|
given how roma are treated throughout europe and how pervasive the belief that all roma are thieves is (and the belief that's not even a racist belief) i would certainly look askance at any claims by a vigilante group that a group of roma they grabbed were thieves it is, however, certainly not an issue limited to ukraine and the impression i have is that it's fairly pervasive in western europe as well
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 15:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 02:12 |
|
|
the holy poopacy posted:The only on the ground source posted in response to the pics claims that they are singled out for being both looters and Roma. If you have a better source that can conclusively claim (or even inconclusively claim) that this is a general treatment for all looters, feel free to post it. https://www.newsweek.com/ukraine-alleged-looter-citizens-kyiv-pole-russia-invasion-looting-crime-1685908 https://meaww.com/local-criminals-humiliated-in-ukraine-for-stealing-russian-troops-also-raid-stores-banks
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 15:57
|
|
|
Terminal autist posted:Why do they put them in blackface? 
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 15:57
|
|
|
New Coke posted:The article was from 2018, so could be related to the prior unrest, but not the current invasion. Which article?
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 15:58
|
|
|
Xombie posted:"Some random twitter tankie nobody said these looters and thieves are Roma" is not the exculpatory evidence you would like it to be I'm afraid Thanks to the internet you too can now gently caress your brain up with the kind of desperate excuses people make during war without ever even needing to step foot on the battlefield.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:00
|
|
|
RBA-Wintrow posted:I've seen EU and US arms manufacturers prototyping truck mounted anti-air and drone systems. MLPWS is the name for the wheeled variant 
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:00
|
|
|
smug n stuff posted:It was a honeypot post from uh somewhere else to see if posters ITT would defend that behavior Also that we’re Nazis and that the Ukrainians are Nazis. Thus justifying big daddy Putin. However on the balance of things; only one side is killing women and children; so 🤷 Edit: this is whataboutism. This is bad. I’m just so loving tired of the decorum poisoning enabled poo poo posting and it’s so easy to sink to their level. I agree with other posters that d&ds tolerance of intolerance is bad and makes the site worse. If the unnamed forum can’t be controlled why do we have to deal with them baiting other forums and celebrating their irony poisoning. freeasinbeer fucked around with this message at 16:04 on Mar 22, 2022 |
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:01
|
|
|
smug n stuff posted:It was a honeypot post from uh somewhere else to see if posters ITT would defend that behavior luckily it is not hard to find someone who will crap out a hot take then double down on it, ensuring the thread is firmly centered around the far more interesting topic of which posters are stupid and evil and deserving of mockery. i mean who really gives a poo poo about the war instead of proving the posting clique i identify with are the best at posting online and sharing good opinions online. i would much rather read pages and pages of posts about random strangers gossipy opinions about other random strangers rather than news about the ukraine war in this, the ukraine war thread
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:02
|
|
|
It's without a doubt an example of a minority being discriminated against and it shouldn't be happening. What is up for debate are the facts of this particular case, with Russia arguing at one end that this is how all Roma arriving in Lviv are treated and is proof of all Ukrainians being nazis, and others alleging that it was the action of a specific group of vigilantes against a group of Roma caught pick-pocketing. I think it's possible to pick a side in that debate while still acknowledging that both extremes are cases of racism, and that racism against roma in general is a widespread problem (both inside and outside Ukraine).
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:04
|
|
|
Mr. Fall Down Terror posted:luckily it is not hard to find someone who will crap out a hot take then double down on it, ensuring the thread is firmly centered around the far more interesting topic of which posters are stupid and evil and deserving of mockery. i would much rather read pages and pages of posts about peoples gossipy opinions about other people rather than news about the ukraine war in this, the ukraine war thread Posting about posters is punishable for exactly this reason, so please report it if you see it.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:04
|
|
|
KitConstantine posted:Nexta link but it's reporting the words of Odesa's spokesperson - apparently the commander in charge of the Mariupol offensive has been identified by Ukraine.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:05
|
|
|
Koos Group posted:Greetings. So about Judakel. For various reasons, positions aren't moderated in D&D. That does unfortunately include ones that are odious or monstrous. However, I've had other complaints about Judakel's posting here, such as he's making points through insinuation rather than directly, that he's not including sources for his assertions, that he's deliberately overstating, that he's posting too much about his personal feelings rather than discussable points, and repeating points without addressing counterpoints. All of those are explicitly or implicitly against D&D's rules, so we'll be taking a look at his thread history and considering more serious moderation options. lol dude has been making GBS threads all around D&D for years, cheering for mass death of undesirables since Venezuela thread, and now you will be "looking at his thread history and considering more serious options" ?
