[Biosphere Collapse] 420 days of blazin' it

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > [Biosphere Collapse] 420 days of blazin' it

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(Thread IKs: Stereotype)

Cloks: Feb 1, 2013; by Azathoth

"Unlocking this Horizon Forbidden West trophy also plants a real-life tree"

Sony posted:

For the release of Horizon Forbidden West, we want to do something to help nature... with you. Just like how Aloy fights to save the Earth in the game, we can do something together to help our planet.

Play Horizon Forbidden West and unlock the �Reached the Daunt� trophy before March 25th, and we, in partnership with the Arbor Day Foundation, will plant a tree across the country to help complete 3 different reforestation projects.

So let's grab our controllers and play for our planet!

Seems like Sony has committed to plant up to 288k trees for people getting this easy achievement in their new game. Nice to get a game and some greenwashing in the same package.

# ? Feb 16, 2022 19:44

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# ? May 26, 2024 05:11

Cup Runneth Over: Aug 8, 2009; She said life's
Too short to worry
Life's too long to wait
It's too short
Not to love everybody
Life's too long to hate

Cloks posted:

"Unlocking this Horizon Forbidden West trophy also plants a real-life tree"

Seems like Sony has committed to plant up to 288k trees for people getting this easy achievement in their new game. Nice to get a game and some greenwashing in the same package.

How many trees would you have to plant to offset the carbon cost of people playing the game assuming they all burn down within 7 years

# ? Feb 16, 2022 20:08

Marenghi: Oct 16, 2008; Don't trust the liberals,
they will betray you

What did happen to the carbon credits when that carbon credit forest went up in flames?
Is there a mechanism to destroy the credit. Otherwise it seems it won't be long before some huckster starts hiring arsonists to double book credits on the same land over and over.

# ? Feb 16, 2022 20:12

lobotomy molo: May 7, 2007; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Marenghi posted:

What did happen to the carbon credits when that carbon credit forest went up in flames?
Is there a mechanism to destroy the credit. Otherwise it seems it won't be long before some huckster starts hiring arsonists to double book credits on the same land over and over.

free market babyyyyy :capitalism:

# ? Feb 16, 2022 20:14

Cup Runneth Over: Aug 8, 2009; She said life's
Too short to worry
Life's too long to wait
It's too short
Not to love everybody
Life's too long to hate

Marenghi posted:

Is there a mechanism to destroy the credit. Otherwise it seems it won't be long before some huckster starts hiring arsonists to double book credits on the same land over and over.

Sounds like a job for the BLOCKCHAIN!

# ? Feb 16, 2022 20:14

lobotomy molo: May 7, 2007; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Cup Runneth Over posted:

Sounds like a job for the BLOCKCHAIN!

oh god no

# ? Feb 16, 2022 20:17

Xaris: Jul 25, 2006; Lucky there's a family guy
Lucky there's a man who positively can do
All the things that make us
Laugh and cry

Corsec posted:

I think I can agree with this, that modern development can explain why birth rates fall but this isn't sufficient to explain why birth rates are below replacement rates in advanced economies. It seems like the constantly growing requirement for parents to work to financially support their children is what pushes fertility below replacement levels. This is also why the rich have consistently high birthrates above replacement levels, because they can afford to pay people to do domestic labour for them and look after their children. It also explains why fertility is below the rate that parents claim to prefer, lots of people would like to have more children but they can't afford more. Basically, capitalism is carrying out an implicit and unstated eugenics policy based on class status.

But wouldn't this predict that a socialized economy would have a growing population (not accounting for migration), and would consequently have rising emissions unless they also had economic degrowth at the same time?

correct. it would. kinda what I was getting at

# ? Feb 16, 2022 20:32

mediaphage: Mar 22, 2007; Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through

Cup Runneth Over posted:

Sounds like a job for the BLOCKCHAIN!

go back to bed kim stanley robinson you're drunk

# ? Feb 16, 2022 20:32

kater: Nov 16, 2010

surely it requires carbon to like drive a tree to wherever the gently caress its being planted right? how fast does that get paid off?

