|
toadee posted:A well played sub isn’t even close to as annoying as CVs are still currently. Because for all of the annoyance of the sub it can only go 30 knots and not 300 the premium German submarine U-4501 that they added for super testers not long ago has a base submerged speed of 41 knots and can go up to 50 with flags and boosts, it can outrun most DDs
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2022 08:58
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 09:34 |
|
|
Shaman Tank Spec posted:You know the "Try your luck" crates in WoWS? The ones where the description says you're likelier to get a supercontainer but if that doesn't happen, you get less rewards? Well that was a huge lie. There's no likelihood. There's no random chance. this was a deliberate change on WG's part, for the BETTER. The chance for supercontainers used to be much lower.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2022 10:11
|
|
|
Teron D Amun posted:the premium German submarine U-4501 that they added for super testers not long ago has a base submerged speed of 41 knots and can go up to 50 with flags and boosts, it can outrun most DDs What.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2022 16:09
|
|
|
Teron D Amun posted:the premium German submarine U-4501 that they added for super testers not long ago has a base submerged speed of 41 knots and can go up to 50 with flags and boosts, it can outrun most DDs 50 is still considerably less than 300
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2022 17:04
|
|
|
Minenfeld! posted:What. Literally what he said. A submarine that goes 41 knots underwater without skills or flags and can reach speeds of 50 knots with them. And then there's the Soviet submarine with 10km hydro. What the gently caress are you going to do as that thing sits somewhere in the same zip code as your team, spamming homing torpedoes at your BBs and spotting everything? It's all extremely balanced. https://thedailybounce.net/world-of-warships/world-of-warships-supertest-german-tier-x-freemium-submarine-u-4501/
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2022 17:30
|
|
|
The thing with submarines is that as toxic as they CAN be, most people playing them are awful. They’re a possible menace. In the infrequent games I’ve had with subs lately most of them do nothing, and the only time I died to one it was in a game I’d gotten a Kraken with Fenyang of all ships, which should illustrate how horrendous my team is. With that said subs are a bad thing as they are today because eventually good people will play them and it will suck.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2022 19:35
|
|
|
I would still rather play against [WMI]SUBMARINE_DIFFERENCE in a U-2501 than I would [WMI]Gaishu_Isshoku in a USS United States
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2022 19:52
|
|
|
Velius posted:The thing with submarines is that as toxic as they CAN be, most people playing them are awful. They’re a possible menace. In the infrequent games I’ve had with subs lately most of them do nothing, and the only time I died to one it was in a game I’d gotten a Kraken with Fenyang of all ships, which should illustrate how horrendous my team is. If you want a preview of things to come, MrGibbins on Twitch has figured out some truly toxic tactics with subs and highlights them frequently because he's trying to get WG to realize the loving dump they're about to take on the game.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2022 20:05
|
|
|
What's the difference between hydroacoustic search and hydrophones anyway?
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2022 20:15
|
|
|
Hydro shows your team where the ships are, the sub variant only shows you where the ships are.
|
|
#
?
Jul 8, 2022 20:37
|
|
|
Shaman Tank Spec posted:If you want a preview of things to come, MrGibbins on Twitch has figured out some truly toxic tactics with subs and highlights them frequently because he's trying to get WG to realize the loving dump they're about to take on the game. Mr gibbons is a moron. Watch Ivan (aka SUBMARINE DiFFERENCE) for true evil sub play. But CVs are still way worse
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2022 01:43
|
|
|
Subs feel more personally insulting. Like a CV dumping on me is just, well its a CV and I exist on the map. But a sub has to make an active effort to focus on a single ship and make its life goddamn miserable.
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2022 03:34
|
|
|
My attitude to CVs has always been like that to car thieves. You can't outright stop them except in a select few ships, but you can do enough to make their life difficult so that they focus someone else. I'm convinced half the playerbase doesn't know about priority sector AA for example.
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2022 10:14
|
|
|
usually, as a game ages, the players become more competent usually
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2022 11:11
|
|
|
Also according to the latest devblog, subs can no longer be passively spotted by other subs, because WG didn't like that sub players could overextend, get surprise spotted and then attacked. Which is a loving core gameplay mechanic for every loving class in the game. Jesus loving christ these things are going to be a loving MESS.
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2022 12:11
|
|
|
Hazdoc posted:usually, as a game ages, the players become more competent Yes - no question whatsoever the WoWs playerbase is much worse now than it was 5 years ago.
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2022 12:18
|
|
|
Shaman Tank Spec posted:Also according to the latest devblog, subs can no longer be passively spotted by other subs, because WG didn't like that sub players could overextend, get surprise spotted and then attacked. It also means they can ram each other without having a clue until they die. Same Devblog said the Dalarna is getting a 30% (ish) DPM nerf and range reductions on its guns and special torpedos. Still bemused it even got put into the game with the previous values. Can someone who understands the game better than me explain the German Super Cruiser too? On the surface it looks like its got double the DPM of the Hindi.
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2022 15:43
|
|
|
Yeah now the European superdestroyer has the same DPM as the Halland while being significantly larger. Which is not a supership. Those subtle gradual Wargaming adjustments.
