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Thaddius the Large posted:I have this weird thing where doing a bad thing is bad, and even if the other guy would do something worse you should still call out said bad things You should both call out the bad thing and act to prevent the worse thing, these are not incompatible
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May 13, 2022 17:46
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The really-hard-to-digest message for a lot of votescolds is that poo poo is not going to get better. Lesser-evilism is not a solution it is, at absolute best, a delaying tactic but any time bought with those lesser evil measures keeps getting wasted by those higher up than them. The entire corrupt institution has made good and god drat sure any effective means of reform that the hard-fought delays might make time to implement, will never happen. The only two options are "make everything worse" and "make nothing better". Look out for you and yours, invest in mutual aid, keep it local. The cavalry isn't coming to save us.
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May 13, 2022 17:47
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haveblue posted:You should both call out the bad thing and act to prevent the worse thing, these are not incompatible I really hope we're going to get some kind of Gohan goes Super Saiyan 2 for the First Time Against Super Perfect Cell ending here because the Democrats keep throwing Republicans a senzu bean insisting that the Republican party must be strong and healthy which is not the kind of behavior one would think goes along with "preventing the worse thing" and I really question the validity of the idea that voting for democrats is preventing the worse then when one of their core messages is that the people that would do the worst things need to be made stronger
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May 13, 2022 17:48
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Mellow Seas posted:It's craven political messaging, and you all act like it's a serious policy pronouncement. Having seen the dems for the past decade or so, I would have to say craven political messaging is democratic policy. NASA grew some weeds on moonrocks. So at least once we finish ruining this planet, one billionaire and his hundreds of clones can go take over the rest of the universe.
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May 13, 2022 17:52
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Oh snap I got some red text. From just a few minutes ago? Is there a way to find out?
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May 13, 2022 17:55
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Reminder to please avoid shitposting and sniping at each other. If you've caught probations for similar recently, that starts at a day.BonoMan posted:Oh snap I got some red text. From just a few minutes ago? Is there a way to find out? No. Also congrats
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May 13, 2022 17:57
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Saying “can you imagine how bad trump would’ve been? At least we’re not doing that” is just literally Making Up A Presidency To Get Mad At, a variation on a popular internet game. This is the presidency we have, and no matter how bad you imagine Trump would be, in this one, we have a desiccated Q-Tip telling us to stop harping about abortion, celebrate deficit reduction and telling people to spend pandemic money on cops. That last one might be in some way smart because cops are going to be in serious demand if the only response to people in the streets is beating and killing them. This is a failed presidency, you don’t get “the other guy might have failed worse” as a defense.
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May 13, 2022 17:58
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Fritz the Horse posted:
Interesting - I believe it's the second time in 20 years! I think it just appeared so I guess someone was mad that I suggested having a failure of a democratic president can entrench the GOP even further. Awesome.
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May 13, 2022 17:59
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selec posted:Saying “can you imagine how bad trump would’ve been? At least we’re not doing that” is just literally Making Up A Presidency To Get Mad At, a variation on a popular internet game. It's no defense. I'm grateful that this travesty of a presidency is ever so slightly less horrible than the prior one, but both are proof that we need to tear it all down and build something new.
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May 13, 2022 18:02
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Tnega posted:Having seen the dems for the past decade or so, I would have to say craven political messaging is democratic policy. I think it's more of a consequence of our terrible polarized politics than a conscious decision of Dem leadership in this case, though. It was clear what Biden wanted to do, it was all in BBB, it was all good - he just didn't get to do it, because >1 Democratic Senators decided that something other than "sensible progressive policy" was their goal. So you're not left with much to run on. "Uhhh... we gave you some money you can use for crime, I guess?" is a terrible message, and fairly politically pointless, but it's just an example of what you're left with when you can't actually legislate. Which has happened to both parties when they have majorities so threadbare. (E: One true thing that the message does reflect, very poorly, that actually is to the credit of the administration (via ARP), is that state and local budgets are generally in very good shape right now.) selec posted:Saying “can you imagine how bad trump would’ve been? At least we’re not doing that” is just literally Making Up A Presidency To Get Mad At, a variation on a popular internet game. Mellow Seas fucked around with this message at 18:07 on May 13, 2022 |
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May 13, 2022 18:03
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Mellow Seas posted:You know, that's not terribly unfair. I’m gonna be honest and I think I speak for a lot of folks in this thread when I say I don’t have any faith that Democratic leadership wants anything but more money and Alzheimer’s medications refills. They talked a lovely game and have managed to fail to live up to even their stunted, capitalist goals. They loving suck and in a just society would’ve self-exiled. no point in rewarding failure, so I’m going to be working to convince people to not vote at this point. I’m going to host a BBQ and give free beer to non-voters. quote:Yeah, people just making up "what Donald Trump is like as President," something they have no actual evidence for, okay, sure I love to sell a car by saying “there are so many shittier cars out there. This one? Oh it’s lovely, bad as hell. But there are shittier ones.” Wealthiest country in the world and this is the best they can come up with. They have really hosed people’s heads up.
