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Ynglaur posted:At this point, I think Shultz is actually a bought man. At best, he simply does not care if Russia conquers its neighbors so long as that neighbor isn't a country that starts with "G" and ends with "many". It's Merkel disease, Germany is fundamentally incapable of doing something that requires effort. And the army is very short on working equipment. And Scholz is a baby who doesn't like being told what to do apparently.
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Jun 1, 2022 21:35
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As an example of unannounced or quietly announced support, if Zelensky's casualty figures from the other day are close to accurate (50-60 KIA, ~500 WIA), then Ukraine has an 1:8 to 1:10 ratio of KIA:WIA. That's indicative of body armor, ballistic helmets, and medevac. It's a horrendous casualty rate and isn't sustainable forever, but a decent portion of those WIA will return to duty in hours/days/weeks. This is in sharp contrast to Russia which, at least during the Battle of Kyiv, seemed to have around a 1:3 or 1:4 ratio of KIA:WIA. This is speculation based on inference, but is promising I think.
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Jun 1, 2022 21:39
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I imagine they're loudly announcing every loan/shipment/supplies because its politically a gimme to get some good press, and its one of the few benefits shucking old equipment actually provides. E: Ynglaur posted:(50-60 KIA, ~500 WIA) https://twitter.com/RALee85/status/1532058783622778881 Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Jun 1, 2022 |
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Jun 1, 2022 21:41
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Just remember many of these casualties are probably being medivacced to Poland etc for great medical care. Very similar to what Israel did for the FSA (I could be wrong about this being the FSA but I remember Israel patching soldiers up to stick it to Assas)
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Jun 1, 2022 21:43
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Ukraine just won another victory in Europe, 3-1 over Scotland in the WC 2022 playoff.
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Jun 1, 2022 21:43
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mrfart posted:I was kinda wondering if my country (Belgium) couldn't give their Piranha vehicles to Ukraine, since they will be replaced soon with french Griffons and Jaguars. But they park them next to the main station in Brussels to look scary right
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Jun 1, 2022 21:43
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We're so used to the very one-sided conflicts that we forgotten what a serious peer war looks like. In the first month of the Tet offensive, the US + South Vietnam suffered over 9k KIA, and North Vietnam suffered over 5k KIA, and the Viet Cong suffered tens of thousands of KIA. Despite that, the Vietnam war was nowhere close to finished. These casualty numbers in the east are savage, but they can maintain them for quite a while if their resupply and training is up to task. EDIT: Also while the Russians have much much more artillery, it's still pretty dumb stuff. Which is precisely why they need to turn a village into a moonscape to capture it. https://twitter.com/JulianRoepcke/status/1531652822441287682 golden bubble fucked around with this message at 22:01 on Jun 1, 2022 |
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Jun 1, 2022 21:50
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The US already budgeted $40 billion in pure aid, plus Lend-Lease, 4 HIMARS isn't all they're EVER giving Ukraine. It's literally that they had 4 prepositioned to hand over right this minute. It's part of TODAY'S $700m chunk of that huge total. Say what you will about the US in general, but we're absolutely not dicking around like Germany is. sean10mm fucked around with this message at 21:58 on Jun 1, 2022 |
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Jun 1, 2022 21:55
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Loudly and publicly saying that Weapon System X is being delivered to the Ukrainian military also keeps Russia from waving around some shell remnants and claiming there are secret teams of US soldiers running around in Ukraine.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:01
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I don't particularly blame Germany or any other european state's reticence. It's not their war, they don't have much to lose if Russia wins the proxy war (I doubt, behind closed doors, that they believe in the Cursed Blood Horde rhetoric), and the longer the sanctions and war continues the worse the recession will get. None of them would publicly admit it, but I bet at least a few wish this had been a 2014 affair, possibly even annoyed that the Kyiv negotiations dissolved in favor of a renewed defense. E: On a lighter note, looks like those helmets were vital aid after all. https://twitter.com/UAWeapons/status/1532080133728870406 Neurolimal fucked around with this message at 22:04 on Jun 1, 2022 |
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Jun 1, 2022 22:02