# ? Feb 16, 2022 21:48

Cup Runneth Over: Aug 8, 2009; She said life's
Too short to worry
Life's too long to wait
It's too short
Not to love everybody
Life's too long to hate

kater posted:

surely it requires carbon to like drive a tree to wherever the gently caress its being planted right? how fast does that get paid off?

huh? what's an "externality"?

# ? Feb 16, 2022 21:51

Cloks: Feb 1, 2013; by Azathoth

Cup Runneth Over posted:

huh? what's an "externality"?

don't worry about it

# ? Feb 16, 2022 22:36

Rectal Death Adept: Jun 20, 2018; by Fluffdaddy

and this ...is to go ...even further beyond Super Suburb 2

https://twitter.com/DiscussingFilm/status/1493986604561707011?t=wA9xBKAbjJ7XlyuCknYoRQ&s=19

# ? Feb 16, 2022 23:06

JAY ZERO SUM GAME: Oct 18, 2005; Walter.
I know you know how to do this.
Get up.

Rectal Death Adept posted:

and this ...is to go ...even further beyond Super Suburb 2

https://twitter.com/DiscussingFilm/status/1493986604561707011?t=wA9xBKAbjJ7XlyuCknYoRQ&s=19

i thought they already did this, and it ended up as a town full of white people where only landowners could vote (i'm not kidding)

# ? Feb 16, 2022 23:15

blatman: May 10, 2009; 14 inc dont mez

Cloks posted:

"Unlocking this Horizon Forbidden West trophy also plants a real-life tree"

Seems like Sony has committed to plant up to 288k trees for people getting this easy achievement in their new game. Nice to get a game and some greenwashing in the same package.

if they were serious then u'd get more trees for harder achievements, like when you platinum bloodborne it gives you your own carbon capture plant

# ? Feb 16, 2022 23:15

mediaphage: Mar 22, 2007; Excuse me, pardon me, sheer perfection coming through

JAY ZERO SUM GAME posted:

i thought they already did this, and it ended up as a town full of white people where only landowners could vote (i'm not kidding)

lmao jesus. i was like whatever if i were rich i'd probably enjoy it

and then i read your post and thought man i'm such a dumbass

# ? Feb 16, 2022 23:15

Deep Dish Fuckfest: Sep 6, 2006; Advanced
Computer Touching; Toilet Rascal

Rectal Death Adept posted:

and this ...is to go ...even further beyond Super Suburb 2

https://twitter.com/DiscussingFilm/status/1493986604561707011?t=wA9xBKAbjJ7XlyuCknYoRQ&s=19

i'm perfectly fine with this if disney decides to wall these things off so no one from the outside can come in and ruin the illusion, and no one inside can get out and have a non mouse approved experience and/or product

# ? Feb 16, 2022 23:21

nomad2020: Jan 30, 2007

JAY ZERO SUM GAME posted:

i thought they already did this, and it ended up as a town full of white people where only landowners could vote (i'm not kidding)

I only know of the one that closed before it even opened, in part because residents could potentially overrule the mouse's edict. I think part of it is downtown disney and the rest is one of the RV parks now.

# ? Feb 16, 2022 23:23

bedpan: Apr 23, 2008

T-Paine posted:

Say it with me now

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/drought-west-climate-change-worst-1200-years/

Study finds 42% of megadrought in West is due to human-caused climate change: "Worst-case scenario keeps getting worse"

Wow, big government has failed to manage the water supply, just like everything else. When can we expect privatization? Has anyone asked Elon Musk?

# ? Feb 16, 2022 23:28

tuyop: Sep 15, 2006; Every second that we're not growing BASIL is a second wasted; Fun Shoe

The Oldest Man posted:

I re-watched The Big Short the other day and had something of an epiphany about this and maybe why our society is so catastrophically bad at undervaluing risk and overvaluing optimism.

When you 'go long' on a stock (or buy into/espouse/act in accordance with) the notion that something will be better in the future you are effectively making yourself a prophet of good news. This thing is good, and specifically, I (and you!) can benefit from my foresight on this subject. There are many ways that prophetic foresight manifests social value, like "buy these stocks and you'll make money" or "buy a house, you'll have a secure future" etc. but the basic premise remains the same: I know something is going to be good, and I can use that foreknowledge to profit myself by joining that venture and by sharing my insight so that others join as well. The social utility of people who display this behavior is obvious; you don't have much of a community or society without people banding together for common benefit.

