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Narsham posted:Also, Chibnall really wants to have the Doctor relearn what she clearly knew at the end of The Husbands of River Song? That’s the big arc he’s going for to wrap up his years as showrunner? Even stranger that he had the Doctor name drop River Song too. River as a character felt far more equal to the Doctor, and plausible that they'd have that kind of relationship. Yas has, er....? Even if the next special is bad, at least Sophie Aldred and Jemma Redgrave are always fun to watch with these characters Also, apparently in the new volume of Stranded, it's revealed that the Curator can apparently take the form of an older version of any Doctor. Opportunities for the next special and the 60th, maybe?
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Apr 17, 2022 20:35
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| # ? Jun 1, 2024 17:50 |
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BBC America has the 50th Anniversary special on. God it’s so good. “You know, I really think you might!” 
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Apr 17, 2022 22:06
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Are Ace and Tegan actually in the episode? I don't want to watch this but I would make an exception for them.
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Apr 17, 2022 22:23
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Rochallor posted:Are Ace and Tegan actually in the episode? I don't want to watch this but I would make an exception for them. I think they’re in the trailer for the finale.
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Apr 17, 2022 22:25
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The_Doctor posted:I think they’re in the trailer for the finale. Thanks! Here's the trailer by the way: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PiV8PfupbjY
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Apr 17, 2022 22:35
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OldMemes posted:The directing and editing felt really...off at times. Whittaker continues to go from strength to strength, but the Yas romance thing was terrible but at least they had the Doctor let her down by saying point blank she doesn't romance companions. Can't find it streaming yet but this is a kind of weird excuse, in particular since we know Doctor dying soon, and the next Doctor might well be one of the romance-companion Doctors. Also isn't RTD kind of the guy who started the Romance Doctors
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Apr 17, 2022 22:50
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Khanstant posted:Can't find it streaming yet but this is a kind of weird excuse, in particular since we know Doctor dying soon, and the next Doctor might well be one of the romance-companion Doctors. Also isn't RTD kind of the guy who started the Romance Doctors The Doctor should be aromantic and asexual towards companions, with River Song being the exception, because she wasn't really human. It's a big power imbalance and comes across as awkward and weird otherwise.
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Apr 17, 2022 23:15
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Don't get me wrong, the companions often tend to be people I want to see romanced, but not by the Doctor. I prefer the Doctor to date cosmic-level beings, since the Doctor is a weird immortal demigod who is both infinity years old and 2 days old sometimes (and sometimes the only other single person of the Doctor's species and age is The Master and their relationship is not a healthy basis for a romance). Regardless of modern sensibilities about power imbalances and my preference, the Doctor can and has romanced companions. There have been companions who are the "cosmic-tier" type of folk and could be more moving forward, former Doctors don't get that much say in who the next person they are will be, besides tending to be who the Doctor "needs" to be in the moment. Arguably the whole habit of taking a human and giving them a little glimpse of a grander universe that basically inherently involves having to quickly irrevocably change your perception of existence itself is pretty messed up but also who the heck is watching this show and wouldn't give an arm and a leg to be a companion for a while-- that's the whole show, getting to be along as the invisible companion. It's a gamble though, never know when being a companion means you'll get a cool x-files job, or end up stranded in an alternate universe, or splintered across time playing guardian angel to the doctor throughout history, or end up spending a thousand years motionless guarding a tomb, or kill yourself to say gently caress you to an arrogant god and preserve history. I liked the "honeymoon/engagement cruise ship" vibe when Amy/Rory were the companions. Khanstant fucked around with this message at 23:33 on Apr 17, 2022 |
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Apr 17, 2022 23:31
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The Doctor, as a Time Lord/Lady, should not have romantic relationships with humans. That’s icky.
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Apr 18, 2022 00:10
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Rochallor posted:Are Ace and Tegan actually in the episode? I don't want to watch this but I would make an exception for them. Same, I never bothered finishing Flux but I’ll watch anything that brings back Ace, the best companion ever.
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Apr 18, 2022 00:14
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Edward Mass posted:The Doctor, as a Time Lord/Lady, should not have romantic relationships with humans. That’s icky. How do you feel about River? Just wondering how far it goes based on species for you.
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Apr 18, 2022 00:26
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Edward Mass posted:The Doctor, as a Time Lord/Lady, should not have romantic relationships with humans. That’s icky. As a general rule I agree, but heck sometimes it just works. Five and Nyssa definitely hooked up once or twice. (I know she's not human but humanish.)
