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site posted:that's fair and actually ties in to the post i was here to make already, which is why does "god" even have a fake hulk persona to gently caress with people tied a certain type of radiation in a universe with 12 Satans i mean it has been directly referenced with the whole Qlippoth allusions casting the one below all as an angra mainyu-like persona since at least IH 15 or so
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Oct 14, 2021 04:42
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A big flaming stink posted:i mean it has been directly referenced with the whole Qlippoth allusions casting the one below all as an angra mainyu-like persona since at least IH 15 or so I have no idea what any of this means and I’ve read the entire run. What are qlippoth allusions and how is OBA like Angra Mainyu specifically?
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Oct 14, 2021 05:17
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Nilbop posted:I have no idea what any of this means and I’ve read the entire run. What are qlippoth allusions and how is OBA like Angra Mainyu specifically? the qlippoth is the dark reflection of the sefirot in jewish kabbalah, and similarly, angra mainyu is the destructive reflection of the keter is the divine will working in unison, and its reflection in the qlippoth, thaumiel, is working against each other in disharmony. the one below all isnt Ultra Satan, it's the destructive force inherently bound up in the creative force. e: all that said i will agree it was kind of weak to have bruce be essentially MIA for the entire climax A big flaming stink fucked around with this message at 08:45 on Oct 14, 2021 |
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Oct 14, 2021 05:25
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If Kirby was the actual god of the Marvel Universe, would that make Spider-Man hellspawn, and does that explain Mephisto's obsession with him? I didn't mind the religious stuff in the Hulk finale because if you're looking to humanize an all-knowing all-powerful creator deity then him having a Hulk to explain all the pain and suffering in the universe makes a fair amount of Marvel Universe sense, along with the idea that sometimes you have to be willing to conscientiously not flip out and smash poo poo in order to prevent things from getting worse. That kinda philosophical moralistic poo poo normally makes my eyes roll pretty hard but considering the story had committed 100% to the metaphysical angle at that point, I felt it had earned it. I mean, having Hulk be a spiritual creature with one foot in the afterlife isn't any weirder to me than mutants being the result of a couple of random dice rolls by the Celestials. It's actually a lot more interesting than that, at least to me, because the Celestials might look cool but gently caress are they boring
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Oct 14, 2021 11:01
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Jackie got green optic blasts. Rad. I'm mostly satisfied with the finale, just a shame they put all the toys back into the box, and would have liked more wrap-up for the Devil Hulk persona.
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Oct 14, 2021 11:49
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Overall, I liked ending of Immortal Hulk, though I agree with many of the critiques, and wasn't as satisfied with it as I'd hoped to be. That said, I feel confident it will be so much better than whatever is going on here in the upcoming run. 
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Oct 14, 2021 15:48
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Smashtronaut is the future of all Marvel titles.
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Oct 14, 2021 18:18
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OnimaruXLR posted:Reading this week's ASM has got me thinking, have there been a lot of solo superheros who operate with what amounts to a pit crew? I know that Iron Man can resemble that in certain runs, and that's kind of what the original Canary/Oracle Birds of Prey was on some level, but it's a dynamic I don't think is used too often which is weird because it provides a pretty elegantly built-in supporting cast along with allowing you to have protagonists who don't have to be omnicompetent polymaths capable of doing literally everything I think early Moon Knight had some of that, of course like half the pit crew were MK's various secret identities, but there was also Frenchie and that homeless guy and the cafe owner and others.
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Oct 14, 2021 18:38
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does squirrel girl's team fall under that category
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Oct 14, 2021 18:49
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Skwirl posted:I think early Moon Knight had some of that, of course like half the pit crew were MK's various secret identities, but there was also Frenchie and that homeless guy and the cafe owner and others. there's a later period where Moon Knight has a "shadow cabinet" of experts to consult about their areas of expertise but it's the era where Frenchie is possessed by a crusades knight and there's demons all over the place so everybody sort of pretends it never happened.
