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CaptCommy posted:Don't mind me, just immediately inserting this into my current BitD game. Something something Non Phylactery Talismans something something.
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Apr 29, 2022 04:27
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PurpleXVI posted:I think that could be a very good RPG but... I don't feel like it would necessarily be a Trek RPG, or need to be a Trek RPG. Star Trek is definitely a setting and tone that's very specific at times and built for certain forms of media. I don't think it's impossible to make and run a fun RPG in the setting, but something more off-brand would be a lot easier. PurpleXVI posted:Do you guys ever feel like you're lucky your players haven't chased you down with torches and pitchforks yet? One thing not seen enough in fantasy settings is in-universe hucksterism, fraud and charlatanism. When there's enough different kinds of magic and applications thereof around that everyone knows about, of course people are going to get weird with it- all the moreso when they do have a measure of Actual Magic. Actually reminds me of that Star Trek episode where a mad scientist thinks he's discovered the secret to immortality through entertaining cells so they don't die of boredom.
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Apr 29, 2022 09:44
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Ghost Leviathan posted:One thing not seen enough in fantasy settings is in-universe hucksterism, fraud and charlatanism. When there's enough different kinds of magic and applications thereof around that everyone knows about, of course people are going to get weird with it- all the moreso when they do have a measure of Actual Magic. Actually reminds me of that Star Trek episode where a mad scientist thinks he's discovered the secret to immortality through entertaining cells so they don't die of boredom. Oh man I love things like that. Over the years what've I thrown at my players... aside from the generic scammers and strange otherworldly beings insisting they can sell the players things like concepts, there was... The Home Of The Future: An ancient civilization had invented what was basically a Smart Home except powered by golems and magic, which meant that, for instance, the doors did not have handles but instead relied on very specific phrasings to open and of course it caught fire every five minutes. It later turned out that the entire civilization had collapsed because they had trusted in the "genius" of someone who was a poorly-hidden Elon Musk expy. He, of course, was still around as a lich and my players greatly loved kicking his rear end and stealing his weed. The Adventuring Channel: A drow civilization had advanced from being someone's poorly hidden fetish to instead being a ruthlessly capitalist society. After mass-producing crystal balls, they set out to capture and enslave as many adventurers as possible, forcing them to star in reality TV that usually involved them being injured, endangered, embarrassed or all three. Included a Jackass knockoff and a knockoff of that crab fisherman show except they were fishing for Illithid tadpoles. An elf society that put my players in daycare and confiscated their weapons because, by the elves' measure, anyone under 500 years old was an immature teenager who couldn't be trusted out on the streets or with weapons. Turned out to be correct, too, for the elves, as their "teenagers" passed through an edgy emo phase where they were a danger to everyone and themselves until their hormones settled down. My players accepted the cookies and juice boxes and then immediately caused the utter implosion of the elven society, as players do. I think those are three of my favourite terrible concepts.
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Apr 29, 2022 11:39
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PurpleXVI posted:An elf society that put my players in daycare and confiscated their weapons because, by the elves' measure, anyone under 500 years old was an immature teenager who couldn't be trusted out on the streets or with weapons. Turned out to be correct, too, for the elves, as their "teenagers" passed through an edgy emo phase where they were a danger to everyone and themselves until their hormones settled down. My players accepted the cookies and juice boxes and then immediately caused the utter implosion of the elven society, as players do. I'm pretty sure this is basically just The Silmarillion.
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Apr 29, 2022 14:24
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I'm not sure Tolkien elves ever become mature.
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Apr 29, 2022 14:26
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Xiahou Dun posted:Something something Non Phylactery Talismans something something. They don’t make you immortal, they just give you an unspecified connection to someone born after your death.
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Apr 29, 2022 15:04
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Xiahou Dun posted:Something something Non Phylactery Talismans something something. Non-Foresakeable Thaums
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Apr 29, 2022 15:37
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Absurd Alhazred posted:Non-Foresakeable Thaums poo poo, you got me. I didn't feel great about swapping a "ph" for an "f".
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Apr 29, 2022 16:25
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Also reminded of some posts suddenly. 
