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Mercrom posted:I'm very ignorant about this topic. Is there anything radical or feminist about TERFs or are they just transphobes who don't also hate cis women. now of course if you realize genitalia doesn't define a person, that whole thing is silly. but there are a lot of actual old 2nd-wavey feminists who see the penis moving into spaces 'they fought for'. to them it doesn't matter anything else besides the fight against the penis. in an extremely hosed up and weird perverse sense, you can almost kind of see the sad pathway that led to it. or rather you can see that it's sad that they've been blinded by raw genitalia determinism that they can't see the greater social structures associated with oppression that have nothing to do with a penis. of course 'terf' gets thrown out as much as 'grift' and has lost a lot of meaning. many people called terfs are just transphobes and it seems dumb to apply it as freely as it has been.
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Dec 15, 2021 07:54
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*hot takeishly* Janice Raymond was right about the medical empire distilling gender down to a medical procedure and being very lovely and sexist (as of 1970 whatever), but being the Mother TERF blames it on the wrong people (trans people) and we've all been suffering since. (don't read transsexual empire)
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Dec 15, 2021 09:03
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tokin opposition posted:*hot takeishly* Janice Raymond was right about the medical empire distilling gender down to a medical procedure and being very lovely and sexist (as of 1970 whatever), but being the Mother TERF blames it on the wrong people (trans people) do you have a page citation for this, out of curiosity? e: like i'm genuinely not trying to be a jerk or anything, i'm gonna need to read the transsexual empire for my MA thesis and that sounds like a good way to approach it for my uses Arivia has issued a correction as of 09:29 on Dec 15, 2021 |
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Dec 15, 2021 09:06
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could it be that the patriarchy is based on hierarchical power structures rather than physical biology and that genitalia is irrelevant to the forces that oppress women? no it is the transpeople who are wrong
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Dec 15, 2021 09:14
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you could replace transpeople there with third wave feminists and still be accurate in regards to the second wave btw
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Dec 15, 2021 09:15
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What gets me about terfs is that most of their arguments, especially irt trans women and their supposed risk that they present to cis "women and girls" (their fun way of insinuating that trans women are pedophiles), is that their arguments are essentially based on the same homophobic and racist rhetoric of the "invader" who seeks to harm both woman and child that was used to justify discriminating against all non straight or non white people Which makes even more sense when you realise alot of terfs are white, middle aged women with the memory of a goldfish Not even getting into their views on trans men as being "poor lost and confused lesbians seduced by the trans craze"
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Dec 15, 2021 09:23
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Some Guy TT posted:could it be that the patriarchy is based on hierarchical power structures rather than physical biology and that genitalia is irrelevant to the forces that oppress women? A pretty common theme is that people are trained to ignore and accept existing power structures and instead blame the resulting oppression on ultimately arbitrary factors Especially given how terfs are p universally well-off white people
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Dec 15, 2021 09:26
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Arivia posted:do you have a page citation for this, out of curiosity? uuuuuuuuh no sorry, it's been years. She talks about it all through the book, you'll find it pretty quickly once you get started. Just be aware that she's very vicious, even as a seasonsed TERF reader it can be nasty.
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Dec 15, 2021 10:26
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tokin opposition posted:uuuuuuuuh no sorry, it's been years. She talks about it all through the book, you'll find it pretty quickly once you get started. Just be aware that she's very vicious, even as a seasonsed TERF reader it can be nasty. No worries, thank you!
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Dec 15, 2021 10:30
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tokin opposition posted:If you ever want to see a TERF get mad, claim that only trans women are women. Cis 'women' are just victims of a patriarchical society forced to confine themselves into a narrowly defined gender role based on genitalia. Only trans people can truly claim to have worked for a gender identity. It's more likely that a given cis person is closeted trans than a given trans person is secretly cis. If you want men out of women's bathrooms, it would be more effective to ban cis women than trans women. 
