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victrix
Oct 30, 2007


AfricanBootyShine posted:

Is Dead Cells still exclusively being developed for its hardcore audience? I remember enjoying it when it just came out of EA, and when I picked it up a couple years later it felt waaaaaay more difficult. Like they tuned it for the most hardcore of fans.

no, in fact they added a whole rear end assist mode, a ton of accessibility settings, and retooled the difficulty ramp in the standard untouched game

you can make it as easy as you want right from the options menu

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explosivo
May 23, 2004

Fueled by Satan

yo why can't I stop playing power wash simulator :psyduck:

The "Just one more.." effect is real

Owl Inspector
Sep 14, 2011

One of the dead cells updates last year tried to offload some of the difficulty from the base game up to the higher difficulties, so it should be easier to complete at BC0.

can’t say how different it would feel since I was stuck trying to do the astrolab on BC5 at that point and had given up after another update removed a bunch of build variety because ??? (most of the changes with a little “based on community feedback” star next to them), which told me I was no longer the target audience.

Oxxidation
Jul 22, 2007
I broke at BC3

the constant balance changes just alienated me more. obviously it’s normal to tweak certain builds/items in the early days of a roguelite, but doing it constantly over a period of years makes it seem like the devs lack confidence

fit em all up in there
Oct 10, 2006

Violencia

https://www.fanatical.com/en/pick-and-mix/fanatical-favorites-build-your-own-bundle

Anything note worthy in this new fanatical bundle ?

Kibayasu
Mar 28, 2010


Barotrauma is one of those aggravatingly difficult games that gets pretty fun with friends but also still aggravatingly difficult.

fit em all up in there
Oct 10, 2006

Violencia

Kibayasu posted:

Barotrauma is one of those aggravatingly difficult games that gets pretty fun with friends but also still aggravatingly difficult.

I'm assuming it's one of those games you dont really want to play solo

fez_machine
Nov 27, 2004

Everything looks like bundle regulars. Graveyard keeper is a pretty chill (no time limit, no risk of failure other than inefficiency) plate spinning farming/life sim. Everything else is self-explanatory and depends on your preferences. Some are mediocre but none are absolute stinkers.

Awesome!
Oct 17, 2008

Ready for adventure!


the original lethal league was pretty cool. havent tried blaze.

Kibayasu
Mar 28, 2010

fit em all up in there posted:

I'm assuming it's one of those games you dont really want to play solo

That’s probably an important thing I should have added but yeah. There is AI but yeah.

CV 64 Fan
Oct 13, 2012

It's pretty dope.
Song Of Horror is cool if you like the genre.

kazil
Jul 24, 2005

Derpmph trial star reporter!

explosivo posted:

yo why can't I stop playing power wash simulator :psyduck:

The "Just one more.." effect is real

It's just a dumb game where you spray water at things, where did the last 2 hours of my life disappear to

Serephina
Nov 8, 2005

恐竜戦隊
ジュウレンジャー

Oxxidation posted:

I broke at BC3

the constant balance changes just alienated me more. obviously it’s normal to tweak certain builds/items in the early days of a roguelite, but doing it constantly over a period of years makes it seem like the devs lack confidence

It's more like the devs bottled lightning and are still running with it five years later. When it was first introduced I made some disparaging comment about the store's buzzword salad description, and how having damage number popups where some numbers where 1/100th the value of others where red flags, and I got shouted down. But I feel that the years have vindicated me, it's a great core game that the devs had no idea where to take - vertical scaling, what to do after your first win, etc.

The Gripper
Sep 14, 2004
i am winner

victrix posted:

no, in fact they added a whole rear end assist mode, a ton of accessibility settings, and retooled the difficulty ramp in the standard untouched game

you can make it as easy as you want right from the options menu
Also aside from the assist feature the game has moved a lot of its brutal difficulty into the higher boss cell difficulties as well. At launch it was hard, and I think that initial difficulty has turned some people off trying it again.

singateco
Jan 28, 2013

Serephina posted:

It's more like the devs bottled lightning and are still running with it five years later. When it was first introduced I made some disparaging comment about the store's buzzword salad description, and how having damage number popups where some numbers where 1/100th the value of others where red flags, and I got shouted down. But I feel that the years have vindicated me, it's a great core game that the devs had no idea where to take - vertical scaling, what to do after your first win, etc.