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2022 16:12
|
|
|
kaesarsosei posted:My attitude to CVs has always been like that to car thieves. You can't outright stop them except in a select few ships, but you can do enough to make their life difficult so that they focus someone else. I'm convinced half the playerbase doesn't know about priority sector AA for example. AA sector does almost nothing. The way you can tell it does almost nothing is that if it did something CVs could go around to the other side, but they don't.
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2022 16:34
|
|
|
James Garfield posted:AA sector does almost nothing. The way you can tell it does almost nothing is that if it did something CVs could go around to the other side, but they don't. You've made that age old mistake when it comes to CV discussions where you are assuming every CV player is a super-unicum. If anything the skill gap in CV players is amplified by the natiure of their MM - and like the rest of the playerbase, they are declining in skill too. A good CV might try to approach from an angle where they can flip sides if they see Priority sector on but for torp drops thats not easy. Most CV players won't do that and have to decide whether to take more losses or to waste time changing sides. But rest assured, it does make a difference. Especially in Dutch cruisers because they can and should spec the 2-pt skill that buffs it from 50% to 85% or something since it also buffs their air strikes.
|
|
#
?
Jul 9, 2022 22:34
|
|
|
kaesarsosei posted:A good CV might try to approach from an angle where they can flip sides if they see Priority sector on but for torp drops thats not easy. That's an option, but even very good CV players don't bother doing it because AA sector doesn't really matter. If AA sector mattered, you could tell because the 80% win CVs would be going around to the weak side. kaesarsosei posted:Most CV players won't do that and have to decide whether to take more losses or to waste time changing sides. That's hardly a decision. Rework CVs have like 140 planes, so losses only matter if it reduces the number of times that squadron can attack. Almost every ship has AA that prevents one attack, and under perfect conditions the sector is less than a 50% increase so doesn't prevent another attack. You get the free damage from pressing the AA sector key so there's no reason not to do it, but it doesn't make CV players' lives any more difficult. You can tell that it doesn't because if it did, very good CV players would go around and bomb from the other side.
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 00:08
|
|
|
I think good carriers actually hope you'll be reinforcing the sector they're attacking from, since they expect to spend more time on the other side, turning around. So the reason you don't see 80% win rate CVs flying around to the weak side may be that they want to attack from the strong side to minimize the total damage they take.
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 02:10
|
|
|
There are a number of ships that use priority sector to very good effect. The Dutch ships, and the Jinan line. You are a no fly zone in some of those ships.General Battuta posted:I think good carriers actually hope you'll be reinforcing the sector they're attacking from, since they expect to spend more time on the other side, turning around.  it's always a game of mitigating plane losses.
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 02:46
|
|
|
Stanley Pain posted:
they used steam catapults even back then, right? so it's a game of throwns
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 02:55
|
|
|
Kesper North posted:so it's a game of throwns 
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 02:57
|
|
|
you win or you dive!!!
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 03:02
|
|
|
General Battuta posted:I think good carriers actually hope you'll be reinforcing the sector they're attacking from, since they expect to spend more time on the other side, turning around. That's (part of) the problem, besides the bit of damage from pressing the key the AA sector doesn't increase your total AA. It might say it's a 50% increase, but it's only active half the time because of the 10 second cooldown, and the effect is ramping up for half of the duration, and it reduces damage on the opposite side where the planes will be for some of the time (more so because you have to activate it pointing at the planes to get the instant damage and then it's ramping up while the planes get in range). The number it displays is 50% but after all the conditions it's negligible. You might as well complain that ~pubbies~ are mad about CVs because they didn't take the 2 point commander skill that gives you 10% more AA damage. edit: and because CVs have ludicrous numbers of planes, plane kills only matter if it reduces the number of times that squadron can bomb you. A large majority of ships have base AA that prevents one attack, so the AA consumable (50% buff) might or might not prevent another one. Obviously if a 50% bonus isn't guaranteed to prevent an attack, things aren't good for the maybe 10% from AA sector. Stanley Pain posted:There are a number of ships that use priority sector to very good effect. The Dutch ships, and the Jinan line. You are a no fly zone in some of those ships. If you're a no fly zone with AA sector you are also a no fly zone without it. James Garfield fucked around with this message at 04:13 on Jul 10, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 03:56
|
|
|
General Battuta posted:I think good carriers actually hope you'll be reinforcing the sector they're attacking from, since they expect to spend more time on the other side, turning around. This is definitely a thing too and I guess if you have time to think about it can make a difference. eg especially against IJN torp squads. Part of the reason Russian CV's are so ridiculous is because none of this matters either. At least with other nations' CVs, they will lose a lot of planes against any ship with decent AA because they will spend a lot of time in the AA bubble but the Russian ones are nearly immune to it, at least against lone targets.