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:07
|
|
|
Koos Group posted:Posting about posters is punishable for exactly this reason, so please report it if you see it. Ah yes. What a crime. Glad we have that one on lockdown.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:07
|
|
|
cinci zoo sniper posted:I wouldn’t be surprised to see America training eagles or some other predatory birds to hunt drones, eventually. Australian Eagles already learned to do that on their own  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hr-xBtVU4lg NTRabbit fucked around with this message at 16:12 on Mar 22, 2022 |
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:10
|
|
|
Gervasius posted:lol dude has been making GBS threads all around D&D for years, cheering for mass death of undesirables since Venezuela thread, and now you will be "looking at his thread history and considering more serious options" ? Yes. If you or anyone else has more info or complaints about him you'd like factored into the decision, please PM me. Any further discussion of Judakel rather than the Russo-Ukrainian war in this thread will be considered posting about posters.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:10
|
|
|
NTRabbit posted:Australian Eagles already learned to do that on their own Magpies, Ravens, and Crows will do this as well, a lot of birds don't take kindly to drones.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:10
|
|
|
You're right. Anyway, here's why I think genocide is good, actually... (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:11
|
|
|
Here's some good news (hopefully it stays good). https://twitter.com/olgatokariuk/status/1506286807192940553
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:11
|
|
|
Koos Group posted:Greetings. So about Judakel. For various reasons, positions aren't moderated in D&D. That does unfortunately include ones that are odious or monstrous. However, I've had other complaints about Judakel's posting here, such as he's making points through insinuation rather than directly, that he's not including sources for his assertions, that he's deliberately overstating, that he's posting too much about his personal feelings rather than discussable points, and repeating points without addressing counterpoints. All of those are explicitly or implicitly against D&D's rules, so we'll be taking a look at his thread history and considering more serious moderation options. Honest question: Why do we have to treat people as "arguing in good faith" if their recent post history in other forums shows that they aren't? It just opens things up to easy trolling and thread making GBS threads.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:11
|
|
|
Everyone have a thread-relevant llama and calm down https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1506285662772858885?s=20&t=oVFcZUJZ5O-EUHE8plv8Uw
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:12
|
|
|
cinci zoo sniper posted:Which article? I meant the Al Jazeera link in Mans's post (the first one which mentioned those pictures). I did slightly misunderstand, though, because I thought those pictures were from the article, so I figured they were all from 2018. The article discusses discrimination faced by Roma people, but there's nothing about those pictures in particular. The public shaming is indefensible, whether or not those people have committed theft, but calling attention to it in order to make Ukraine seem less sympathetic and the large scale destruction of it's population seem justifiable is not a great look either
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:12
|
|
|
Gervasius posted:lol dude has been making GBS threads all around D&D for years, cheering for mass death of undesirables since Venezuela thread, and now you will be "looking at his thread history and considering more serious options" ? Keeping one's persona relevant to the situation at hand by turning their rap sheet into a russian novel is at least the solution-mindedness we need
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:13
|
|
|
CommieGIR posted:Magpies, Ravens, and Crows will do this as well, a lot of birds don't take kindly to drones. Wedgies get up to 2.5m wingspan and also attack ultralight aircraft, gliders, and paragliders
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:14
|
|
|
ummel posted:Here's some good news (hopefully it stays good). Other reports I've seen are that she's on her way home. I'm sure/dreading that we'll get more details soon  Ukraine still has tanks fighting in Mariupol so I think the Russians aren't in for an easy time of it as they get closer to the city centerNothing shown, but it's tanks firing on presumably other tanks and surrounded by destroyed civilian architecture. https://twitter.com/Blue_Sauron/status/1506285287273639945?s=20&t=oVFcZUJZ5O-EUHE8plv8Uw
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:14
|
|
|
freeasinbeer posted:Also that we’re Nazis and that the Ukrainians are Nazis. Yeah it's kind of wild, I thought D&D was generally better about keeping racists out and being intolerant of intolerance but now posters are quickly falling into holes about justified attacks on Roma. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:15
|
|
|