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May 13, 2022 18:09
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I mean the whole thing started with someone saying "congratulations on voting for Biden, boy don't you feel dumb now!" to which it's entirely appropriate to respond that Trump would've been even worse. Neither is particularly helpful but there you have it.
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May 13, 2022 18:33
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Mellow Seas posted:Yeah. Donald Trump could literally be President right now. People pretend things can't be worse, despite the fact that we have been very aggressively reminded by Justice Alito that they very much can. This is reaching cult like arguments about how any messages from your leaders that you don't like are actually just lies they're telling to win over idiots. It's far easier to believe Biden just thinks police need more money.
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May 13, 2022 18:40
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Here's some news. I wish we would stop giving money and weapons to these assholes NYT article on Isreal police attacking Shireen Abu Akleh's funeral quote:JERUSALEM — Israeli police officers on Friday assaulted mourners at the funeral procession of a prominent Palestinian American journalist killed this week in the occupied West Bank, forcing pallbearers to nearly drop the coffin.
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May 13, 2022 18:40
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Sir Lemming posted:I mean the whole thing started with someone saying "congratulations on voting for Biden, boy don't you feel dumb now!" to which it's entirely appropriate to respond that Trump would've been even worse. Neither is particularly helpful but there you have it. Keep in mind there is frustration in what Dems have done that would have been more challenging if the Liberals had to eat the poo poo sandwich for once: virtualboyCOLOR posted:
The above would not have stopped if Trump remained in office. I see this as a classic case of winning the battle but losing the war. It would have sucked short term but long term would have been better if Biden lost. vvvv least surprising thing next to Dems attacking the left while schmoozing the right. virtualboyCOLOR fucked around with this message at 18:48 on May 13, 2022 |
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May 13, 2022 18:46
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Fresh off of twitter firing the head of it's consumer and revenue divisions last night musk says the deal is on hold now. Time for twitter to get that 1 billion dollar back out fee ready. https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1525080945274998785
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May 13, 2022 18:47
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Gumball Gumption posted:This is reaching cult like arguments about how any messages from your leaders that you don't like are actually just lies they're telling to win over idiots. It's far easier to believe Biden just thinks police need more money. On this very page selec has insisted that the nine months of negotiating with M&S over BBB, just to end up looking like an ineffective loser, was just something Biden did for fun while actually just refilling "Alzheimer's medication" (ableist, btw). selec posted:I’m gonna be honest and I think I speak for a lot of folks in this thread when I say I don’t have any faith that Democratic leadership wants anything but more money and Alzheimer’s medications refills.
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May 13, 2022 18:49
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cat botherer posted:I don't understand how anyone can defend Biden at this point. Pretty amazing to simultaneously encourage defunding a pandemic that is still killing and maiming enormous numbers of Americans, especially poor and minorities, while advocating to increase funding to police forces who oppress and kill those same minorities. The tweet and article both talk about diverting the money to public safety, not police departments specifically. Despite the writer's obvious eagerness to drag the subject to policing, there's actually far more that goes into public safety than just plain old policing - as any "defund the police" advocate knows! Lib and let die posted:I really hope we're going to get some kind of Gohan goes Super Saiyan 2 for the First Time Against Super Perfect Cell ending here because the Democrats keep throwing Republicans a senzu bean insisting that the Republican party must be strong and healthy which is not the kind of behavior one would think goes along with "preventing the worse thing" and I really question the validity of the idea that voting for democrats is preventing the worse then when one of their core messages is that the people that would do the worst things need to be made stronger So the centrists would be Goku and progressives would be Gohan? That's probably not the best thing to aim for, given that Gohan was a fuckup who got everyone else pummeled pretty badly while he sat around whining and making excuses for why he couldn't fight right. Even after he powered up, he still hosed things up twice and had to have Goku come in and clean up after his mistakes. I'll admit this is a pretty accurate description of progressives' efforts against conservative Cell, though: 
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May 13, 2022 18:53
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Main Paineframe posted:The tweet and article both talk about diverting the money to public safety, not police departments specifically. Despite the writer's obvious eagerness to drag the subject to policing, there's actually far more that goes into public safety than just plain old policing - as any "defund the police" advocate knows! Goku had the common sense to try and stay dead when he realized he was the biggest threat to the planet's safety - you're giving Democrats too much credit.