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Dec 15, 2021 13:09
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https://twitter.com/heraldleader/status/1471155911133704197?s=21 not nice
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Dec 15, 2021 18:27
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Unfortunately, because of my attempt to articulate my gender critical beliefs, I now find myself without a company and without an Orlando. I stand accused of transphobia, which is damaging to the trans community, to women and to me and my reputation as an artist. But I must defend myself, defend my views and stand with the other, incredibly brave women and men who are speaking out against this dangerous ideology. The oppression of women is based entirely on our biology and our reproductive rights and vulnerabilities. We embody our oppression and our strength. I feel this powerfully in my own body. A dancer’s body, but also a woman’s body; a body that has been raped, assaulted, attacked, strangled, knocked out and abused. My body has been in deep pain, physical and mental. My body has been a victim, that has scars running deep — on my scalp and in my soul. But it is also a body that has created, nurtured and given life. A body that coped with pregnancy, that survived an emergency birth, and then breastfed an infant until he was 30 months. A body of beauty, miracle, love and care. A body that sat in local cafes, shamed me with my bursting boobs, leaking nipples and abundant health. A body that was met, even as an infant suckled, with tuts and looks from by passers — the old judging my openness, the young unable to see boobs as anything but sex objects. I sat there, ashamed but not understanding why until I realised that I felt like an an animal. I was an animal. It shocked me. I couldn’t identify out of my life-giving properties. I couldn’t pretend I wasn’t female; I was a woman, a mother, a life giver, yet I wasn’t respected or liked or even tolerated because of it. Something changed in me. Something deep, and I became braver, fiercer, angry even, about how badly women are treated. And it certainly wasn’t just me — it was all my friends, all those forceps births, split and cut vaginas, c-sections, dangerous births, the refusal to give any kind of painkillers, husbands and partners banned from the birthing room. And then there is the aftermath: the refusal to learn your baby’s name. The infantilising of you and your body and your baby, despite being a grown-up professional woman. I felt like I was 10 years old and being told off. The moment of sheer relief when one midwife treated you and your body with respect and compassion. Often the most overworked and exhausted of women who still hung onto a modicum of love and respect for our bodies and babies. This body, my body, it’s been through so much. But it is a dancing body, a body with more to give and to learn than ever before. My body is why I challenge the belief that we are walking meat sacks. How can it be that we are just flesh, blood, fluids, nerves, muscles, bones. That we are nothing alive, we have nothing to feel, nothing to give pleasure. It is this sort of “transhumanistic philosophy”, that we are merely a brain homunculus behind two jiggling eyes, which is the destroyer of women, of our innate power in the universe, of our understanding that we are mammals, we live on a finite planet, we eat and we poo poo and we make love and we birth babies and we orgasm and we feel pain and we feel hurt and some of it is from outside of us and some it we invent inside ourselves. We only have this life, this existence and this time on this planet. We cannot invent a new planet, we cannot pretend we do not exist, we cannot pretend our bodies are not ours. We are more than the sum of our parts, we are our bodies, minds and consciousnesses. We are only just now starting to truly understand the connectivity between our minds, bodies, nature and the planet. So I say no to the new puritans, the sex deniers and the body snatchers. No to erasure of my sex, no to erasure of my boundaries and my safety. You are asking far, far too much and we know it. We must, and always must, state our truth of our own existence.
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Dec 18, 2021 00:32
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Very normal poo poo
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Dec 18, 2021 00:35
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Ash Crimson posted:Very normal poo poo honestly it is, to claim your trauma as your essence, to say you are the scars. deeply hosed up ofc
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Dec 18, 2021 15:32
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Brain Candy posted:honestly it is, to claim your trauma as your essence, to say you are the scars. deeply hosed up ofc Im dumb are you being serious or sarcastic
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Dec 18, 2021 15:47
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gender critical: female is a category that exists and is defined by blood and horror. which of course is then justified by a mystical life generating experience, because that has to be worth it somehow. which in turn grossly distills an entire life down to a womb 'oh i've been treated like a thing? well i'll show, you, i'll like it!' even the dancer thing is about being treated as an object, an object of desire. it's all so stunted
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Dec 18, 2021 15:47
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Ash Crimson posted:Im dumb are you being serious or sarcastic like if you get hit by a car and it breaks your spine, it is super common to be defined by that event in your own head ever after. it's 'normal' in that people do it all the time, it's hosed up in that it's not good for you or anyone else
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Dec 18, 2021 15:52
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Brain Candy posted:like if you get hit by a car and it breaks your spine, it is super common to be defined by that event in your own head ever after. it's 'normal' in that people do it all the time, it's hosed up in that it's not good for you or anyone else True Heres another definitely normal thing https://twitter.com/SydneyLWatson/status/1471683537346744325?t=8-ImTp2TxnUR9tqDK-ZWtQ&s=19
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Dec 18, 2021 22:02
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Ash Crimson posted:True That's some low effort tomboyery right there smdh
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Dec 18, 2021 23:20
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TERFs do not know what "tomboy" means (a proper tomboy wouldn't have such a nicely kept manicure, she'd at the very least have chipped it while fixing her bike or something, much to the annoyance of her mother). I saw one trying to insist that JK Rowling is gender non-conforming because she's very wealthy. That exact same person in the picture very definitely freaks the gently caress out if she sees a young man with pink hair or painted nails, and goes straight to MumsNet or somewhere to talk about how she can't avoid the trans menace, they're everywhere.