Xombie posted:https://www.newsweek.com/ukraine-alleged-looter-citizens-kyiv-pole-russia-invasion-looting-crime-1685908 Thank you for the source. I am still reluctant to dismiss claims of hate crimes by pro-Roma advocacy groups (that are specifically pushing against tankie twitter claims that this is just regular life under Nazi Ukraine rule) but if it's a common punishment among vigilantes of all stripes then that does change the context.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:15
|
|
|
Koos Group posted:Greetings. So about Judakel. For various reasons, positions aren't moderated in D&D. That does unfortunately include ones that are odious or monstrous. However, I've had other complaints about Judakel's posting here, such as he's making points through insinuation rather than directly, that he's not including sources for his assertions, that he's deliberately overstating, that he's posting too much about his personal feelings rather than discussable points, and repeating points without addressing counterpoints. All of those are explicitly or implicitly against D&D's rules, so we'll be taking a look at his thread history and considering more serious moderation options. Without discussing this specific poster, "bad posters of any and all types who stick around and shitpost with no consequences turn forums to poo poo, and the solution is to get rid of them" is the only reason why forums dot somethingawful dot com has been an ongoing website long after fark and digg are dead. After having done nothing about it for years, you (meaning the mods) are now in the massively uncomfortable situation of protecting some of the worst posters, not to mention people, on the english speaking internet from a critical mass of onlookers after their masks all came off at once. Maintaining that status quo is not something that will help the forums out or turn them into a better place over time.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:15
|
|
|
evilweasel posted:given how roma are treated throughout europe and how pervasive the belief that all roma are thieves is (and the belief that's not even a racist belief) i would certainly look askance at any claims by a vigilante group that a group of roma they grabbed were thieves Yeah, this is very important thing - we are racist as gently caress towards roma or any other minorities, and poo poo like this is happening, and needs to be dealt with. Also, stunning difference in treatment of Ukranian refugees compared to refugees from Syria, Afghanisan and other places is more than sickening. And yes, existence of Azov is a major issue. However, we could please first try to stop a nation run by literal nazis from dropping cluster munitions on maternity hospitals.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:16
|
|
|
ummel posted:Here's some good news (hopefully it stays good). Making her record the video and then freeing her so she can denounce it seems counterproductive but I guess the russians forgot they are not in their home country where this poo poo works.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:17
|
|
|
Slashrat posted:It's without a doubt an example of a minority being discriminated against and it shouldn't be happening. What is up for debate are the facts of this particular case, with Russia arguing at one end that this is how all Roma arriving in Lviv are treated and is proof of all Ukrainians being nazis, and others alleging that it was the action of a specific group of vigilantes against a group of Roma caught pick-pocketing. It's not like the Roma are treated any better in Russia. Unsurprisingly, when something racist against the Roma happens in Russia, they blame the US. The "reputation" as pickpockets a pretty harmful stereotype that Roma have to deal with all over Europe. It's pretty disgusting and harmful, and one of those bizarrely regressive attitudes still remaining in Europe as a whole. However, the claim that they actually do treat other looters in a similar way is true, there's pictures to corroborate that, including one of a guy tied down to a post with his pants pulled down and a Russian flag stuck to his rear end. It's what happens when the rule of law falls apart, people take justice on their own hands and do horrible poo poo to perceived criminals without a fair trial.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:17
|
|
|
Gumball Gumption posted:Yeah it's kind of wild, I thought D&D was generally better about keeping racists out and being intolerant of intolerance but now posters are quickly falling into holes about justified attacks on Roma. Wait, what? I've read or skimmed probably like 25% of this 1000 page thread, and I've not even seen a single post about Roma before these ones, except at the very beginning regarding how they were required to show ID to get food at refugee centers, and supposedly many Roma-Ukrainians don't have ID or something while non-Roma Ukrainians mostly do. That's the only time I've ever seen Roma referenced, and it was like... Feb 26th. E: I see Holy Poopacy posted the links a couple posts up, goddamn this thread moves fast.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:18
|
|
|
Gumball Gumption posted:Yeah it's kind of wild, I thought D&D was generally better about keeping racists out and being intolerant of intolerance but now posters are quickly falling into holes about justified attacks on Roma. Enough. If you find a post that is making sketchy, racist claims. Report it. If its especially concerning, PM a Mod. Let's move on.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:18