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May 13, 2022 18:54
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Mellow Seas posted:On this very page selec has insisted that the nine months of negotiating with M&S over BBB, just to end up looking like an ineffective loser, was just something Biden did for fun while actually just refilling "Alzheimer's medication" (ableist, btw). Just to clear a few things up here
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May 13, 2022 18:55
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I don't scold people for not voting, I scold people for not organizing. Voting is the bare minimum. Live your values, build power, engage in activism and direct action.
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May 13, 2022 19:00
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Main Paineframe posted:So the centrists would be Goku and progressives would be Gohan? That's probably not the best thing to aim for, given that Gohan was a fuckup who got everyone else pummeled pretty badly while he sat around whining and making excuses for why he couldn't fight right. Even after he powered up, he still hosed things up twice and had to have Goku come in and clean up after his mistakes. i'm here to be that loving nerd and point out gohan's still the one who actually killed cell while goku A. actually only killed king kai and himself while accomplishing nothing and B. is the one who let it get that bad in the first place in this metaphor piccolo is bernie sanders
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May 13, 2022 19:03
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TGLT posted:i'm here to be that loving nerd and point out gohan's still the one who actually killed cell while goku A. actually only killed king kai and himself while accomplishing nothing and B. is the one who let it get that bad in the first place I might make the argument that Bernie is Yamcha, but I'm extremely bitter.
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May 13, 2022 19:05
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Lib and let die posted:I might make the argument that Bernie is Yamcha, but I'm extremely bitter. Warren is Yamcha
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May 13, 2022 19:07
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Who's Android 18 here? John McCain?
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May 13, 2022 19:07
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goddamitFritz the Horse posted:Reminder to please avoid shitposting and sniping at each other. If you've caught probations for similar recently, that starts at a day. that's enough Dragonball Z derail unless you wanna roll the dice on being particularly funny and/or insightful
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May 13, 2022 19:09
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Fritz the Horse posted:goddamit I'm sorry, but also, I'm not. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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May 13, 2022 19:09
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Lib and let die posted:I might make the argument that Bernie is Yamcha, but I'm extremely bitter. A guy with no power, who never, ever actually had any power, was considered an ineffectual joke from the first moment he appeared on screen and then became a veritable meme in and of himself based on how many times he immediately ate poo poo and died? You sort of suck at making DBZ analogies, I’m glad you got whacked for it. E: posted this before seeing the warning
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May 13, 2022 19:12
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Fair warning that I've seen like 2 animes in my entire life and DBZ was not one of them, and my interpretation is that I have the moral authority to start banning people for liking anime in here.
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May 13, 2022 19:13
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Professor Beetus posted:Fair warning that I've seen like 2 animes in my entire life and DBZ was not one of them, and my interpretation is that I have the moral authority to start banning people for liking anime in here. Someone should make a post about what Gundams they think the Democrats are vs, how Republicans just kick doors in and poo poo down peoples necks and laugh like jacked up gigachads because they know how to win elections and all centrists and leftists know how to do is lose and cry.
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May 13, 2022 19:16
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In American politics it's Zeon all the way down.
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May 13, 2022 19:19
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nine-gear crow posted:Someone should make a post about what Gundams they think the Democrats are vs, how Republicans just kick doors in and poo poo down peoples necks and laugh like jacked up gigachads because they know how to win elections and all centrists and leftists know how to do is lose and cry. The Republicans, like Zeon, love fascism and faux macho warmaking while the Democrats, like the Feddies, will play at being respectable but happily gas a shitload of protestors if they feel the slightest bit threatened. I'd contest that rigging elections count as winning them, but I mean gently caress it's a pointless distinction when they're still taking power. However all this ends, dems staunchly refusing to act on voting rights is going to go down in theoretical history books as the dumbest loving thing they've done.
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May 13, 2022 19:23
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World Famous W posted:Here's some news. I wish we would stop giving money and weapons to these assholes poo poo like this is completely loving bipartisan.
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May 13, 2022 19:34
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Nucleic Acids posted:poo poo like this is completely loving bipartisan. One of the funniest things to come out of this legislative season was AoC voting no to give Israel a few billion dollars for missles and after Pelosi scolded her she started crying and changed her vote.
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May 13, 2022 19:41
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Did he give this speech yet? Maybe he'll surprise everyone by clarifying that crime prevention means poverty reduction, not more cops. VideoGameVet posted:Ukraine would be in a very bad state if Trump had won in 2020 Well, it's a relief that American voters made the right choice for the people of Ukraine.