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Apr 18, 2022 00:31
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Flux is two good monster of the week episodes, and some interesting if undercooked characters thrown into a stew of utter nonsense that makes no sense as a coherent story. Eve of the Daleks was better, creepy stalking subplot aside. Anyone remember that Ace short film they did for the Blu-Rays a while back? Not quite as good as the Peri one, imo, but a nice little epilogue. Khanstant posted:How do you feel about River? Just wondering how far it goes based on species for you. River wasn't technically human, and developed far beyond most humans, plus it wasn't sexual per say, so it wasn't weird. Alex Kingston could pull off a character who felt like an equal to the Doctor. It seems more fitting for the Doctor to hardly understand what sex is, let alone have any interest in it. plus Time Lord children come from THE LOOMS. Maybe. Sometimes. Who knows. OldMemes fucked around with this message at 00:35 on Apr 18, 2022 |
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Apr 18, 2022 00:33
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River Song is Time Lord-ish, so that’s not too big a problem.
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Apr 18, 2022 00:48
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As a youth, the Doctor once accidentally got married to an Aztec lady by drinking a cup of hot chocolate, so it's fair to say the character has no idea how romantic relationships work. 
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Apr 18, 2022 00:49
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About half way through this thing and it's just events happening for no apparent reason. It's like a procedurally generated script that nobody's curated.
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Apr 18, 2022 00:53
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Rochallor posted:As a general rule I agree, but heck sometimes it just works. Five and Nyssa definitely hooked up once or twice. (I know she's not human but humanish.) five was absolutely horny and felt really weird about it. the BF audio Circular Time is largely about this
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Apr 18, 2022 00:55
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River's part human, sometimes when it comes to species based discrimination that matters to folks. I don't think the species matters so much as their level of experience and level of existence. It's wrong for Zeus to go gently caress a duck, but if Zeus like, invited the Duck to Olympus and after a while the Duck became Duckacles the Hero of Whatever and had their own demigod life for a while and then one day they consensually hooked up, like, way less creepy than zeus loving the regular-life-duck. I think the wrongness comes from the fact that Rose is barely out of highschool, is still trying to figure out what she's gonna do with her life, has only very mundane experiences of a kid of her life and times, but like, what she offers The Doctor in a relationship is pretty creepy under examination. But simply being human alone doesn't seem wrong in the same sense as bestiality. I also wouldn't say the relationship with River was non-sexual, but the ambiguity there is perfect since the sexual side needn't be shown there when it's communicated perfectly well otherwise. Given how much the Doctor involves themself with humanity and human lives, I think it's important they not be totally removed from such core things about humanity unless it's serving a specific arc or story. But they can also have those things without The Doctor romancing whichever humans they pluck and toss into the cosmic blender.
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Apr 18, 2022 01:00
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I still can't get over how badly edited that was. I have to assume that there were MASSIVE problems with that Sea Devil costume and they edited around it as well as possible, otherwise holy gently caress that was a hack-job. I wonder if the poor editor was sitting there tearing their hair out as they realized they simply didn't have enough to actually tell a coherent story. DoctorWhat posted:five was absolutely horny and felt really weird about it. the BF audio Circular Time is largely about this He was horny all right.... horny for cricket  TinTower posted:e: apparently Tegan and Nyssa being an item is canon now, which I’m pleasantly surprised about! Tegan: Hey Nyssa, quick let's make out! Nyssa: So Turlough will see and stop hitting on me? Tegan: Who's Turl.... yes.
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Apr 18, 2022 02:02
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Khanstant posted:I think the wrongness comes from the fact that Rose is barely out of highschool, is still trying to figure out what she's gonna do with her life, has only very mundane experiences of a kid of her life and times, but like, what she offers The Doctor in a relationship is pretty creepy under examination. But simply being human alone doesn't seem wrong in the same sense as bestiality. I've just finished a rewatch of the RTD stuff, and specifically what makes the Rose stuff kinda creepy (and solidly creepy once we get Tennant) is how lovely the Doctor is to Mickey, making him appear like a romantic rival. Mickey gets dumped on for no reason (except in retrospect) except seemingly for jealousy.
