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bitmap posted:but this is the point, right? nobody thinks any of this poo poo is an electoral slam dunk- the entire point is the alienation of another generation from politics. Alienation from progressive politics. I was listening to some ghoul on the radio today talking about how Le Pen has scored a surge of votes from young people in France, how this shows that the young generation are excluded from the prospects and prosperity that older people take for granted, how this could be the basis of a long-term resurgence in the hard-right and how it should be a wakeup call to the establishment. And the interviewer just hmm-ed and umm-ed along  No mention that Melenchon, the populist socialist, also rode a wave of youth support and actually placed top of votes for those under 35. And of course here in the UK when we had our own left-wing outsider unexpectedly sweep to power in one of our main political parties, we never heard how the centre and right needed to take this onboard and accept or adapt to this new landscape or court this newly-invigorated voter base. That only applies to right wingers. Great to see the Legitimate Concerns train get rolling again, and hear the Right Wing Politics Ratchet do another 'click'.
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Apr 18, 2022 21:24
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Venomous posted:idk, I feel like both Labour under Kieth and the Democrats under Biden genuinely believe they're doing the right thing, because they're loving neoliberal idiots who don't know how to resist fascism short of saying 'yes, the other folks are fascists, but you need to vote for our neoliberals to keep the fascists out of power for the next five years' speaking as a fat american I don't believe that Biden's Dems genuinely think they're opposing fascism. I don't think they care about opposing fascism at all. I think the entire point is that Bernie's campaign rhetoric and things like the anti-police protests got uncomfortable for establishment Democrats and they want to put the boot down on the neck of the young to show them they have no place in politics. Seems like that's Keith's thing in the UK as well. Why are they doing this? idk, seems like it's not gonna end well for them.
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Apr 18, 2022 21:38
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yeah consider also e.g the dem's response to their fringe populist surge vs the gop's response to their fringe populist surge
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Apr 18, 2022 21:49
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Casey Finnigan posted:speaking as a fat american I don't believe that Biden's Dems genuinely think they're opposing fascism. I don't think they care about opposing fascism at all. I think the entire point is that Bernie's campaign rhetoric and things like the anti-police protests got uncomfortable for establishment Democrats and they want to put the boot down on the neck of the young to show them they have no place in politics. tbh you are exactly right and I really shouldn't make the mistake of thinking they believe in anything idk lmao
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Apr 18, 2022 23:45
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Casey Finnigan posted:Why are they doing this? idk, seems like it's not gonna end well for them. Part of it is pure careerism, but a lot of it is thinking they stand for "sensible" politics and being the political arm of responsible capitalism. So they need to oppose the left who seek to take things away from corporations & their profits, but also oppose Boris/Trump etc because they are incompetent at managing the modern capitalist state Of course this all falls apart when you look at what actual sensible politics would be in the face of the climate catastrophe and housing crisis etc
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Apr 19, 2022 00:08
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I'm not sure it's entirely valid to compare Keith's Labour to the US dems. Like the dems suck a whole bunch, but I don't think they're actively trying to flank from the right by promising more transphobia and fewer taxes than you'll get from the conservatives, while also complimenting them for doing a bang-up job of international relations and pandemic handling.
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Apr 19, 2022 01:17
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Yes the closest the US Dems get is the whole "both sides have valid points and we need a strong Republican party to seek consensus with", not nearly as hilarious as the "that's a mighty fine cock you're loving my wife with, sir" level that uk labour seems to operate on lately
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Apr 19, 2022 01:34
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This thread has become really slow. Does that mean everyone here has succumbed to nihilism? Anyhow, this is interesting. Boris isn't really doing well in the polls right now so the bot army is out in force. https://twitter.com/seanwood1/status/1514245621158498315 It also implies Boris has been involved in politics since he was 7.
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Apr 20, 2022 01:12
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Valko posted:This thread has become really slow. Does that mean everyone here has succumbed to nihilism? Do you actually care about the answer to this question?
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Apr 20, 2022 01:36
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Tactical PM
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Apr 20, 2022 01:43
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a 100 kiloton short range ballistic prime minister has detonated near fulda, germany
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Apr 20, 2022 04:12
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the bin bag has broken and the custard is loose
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Apr 20, 2022 06:43
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it's p obvious that both the dems and new labour have two tiers of operators, the ones on the top who're in on it all being a cynical grift and then below them you have a mass of wimp los, who have been purposely trained wrong, as a joke
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Apr 20, 2022 09:05
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Valko posted:This thread has become really slow. Does that mean everyone here has succumbed to nihilism? There's not anything positive or even funny to really post about right now, so better to post nothing than develop doomer brain just despair posting
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Apr 20, 2022 09:08
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 Vote!
