal family got Romanov'd in the revolution. Frederica's the only one who survived.
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Oct 11, 2021 01:01
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MonsterEnvy posted:I don’t think there is any way you can say Frederica committed genocide. As she said the Legion was ordered to invade the rest of the continent 10 years ago. She is 10 years old so she would have been an infant at the time. I mean, she seems pretty willing to claim responsibility for it, and the revolution that overthrew her royal family is the only reason they stopped. I think the show 86 is still very good, I just think she's a bad addition to it.
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Oct 11, 2021 01:08
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Okay, this 10 year old is literal Hitler. Sorry for spoiling the LN everyone.
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Oct 11, 2021 01:10
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Of all the out-of-place super powered princesses in all of Japanese sicfi military anime, I think this one isn't particularly bad It's kind of a tired old trick, but the way her high minded aristocratic act is undermined/contrasted with the fact that she's a doofy little gremlin helps a lot Having the last surviving proxy of a genocidal imperialist regime be a dumb child trying to wrangle a legacy forged before she was born is p. good too. It'd be better if we were shown some bloodthirsty old revolutionaries who would still kill her if given a second chance, though.
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Oct 11, 2021 01:16
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Nitrousoxide posted:Okay, this 10 year old is literal Hitler. Sorry for spoiling the LN everyone. I'm sure she's one of the good people that uses the term "blood and soil" when telling someone how to live their life.
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Oct 11, 2021 01:32
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OnimaruXLR posted:Of all the out-of-place super powered princesses in all of Japanese sicfi military anime, I think this one isn't particularly bad Omnicidal. 
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Oct 11, 2021 01:39
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 The line from the LN translation, for reference
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Oct 11, 2021 03:15
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Seems like it was just a dumb word choice for the translation then.
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Oct 11, 2021 03:22
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Reik posted:I mean, she seems pretty willing to claim responsibility for it, and the revolution that overthrew her royal family is the only reason they stopped.
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Oct 11, 2021 03:52
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MonsterEnvy posted:Shin pointed out she was too young to claim responsibility for the Legion, and the revolution did not stop the Legion. I meant that it stopped the royal family from participating in it. I don't think we know why the Legion went haywire, do we?
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Oct 11, 2021 03:56
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Reik posted:I meant that it stopped the royal family from participating in it. I don't think we know why the Legion went haywire, do we? From how it appears. Giad Empire creates the Legion tells them to conquer the continent for the Empire and defeat it's enemies. Revolution happens and Empire is overthrown and replaced with a Federal Republic. The Legion having no masters now just continues on it's ordered path to conquer the continent, but evolves enough to figure out a way around it's built in shut down sequence.
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Oct 11, 2021 08:57
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MonsterEnvy posted:From how it appears. Giad Empire creates the Legion tells them to conquer the continent for the Empire and defeat it's enemies. Revolution happens and Empire is overthrown and replaced with a Federal Republic. The Legion having no masters now just continues on it's ordered path to conquer the continent, but evolves enough to figure out a way around it's built in shut down sequence. Watch them realize the solution to everyone’s problems is just getting Frederica to walk up to the Legion and say “I’m the empress please turn off.” We’ve all been overthinking this killer robot problem.
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Oct 11, 2021 09:17
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My understanding of the legion is it's less that they have a built in shut down sequence and more that they're all going to run out of gas
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Oct 11, 2021 09:21
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That doesn't really make sense though because then why would the ones with human brains not shut down, at best the better efficiency would just push the time table down right? But it's not an intentional kill switch so much as a flaw in the design
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Oct 11, 2021 09:23
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ninjewtsu posted:That doesn't really make sense though because then why would the ones with human brains not shut down, at best the better efficiency would just push the time table down right? But it's not an intentional kill switch so much as a flaw in the design From how it sounded, the primary Legion AI is based on a human brain scan that was purposefully degrading and after a certain point it would hit a point where it was useless and the Legion would not longer be able to function. However the Legion figured out that it could just replace the Brain Scan with new ones. This would both increase it's intelligence, and increase the time it could function. The Legion seem to operate based on the commands of the most intelligent type of Legion nearby. Which is why destroying a Shepard can temporarily cause disarray in the units.
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Oct 11, 2021 09:34
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Tarezax posted:
Thank you for this, it does seem like maybe the localizer had just heard the phrase recently because of all the Nazis running around today and wasn't aware of it's explicitly Nazi connotation.
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Oct 11, 2021 14:48
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Yeah I suspect that's exactly it. Like many fascist things it unfortunately sounds cool when removed from any context. Anyways season is starting strong so far. Agree with the others re: the sense of unreality in Giad. I'm really curious what exactly Lena was doing with the scientist lady that she was in such a rush to get to in the first episode. Looking forward to see what develops there. Also is it just me or are they making a big point of making the republic look even more physically decayed than before? If so, I appreciate that this show is not buying into the big lie that fascist societies are inherently more efficient: "Mussolini made the trains run on time" and all that.
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Oct 11, 2021 20:24
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Talorat posted:Yeah I suspect that's exactly it. Like many fascist things it unfortunately sounds cool when removed from any context. I think in particular Lena is researching how to further push the communication tech so she can be more aware of the tactical and strategic situations she's overseeing; or maybe extend the range so she can attempt to contact Shin's group in the hope they're still alive? As for seemingly more decayed, I remember from Speer's autobiography he and Hitler had aimed for a deliberately "decayed" look to their neoclassical architecture in order to make their "civilization" look older than it is; I wonder if that's part of it. Could be an extension of how the military is just extremely complacent because the war will win itself soon enough but that mindset maybe extended to the rest of society? Maybe they were so used to the 86 being their labour force?