When you 'go short,' the premise is inverted: you are making yourself a prophet of bad news. This thing is bad, you shouldn't participate in it, you should bet against it, you should avoid it. The thing is, this isn't symmetrically valuable to being the bringer of good news. There's no immediately obvious way that others can profit from a forecast of a bad outcome the way that they can from a forecast of a good outcome. So what's the value of the bad news bringer to the community? If everyone listens to them, and the thing they are warning about doesn't happen/bad outcome avoided, the obvious value is zero. Even if they were clearly, obviously correct (and that often isn't the case), you don't profit by listening to the guy who says the '08 housing bond market is hosed or who says the barn being raised is going to collapse (I'll get to short-selling in a sec) and staying out of it, you simply avoided some potential hypothetical losses - but the people tied to those endeavors are pissed because you kept others from supporting you. If no one listens and the event happens, everyone is pissed at you anyway because you knew and didn't stop them.

In the financial markets they had to specifically legalize short selling equities in the 30s because there was no incentive to step up and publicize even a very accurate forecast of bad news. Sure, you could avoid losses and maybe help others avoid losses, but avoiding losses is not a symmetrical incentive to gaining profits. Legalizing shorts helped balance that out by creating a financial vehicle for people to make huge piles of money if they were right (according to the market, in the future) that something was not going to work out. But there's something interesting about the way short sales are structured (partially fixed by options trading) that I think speaks to the asymmetry of optimism and pessimism in our society: if you go long, your gains are potentially unlimited but your losses are capped. If you go short, your gains are capped, but your losses are potentially unlimited. Betting a good outcome will occur is structurally less risky than betting a bad outcome will occur.

Now apply the same exact lens to poo poo like COVID or climate change. Where is the social or economic penalty for being wrong over and over and over on the side of optimism? It's extremely limited. Now look at the other side: you err on the side of caution (or hell, don't even make any errors but just talk about it a little too much) and you're a doomer, a chicken little, etc. Bottom line is, you can prognosticate incorrectly many many more times on the side of optimism and get away with it because we are socially conditioned to treat 'going long' and being optimistic as both more inherently valuable and less risky than 'going short' and being pessimistic. And when you can consistently profit from pathological optimism without suffering the consequences of your rosy view of the world, regardless of the actual outcomes, you can leverage that profit into greater and greater influence on the rules of the game - you can protect your bets by making it harder to bet against you. The status quo of our economic system is pathological optimists making pathologically optimistic bets and hiring other pathological optimists to run the optimist betting machinery, do PR for the bets being made, and write that no one could have predicted a bad outcome in the charred aftermath when those bets fail.
Pathological optimism at some point stops being the most profitable strategy and becomes the only acceptable strategy.

So what's the value of any of this navel-gazing?

In the 08 market collapse, the big optimistic betters almost all got cover from the government first to unwind their bets and then to sell off the crap they couldn't unwind when they turned out to be catastrophically wrong because our entire social and economic order is based on optimism being the default correct stance. Think about this for a second: we have baked in the correctness of pathological optimism into our culture to such a radical extent that even when we knew it was wrong to a degree that put the entire country's financial system in jeopardy of total collapse, the response was to pause the whole machine, change the rules, and make sure we protected the pathological (even fraudulently pathological) optimists from the consequences of their own terrible wagers before we started the machine up again.

That was in a system where the outcomes could be rigged to protect the gamblers when they were on the 'right' side. So what the gently caress happens when the system is the global climate or a pandemic and you can't bully it or cheat it or rig it so that the pathological optimist bet always pays out the way our society needs it to? In this society, anyone who says "things are going to get worse" becomes the equivalent of a crazed doom-saying prophet on the street corner because our society is no longer equipped to deal with the possibility of optimism being wrong. The prediction of the possibility (or likelihood) of a bad outcome is automatically apocalyptic because we can no longer prepare for or fix bad outcomes.