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Apr 20, 2022 09:33
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that len McClusky chap has an good interview on Novara about the whole recent political landscape and even his concern that labour are becoming democrats it was interesting because i’ve never actually seen an interview of him which wasn’t framed as a “here is an evil union man” on tv, and the media seems to just frame him as some corrupt communist
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Apr 20, 2022 09:34
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the sex ghost posted:
Yeah let's do it, let's vote the PM from office.
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Apr 20, 2022 09:38
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Jel Shaker posted:that len McClusky chap has an good interview on Novara about the whole recent political landscape and even his concern that labour are becoming democrats I saw that a few days ago. Surprisingly watchable despite being 1h15 long! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W_y5cIZsr1g
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Apr 20, 2022 10:25
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I've not watched it but it completely side steps the antisemitism smear whenever Corbyn/labour are discussed right? Anyway seems labour are actually going to parachute in ed balls https://twitter.com/Ian_Fraser/status/1476184242463858691?t=gMS41Fc8SHi9RPBK5BdG-Q&s=19
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Apr 20, 2022 10:50
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Andy Burnham is sitting right there too
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Apr 20, 2022 11:15
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No Dignity posted:Andy Burnham is sitting right there too butbutbut Burnham's too much of a *gasp* CORBYNISTA 
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Apr 20, 2022 11:20
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No Dignity posted:Andy Burnham is sitting right there too Burnham can't make his move until starmer has had a large scale failure. Maybe after the local elections.
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Apr 20, 2022 11:20
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Can't decide which party would be funnier to get humiliated in the locals. Got my LIB DEMS WINNING HERE leaflet with dodgy bar chart the other day, our would-be councillor is extremely keen if nothing else and might actually have a chance against whichever labour skeleton we have who's been on the council since about 100BC and attended 4 meetings in that time. Probably not though
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Apr 20, 2022 12:01
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They're going to resurrect Blair out from his crypt and you all know it
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Apr 20, 2022 12:02
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I'm still waiting for Kier to win just so we are fully, finally owned
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Apr 20, 2022 12:17
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gonadic io posted:They're going to resurrect Blair out from his crypt and you all know it and how the papers will cheer! until the election, ofc
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Apr 20, 2022 12:18
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Communist Thoughts posted:I'm still waiting for Kier to win just so we are fully, finally owned No way, he won't even run in the selection, he's just sitting there soaking up all the damage so that his successor doesn't have to. The moment an election is announced he'll state that he doesn't intend to run, I firmly believe.
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Apr 20, 2022 12:19
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I reckon there's probably some pro business "respectable" tory types who will find it too gauche to support bojo but think Kier has a good head on his shoulders and have noticed that the left hate him Whether they'll swing it for him I dunno but it's just about plausible imo. Orrr he eats poo poo
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Apr 20, 2022 12:32
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But that applies to every candidate the labour right would field, and everybody likes a known winner (please don't ask about any time post 2003 or so)
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Apr 20, 2022 12:36
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Plus the Tories will love it, for this very reason:redleader posted:and how the papers will cheer! Who else do they have more ammo on than the architect of the Iraq war?
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Apr 20, 2022 12:47
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Blair to comeback in 2023 and put Britain on the blockchain.
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Apr 20, 2022 12:49
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Dissolve the home office and everyone who works.for it https://twitter.com/SageSussex/status/1516421093371883525?t=ZDxWKeq_oF1wkmSNENODJw&s=19 https://twitter.com/kirstininnes/status/1516487071409582086?t=D9iNH-Qi3SQThrwMS_pH6Q&s=19
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Apr 20, 2022 13:18
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This country is loving sick.
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Apr 20, 2022 13:21
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E: ^^^Jesus christ. That is twisted. Can't wait for Keith to cross to the tories and the papers say to only ever vote tories from now on
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Apr 20, 2022 13:25
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Jose posted:Dissolve the home office and everyone who works.for it disgusting
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Apr 20, 2022 13:31
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Venomous posted:butbutbut Burnham's too much of a *gasp* CORBYNISTA i’ll believe he’s a comrade when i loving see it. it’s very easy to make left wing noises when you’re mayor of manchester. although i guess london is similarly red and sadiq khan has made an art form out of doing and saying less than nothing
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Apr 20, 2022 14:26
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I never said Burnham's a comrade, I said he's someone who the press would vilify as a Corbyn supporter Corbyn was no comrade, after all, since he let dipshits like Kieth into his shadow cabinet and allowed the Labour right to undermine him at every opportunity
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Apr 20, 2022 14:52
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I would not expect a single thing from anyone who could win a leadership election at this point, I just bring up Burnham because he's like the only guy of theirs who seems to have that 'electability' they can't stop banging on about, Ed Balls is just pitiful nostalgia for a guy who failed on his own terms in his own time
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Apr 20, 2022 15:02
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The labour right will destroy Burnham if he won a leadership election
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Apr 20, 2022 15:07
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Jose posted:The labour right will destroy Burnham if he won a leadership election hell, they gave it an attempt in the last mayoral election iirc
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Apr 20, 2022 16:15
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