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Apr 29, 2022 19:03
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PurpleXVI posted:I think personally for me it's something like... Star Trek doesn't feel like it has a lot of space for player agency or non-canon conflicts. Spaceships don't really feel like they're something some group of goobers would just own, they'd have to be Federation bridge crew or some such. Secondly, the world feels organized into a few large species-defined power blocs, so if there's a conflict going on it's not some small-scale thing, it's going to be a galactic-scale war on the horizon. Plus the tools available to players would be a bit too powerful. Just having replicators, transporters and players with five brain cells to knock together would allow them to resolve almost every issue because replicators and transporters have never really been given costs or limitations in the Star Trek universe beyond "in this episode it would be too easy for them to solve everything with it." As for the small scale stuff it is funny to me because like, I look at Star Wars and I think either 'wow! you could create, like, your own version of those kinds of stories with your party as the leads' or possibly 'drat, this would be just perfect for cribbiing from Westerns and martial arts movies,' and it seems like they have JUST BARELY, RECENTLY gotten the first part of that second idea in some of the original media, after 45 years.
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Apr 30, 2022 08:11
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Nessus posted:I think with regards to Trek vs. Wars in this situation, what matters to a lot of people - and I'm not actually sure it's universal, it's more like the 'ragtag bunch of weirdos, misfits, and found family people do grungy stuff and eventually escalate into huge bullshit' concept for an RPG campaign has become kind of the Joseph Campbell monomyth - is the feeling that nobody's telling you what to do and that it's all your own idea. In either case, of course, you are in fact working with the GM. I would say, though, that I wouldn't want to do any kind of tabletop adventure in the TNG/DS9/VOY era; TOS/TAS is way more flexible, and in those periods the transporter was much less of a magic box. I mean the original original media was based heavily on The Hidden Fortress I do agree that *most* gamers do tend to want a game setup where it feels like they're in charge, but I don't think that necessarily makes Trek nonviable for gaming, it's just never going to be as much of a draw as SW or D&D. Which is fine, we can have games that have a narrower focus.
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Apr 30, 2022 09:32
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Maxwell Lord posted:I mean the original original media was based heavily on The Hidden Fortress
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Apr 30, 2022 09:39
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Nessus posted:With regards to Star Wars stuff, I've often wondered how much of a match there is between the online rhetoric about what they wanted/hated the films and what actually ends up going into people's tabletop games. People complain tons about the space wizards, except without the Space Wizard seasoning it kind of does just become 'running drugs with more special effects'. Especially since that entire mil-fic aura around TIE Fighter/X-Wing seems like it's gone by. Kinda funny given that's basically Dune, except the space wizards are drug powered in that to tie it all together Also the whole starfighter aspect everyone's kinda forgotten how to do since flight sims became niche and shmups became even more niche Nessus posted:I think with regards to Trek vs. Wars in this situation, what matters to a lot of people - and I'm not actually sure it's universal, it's more like the 'ragtag bunch of weirdos, misfits, and found family people do grungy stuff and eventually escalate into huge bullshit' concept for an RPG campaign has become kind of the Joseph Campbell monomyth - is the feeling that nobody's telling you what to do and that it's all your own idea. In either case, of course, you are in fact working with the GM. I would say, though, that I wouldn't want to do any kind of tabletop adventure in the TNG/DS9/VOY era; TOS/TAS is way more flexible, and in those periods the transporter was much less of a magic box. Yeah, and the galaxy is clearly more of a Wild West in TOS/TAS, even still having currency and tech with limitations, compared to TNG onwards where the Federation is explicitly a superpower and exploring utopian ideas. Though honestly there's still plenty of room in either setting for adventurer stuff in some corner of the galaxy, whether you're doing Orville/Lower Decks stuff of a C-list Starfleet crew, or mix it up as say, a Klingon ship questing for glory, or a bunch of ragtag weirdos who just happen to exist in that setting. The whole premise is that there's always tons of poo poo going on at the fringes of known space, and you get full blown adventurer types like Vash, and the Outrageous Okona, with their own stories. Also, I know right? So many years of the comically formulaic and incestuous EU and the Disney sequels somehow doing everything they did but even worse, it took the TV guys (who were basically just picking up where they left off from Clone Wars- which also understood the aesthetic, cribbing from pulp sci-fi and war movies just like the prequels did. Ghost Leviathan fucked around with this message at 10:04 on Apr 30, 2022 |
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Apr 30, 2022 09:56
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Nessus posted:With regards to Star Wars stuff, I've often wondered how much of a match there is between the online rhetoric about what they wanted/hated the films and what actually ends up going into people's tabletop games. People complain tons about the space wizards, except without the Space Wizard seasoning it kind of does just become 'running drugs with more special effects'. Especially since that entire mil-fic aura around TIE Fighter/X-Wing seems like it's gone by. Doing an Edge of the Empire game centered around a small time gang competing in an illegal swoop bike circuit right now.