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Oct 11, 2021 20:31
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Talorat posted:Yeah I suspect that's exactly it. Like many fascist things it unfortunately sounds cool when removed from any context. I feel like I should point out that the Republic is not actually fascist. It lacks far too many of Fascism's traits to be considered as such. The Republic is however extremely racist and genocidal and is just as bad as a fascist state.
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Oct 11, 2021 20:55
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San Magnolia is a tiny country that's been operating an isolated war economy for a couple years; from the very beginning the audience is informed that they're rationing critical resources through mention of diary substitutes for foodstuffs or visually by the relative absence of motor vehicles. It's worth remembering that their defensive posture isn't just complacency in eventual victory through attrition, but a consequence of their army getting the poo poo kicked out of them by Legion during the initial stages of the war. OTOH while we don't have a full picture of Giad (though the damaged buildings strewn here and there are a neat touch), they're nevertheless the successor state of the advanced nation that created the Legion in the first place, so it stands to reason they're in a more robust position economically and technologically - if their urban and industrial centers had been overrun then they'd have long since perished, so the revolutionary forces somehow managed to prevent that much at the very least, despite being near ground zero for Legion's expansion.
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Oct 11, 2021 21:05
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Conspiratiorist posted:San Magnolia is a tiny country that's been operating an isolated war economy for a couple years; from the very beginning the audience is informed that they're rationing critical resources through mention of diary substitutes for foodstuffs or visually by the relative absence of motor vehicles. It's worth remembering that their defensive posture isn't just complacency in eventual victory through attrition, but a consequence of their army getting the poo poo kicked out of them by Legion during the initial stages of the war. I wonder if perhaps that's because most of the Legion was probably in San Magnolia's territory when the revolution happened so Giad had a bit more breathing room to gather forces and create a front line?
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Oct 11, 2021 21:11
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Raenir Salazar posted:breathing room Do you want another derail?!
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Oct 11, 2021 23:18
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galagazombie posted:Watch them realize the solution to everyone’s problems is just getting Frederica to walk up to the Legion and say “I’m the empress please turn off.” We’ve all been overthinking this killer robot problem. Extreme novel spoilers from the latest book: Well, she has to go say it to the central control unit at the center of the swarm, but this is legitimately the solution presented as of the most recent novel. Somebody fucked around with this message at 21:20 on Oct 12, 2021 |
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Oct 11, 2021 23:36
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Something I wish the show hadn't skipped so far are the Legion POV sections. Those are kind of neat in establishing their way of thinking.
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Oct 11, 2021 23:38
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Nitrousoxide posted:Something I wish the show hadn't skipped so far are the Legion POV sections. Those are kind of neat in establishing their way of thinking. We got a few things like that.
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Oct 12, 2021 05:21
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K Prime posted:Extreme novel spoilers: Well, she has to go say it to the central control unit at the center of the swarm, but this is legitimately the solution presented as of the most recent novel. Latest book spoilers, don't read if you're partway through like me. Also never understood why people feel compelled to book spoil in these threads.
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Oct 12, 2021 20:27
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Yeah the only spoilers that should be allowed are for content that was cut that might provide context, stuff that hasn't happened yet and especially content that's several books away should not be in the thread for anime watchers.
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Oct 12, 2021 20:28
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Personally, I am ok with a single one sentence post that is marked "extreme novel spoilers" that presumably just directly answers a mystery raised and leaves everyone free to decide on if they should spoil themselves or not. Spoilers are really obnoxious if they're unmarked or if they become part of the discussion but as a "hey if you're curious here's a quick answer" I dont see the problem
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Oct 12, 2021 20:36
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it's an incredibly obvious place for the story to go, anyway.
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Oct 12, 2021 20:38
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Yeah the spoilers are fine, but they should probably be marked as "most recent novel spoilers" and we don't need a lengthy discussion about it'll either.
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Oct 12, 2021 21:17
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Do we have a separate thread for the novels?
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Oct 12, 2021 23:47
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Not currently. I had asked if people were interested back in cour 1 and there didn’t seem like much interest, but if at least a couple would like one now I’d be happy to make one.
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Oct 13, 2021 00:20
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86 - season 2 episode 2 The new opening song is bad. Sounds like one of the dozen forgettable MHA opening songs. This shot was pretty cool, though.  I also don't like how the OP implies that the robo dog gets resurrected. We already have a lack of stakes due how they burned through all of the fodders too quickly and then walked back the robo dog's and Shin's deaths. That other guy Shin met in the library having a little sister is so cliche. Can't it be a little brother for once? Episode was surprisingly above average up until the 10 year old girl started monologuing like an adult and lecturing the the president. Cringe. Lol Raiden tells the girl that he blames the Republic and hates their guts, which directly contradicts that episode from season 1 when Leina asked why the 86s would still fight for the Republic and they said they had no beef. Would be interesting if the Republic and the Federacy got into a war, with Republican 86s facing off against the Spearhead legends and Federacy soldiers.
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Oct 13, 2021 09:12
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Moofia Boss Val posted:Lol Raiden tells the girl that he blames the Republic and hates their guts, which directly contradicts that episode from season 1 when Leina asked why the 86s would still fight for the Republic and they said they had no beef. well in between he learned violent revolution was an option and that can make someone reevaluate some stuff
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Oct 13, 2021 11:22
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well, hating the republic was pointless when they were war slaves. there was no escape, and even choosing death just meant that they'd drag down their comrades. so, there might have been some mental gymnastics going on to justify it to themselves.
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Oct 13, 2021 11:50
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Moofia Boss Val posted:86 - season 2 episode 2 Spearhead just spent weeks seeing exactly how insane and unnecessary their treatment by San Magnolia was, simply by living in a country that doesn't do any of that stuff and seems to be doing rather better against the Legion. That seems like a reason to shift from acceptance to rage.
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Oct 13, 2021 12:11
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