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 08:48
|
|
|
James Garfield posted:That's (part of) the problem, besides the bit of damage from pressing the key the AA sector doesn't increase your total AA. It might say it's a 50% increase, but it's only active half the time because of the 10 second cooldown, and the effect is ramping up for half of the duration, and it reduces damage on the opposite side where the planes will be for some of the time (more so because you have to activate it pointing at the planes to get the instant damage and then it's ramping up while the planes get in range). Some CVs get cheeky (or forget) about certain ships' AA power. Mashing the AA sector button helps remind them that they should kindly gently caress off 
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 15:19
|
|
|
Priority sector (and AA in general) is designed entirely upon the idea that planes will do multiple drops and as such take more damage over time. Its no fun for the carrier player if they cant get a strike off after all! I will say it does appear that AA flak seems to be increasing on newer ships but that only helps if the CV is an idiot. This goes completely out the window with Russian planes since they drop all at once but you know, Russia.
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 15:57
|
|
|
serious gaylord posted:Its no fun for the carrier player if they cant get a strike off after all! the carrier could go to a ship with less AA at 300 knots, help its team by spotting, or wait until later in the game when AA mounts are destroyed. Is "it's no fun if you can't get a strike off" a CV exclusive rule or should you be able to land at least one torpedo if you drive your Paolo Emilio at three Worcesters? edit: another problem is that there are very few differences in AA because almost every ship prevents exactly one attack from same tier CVs, and CVs don't run out of planes over time so preventing attacks is the only aspect of AA that matters. James Garfield fucked around with this message at 16:38 on Jul 10, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 16:33
|
|
|
I mean, we're not even a week out from this gem:quote:
To say nothing of the two loving premium subs being tested with 40kt+ underwater speed and 10km hydro respectively. It's almost like sane ship design and overall class balancing goes completely out the window or something for CVs and subs. Admittedly it's not been particularly great in general for a while.
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 17:22
|
|
|
I'd say the last few tech tree ship lines have been fun and well balanced (if not overbalanced, in some cases).
|
|
#
?
Jul 10, 2022 17:23
|
|
|
So...is Paolo Emilio unironically a good ship in ranked? I just got mine and just hit Gold League and have no interest in ranking out so am just messing around to collect my 18 wins for the final sprint and it seems to do good work. I just had a game against a Friesland, Agir and 2 Rupprecht - ie hellish MM, yet whilst not carrying the game or anything I still did OK. The game before I very much did carry with 3 kills including a 100-0 Musashi. Its fun, and it kinda seems *ok* after a small sample size of 6 games. A lot of Emilio's I see are determined to yolo under any circumstances as soon as the game starts. If you are patient and realize there are many times you can't do that it seems much less of a meme-ship.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2022 11:06
|
|
|
Paolo is *fun* in ranked in that you can usually yolo something and cruise around being a scary threat otherwise. It isn’t as good at carrying games due to the bad concealment and inability to kill enemy dds particularly reliably. I’d put good ranked dds as Kita >> Friesland/Grog, Paolo, Black, Yugumo and Z-46.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2022 14:59
|
|
|
Next season of ranked is going to be 6v6, all T10 ships. So I guess now is ship recommendation time! The Drake was a beast in T8-T9 ranked, would the Goliath work in T10? I also recently picked up the Marceau, although I should get some more practise in before the season starts. My only other T10 DD is a Halland, although I also have the Daring unlocked but not bought.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2022 18:03
|
|
|
Halland won't work in ranked imo. I've never tried Goliath but iirc it's a solid pick in clan battles for countering bow-in Petros, and it can probably shoot DDs. Shooting DDs is most of how you win ranked, so Goliath might suffer for lack of radar. Daring looks appealing for ranked but has never much worked out for me in practice, its slow speed makes it no match for all the French and Russian monsters running around. Marceau is strong in ranked. Just don't get caught up close/early game or you die as quick as everyone else.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2022 18:36
|
|
|
Yeah I've never had great luck with the Halland in ranked before. I also have the Petro, DM, Smolensk, Yoshino, Moskva and Hindenburg as far as cruisers go, Thunderer, Conqueror and GK for battleships. (Minotaur and Nevsky also but not bought ATM) Shaman Tank Spec fucked around with this message at 18:47 on Jul 11, 2022 |
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2022 18:45
|
|
|
So you can probably extrapolate what works in CB to ranked, it’s virtually the same. So Smaland is king, because 6.1 km conceal with 7.5 km radar and crazy DPM is amazing. Kleber and Marceau are going to be great, you’ll be able to potentially Khaba it up as a counter to Kleber/Marceau. Daring is unquestionably great for cap control. Shima is Shima, you can make it work in randoms because it’s still king of torp mountain. Ragnar is going to be solid too, Sherman for annoyance/farming is good. All the rest of the dds are going to be probably viable but not in the same overpowered or really strong in their niche the way the above are. You can totally make Z-52 work, for example, but it’s harder than making Smaland work. There aren’t too many aggressively bad dds at tier 10, even Hayate is probably fine in a 6v6 format.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2022 18:50
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 16, 2024 09:34 |
|
|
Whatever DD you're best at is usually good enough for reliable ranked wins, otherwise very good DD ambush ships to snipe the enemy potato DDs is the best thing you can do to make life easy in ranked. The clan battle stuff surrounding cruiser picks doesn't really tend to apply so much, because random people in ranked aren't going to pick a spot to hold a cap in their Petro like a clan battles team will.
|
|
#
?
Jul 11, 2022 19:28
|
|