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Oct 14, 2021 19:02
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site posted:does squirrel girl's team fall under that category I was thinking the same, but I don't think they count as a pit crew if they join you out in the fight. So not even Gwenpool's team counts under that umbrella. X-Force has some of that going on with Sage staying behind and being the "[wo]man in a chair" to paraphrase Spider-Man: Homecoming.
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Oct 14, 2021 19:49
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Bruno and Ms Marvel?
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Oct 14, 2021 20:07
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How about Hellcat and that secretary in the She-Hulk run, where she actually gets to lawyering.
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Oct 14, 2021 21:28
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ewing's new/usavengers had aim? black widow has a couple of people who work primarily at her home base in the current book
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Oct 14, 2021 21:41
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Speaking of, since I don't remember the ending very well, what happened to AIM? They're probably back to being supervillains again, but I really liked them under Roberto and was kind of hoping that would stick around a bit.
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Oct 15, 2021 00:32
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Gologle posted:Speaking of, since I don't remember the ending very well, what happened to AIM? They're probably back to being supervillains again, but I really liked them under Roberto and was kind of hoping that would stick around a bit. It visibly splintered into a bunch of different factions at the end of U.S. Avengers. Many of them went with Toni Ho to form a new, benevolent organization called RESCUE, but just as many formed their own evil-science three-letter acronym groups.
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Oct 15, 2021 00:50
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most of the ones under roberto defected to nazi cap during secret empire. so, one more mark against that event. lately they've been in orchis crowd scenes.
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Oct 15, 2021 00:50
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Sunspot must be so disappointed right now, if he wasn't drowning in space money and bird waifu
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Oct 15, 2021 01:17
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it's very likely that either no one told him about orchis or they did and he wasn't paying attention.
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Oct 15, 2021 03:04
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Jiro posted:Also it's been a while but the whole possessed Hulk entity at the end of time/universe killing Franklin, was that ever concluded? Circling back on this now I've had a chance to read and digest #50 The future where TOBA-possessed Hulk becomes the last thing in the cosmos and devours Metatron only really existed in Sterns' head. It was meant as a warning from the residents of the ninth (last?) cosmos about what would happen if TOBA could destroy Bruce's soul, but it was a call to action for Sterns. As a sidenote I did like how the reveal that TOBA is TOAA's Hulk means that he is literally consumed by his own rage. In #50 McGee asks what if it's not over and Hulk reminds her that Sterns said all the green doors were closed and locked. From that I took that the threat of TOBA is off the table for now at least. Overall I liked the issue even if it seemed in a bit of a rush to wrap everything up. At the end was that Walt in Doc Samson's body? I got a bit lost with some of the body swapping. I hugely enjoyed the run as a whole, it really elevated Hulk as a character for me and even got me to dive back into old Tales to Astonish so I could read more about the gamma family that Ewing was pulling from. I doubt I'll be able to read all 600+ issues of Hulk history but I'll definitely be taking a look at some of the bigger runs on the character.