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Apr 30, 2022 14:57
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Relevant Tangent posted:Fragged Empire is great because it has mechanics for adding low level mooks that hate a specific PC to encounters as a reward for leveling up. Also because of the way spotting someone vs hiding works mechanically RAW everyone is better at hiding than spotting regardless of equipment and bonuses so it's a setting where ambushers are constantly getting ambushed. Uh, are you sure you're actually running that RAW? Stealth checks don't just have to pass the highest Defense vs. Stealth on the enemy team, said Defense is increased by one for every enemy on the field, including the minion equivalents. Stealth is normally a huge investment with huge pay-offs, requiring dedicating nearly every ability slot to relevant abilities.
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Apr 30, 2022 15:00
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Colonel Cool posted:Doing an Edge of the Empire game centered around a small time gang competing in an illegal swoop bike circuit right now. Living your life a quarter parsec at a time.
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Apr 30, 2022 16:26
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Lumbermouth posted:Living your life a quarter parsec at a time. It's about (space) family.
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Apr 30, 2022 18:51
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Been doing tomb of horrors for the last couple of months and lol the GM put loving megalovania to play on the acererak fight
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Apr 30, 2022 19:25
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Ghost Leviathan posted:Kinda funny given that's basically Dune, except the space wizards are drug powered in that to tie it all together Also they better loving learn because that poo poo is cash, god drat. TIE Fighter was too loving good. quote:Yeah, and the galaxy is clearly more of a Wild West in TOS/TAS, even still having currency and tech with limitations, compared to TNG onwards where the Federation is explicitly a superpower and exploring utopian ideas. Though honestly there's still plenty of room in either setting for adventurer stuff in some corner of the galaxy, whether you're doing Orville/Lower Decks stuff of a C-list Starfleet crew, or mix it up as say, a Klingon ship questing for glory, or a bunch of ragtag weirdos who just happen to exist in that setting. The whole premise is that there's always tons of poo poo going on at the fringes of known space, and you get full blown adventurer types like Vash, and the Outrageous Okona, with their own stories. It would be relatively simple for a GM, or even an official product, to write a list of 'this is what replicator/transporter technology does. Here are some things from the program which are not, at all, in official specs, but might be possible with player-character ingenuity and appetite for risk. Here are a couple of things we are ignoring.' Colonel Cool posted:Doing an Edge of the Empire game centered around a small time gang competing in an illegal swoop bike circuit right now.
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Apr 30, 2022 20:08
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Regarding Monty Cook,FMguru posted:His games have lots of content, lots of details, all of which are very well presented, and none of which are at all interesting. I was struggling to put into words why I didn't like what he had done with Numenera, but this really just encapsulated it for me. His stuff has great promise at first blush, but the way it is carried out, it's just dull. The Ninth world? Earth set an ungodly number of years in the future where science has mostly become mysticism after a number of apocalypses/singularities/who knows what with all sorts of weird cultures? Hell yeah! A traditional dungeon crawl and MMO style fetch quests in a pastoral type village? We've all seen this before, why dangle the premise of real creativity and then abruptly shunt you back into the D&D mindset? It's a waste of creativity and cool ideas. So anyway that's my irrelevant Monty Cook take. I do have to give him credit for introducing me to the podcast of Old Gods of Appalachia through the kickstarter. I was not aware of it before then. However I'm not going to support the kickstarter because I know what Monty Cook does with cool settings. Puts them in a stratified straightjacket of a D&D clone. Also I agree with FMguru about what he said above with one cypher exception. 
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Apr 30, 2022 21:20
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Nessus posted:It would be relatively simple for a GM, or even an official product, to write a list of 'this is what replicator/transporter technology does. Here are some things from the program which are not, at all, in official specs, but might be possible with player-character ingenuity and appetite for risk. Here are a couple of things we are ignoring.' In my opinion if a GM has to write that list, then the official products have failed. If nothing else the official products should at least provide a list of what's "canon" and then offer suggestions to modify it, how to prevent the PC's just beaming out whenever they're in the "find out" part of loving around, how to prevent them from just replicating a stack of RDX and beaming it on to any problem they need blown up, etc. Offloading that work entirely on to the GM is the point at which you haven't bought a game, you've bought an idea-guy's pitch for a game and now have to do all the actual work of making it a game yourself.