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sean10mm posted:The US already budgeted $40 billion in pure aid, plus Lend-Lease, 4 HIMARS isn't all they're EVER giving Ukraine. It's literally that they had 4 prepositioned to hand over right this minute. It's part of TODAY'S $700m chunk of that huge total. golden bubble posted:We're so used to the very one-sided conflicts that we forgotten what a serious peer war looks like. In the first month of the Tet offensive, the US + South Vietnam suffered over 9k KIA, and North Vietnam suffered over 5k KIA, and the Viet Cong suffered tens of thousands of KIA. Despite that, the Vietnam war was nowhere close to finished. These casualty numbers in the east are savage, but they can maintain them for quite a while if their resupply and training is up to task. I've forgotten these facts. We've seen so many one-sided conflicts waged by western countries that I'm forgetting even with institutional rot this is the army of RUSSIA. This is literally the successor state to the USSR which during the cold war was incredibly scary and 85% of their best battle ready units are now actively making tiny gains in Ukraine for what should have been a short 1 month conflict. Despite everything I think what I forgot is as horrible as this is, it could have been so much worse. For all intents and purposes it could have gone down the way Poland capitulated in 1939 if not faster. I also recall hearing how the US needed troops in Vietnam so badly that Lee.R Ermey himself said in an interview how they had to send marines out from a more abridged basic training program that contributed to them losing a lot of people who just weren't ready for primetime yet.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:03
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https://twitter.com/christopherjm/status/1532099162707214342 Slice of life video thread. Featuring like a dog-sized hare. https://twitter.com/seth_hettena/status/1532020497424101377
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Jun 1, 2022 22:08
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Neurolimal posted:I don't particularly blame Germany or any other european state's reticence. It's not their war, they don't have much to lose if Russia wins the proxy war (I doubt, behind closed doors, that they believe in the Cursed Blood Horde rhetoric), and the longer the sanctions and war continues the worse the recession will get. The "proxy war" has caused the single largest mass migration in history to the EU, and the EU does not stand to benefit in the slightest from having an occupied militarized border with a belligerent fascist state that hates them.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:09
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cinci zoo sniper posted:Hot on the heels of this, Predator drones with Hellfire missiles for Ukraine. This seems absolutely enormous news if true but the article seems a bit vague
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Jun 1, 2022 22:09
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fnox posted:The "proxy war" has caused the single largest mass migration in history to the EU Cheap labor isn't actually a negative, and in plenty, most? Cases properly integrated migrants and refugees end up being a net economic benefit. They also have the benefit of being quote:and the EU does not stand to benefit in the slightest from having an occupied militarized border with a belligerent fascist state that hates them. Doubtful that the cursed blood horde is thirsty for the spinal fluids of what is collectively their largest trade partner, personally.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:13
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Chalks posted:This seems absolutely enormous news if true but the article seems a bit vague It’s probably on the rumour level until General Atomics are done washing every hand involved in making this handout to them happen.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:13
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FishBulbia posted:Yeah. This is becoming a WWI type conflict and both sides are incurring massive losses. Still, even at 700 a day it will take years for one side to run out of manpower. ukraine can sustain 50-100/day the same way russia can sustain 200/day. neither side is losing people faster than a nation of their size can replace them. Not in the sense of being unable to get fresh people into uniforms anyways. Obviously that's a big loss of experienced, trained people for both sides, though.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:16
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An expose of the Ukrainian fascist army by Finnish Yle: https://yle.fi/uutiset/3-12469969 quote:The unicorn became the symbol of Ukraine's LGBTQ soldiers: fantastic imaginary creatures, just like the gays in the army, says Oleksandr Zhuhan Nenonen fucked around with this message at 22:20 on Jun 1, 2022 |
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Jun 1, 2022 22:17
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Neurolimal posted:Cheap labor isn't actually a negative, and in plenty, most? Cases properly integrated migrants and refugees end up being a net economic benefit. Should've backed off but I'll bite. You're describing 8 million people, primarily women and children, as "cheap labor". Let's not even go there, because what you're essentially implying is that we should be thankful to Russia for bombing all these civilians. Neurolimal posted:Doubtful that the cursed blood horde is thirsty for the spinal fluids of what is collectively their largest trade partner, personally. It doesn't look like they give a single poo poo about the economic consequences of this at all? Far and away the most rational, logical thing to do here was to not start the war at all. What happened to the days when you were saying that this war was never going to happen and was a complete fabrication by NATO?