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Oct 15, 2021 08:37
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So having read IH #50, I really liked it. (Content Warning. Child death.) Yeah some of the plot threads from the series didn't get resolved (the end of the Universe, Brian Banner) and the Sterns family stuff was cool but should have been in the series earlier, but overall it really resonated with me. The idea that the finale wasn't Hulk smashing, but Hulk yelling at God about why bad stuff happened really hit deep with me. So I always loved Greg Pak's run on Hulk. But I was disappointed with the ending to Planet Hulk/World War Hulk because the conflict was built on the idea that it was Reed Richards fault that the ship he sent the Hulk into space blew up and destroyed Skaar. And at the end of WWH they resolve it by saying that Miek was the one who sabotaged the ship and that's why it blew up. Simply so Hulk would have someone he could smash. I always felt a better ending would have been that the Survivors of Skaar just went along with Hulk's idea that someone was to blame rather than have to sit with the idea that accidents can happen. And unless you blame God, you can't find someone to get angry at. This ending to Hulk felt like it was touching on this idea of "Man raging at his Creator for all his pain" that I've been smashing to read all these years. The conclusion also hit home for personal reasons. Two years ago my daughter was still-born. And it hurt. A lot. I was devastated. I still am. Many days I'm okay, some days I'm just not. One thing my mind keeps going back to is whose fault it is. And you look at and analysis the situation and you try and figure out what could have been done differently or if there is someone to blame. And if you don't have anyone to be angry at, you try and visualize a system or deity just for someone to blame. And having read up on this, I understand that the idea is that anger is a human response that we turn to because it makes us feel powerful in the face of chaos or powerlessness. We turn to it because when we are angry we feel strong or righteous or whatever. But it let's us act (or more often, lash out.) However when we are angry like that, very often we end up hurting ourselves and others. Like the Hulk does. This ending acknowledged all that, but also acknowledged that the other use for strength is mercy. Forgiveness. And how even forgiveness can be a way of applying mercy and forgiveness to yourself as much as others. So yeah, I got a whole lot of thinking to deal with as a result of that ending. For the Left Hand is Strength. But the Right Hand is Mercy will stay with me a long time. On another note, they decided in this series that Gamma Energy is from Hell and makes you go to super double Hell. They also decided that Cosmic Energy is the opposite of Gamma Energy. So is that why the Fantastic Four were able to go to Heaven to bring Ben Grimm back from the dead that one time? Al Ewing FF book? About having them explore the Heavens could be a good look.
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Oct 17, 2021 15:46
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I'm really sorry you had to go through that but I'm glad you could find some solace in the book. I think the future and Brian Banner were both as resolved as Devil Hulk. Brian's soul was annihilated by the Leader. He's not just dead, he's super dead. As for the future of the World Breaker, it happened and the fly sent back in time gave the Leader foreknowledge and so now that timeline has been averted.
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Oct 17, 2021 15:51
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Rainbow Rowell's writing She Hulk https://twitter.com/Marvel/status/1450168959462948877 I thought she did a great job with Runaways, so I'm looking forward to this one.
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Oct 18, 2021 20:01
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Is she staying in her more monster form? I liked it. It also made some people very mad.
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Oct 18, 2021 22:21
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I never got far into the new Runaways series, but what little I read of it was pretty good. I'm looking forward to her take on She-Hulk! 
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Oct 18, 2021 22:42
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Azubah posted:Is she staying in her more monster form? I liked it. I never minded super shredded mega muscle She Hulk, but her being a monosyllabic rage monster is like taking Batgirl and making her an angsty billionaire orphan Spin-off oughta be different. There's a reason that Lauraverine doesn't go around in cowboy boots and flannel drinking beer non-stop.
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Oct 18, 2021 23:01
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I'm ready for She-Hulk to get back to where she was as the fun Hulk. This will also better match her MCU appearance too, I bet.
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Oct 18, 2021 23:02
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Muscular She-Hulk's days were numbered as soon as Disney greenlit a TV show for her. Sassy, sexy Ally McBeal Hulk is that was always going to be. And to be fair it's also a better character - I don't really think Aaron did much to differentiate She-Hulk from Hulk in his Avengers run (aside from the Thor romance) and I don't think anybody else has significantly used her recently, have they?
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Oct 18, 2021 23:33
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JordanKai posted:I never got far into the new Runaways series, but what little I read of it was pretty good. I'm looking forward to her take on She-Hulk! It was amazing up until the last issue that failed to wrap up or explain anything that had been building for nearly 40 issues, because that's how post-BKV/Alphona Runaways rolls.
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Oct 18, 2021 23:48
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i haven't read a lot of monster she hulk but i liked her in the war of the realms stuff she was in still, if there's one medium that constantly undoes change, it's comics
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Oct 18, 2021 23:59
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Didn’t they undo some of the monster hulk part of her during her short death / visit to hulk hell when leader sends her back to life.