So don't be a doomer, you're really harshing everyone's vibe.

this is an interesting point made long ago that I think is good

# ? Feb 16, 2022 23:52

Ocean Book: Sep 27, 2010; - hi

Rectal Death Adept posted:

and this ...is to go ...even further beyond Super Suburb 2

https://twitter.com/DiscussingFilm/status/1493986604561707011?t=wA9xBKAbjJ7XlyuCknYoRQ&s=19

looking forward to the defunctland episode

# ? Feb 17, 2022 00:26

T-Paine: Dec 12, 2007; Sitting in the Costco food court unmasked, Bible in hand, reading my favorite Psalms to my five children: Abel, Bethany, Carlos, Carlos, and Carlos.

https://twitter.com/alex_sammon/status/1493971018725138434

# ? Feb 17, 2022 01:02

lobotomy molo: May 7, 2007; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

T-Paine posted:

https://twitter.com/alex_sammon/status/1493971018725138434

god drat it ikea :negative:

# ? Feb 17, 2022 01:11

SKULL.GIF: Jan 20, 2017

*laughs in Lorax*

# ? Feb 17, 2022 01:28

Real hurthling!: Sep 11, 2001

why doesnt ikea just walk down the street on large trash day and reclaim all their particle board furniture off the curb for shredding and recycling

# ? Feb 17, 2022 01:34

Trabisnikof: Dec 24, 2005

Marenghi posted:

What did happen to the carbon credits when that carbon credit forest went up in flames?
Is there a mechanism to destroy the credit. Otherwise it seems it won't be long before some huckster starts hiring arsonists to double book credits on the same land over and over.

https://carbonplan.org/research/offset-project-fire

quote:

The buffer pool

The California forest offset protocol addresses permanence concerns through a mechanism called a �buffer pool.� Each forest offset project must contribute a share of its offset credits to the buffer pool, which is available to compensate for any unintentional �reversal,� or forest carbon loss, across all forest projects in the offset program over projects� 100-year commitments.

In essence, the buffer pool functions as an insurance program that can be accessed when fire, drought, or other unintended events cause a loss of carbon. Whenever there is an unintentional reversal of forest carbon storage, an equal number of credits from the buffer pool are retired to maintain the environmental integrity of the credits that circulate in private markets. This works so long as the buffer pool is large enough to never be depleted. As a result, establishing the appropriate size of the buffer pool is essential � similar to setting financial requirements for an insurance provider.

California�s forest offset protocol identifies a set of risks that determine what share of each project�s credits must be set aside in the buffer pool. Contributions per risk factor vary per project, but forest offset projects typically contribute between 15% to 20% of their total credits to the buffer pool. Notably, the entire buffer pool is available to cover comprehensive carbon loss from unintentional reversals, no matter the share of the buffer pool associated with that specific risk and no matter the contribution an individual project has made to the collective buffer pool.

As of early July, more than 127 million forest offset credits were in the private market, and just over 24 million credits remained in the buffer pool � equal to about 15.8% of the total.
�
As a historical reference point, the 2003 B&B fire, which burned nearby under similar conditions, ultimately killed almost half the trees it encountered.6 Though the situation in Oregon is still evolving, we can calculate the carbon impacts that would arise from a similar outcome in this incident. At a 50% loss of carbon in the 72% of the ACR260 project area burned through September 17, the Lionshead Fire will have reversed 963,534 credits (about 4% of the total buffer pool). In a worst case scenario in which the entirety of the project burns and all credited carbon is lost, more than 11% of the buffer pool could be depleted.
�
Under a scenario in which carbon loss is 50% in burned areas and events of this magnitude occur once every 4 years, fire alone could consume the entirety of the buffer pool by 2100, despite the fact that the buffer pool is intended to insure against many other non-fire risks.

Relatively conservative assumptions still present a worrying picture. In a scenario with 20% carbon loss and events occuring every 10 years, fires could still exceed the 20% of the buffer pool specifically set aside to cover the risk of fire. While buffer credits are fungible and can compensate any unintended reversal, when fire reversals exhaust more than their "fair share" of the buffer pool, all other risks would have to outperform expectations for the buffer pool to adequately insure against future reversals from all types of permanence risks � including drought, disease, insect infestation, and other mounting climate-related stressors.

