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no you see kicking out an ardent zionist will split the palestine solidarity movement I swear
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Dec 3, 2021 07:21
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Pentecoastal Elites posted:this is one of the dumbest loving things I've ever read, holy poo poo. embarrassed to have ever been associated with this dogshit loser org. I think that people in denial about the lack of left-wing power instead decide that the left axiomatically *must* have allies in positions of power. The idea that there aren't members of Congress who are allies to the left is basically something they reject as inherently absurd. Basically in the absence of left-wing allies with power, they just choose to live under the delusion that non-allies are actually allies.
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Dec 3, 2021 08:21
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Ytlaya posted:I think that people in denial about the lack of left-wing power instead decide that the left axiomatically *must* have allies in positions of power. The idea that there aren't members of Congress who are allies to the left is basically something they reject as inherently absurd. this is because they, as squishy libs, cannot accept the truth that the US government itself is evil, and should be opposed.
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Dec 3, 2021 08:29
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Every loving time, it happens every loving time, socialists always loving themselves over.
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Dec 3, 2021 08:37
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Al-Saqr posted:Every loving time, it happens every loving time, socialists always loving themselves over. well it doesnt help when you read all the theory and then do the exact opposite of what they outlined because you're a special snowflake
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Dec 3, 2021 19:39
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that Marx guy never considered that I’m trying to get a nice comfortable job with whatever dem outfit arises to suck the left sentiment out of their voting base and safely discharge it into clapback tweets
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Dec 3, 2021 20:44
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The dsa is trash join the CPUSA
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Dec 4, 2021 00:56
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Top City Homo posted:The dsa is trash join the CPUSA I guess at least that solves the awkward "are they or aren't they" question on if local leadership are feds
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Dec 4, 2021 01:16
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CaptainACAB posted:well it doesnt help when you read all the theory and then do the exact opposite of what they outlined because you're a special snowflake I think it really is difficult to make people want to commit to the necessary lifestyle change apopros a cosmic and dramatic drop in quality of life. Everything I've seen in the last year and a half indicates that the critical mass in the US isn't there for like, true marxist organizing that's going to actually overcome all the forces pivoted against it.
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Dec 4, 2021 01:16
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CaptainACAB posted:The DSA is a useless and suicidal movement that is dedicated to fragmenting and diluting the left. It has no ideology, no discipline, no structure and is generally in every way an organization not fit for purpose. Lenin specifically warned against leaderless, orderless organizations like this and the DSA did it anyway, almost like they wanted to fail. The only purpose for the DSA is to join it and poach it's members to actual useful Marxist-leninist organizations. It was a mistake for The democratic socialists of America, an organization that doubled in size in 2016, to not follow the ideas of Lenin. Maybe leftism is inherently hard to organize. Growing an organization of organizers means most of the people who join have ideas on how it should be run and the ability to start their own thing if they dislike it. Golden Bee has issued a correction as of 02:05 on Dec 4, 2021 |
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Dec 4, 2021 02:02
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Riot Bimbo posted:I think it really is difficult to make people want to commit to the necessary lifestyle change apopros a cosmic and dramatic drop in quality of life. Everything I've seen in the last year and a half indicates that the critical mass in the US isn't there for like, true marxist organizing that's going to actually overcome all the forces pivoted against it. the lifestyle drop precipitates the political change, not the other way around. the critical mass will come only when things get bad enough -- which will happen, but maybe not before we're well and truly beyond any hope of an even nominally-livable biosphere.
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Dec 4, 2021 02:06
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for an org that's doubled in size, why has its growth in power not been commensurate? because it funneled all that growth and new blood into a big fat nothing, sat on it, and b uried the corpse. it may not be an ideological failing but it sure is a loving failure.
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Dec 4, 2021 02:06
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CPUSA maintain fraternal relations with the CPC so when this country goes all Mad Max they’ll be the ones who get the J20s and T99s to wreck everyone else
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Dec 4, 2021 02:45
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fermun posted:not actually related to your post but it reminded me and is somewhat tangential and i wanted to post it as it is one of the main criticisms from liberals (not calling you one), DSA did a poll of members in the weeks leading up to the convention and did find that while DSA is absurdly white, it is actually very representative of the nation in terms of income breakdown. Interesting. Do you have the poll on how many members are white?