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May 13, 2022 20:04
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Mellow Seas posted:It's not a "cult like argument" to say that the leader of the big-tent political party, out of our two (2) major political parties, is sometimes going to make messaging decisions that are not directly reflective of their core priorities, or that are made for primarily political reasons. If Biden wanted to pass a bill with a bunch of funding for police, he probably could. Instead he gave this milquetoast message that affects basically nothing. the QAnon people still, despite all evidence over the last four years, believe that any day now Trump is going to finally set off the Storm, arrest/execute all the pedophiles, reveal JFK Jr. is alive and has the cure for cancer, and make their kids willing to talk to them again. in their frenzied reaffirmations of belief they are developing ever-more arcane rationalizations for why the universe is not aligning with the story they have told themselves. sure, it may -look- like Trump has no interest in doing any of these things, if he's aware of them at all. but he's engaged in a very important struggle with the forces of all that is evil, and so he speaks in codes decipherable only by the Elect. they must have faith that one day soon, he will deliver them. because otherwise, they have spent the last however-many years engaged in tragic self-delusion, rather than face a world where the thing they trusted to save them from their misery was never planning to help them. and it is better to believe their continued suffering is somehow in service of that glorious vision of the future, than to believe they have tortured themselves for nothing. it's a good thing that your position is nothing like theirs. you understand that when the democrats looks like they're ignoring you completely at best, and actively hurting you at worst, it is 'not directly reflective of core priorities.' it's a shame about the kids in camps, and a shame about the women in red states. but they have to make some sacrifices, and keep unquestioningly voting blue no matter who, in the hope that one day, your faith will be rewarded.
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May 13, 2022 20:09
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My philosophy is to always look at what people do, not what they say But if you find yourself having to ignore both actions and words to convince yourself something is good then maybe that thing isn't good
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May 13, 2022 20:12
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https://twitter.com/disclosetv/status/1525171261797801987?s=21&t=ikx2RUd-YqLfEc--BwEBfw I didn’t realize Congress already declared war. Perhaps the democrats should focus more on issues that affect the public than giving more money to Ukraine for a proxy war.
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May 13, 2022 20:14
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Nucleic Acids posted:It’s amazing how much of a failure he’s been. I mean, anyone who could look at things objectively basically saw all this coming, but it’s still amazing. Yeah, I never imagined it could be this bad and I grew up in Delaware knowing all about Joe Biden. I didn't mind him as a VP choice for Obama but for 2020, I felt he was about the worst choice in the field. Some of my liberal friends (and some people on this board) argued that we needed a pragmatic centrist lol. virtualboyCOLOR posted:In retrospect Biden winning over Trump set back a number of movements and emboldened liberal ideology, allowing the further march to fascism. Agree here too. People are going to look at this performance, compare it to Trump and arrive at the idea that the poo poo Trump offers is better, a lot of whom long ago ceded and recognized the lesser of two evils "choice" in the first place. You can't on run being "not the other guy", campaign on being better than one of the worst presidents in US history and offering to save the country, then doing a hold my beer and performing worse by any objective measure. The takeaway for the average voter is going to be that we tried all that liberal socialist poo poo and now I pay $4.50 a gallon for gas. Never mind that Biden is the furthest thing from a far left socialist but that's the narrative/framing and what most people will take away from this disaster. This is like Carter 2.0 without any of the altruism or decency of character that Jimmy at least brought to the table. For the most part, Biden doesn't even have Obama's built in excuse of inheriting a mess a la 8 years of GWB. I mean he DID but to most people's minds all he did was throw gasoline on it. Biden can't blame most of this poo poo on Trump if I'm being honest about it. Remember about 10 years ago when people here were saying the GOP would basically cease to exist by 2016? If anything, it looks like it's going to be the other way around.
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May 13, 2022 20:15
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Main Paineframe posted:The tweet and article both talk about diverting the money to public safety, not police departments specifically. Despite the writer's obvious eagerness to drag the subject to policing, there's actually far more that goes into public safety than just plain old policing - as any "defund the police" advocate knows! I think it is quite fair to interpret this as the WH calling for an increase in policing, since they specifically said "you should hire more cops with this money" already. From a different article: https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/white-house/biden-urge-cities-spend-covid-relief-money-police-crime-prevention-rcna28656 quote:In his remarks Friday, Biden will call on states and local communities to spend the Covid relief money on “putting more police officers on the beat for accountable community policing, expanding evidence-based community violence intervention programs, and preventing crime by making our neighborhoods stronger with more educational and economic opportunities,” the White House said.
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May 13, 2022 20:17
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