|
|
|
The question is why the treatment of Roma in Ukraine isn't part of the Eastern Europe thread, and is instead in the thread dedicated to world altering war between Russia and Ukraine. EDIT: Actual content: https://twitter.com/KofmanMichael/status/1505950708239065097 Russia may be running out of working precision munitions.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:19
|
|
|
fatherboxx posted:Making her record the video and then freeing her so she can denounce it seems counterproductive but I guess the russians forgot they are not in their home country where this poo poo works. Because the video isn't for us.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:20
|
|
|
Mr Luxury Yacht posted:Honest question: Why do we have to treat people as "arguing in good faith" if their recent post history in other forums shows that they aren't? It just opens things up to easy trolling and thread making GBS threads. This is a point that I may need to clarify in the rules. We should assume someone is posting in good faith when we engage them with an argument, because erring on that side is better than the other where we might end up accusing someone's who innocent and tanking discussion, and making the accusation shifts discussion away from the actual point to forum personalities. However, you do not literally need to assume in your head everyone is posting in good faith, and if you have reason to suspect they aren't, you should report them. As bad faith is against the rules.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:20
|
|
|
CommieGIR posted:Magpies, Ravens, and Crows will do this as well, a lot of birds don't take kindly to drones. I tried flying a drone in an abandoned iron mine a few months ago – my drone took off and nearly immediately went haywire out of control and then smashed into a tree at like 15m, then surprisingly fell down without any damage at all, not even a broken propeller. I assume most of the other drones that these forces are using are unshielded and consumer grade DJIs or similar. Anyway shielding a drone would add weight and reduce its operating efficacy. I'm surprised there's no way to replicate "flying in a giant magnetic vortex" with some sort of small device. Did they not figure out how to keep consumer drones away from big airports, other than hunting down idiots doing it and trying to reduce the number of idiots being idiots? I guess there can't have been countermeasures a few years ago, since that dude was able to accidentally his drone into the White House ( https://time.com/3682307/white-house-drone-crash/ ) but presumably anti-drone-tech has improved since 2015. There's geofencing, but obviously that wouldn't work in a combat zone... and anyway with DJI drones, the geofencing is just a "don't fly here. Unless you want to. Press OK to override" rather than a "you cannot take off here", although maybe those warnings plus catching some idiots has been sufficient to keep other idiot plane enthusiasts from flying their phantoms over JFK's runway.
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:25
|
|
|
the holy poopacy posted:Thank you for the source. Yes; it had been the de facto punishment for low level crimes since the start of the war. It isn’t great, and it’s been taken waaaaaayyyyyyyyyyy too far, but it isn’t a thing for just Roma. That Czech Roma News NGO, seems to corroborate that it might have been punishment for looting, not per se for being Roma. As with African Americans in the US, there is a ton of bias there towards Roma built in, so a healthy dose of criticism is healthy? Small miracles, it doesn’t look like they are being beat or stripped naked like some non Roma folks who were accused of looting were elsewhere. The other other context is that Russia has been pushing propaganda hard around this, and thus it has a tainted perspective that leads me to think the person posting is doing it in bad faith. If they aren’t reacting or posting propaganda from Ukraine then; even moreso. freeasinbeer fucked around with this message at 16:27 on Mar 22, 2022 |
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:25
|
|
|
Gumball Gumption posted:Yeah it's kind of wild, I thought D&D was generally better about keeping racists out and being intolerant of intolerance but now posters are quickly falling into holes about justified attacks on Roma. Do you realize that the source for them being pickpockets was a Ukrainian Roma rights activist?
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:25
|
|
|
SlowBloke posted:MLPWS is the name for the wheeled variant People who lost their homes and all furniture in bombings will appreciate the arrival of the IKEA mobile showroom 
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:27
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 02:12 |
|
|
Russians landing more very big ships at their captured port in Berdyansk. https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1506284921844908051?s=20&t=oVFcZUJZ5O-EUHE8plv8Uw There's also a lot of evidence that Russian marines are being used in the assault on Mariupol/in the south in general. This is mostly evidenced from Russian-sourced casualty reports but has also been mentioned by the Ukrainian military. https://twitter.com/ArmedMaidan/status/1506245805455335431?s=20&t=oVFcZUJZ5O-EUHE8plv8Uw If so this makes an attempted amphibious assault on Odesa increasingly unlikely
|
|
#
?
Mar 22, 2022 16:28
|
|