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Apr 30, 2022 21:44
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I've never played STO, that might be more useful as a guide for a ST RPG than actual ST shows, similar to how SWG is frankly a better place to start for a Star Wars RPG than actual SW movies.Jimbozig posted:Burning Wheel took a lot of inspiration from Earthsea for its magic (some variants - there are a bunch of different versions of magic in BW). I would guess you could do a decent job of it there, picking the right lifepaths. I did bother to google "earthsea RPG" afterwards and found out that Le Guin was rather explicitly opposed to there being any TTRPGs based on her work, and I don't really blame her since the people pitching her had their experience with like DND and such. I still would like there to be one, since I think she kind of saw TTRPGs as too much in the Conan tradition and Earthsea is such an explicit rejection of that Conan tradition that any decent RPG would also be a strong contrast. I guess Wanderhome is probably the best that currently exists but I think that doesn't deal with a lot of what Earthsea is.
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Apr 30, 2022 22:16
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A hardcore indie earthsea rpg would be amazing
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May 1, 2022 02:15
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sebmojo posted:A hardcore indie earthsea rpg would be amazing Indeed.
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May 1, 2022 04:50
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I feel like a game designed to evoke the feeling of Earthsea wouldn't really gain anything by being set in Earthsea. The setting isn't really what makes those books what they are.
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May 1, 2022 09:54
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I'm curious what people in this thread would consider the feeling of Earthsea? Because what I remember most is that like two out of the seven or so different Earthsea protagonists we get to encounter actually, actively does stuff and the rest mostly just sit around waiting for someone else to come along and change their life and situations, often disregarding several "calls to adventure" for a variety of reasons.
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May 1, 2022 13:05
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Nessus posted:I figure in TOS you still have the Federation as a good and caring space-nation who you can stand up for rhetorically and such (which, itself, makes people uncomfortable now a lot of the time). The big things to me that make it stand out are, first, the narrative tone of the stories were a lot more pulpy, and second, you avoid the simultaneous risk of "the transporter/replicator/warp particle fountain can do everything" and just as importantly the anxiety about that stuff which I think is probably more influential on the noosphere of the subject.
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May 1, 2022 14:36
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potatocubed posted:I feel like a game designed to evoke the feeling of Earthsea wouldn't really gain anything by being set in Earthsea. The setting isn't really what makes those books what they are. I suppose. I mean the setting provides a bit of a jumping off point for trying to do what I'd really want to get out of Earthsea, which is the philosophy around conflict and the tools the characters actually use to resolve conflicts. I think in particular the names thing, which is thematically very potent and I can imagine making it a good game system but I can't think of anything that's ever been like that and the how of it is not intuitive enough to me to just do it. Maybe I'll get inspired but I've got a lot on my plate lately. I do think a lot of the feeling of Earthsea I was able to capture in my Wanderhome campaign but I'd like to see if I can do something more agentic with the tools that Le Guin described. PurpleXVI posted:I'm curious what people in this thread would consider the feeling of Earthsea? Because what I remember most is that like two out of the seven or so different Earthsea protagonists we get to encounter actually, actively does stuff and the rest mostly just sit around waiting for someone else to come along and change their life and situations, often disregarding several "calls to adventure" for a variety of reasons. I mean I'd say this is a fully unique read of Earthsea, and I'm a little confused by the question because the actions of the protagonists are not generally what people mean by the feeling of a book, they usually mean the narrative ornamentation and set dressing and broader vibe. The feeling of Lord of the Rings is more contained in descriptions of the Elvish linguistics than the actions of Frodo, for example. For what the feeling of Earthsea as a series is, I'd first point to it being expansive - travel and distances have this incredible weight to them, and mostly seen in Wizard of and Farthest Shore, you have communities that you can get to but that are also surprisingly isolated. Which leans into the narration having this particular tone around familiarity - the narrator just assumes you know the locations and such, which is alienating, but the narrator is not hostile and neither are most of the strangers encountered, creating this feeling of being at a party where you don't know anybody but everybody's nice to you anyway and you're able to pick up on the cues without actually understanding them. A very cool vibe imo (FWI this is the thing that I think Wanderhome nails). And this alternates with stuff that is genuinely unsettling and mysterious, Tombs in particular is just overflowing with sense of a disturbing unknown that must be constantly navigated. A large component and I think in some ways what is the thing that I'd most like to see in an RPG is that it's mythic but nonviolent. It is very much a mythic story, honestly feels more mythic to me than Conan or Lord of the Rings, but pretty much all mythic stories revolve around slaughter, whether its Beowulf and Grendel or Gilgamesh and Humbaba. It creates a very curious feeling, having a setting where "soldier" isn't seemingly the profession of 75% of the people, where sailors and scholars are the ones who confront these grand narratives.