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Apr 18, 2022 02:27
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Rochallor posted:I've just finished a rewatch of the RTD stuff, and specifically what makes the Rose stuff kinda creepy (and solidly creepy once we get Tennant) is how lovely the Doctor is to Mickey, making him appear like a romantic rival. Mickey gets dumped on for no reason (except in retrospect) except seemingly for jealousy.  I don’t have a problem with Doctor-Companion romances in theory because a) it’s a modern TV show and romance or tension is a given and b) each Doctor is effectively a new mortal person and the show only treats them as a singular ancient immortal god when the plot demands it. Rose-Doctor sucked because of the above and because Rose-Ten was just an unbelievably obnoxious pairing that actively made both characters unlikable when they were together. River-Doctor started fine but became grating and annoying because of Moffat’s overuse of the character and the subsequent unnecessary exploration of her entire life that made less sense the more it went on.
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Apr 18, 2022 02:54
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I do have to say that when I recently rewatched all of Davison's run as Five, I didn't detect anything stronger than a "sisterly" vibe between Tegan and Nyssa. If anything, I always thought it was pretty obvious Nyssa had a bit of a thing for Five, she even gave him a kiss at the end of her last episode (though granted, it was a chaste peck on the cheek). That said, if they want to establish them as a couple, well it's no skin off my nose. 
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Apr 18, 2022 04:52
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I never really got that from the pairing either, but again, yeah go for it. Part of it is that with the two-person TARDIS crew being the default and it almost always being male Doctor/female Companion that you have precious few queer pairings in the classic series. There's nothing really plausible in the black and white stuff, Harry Sullivan is pretty much the most boring human being possible, so that leaves you with Five. Come to think of it, I could see Turlough having something for Five, though it would probably not be reciprocated.
Rochallor fucked around with this message at 09:38 on Apr 18, 2022 |
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Apr 18, 2022 06:49
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Jerusalem posted:Oh man, they are REALLY shooting around that costume. Ah I was wondering if it was Covid protocols or what. Makes sense. Fun episode but uh, Chibnall, you did the "character we kinda know sacrifices themselves in the Doctor's stead" bit in Timeless Children and we didn't like it then either
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Apr 18, 2022 08:53
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It was mostly bad, and the sound mix was as terrible as ever. Had to put subtitles on again as thr music was obliterating the effects which were in turn obliterating the dialogue. Also.had to ride the volume control on my TV the whole time as it was mostly too loud at where I normally have it, but sometimes when the music lets up could barely hear anything.
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Apr 18, 2022 10:54
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I don't get any sense that Yaz and the Doctor have any romantic feelings for each other, except that they say they do. Tennant and Rose may have been problematic if you thought about it, but watching the show it was easy to believe these were two people who wanted to be together as a couple.
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Apr 18, 2022 12:22
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Regenerations in general are enough of an excuse for me to let them do whatever they want with a new version of the Doctor and ignore a lot of what came before. This Doctor doesn't do romance, then the next one's halfway to Jark Harkness in terms of horniness/romantic desires, then maybe the next one's a full Jack Harkness in that regard. Let them each have that core of being the Doctor, but give them general traits or mindsets that set them apart from each other and let each fresh actor put their own stamp on things. The show's been going forever, and in the course of that often returns to the same foes or tells very similar stories (I love time loops, but I'm sure a more hardcore fan can tell me how many of those there have been in WHO, and I'm sure it's more than the two that immediately come to mind for me). With that being the case, I'm down for whatever. Hell, give me an arc where the Doctor gets progressively more evil, to the point where they're clearly the antagonist and the audience hates them, and then have that be the Valeyard incarnation with any companions and supporting characters involved teaming up to try to beat the Doctor. That definitely hasn't been done to my knowledge, and while a lot of WHO fans will see where that story is going it's hard to imagine it not being a fun ride anyway. It also seems like the kind of thing that could be done as a fun special episode, an arc across a few episodes, an arc across a season, or an arc across an entire actor/regeneration cycle if they do it subtly. I'll be the first to admit there are plenty of ways to do that poorly, and it's absolutely not the kind of risk I would take with the show now after how people have responded to WHO lately, but with a show this long in the tooth I don't think anything should be inherently off the table. Anyway, right now my expectations are that RTD and the next Doctor will create a show that's firmly in the "this is fine" category where the show basically puts out standard Dr. Who stuff, as in overall it's average with some real bad episodes and some great episodes, and then hopefully we'll get a fresh showrunner and fresh regeneration of the Doctor that'll basically always hit it out of the park. Maybe they'll be the ones to do my dumb Valeyard idea and everyone will get excited for that because they're doing it really well.