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Oct 19, 2021 00:04
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I believe she's still a very bulky Red She-Hulk in Avengers at the moment, but I haven't kept up in a while. A number of series have also actively disregarded Aaron's take on Jen, like Captain Marvel and Empyre. To me, the worst thing about the current incarnation of She-Hulk isn't that she has become a cheap Incredible Hulk replacement--I think Aaron has wrung some decent stories out of it. It's far worse that the She-Hulk run which directly preceded Aaron's Avengers already dealt with the concept of a monster She-Hulk and very definitely closed the door on it by the end of the story. To relitigate that idea immediately afterwards always smacked me as a bad idea, but for what it's worth the excecution could've been far worse.
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Oct 19, 2021 00:37
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Letting her be a MCU style Hulk while Bruce was busy with Immortal Hulk wasn’t a bad idea. It’s probably getting wrapped next issue regardless.
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Oct 19, 2021 00:47
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:Didn’t they undo some of the monster hulk part of her during her short death / visit to hulk hell when leader sends her back to life. iirc that was all a long con by the Cotati who killed her then worked her body like a meat puppet. When she came back she was still monster hulk.
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Oct 19, 2021 01:05
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TwoPair posted:iirc that was all a long con by the Cotati who killed her then worked her body like a meat puppet. When she came back she was still monster hulk. Ewing did a one-shot explaining that Empyre, Secret War 2 and the original incident with the blood transfusion were all real deal deaths for Jennifer, but the Green Door let her come back. Aaron, to be fair, did try and cover some legitimate arguments for her being more like the 'traditional' Hulk in his Avengers, pointing out that society loves to de-legitimise female anger or police women's bodies and appearance, so there's an element of bias in preferring the 'fun' She-Hulk because it's arguable that's because it's more comfortable to have a more conventionally 'pretty' Hulk who doesn't yell or smash and is calm and articulate. But you can also argue that the reverse is true, that pretending that being socialised differently would still mean that women express anger in literally the same way as men is very patriarchal, as if that's the only way to view that feeling. Basically, poo poo is complicated, yo.
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Oct 19, 2021 01:34
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I was going to say does She hulk need a back to basics approach but apparently yes
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Oct 19, 2021 01:43
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Yes and no. The only person that’s really been using her since Aaron took over is Aaron, and there just isn’t space to grow the character in that direction in a team book while also cramming in all the crazy stuff Aaron wants in there. I will say that Big Jen has felt like she earns her spot on The Big Team in a way that Ally McGreen almost certainly wouldn’t.
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Oct 19, 2021 02:00
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Gaz-L posted:Ewing did a one-shot explaining that Empyre, Secret War 2 and the original incident with the blood transfusion were all real deal deaths for Jennifer, but the Green Door let her come back. I remember back during the Slott run, Jen mentions during a trial proceeding at one point that she'd died twice. I always wondered which occasions Slott meant to be referencing. She was one of the characters who got definitively merked by Thanos in Infinity Gauntlet, I know that much.
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Oct 19, 2021 02:12
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there's always a place for the hulk who has her poo poo together. even the more monstrous version of she hulk is still more stable than any version of her cousin.
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Oct 19, 2021 03:38
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I largely agree. I've always liked the idea that gamma energy isn't about anger, it's about repression, it lets your latent inner turmoil surface. The bomb didn't turn Bruce into a rage monster, it just let everyone else see it. The most common version of She-Hulk can be read as her confidence or self-image issues or struggles with what was expected of her. She was meant to be shy, quiet 'good' girl so she becomes this boisterous outspoken sexually liberated green lady that you can't ignore or tell what to do Gaz-L fucked around with this message at 03:49 on Oct 19, 2021 |
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Oct 19, 2021 03:45
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