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Dec 4, 2021 02:54
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You'd still expect a socialist party to skew heavily working class, so it's still a massive failure in my eyes.
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Dec 4, 2021 04:21
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Best Friends posted:I guess at least that solves the awkward "are they or aren't they" question on if local leadership are feds all the feds are focused on fomenting stochastic informant led white militia terrorism or using informants to frame mentally disabled Muslim men in the act of terrorism its a golden opportunity for getting rid of the old cpusa morons and putting in fresh blood
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Dec 4, 2021 04:23
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ToxicAcne posted:You'd still expect a socialist party to skew heavily working class, so it's still a massive failure in my eyes. Way to move those goalposts comrade
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Dec 4, 2021 06:27
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ToxicAcne posted:You'd still expect a socialist party to skew heavily working class, so it's still a massive failure in my eyes. what do you think working class means?
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Dec 4, 2021 06:43
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Golden Bee posted:It was a mistake for The democratic socialists of America, an organization that doubled in size in 2016, to not follow the ideas of Lenin. Trump made that happen. Thank Trump, not the DSA "doing the right thing".
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Dec 4, 2021 07:45
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Ytlaya posted:I think that people in denial about the lack of left-wing power instead decide that the left axiomatically *must* have allies in positions of power. The idea that there aren't members of Congress who are allies to the left is basically something they reject as inherently absurd. It boggles my mind that we can't just go "Yeah we'll work with Bowman on the GND stuff he's pushing, but he crossed a major uncrossable line and as such he can't be a member" That isn't even getting to the details that the Lower Hudson Valley chapter which initially endorsed him (and dropped the ball imo when they didn't see how clearly anti-BDS he was when looking at his campaign statements) were left in the dark with this decision from the NPC. I'm going to blame it on the Socialist Majority Caucus, Green New Deal Slate, and B&R members for being absolutely the jellyfish spined cowards that want to have political staffer gigs or are just that deluded enough to believe this theory of change bullshit.
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Dec 4, 2021 08:08
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punk rebel ecks posted:Interesting. Do you have the poll on how many members are white? I did a few quick searches but couldn't find it, it's from the member survey pre-convention though. Riot Bimbo posted:for an org that's doubled in size, why has its growth in power not been commensurate? my local chapter alone has accomplished more in the last 5 years than any socialist organization other than SAlt has in the last 40.
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Dec 4, 2021 10:51
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Golden Bee posted:It was a mistake for The democratic socialists of America, an organization that doubled in size in 2016, to not follow the ideas of Lenin. Nah this poo poo is just diluting the effort of the left and leaving it eternally fractious, undisciplined and unprepared. The only use for the DSA is to pillage it of good members and contacts. As Lenin himself did to the succdems in Russia prior to the revolution.
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Dec 4, 2021 10:56
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jarofpiss posted:what do you think working class means? If you can't attract people disproportionately from the lower end of the pay scale, then I don't know what to say. Sure some NGO rear end in a top hat is technically working class because they work for a wage, but nobody is going to miss them if they go on strike. poo poo even the social democratic parties in their heyday could do better than that. Also it seems like DSA leadership is full of the same lame rear end lanyards who ruin everything else. That Honda Wang rear end in a top hat thinks that selling out the Palestinians is the pragmatic working class decision. Edit: I guess Palestinian solidarity alienates the working class but Jazz hands don't. ToxicAcne has issued a correction as of 15:16 on Dec 4, 2021 |
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Dec 4, 2021 15:14
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fermun posted:NPC has finished the deliberation on whether to expel Jamaal Bowman How are the chapters taking this? It seemed (at least online) that expelling bowman was popular among some of the smaller chapters.