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May 1, 2022 15:41
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Well, see, that's where I'm confused because generally if I want to play a game in a setting, right? My first thought would be: "what the protagonists are getting up to here or something adjacent to that(wow imagine if I played in this setting and I took the Skull Worm's offer rather than turning it down!!!!) are really cool and interesting, I want more of that." My memory of reading the Earthsea stories is that in two of them we have a protagonist who actually moves about and experiences the setting and has goals and interests, where there are conflicts that need resolving and which he participates in the resolution of. The remainder, the main/viewpoint character sits around, occasionally walks in a circle, gets brutalized by some random thing, potentially has the option to do something about it, but generally does not really... do anything or go places. In general the feeling I got after reading the Earthsea stories was that the author was disdainful of the whole idea of going places and resolving issues and generally had a negative view of the people who did so. All of the aspects that I could imagine a player in the Earthsea universe getting engaged with are aspects that I feel are presented as ultimately being bad for everyone involved. Don't use magic, don't talk to dragons, don't poke around the interstice between life and death, don't get into fights, don't go on adventures, don't try to improve things for people near you, don't go to weird old castles, just sit at home, mend some socks and wait for your problems' resolution to occur naturally or for you to die of old age. I get what you're presenting as the "feel" of Earthsea that you like, but if it's just "not everyone is a combat-hardened murderhobo, farmers and fishermen are important, too," we already have WFRP which is a setting I feel has considerably more space for people to go places, do things.
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May 1, 2022 16:17
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PurpleXVI posted:Well, see, that's where I'm confused because generally if I want to play a game in a setting, right? My first thought would be: "what the protagonists are getting up to here or something adjacent to that(wow imagine if I played in this setting and I took the Skull Worm's offer rather than turning it down!!!!) are really cool and interesting, I want more of that." I mean this is not the literary analysis thread so apologies but like, this just is not at all similar to my read on Earthsea. Admittedly I have only read the first 4 but also I have read them all fairly recently and I just...don't see it like that at all. I can kind of see Arren as being fairly passive but Ged and Tenar are extremely active protagonists, profoundly engaged with the world and the problems in it, more so than most fictional protagonists I can think of. I particularly read the "don't x" passage here as almost 180 degrees from what I read in Earthsea, the successes of the protagonists require that they poke around in old castles and the nature of reality and befriend dragons and use magic. There is pain but there is also glory and that is adventure and its good. The mistakes the protagonists make tend to be things like trusting malicious authorities. Ged and Tenar in particular engage with verbs that I've so far never seen handled by an RPG to my satisfaction - Ged succeeds through research, listening, curiosity, while Tenar's powers rest in social connections and clever applications of her role in society and how it changes. I've never played an RPG where I felt like research was anything deeper than "a meter fills up when you roll dice and when its full you learn something," and I'm profoundly dissatisfied with nearly every social mechanics I've seen (I can think of Wanderhome and Firebrands as being fairly good but those are VERY narrow games). I suppose that's part of why I'm thinking about this. I hope I'm not coming across as hostile or judgmental, I'm feeling mostly curious, but I just don't see those books that way and I also don't really see using RPG settings like that (like when I think about AW, I don't think "what if I just joined forces with Lord Humongous" and when I think of SW roleplay I don't think "What if I personally had the chance to kill Lando," I think like far more broadly about "surviving in the wasteland" and "owning a spaceship")
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May 1, 2022 17:58
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Oh, no, you don't come across as hostile, I just don't understand your perspective at all. In particular I found Tenar to be incredibly passive, especially in the later stories where she's a central character(it feels like every chance she has to go and do something, she sits at home instead until at the very end things are fixed without her intervention). Ged is kind of the exception in that he's the one character who goes out and does things and where his poking around doesn't feel framed as bad(...mostly, at least). There's another female protag whose name eludes me who feels almost like she's about to be important and pro-active but then at the eleventh hour a deus ex machina just kind of yanks the carpet out from underneath it all. And like, at least one of the later stories felt very much "all