After beating BC0, you have the option to play harder version of the game (BC1), except it doesn’t give you more cells. That only happens after BC2.

So you have the choice of either grinding in the easy version to unlock more stuff, but not having a chance to unlock BC2, or you have a chance to unlock BC2 and see more content, but the game is fuckton harder and you’re not getting more cells to unlock items.

That is not a fun choice to make, and it shows that the devs are not really good at game design on meta-progression level.

(Play Rogue Regacy 2, it’s a better game)

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

"Good meta-progression design" is an oxymoron.

K8.0
Feb 26, 2004

Her Majesty's 56th Regiment of Foot

Jack Trades posted:

"Good meta-progression design" is an oxymoron.

Isaac exists.

Also, Outer Wilds is a game about meta-progression, except 100% of it takes place inside your own head which is pretty awesome.

singateco
Jan 28, 2013

Jack Trades posted:

"Good meta-progression design" is an oxymoron.

Numbers going up is inherently satisfying and we should try harness its power, not cowered by it

Gaius Marius
Oct 9, 2012

singateco posted:

Numbers going up is inherently satisfying and we should try harness its power, not cowered by it

Just invest so you can waste your money instead of just your time

goferchan
Feb 8, 2004

It's 2006. I am taking 276 yeti furs from the goodies hoard.

singateco posted:

After beating BC0, you have the option to play harder version of the game (BC1), except it doesn’t give you more cells. That only happens after BC2.

So you have the choice of either grinding in the easy version to unlock more stuff, but not having a chance to unlock BC2, or you have a chance to unlock BC2 and see more content, but the game is fuckton harder and you’re not getting more cells to unlock items.

BC1 used to be a fuckton harder than BC0 but it's definitely not anymore. It's basically BC0 with a different enemy arrangement and slightly less healing. I'm no god at the game and getting my first BC0 clear took me a long time, but I think I won BC1 on like my third one. And there is new content there in the form of new enemies appearing in levels and their associated droppable unlocks.

kirbysuperstar
Nov 11, 2012

Let the fools who stand before us be destroyed by the power you and I possess.

K8.0 posted:

Isaac exists.

Yeah that's not an example of good meta progression either

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

K8.0 posted:

Isaac exists.

Also, Outer Wilds is a game about meta-progression, except 100% of it takes place inside your own head which is pretty awesome.

Isaac is an example that just proves my point.

And meta-progression that's all in your head is otherwise known as "knowledge" or a "skill".

Kazzah
Jul 15, 2011

Formerly known as
Krazyface
Hair Elf
Mate you gotta play Outer Wilds

tildes
Nov 16, 2018

singateco posted:



(Play Rogue Regacy 2, it’s a better game)

(Except in every way other than metaprogression)

Granted dead cells did manage to make their game slightly worse in some ways even over EA imo, but the basic mechanics are just so so good it really carried it for me through its other problems. But yeah if you’re going for the metaprogression drops and not just for the challenge of it then the higher BC stuff is not a very fun system I think.

tildes fucked around with this message at 05:09 on Jul 19, 2022

Ghostlight
Sep 25, 2009

maybe for one second you can pause; try to step into another person's perspective, and understand that a watermelon is cursing me



Jack Trades posted:

"Good meta-progression design" is an oxymoron.
Hitman has good meta-progression imo

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

Ghostlight posted:

Hitman has good meta-progression imo

Item unlocks? Eh, it's not terrible.

redreader
Nov 2, 2009

I am the coolest person ever with my pirate chalice. Seriously.

Dinosaur Gum

Jack Trades posted:

Item unlocks? Eh, it's not terrible.

Item unlocks for any level, level-specific starting locations sometimes including uniforms/disguises, extra-items-smuggled-in locations. Probably other stuff but yeah I like that progression.

The Lone Badger
Sep 24, 2007

CharlestheHammer posted:

People really did like ME3s multiplayer.

It was weirdly good. I do not understand how it was good.