# ? Feb 17, 2022 02:03

Tempora Mutantur: Feb 22, 2005

T-Paine posted:

https://twitter.com/alex_sammon/status/1493971018725138434

swedish house mafia taking on a darker meaning

# ? Feb 17, 2022 02:10

Just a Moron: Nov 11, 2021

Rectal Death Adept posted:

and this ...is to go ...even further beyond Super Suburb 2

https://twitter.com/DiscussingFilm/status/1493986604561707011?t=wA9xBKAbjJ7XlyuCknYoRQ&s=19

Every day I get sadder that Jean Baudrillard isn't around to witness this incredible content.

# ? Feb 17, 2022 02:10

Just a Moron: Nov 11, 2021

Fly Molo posted:

god drat it ikea

It's not like they can't just use farmed trees in their products, wtf

# ? Feb 17, 2022 02:12

Tempora Mutantur: Feb 22, 2005

look I don't think you guys understand the premium people pay for "made from old growth tree" spoon holders

# ? Feb 17, 2022 02:15

skooma512: Feb 8, 2012; You couldn't grok my race car, but you dug the roadside blur.

The Wisest Moron posted:

Every day I get sadder that Jean Baudrillard isn't around to witness this incredible content.

Really wish we had his take on NFTs and crypto. :smith:

# ? Feb 17, 2022 02:18

RC Cola: Aug 1, 2011; Dovie'andi se tovya sagain

I love the end of the world. This poo poo is great

# ? Feb 17, 2022 02:19

The Protagonist: Jun 29, 2009; The average is 5.5? I thought it was 4. This is very unsettling.

I'm reading that blog and I love that he calls for the use of the internet to Build Communism lol

It's like, okay! Time to talk about how we need to [REDACTED] :commissar:

# ? Feb 17, 2022 02:22

Trabisnikof: Dec 24, 2005

https://www.eenews.net/articles/biden-im-going-to-work-like-the-devil-to-cut-energy-prices/

Speaking at a meeting of the National Association of Counties, Biden said he understood the impact that high energy prices have on Americans.

�I grew up in a family where the price at the pump was felt in the kitchen,� he said. �I�m going to work like the devil to bring the price of gasoline down.�

# ? Feb 17, 2022 02:40

Cloks: Feb 1, 2013; by Azathoth

gently caress it, time to switch to the winning side

# ? Feb 17, 2022 02:47

Rime: Nov 2, 2011; by Games Forum

They're looking at bringing in gasoline pricing restrictions in BC, despite fuel not even being close in adjusted terms to the record highs of '08 (but massively high relative to our lovely deflated purchasing power situation).

That tells me that things are getting exciting.

# ? Feb 17, 2022 02:48

lobotomy molo: May 7, 2007; by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

The Wisest Moron posted:

It's not like they can't just use farmed trees in their products, wtf

slashing and burning the last old growth forest to turn it into particle board

lol

lmao

# ? Feb 17, 2022 02:49

Car Hater: May 7, 2007; wolf. bike.
Wolf. Bike.
Wolf! Bike!
WolfBike!
WolfBike!
ARROOOOOO!

Particle board, particle board

Replace the wood we cannot afford

How long's it last? Not important

Particle board

# ? Feb 17, 2022 03:43

Cup Runneth Over: Aug 8, 2009; She said life's
Too short to worry
Life's too long to wait
It's too short
Not to love everybody
Life's too long to hate

T-Paine posted:

https://twitter.com/alex_sammon/status/1493971018725138434

quote:

But Europe has almost no old growth forest left. Romania, because it was a walled off Soviet state, still has spruce, beech, and more.

quote:

The corruption-addled post-Soviet liberalization period resulted in the Harvard University endowment buying up illegally privatized forest, and then flipping it to Ikea, which relies heavily on Eastern Europe for wood and contracted manufacturers.

lmao

# ? Feb 17, 2022 03:43

Homeless Friend: Jul 16, 2007

Car Hater posted:

Particle board, particle board

Replace the wood we cannot afford

How long's it last? Not important

Particle board

# ? Feb 17, 2022 03:46

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ? May 26, 2024 05:11

Cold on a Cob: Feb 6, 2006; i've seen so much, i'm going blind
and i'm brain dead virtually; College Slice

Car Hater posted:

Particle board, particle board

Replace the wood we cannot afford

How long's it last? Not important

Particle board

# ? Feb 17, 2022 03:59

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > [Biosphere Collapse] 420 days of blazin' it

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