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Jun 1, 2022 22:18
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Neurolimal posted:I don't particularly blame Germany or any other european state's reticence. It's not their war, they don't have much to lose if Russia wins the proxy war (I doubt, behind closed doors, that they believe in the Cursed Blood Horde rhetoric), and the longer the sanctions and war continues the worse the recession will get. What is "Cursed Bloody Horde rhetoric"?
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Jun 1, 2022 22:18
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sean10mm posted:The US already budgeted $40 billion in pure aid, plus Lend-Lease, 4 HIMARS isn't all they're EVER giving Ukraine. It's literally that they had 4 prepositioned to hand over right this minute. It's part of TODAY'S $700m chunk of that huge total. Well, not really pure aid to Ukraine. Billions are paying US firms to refill its own US stocks, pay for US forces in NATO ops, etc. It opens up a lot of funding, but huge chinks of it are paying US expenses for US stuff.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:21
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fnox posted:Should've backed off but I'll bite. You're describing 8 million people, primarily women and children, as "cheap labor". Let's not even go there, because what you're essentially implying is that we should be thankful to Russia for bombing all these civilians. When discussing how a pragmatic european leader would feel behind closed doors, yes. quote:It doesn't look like they give a single poo poo about the economic consequences of this at all? Far and away the most rational, logical thing to do here was to not start the war at all. Likely weren't expecting global finance to compromise the dollar & central banking as a neutral resource for superpowers in the way that they did. Also likely that they had expected a ceasefire sooner. Plenty of political reasons why Putin would feel compelled to attack Ukraine but not France, we could get into them but that seems ripe for a derail. quote:What happened to the days when you were saying that this war was never going to happen and was a complete fabrication by NATO? Seems like a petty barb from someone annoyed by a post, but if you'd like we could relitigate any posts of mine you have grievances with in Discord DM's, seeing as we share a server. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jun 1, 2022 22:26
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socialsecurity posted:What is "Cursed Bloody Horde rhetoric"? To some, pointing out the war crimes and looting done by Russian soldiers invading Ukraine is exactly the same as describing them in the sort of racist terms the Nazis used to describe Slavs in general.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:27
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socialsecurity posted:What is "Cursed Bloody Horde rhetoric"? While I've never heard of this cursed bloody horde but using the power of context I'm able to ascertain that its probably the virulent and very prevalent Russian racism in main stream discourse. I find it pretty hard to believe if you've been following the war for more than a week you haven't seen Russians refered to as orcs or Mongols hence the horde, HtH! (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Jun 1, 2022 22:29
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socialsecurity posted:What is "Cursed Bloody Horde rhetoric"? It's a bit they're doing, lampooning the people who have been describing the Russians as basically blood-thirsty Orks, or zerglings, or whatever else along those lines. Personally, while that sort of rhetoric does get a little over-the-top sometimes, I have little sympathy for the idea that we need be more even-handed towards those poor Russians, especially considering the war crimes and atrocities committed by them.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:35
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I like the part where they imply that the idea that Russia could go on further imperialist adventures is "cursed blood horde" thought when we are, in fact, in the middle of an irrational war driven by imperialist revanchist ideology. Nobody's worried Russia is going to invade Germany, the point of a unified front against this aggression is because it could still happen again to weaker links in a heartbeat. You are not dealing with a rational actor.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:35
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its easy to believe your enemies are monsters, much harder to realize they are humans just like you
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Jun 1, 2022 22:38