of magic and other human attempts to change the status quo were unnatural mistakes"-vibe. I am entirely down with an RPG based around your perspective "go explore, be curious, but do not get into punching fights with everything that moves and breathes, you morons, perhaps try talking" but that to me feels like a narrow part of the Earthsea stories I read. Also perhaps I misframed it, but to me when something is set in a literary universe, what the main characters get up to feels, to me, like it usually frames the focus of the setting, the stakes and what's possible in the setting. Like if every main character in a book series is a swashbuckling slaughterman, then I do not think: "Ah, yes, an excellent setting wherein to be a farmer or perhaps a quiet monk who lives in a box." What succeeds and fails for them establishes the tone of the setting, whether negotiated compromises are even possible with the Blorg, whether players need to be careful because they fall down after one shot or whether they, like Trunk Slabmeat, can eat fifty Blorg arrows without flinching. PurpleXVI fucked around with this message at 18:52 on May 1, 2022 |
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May 1, 2022 18:50
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Our very own Open Sketchbook is posting developmental material from her take on a Trek RPG on Twitter. Torchship has a lot of promise at an early stage.
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May 1, 2022 20:56
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Splicer posted:A chunk of this is why I ran my game in TOS. The other thing is that in TOS you're a lot more independent. You pretty much are the federation 90% of the time and there's no zoom chats with admirals putting their input in, just the occasional telegram message with a massive time delay. I've been watching a couple of TOS episodes recently, and the enterprise's role is very amusing sometimes. One episode I watched their mission was to give remote researcher's their yearly medical check up, and the background time pressure was that they were supposed to deliver a shipment of chili peppers before they went bad.
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May 1, 2022 21:15
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The legally complicated spin off Star Fleet Battles universe/continuity/license holders had an RPG that used the premise of "Prime Teams", a small group of handpicked and highly cross trained Diplomat/Commando/Engineer/etc specialists whose job was to go to various hotspots and fix problems. You could easily combine that with a small ship like the Archer-class scout ship that features in the B-cannon novels: 
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May 1, 2022 23:03
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The best premise I ever saw for a Trek game was that post about the Third Man style adventure on occupied Cardassia. Occupation rules require every troubleshooter team to have at least one Romulan, one Klingon, one Cardassian and one Federation officer, and together you go around putting out fires in the wreckage of the Dominion War. Leftover Jemadar, Vorta carving out their own fiefdoms, Ferengi weapons merchants buying up all the war surplus they can get their hands on to resell on backwater planets. The race to secure loose WMDs left behind by the major powers. Klingons emptying whole occupied cities as slave labor. Romulans scooping up Cardassian experts in biogenic warfare. Renegade Federation officers who never want to stop killing Breen.
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May 1, 2022 23:22
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DalaranJ posted:I've been watching a couple of TOS episodes recently, and the enterprise's role is very amusing sometimes. One episode I watched their mission was to give remote researcher's their yearly medical check up, and the background time pressure was that they were supposed to deliver a shipment of chili peppers before they went bad.
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May 2, 2022 00:04
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A setting like DS9, where you've got a crew with differing motives in a complicated setting with lots of external forces pulling in different directions, would work really well for the Hillfolk system.
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May 2, 2022 01:04
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DS9 troupe system TRPG
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May 2, 2022 03:50
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You could probably take Dune's Drives (value statements, etc.) and use them in place of Attributes in Star Trek Adventures, and you'd be off to the races with almost zero work.
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May 2, 2022 04:27
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DS9 RPG should be like Everyone Is John but instead of a pretty gross joke about mental illness the players are different aspects of Miles O’Brien’s personality. Instead of skills each player has a FATE style aspect like Stubbornness that they can tap to succeed or invoke in the negative for narrative bennies. The GM is named after O’Brien’s one true antagonist in the series : Keiko.
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May 2, 2022 04:28
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