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Apr 18, 2022 13:05
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 Feel a little sorry for the Thasmin shippers, but them's the breaks I suppose
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Apr 18, 2022 13:55
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I genuinely think the Yaz/Doctor stuff is Chibnall's best dramatic idea for the show: a person who discovers her own orientation and falls in love with the one person who can't truly love her like she wants. It's top-tier unrequited love plotting! But like someone else said, these feelings only seem to exist whenever they get to the romantic subplot scenes and nowhere else, it feels less convincing. All that aside, a pretty ropey special--the constant cutting/teleporting around felt like I was watching a sentai show without the tone to match.
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Apr 18, 2022 14:32
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Jerusalem posted:I still can't get over how badly edited that was. I have to assume that there were MASSIVE problems with that Sea Devil costume and they edited around it as well as possible, otherwise holy gently caress that was a hack-job. This has basically been every Jodie episode. I don't know if the editors are just straight up bad, or if the directors are just not getting coverage or what. But most of her episodes are awkwardly stitched together.
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Apr 18, 2022 14:32
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From what I've read, and what's been leaked, it seems that this episode lost about twenty minutes of footage -- some of it because of dissatisfaction from the Chinese market, and some of it was just cut during the reshoots. The Sea Devils costumes were also -- like I mentioned earlier in the thread -- a terrible loving mess. They'd previously tried to make them work for season 12, but they'd failed miserably there too. No idea why they tried again knowing that.
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Apr 18, 2022 16:45
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Open Source Idiom posted:From what I've read, and what's been leaked, it seems that this episode lost about twenty minutes of footage -- some of it because of dissatisfaction from the Chinese market, and some of it was just cut during the reshoots. Where can I read more about this?
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Apr 18, 2022 17:18
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The shots with the TARDIS lighting up the sea floor were really nice and created a sense of wonder at least. I wouldn't mind seeing another script from Ella Road, because Chibnall's model of writing most of the show himself is absurdly unsustainable. It should be that the show runner writes a few episodes a season, then edits and gives feedback to the other writers. It's like, Malorie Blackman writing Doctor Who should have been great, but we ended up with the well meaning but clunky Rosa, because Chibnall spread himself far, far too thin. Delegation is key. Also reminds me, remember how people were whining about how 'woke' the show was at Whittaker's first season, yet Ryan is a young black man who has an absentee dad and likes rap music? And that 'this is the moral of the story' speech him and Yas have in Rosa, where Yaz inexplicably becomes a muslim despite her and her family being heavily coded to be Sikh/Hindu previously? Whittaker really is the modern day Colin Baker.
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Apr 18, 2022 17:33
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https://twitter.com/pie1883/status/1516055541931458564
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Apr 18, 2022 19:57
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I really wish they'd run with the (barely suggested probably I was just reading too much into it) idea that this wasn't so much about Yaz being in love with the Doctor as it is an awakening for Yaz or at the very least finally feeling free enough to admit that she's gay. The Doctor helping her work through this while very gently explaining that any feelings she has for the Doctor are basically because she is the most available person and she's wrapping up the freedom of time travel with a newly discovered freedom in expressing her sexual identity. It's very, very nice that the Doctor said that if she was going to have a relationship with anybody it would be Yaz, but as others have said the only real romantic tension between them only appears when they explicitly say there is, and then it disappears for every other scene. Oh my God 
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Apr 19, 2022 00:02
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Does Yaz even know about the idea of regeneration? They've had a few scenes with 13 being all 'this isn't an equal partnership, I have many secrets', but I don't think she's outright told them about all of her previous incarnations being male in a context that doesn't seem like the Doctor is making a flippant joke.
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Apr 19, 2022 00:40
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one of the incarnations really needs to work out an onboarding protocol or simple audio recording for new companions Welcome, I see you have accepted a ride from a stranger. Don't worry, not even half of my travelling companions experience a normal mortal death while travelling with me! You're more likely to see me die, but it's fine!
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Apr 19, 2022 01:24
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Well, that was poo poo.
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Apr 19, 2022 03:17
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bad
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Apr 19, 2022 06:20
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really shockingly poor editing near the beginning, especially with characters teleporting to each other like when they find the guys dad dead. the fish monster was cute in a goofy kinda way. characters are still an absolute void of charisma, besides dan really. Dongicus fucked around with this message at 06:35 on Apr 19, 2022 |
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Apr 19, 2022 06:32
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