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Terminal autist posted:While I've never heard of this cursed bloody horde but using the power of context I'm able to ascertain that its probably the virulent and very prevalent Russian racism in main stream discourse. I find it pretty hard to believe if you've been following the war for more than a week you haven't seen Russians refered to as orcs or Mongols hence the horde, HtH! What exactly is "bad faith" about this post? The "HtH" is unbecoming but I've certainly witnessed plenty of what seems to be anti-Russian sentiment bordering on the xenophobic and racist. Even Phlegmish mentions it gets a bit over-the-top.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:47
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At the same time, are we really expecting people to have sympathy for the Russian soldier, or much less, the Russian government? I think that's primarily where the hatred is driven towards, like, the rather prominent use of the word "vatnik" isn't a slur against all Russians, it's first of all a word of Russian origin, secondly it refers to those who blindly follow government propaganda. It's all pretty directed at Putin and his fascist regime, claiming it's racism is disingenuous when the Ukrainians are ethnically very similar.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:48
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Attributed to Pentagon Deputy Assistant to the Secretary of Defense (Media) Todd Breasseale: Today, June 1, the Department of Defense (DoD) announced the authorization of a Presidential Drawdown of security assistance valued at up to $700 million, tailored to meet critical Ukrainian needs for today’s fight. This authorization is the eleventh drawdown of equipment from DoD inventories for Ukraine since August 2021. Capabilities in this package include: High Mobility Artillery Rocket Systems and ammunition; Five counter-artillery radars; Two air surveillance radars; 1,000 Javelins and 50 Command Launch Units; 6,000 anti-armor weapons; 15,000 155mm artillery rounds; Four Mi-17 helicopters; 15 tactical vehicles; Spare parts and equipment. https://www.defense.gov/News/Releases/Release/Article/3049472/
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Jun 1, 2022 22:50
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FishBulbia posted:its easy to believe your enemies are monsters, much harder to realize they are humans just like you The biggest difficulty is in understanding how a cultured people can act like barbarians. How could the nation of Bach, Schubert, Hegel, Wittgenstein and Einstein commit the holocaust?
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Jun 1, 2022 22:52
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TipTow posted:What exactly is "bad faith" about this post? The "HtH" is unbecoming but I've certainly witnessed plenty of what seems to be anti-Russian sentiment bordering on the xenophobic and racist. Even Phlegmish mentions it gets a bit over-the-top. Just the "HtH!", I would've paid no mind to the post without it.
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Jun 1, 2022 22:52
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PederP posted:Those Euros are in a frozen account in the ECB. They dont pay with cash. Then why is anyone complaining about the EU supporting Russia with blood money? If they're paying it into a frozen account, then why is anyone talking about blocking Russian oil and gas to stop the Russian war machine?
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Jun 1, 2022 22:53
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TipTow posted:What exactly is "bad faith" about this post? The "HtH" is unbecoming but I've certainly witnessed plenty of what seems to be anti-Russian sentiment bordering on the xenophobic and racist. Even Phlegmish mentions it gets a bit over-the-top. HtH is short for 'Heil to Hitler' tia
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Jun 1, 2022 22:53
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There’s some interesting talk in this thread about whether or not Ukraine is ‘losing’ or Russia is ‘winning.’ This is an interesting matter of perspective that has many nuances to consider. Through one lens, Ukraine has basically been ‘losing’ since the very first Russian solder crossed the border and began the full-scale invasion. Countless Ukrainians have been mercilessly butchered, and had their homes and livelihoods completely upended. It’s hard to call that ‘winning,’ no matter how far back you push the Russians. However, if we consider ‘winning’ for the Ukrainians as cultural and national survival, then I would say that they are winning and seriously exceeding any expectations that any outside observes had before the war started. If we consider Ukraine winning a return to the 2014 or 1991 borders, I’d say they are losing, but not by much and it’s still anyone’s game. As a country that’s being invaded by an imperialistic and genocidal power, it’s hard to ‘win.’ From Russia’s perspective, saying if they are winning or losing is a bit easier. Russia has clear strategic goals, and their invasion has a purpose to achieve certain geopolitical outcomes. Russia’s obvious goal at the beginning of the war was to annex the whole country, or at least everything south and east of Kiev. This has been an abject failure. Scaling back from that, their goals (in my opinion) were to control the oil reserves in the north (failure); make a connection to Transnistria (looking like a big fat failure at this point); establish control of the water needed to maintain Crimean agriculture (looking like a win, though this could change); and annex as much of Donbas as they can (looking like a win at this point). So with that in mind, I think we could say that Russia is ‘winning,’ but they’ve had to move the goalposts several times and have burned through an incredible amount of resources. However, since Russia is a major geopolitical player and the aggressor in this war, there are other things outside of Ukraine that count towards ‘winning’ or ‘losing.’ Some examples include Finland and Sweden could join NATO; The Russian Regime has had billions upon billions of dollars in foreign reserves frozen; The Russian economy is getting battered (even if not as badly as predicted by some) and there is massive brain drain happening; the institutional knowledge and credibility of their army is getting totally wiped out; their closest ally, Belarus is looking unstable, with the opposition parties openly calling for sabotage of Russian solders; Even Transnistria’s leadership is distancing itself from the unpopular war and Russian leadership; Russia has even been kicked out of UN Security Council, which is small, but counts for something; Russia is looking more and more isolated on a global scale, which is never a good sign for an imperialistic power. All these things and more are some of the unforeseen costs that Russia has had to pay for this war. Whatever political fallout happens after this war in Russia will also cost the Russian regime a lot. So with all of that said, I think it is hard to say that Ukraine is ‘winning.’ They may be surviving, and making the Russians pay dearly, but they are still suffering an atrocious and criminal punishment at the hands of an unaccountable regime. It’s pretty easy to say that Russia is burning an enormous and unsustainable amount of resources and political capital to get even a little bit of ground. As of today, it looks like any victory that Russia has will be pyrrhic. Dark clouds are gathering above Russia. Will they ‘lose’ in Ukraine? Depends how you look at it. Will they lose in the great game of geopolitical chess that they have been playing against the Western block countries and China for the last 75 years? Almost certainly. The war in Ukraine has put on so many new pressures on the regime outside of the theater of war, that any positive outcome outside of annexing a few hundred miles of scorched earth looks impossible for Russia. Chill Monster fucked around with this message at 23:03 on Jun 1, 2022 |
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Jun 1, 2022 22:57
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Herstory Begins Now posted:HtH is short for 'Heil to Hitler' No, no, no, HtH is where my kitchen cabinets are from. HtH Kokken
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Jun 1, 2022 23:01
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Nenonen posted:The biggest difficulty is in understanding how a cultured people can act like barbarians. How could the nation of Bach, Schubert, Hegel, Wittgenstein and Einstein commit the holocaust? Every "Barbarian" has a culture. No such thing as an uncultured people.
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Jun 1, 2022 23:02
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Is hth one of those things that got newly stolen, because it's always stood for hope that helps in my experience. I mean if you google hth definition you get a full page of sites saying it stands for hope that helps. Apologize if it's some in joke I'm missing.
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Jun 1, 2022 23:02
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Saladman posted:Then why is anyone complaining about the EU supporting Russia with blood money? If they're paying it into a frozen account, then why is anyone talking about blocking Russian oil and gas to stop the Russian war machine? https://www.bruegel.org/2022/04/a-sanctions-counter-measure-gas-payments-to-russia-in-rubles/ ranbo das posted:Is hth one of those things that got newly stolen, because it's always stood for hope that helps in my experience. I mean if you google hth definition you get a full page of sites saying it stands for hope that helps. It still means that, posters above are joking. I simply don't believe there was such genuine hope on this occasion.
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Jun 1, 2022 23:05
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Boris Galerkin posted:But they park them next to the main station in Brussels to look scary right No those were just IVECO LMV or ancient unimog trucks  . Don(t know if the Ukrainian army would want those. But i guess anything is useful for transport.golden bubble posted:
Imagine, this is the stuff they release as propaganda, missing a target by 100 meters, using his own phone to do the calculations.
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