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Dec 4, 2021 17:22
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ToxicAcne posted:Edit: I guess Palestinian solidarity alienates the working class but Jazz hands don't. AnimeIsTrash posted:How are the chapters taking this? It seemed (at least online) that expelling bowman was popular among some of the smaller chapters. Beyond that I don't know what to do personally since my chapter is good despite what dipshit lanyards like Duhalde and Honda think because we "lost" Summer Lee despite the fact she left the chapter after people on facebook gave her minor criticism and also her campaign manager Dan Moraff being a slimy careerist. DSA electeds need to be less federal AND also people who join 2 weeks before a deadline to get an endorsement.
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Dec 4, 2021 17:54
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start purging bowman and you won’t stop until you’re a nice trim marcyite org. npc made the right call, put him on notice he won’t be re-endorsed without a change of course and move on
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Dec 4, 2021 20:02
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DOCTOR ZIMBARDO posted:put him on notice he won’t be re-endorsed without a change of course
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Dec 4, 2021 20:23
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R. Mute posted:lol oh no
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Dec 4, 2021 20:58
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i wouldn't have minded bowman being purged but what actually needs to happen is oversight and pressure on the people and chapters who endorsed bowman in the first place, since bowman never even pretended to be pro-bds. the npc letter implies this will be happening but doesn't go into detail so i don't know what that will look like or if it's even real
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Dec 4, 2021 21:10
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achillesforever6 posted:Thing is Honda and the B&R would say both do when they are both don't in fact alienate the working class, being obssessed with M4A and GND canvassing and sneering at helping the communities directly in fact alienate the working class. what
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Dec 4, 2021 21:16
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honda wang is a minor tiktok personality who often proclaims the views of dsa's "bread and roses" caucus
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Dec 4, 2021 21:22
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Top City Homo posted:The dsa is trash join the CPUSA The DSA was a great "though experiment" since it really reaffirms Lenin's criticism and mockery of socialist reform movements.
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Dec 4, 2021 21:24
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Folks if any of you thought succdems would ever be on your side idk what to say beyond lol. Lmao.
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Dec 4, 2021 23:01
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I thought the statement was okay. I'm irritated that Bowman's local didn't get them to fit BDS support before endorsing. If Bowman keeps withholding support for BDS, disendorsment, then censuring, then expulsion as a last resort should be pursued. I'm only inclined to give Bowman this leeway for now as the platform was not in place until the most recent convention and international positions hadn't been fully hammered out and agreed upon. National DSA politics still feel far away from our small west-coast chapter. We are prefer to focus on municipal issues and build power from there so we can exert real power on elected folks because they've been built along with our organization. DSA is still young as a national organization of appreciable size so this seems like natural growing pains. Also, wtf are folks mad about an old convention where folks used the d/hh clap? Have people really never seen that before?
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Dec 5, 2021 00:23
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ralph wiggum saying im building power
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Dec 5, 2021 00:29
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I'm putting you on notice, continue actively supporting and funding genocide and you're looking at a demerit, mister man!
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Dec 5, 2021 00:34
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R. Mute posted:ralph wiggum saying im building power
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Dec 5, 2021 01:24
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we didn't officially condemn genocide until after his endorsement so it's actually fine
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Dec 5, 2021 01:25
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It's pretty hard for the DSA to enforce any discipline among their members when their structure is built up specifically to avoid that because they are what Lenin called artesinal socialists. The DSA has done a great job modeling themselves after what Lenin said in What is to be done, it's just that they modelled themselves off the party Lenin spends half the book criticizing.
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Dec 5, 2021 01:49
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CaptainACAB posted:It's pretty hard for the DSA to enforce any discipline among their members when their structure is built up specifically to avoid that because they are what Lenin called artesinal socialists. “Members can be expelled if they are found to be in substantial disagreement with the principles or policies of the organization or if they consistently engage in undemocratic, disruptive behavior or if they are under the discipline of any self-defined democratic-centralist organization.” the only principle or policy explicitly stated as a reason for expulsion is to have ever been a member of an organization that could get anything done. genocide isn’t in substantial disagreement with the principles or policies of DSA though.
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Dec 5, 2021 01:53
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