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Dec 19, 2021 00:05
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tokin opposition posted:That's some low effort tomboyery right there smdh just needs a skateboard 'how do you do, fellow tomboys'
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Dec 19, 2021 00:32
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Ash Crimson posted:True clean your loving mirror
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Dec 19, 2021 02:00
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Ash Crimson posted:True It's true. I am forced to take estrogen because I am a tomboy. What's funny is, it used to be that a doctor could diagnose a young girl with gender dysphoria if she was too much of a tomboy. Doctors focused a ton on gender stereotypes and, much less on gender identity. You weren't allowed to be a woman if you were a tomboy. Trans people, of course, learned the diagnostic criteria and figured out how to play the gender stereotype game in order to access medical care. Now, the criteria are more focused on stated identity and desire for medical transition. Transphobes hate this because it means they aren't screening out the "fakers" who don't conform to gender stereotypes. And then they turn around an accuse trans people of reinforcing those stereotypes.
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Dec 19, 2021 02:31
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fellas, is it trans to wear a cap?
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Dec 19, 2021 02:57
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yes if its facing forward if its facing backwards youre just a tomboy
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Dec 19, 2021 03:01
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Dr. Stab posted:It's true. I am forced to take estrogen because I am a tomboy. More like hairy benjamin am I rite
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Dec 19, 2021 04:02
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*hot take voice* tomboys are transface, like drag
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Dec 19, 2021 04:04
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If you want evidence of how bad terfery is over here in the uk just read the comments to this https://twitter.com/Commonswomequ/status/1472915228392398855 And if you want to know how behind the times we are with regards to treatment of trans people, read the report today; https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm5802/cmselect/cmwomeq/977/report.html Bear in mind this was staffed by majority conservatives and even they came to the conclusion the process is poo poo and atmosphere is hostile lmao
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Dec 21, 2021 13:06
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Some Guy TT posted:in pure theory terms the question of whether gender is innate or culturally imposed has been around about as long as the concept of gender itself terfdom is what you get when you decide gender is innate but tied inextricably to the biology of sexual organs You seem to be saying trans people (or atleast the majority) think gender is innate. Is this an accurate reading of your post? Seems to me it's perfectly possible to think gender is a cultural construct and be trans.
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Dec 21, 2021 21:18
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Arm Women.
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Jul 8, 2022 18:48
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tokin opposition posted:That's some low effort tomboyery right there smdh
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Jul 8, 2022 18:50
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Southpaugh posted:Arm Women. I'm more of a leg man myself
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Jul 8, 2022 19:14
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i prefer the most feminine of body parts, the penis
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Jul 8, 2022 20:01
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https://mobile.twitter.com/ryanlcooper/status/1545527960425431042
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Jul 9, 2022 14:04
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tokin opposition posted:i prefer the most feminine of body parts, the penis *extremely natalie wynn voice* why is no one talking about the female peniiiiiis Is contrapoints good still? I don't think I've seen one of her videos in years. Probably just on the creator grift hamster wheel.
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Jul 9, 2022 14:25
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She sucked rear end as soon as she got famous and doing art bullshit instead of philosophy and basically stopped putting stuff up years ago
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Jul 9, 2022 18:58
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Xaris posted:i think its already been answered in a lot of ways but yes there is, but in the second wave feministic sense. to maybe make it a little more in raw terms: the penis is evil. the penis is a symbol of oppression and patriarchy, one meant to subjugate vaginas. the penis must be destroyed. I appreciate this post a lot and think it's a little sad that any female transphobe is now called a TERF because the classical definition of "second-waver who is so mad at the concept of penises and at Kids These Days that they have earnestly convinced themselves that all trans women are braving bigotry and violence and taking hormones daily for years just so that they can sneak into women's bathrooms and force lesbians to touch dicks" is so loving bonkers that it needs to be preserved
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Jul 9, 2022 19:16
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Seriously, find an original-recipe TERF (JK Rowling's mentions are a good place to find them) and talk to them about their beliefs and see how quickly they bring up public bathrooms. It is a pathological fixation
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Jul 9, 2022 19:19
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Southpaugh posted:Arm Women. they already have 2
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Jul 9, 2022 19:28
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AnimeIsTrash posted:they already have 2 Some of us have three
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Jul 9, 2022 19:31
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