Owl Inspector
Sep 14, 2011

ME3 had really nice feeling weapons and abilities with good sound and the controls were really snappy (even if they were also poo poo because they put 30 overlapping functions on a single button). just getting action game feel right counts for a lot. the multiplayer also let you play as the beep boop robots


andromeda multiplayer had so much potential because this time they actually knew that people liked the multiplayer ahead of time instead of it being a runaway unexpected success, it fixed the controls which were the biggest issue with ME3, and it had much better pacing with quicker rounds and a shift to a larger number of fodder enemies/fewer of the sponges that ME3 threw everywhere on later gold waves. except it shipped with 5 maps and almost comically poor balance where maybe 20% of the content was viable on gold.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?


redreader posted:

Item unlocks for any level, level-specific starting locations sometimes including uniforms/disguises, extra-items-smuggled-in locations. Probably other stuff but yeah I like that progression.

I too enjoy doing the same thing over and over again to get a new way to do that same thing slightly differently.

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

I too enjoy doing the same thing over and over again to get a new way to do that same thing slightly differently.

In Hitman's defense, you explicitly cannot get new stuff by doing the same thing over and over.

Mescal
Jul 23, 2005

On the chance that you've missed playing dead cells, don't let the nitpicks turn you off to the idea. Play it. If there's any better game in that genre, I'll be surprised. The tightness of the controls, the feeling of "I am the precision master" when you get into the rhythm of it, just the feel of playing well is so good. If you were raised on 2d action platformers, it will make your inner child cum.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?


Jack Trades posted:

In Hitman's defense, you explicitly cannot get new stuff by doing the same thing over and over.

You’re still killing the same one or two and maybe three people on the same map. Some people can enjoy that, I’m not one of them.

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

You’re still killing the same one or two and maybe three people on the same map. Some people can enjoy that, I’m not one of them.

I also don't like games where you kill the same enemy type more than once. Thant's why I exclusively play visual novels.

HerpicleOmnicron5
May 31, 2013

How did this smug dummkopf ever make general?


Jack Trades posted:

I also don't like games where you kill the same enemy type more than once. Thant's why I exclusively play visual novels.

Usually an enemy type doesn’t follow the exact same scripted path and does nothing against you at all. I like Hitman don’t get me wrong, but each level is a one and done for me and it blows that the fun toys are held back for the 50th time through.

juicefest
Jun 12, 2022

HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

You’re still killing the same one or two and maybe three people on the same map. Some people can enjoy that, I’m not one of them.

Well to be fair there are escalation missions and elusive targets that use the same maps but with different targets and restrictions. I could definitely see it being repetitive if you just do the main missions.

Edit: in context you were talking about map unlocks and yes, your point stands since I don't think you can unlock map stuff through the special missions.

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

HerpicleOmnicron5 posted:

Usually an enemy type doesn’t follow the exact same scripted path and does nothing against you at all. I like Hitman don’t get me wrong, but each level is a one and done for me and it blows that the fun toys are held back for the 50th time through.

You really don't understand what Hitman games are about. It's not a stealth action game where you shoot a guy in the face and then run away.
It's a puzzle game about manipulating a clockwork mechanism to make different things happen. That's what the unlock system is trying to encourage you to do, because you can only get item progression by triggering different events.

juicefest
Jun 12, 2022
Getting map unlocks actually only requires one playthrough, though, if you do it on master difficulty, SASO with some other objectives thrown in. You can view it as a special challenge to get it all in one go.

Jack Trades
Nov 30, 2010

Jack Trades posted:

You really don't understand what Hitman games are about. It's not a stealth action game where you shoot a guy in the face and then run away.
It's a puzzle game about manipulating a clockwork mechanism to make different things happen. That's what the unlock system is trying to encourage you to do, because you can only get item progression by triggering different events.

Now that I think about it, I guess that's why your average Joe really hated the original Hitman's episodic release schedule, because it was perfect for playing through the game at the pace it was meant to be played but most players just wanted to see all the setpieces once and call it a day.

juicefest posted:

Getting map unlocks actually only requires one playthrough, though, if you do it on master difficulty, SASO with some other objectives thrown in. You can view it as a special challenge to get it all in one go.

I'm really not sure that people who play through every Hitman map only once care about SASO.

Jack Trades fucked around with this message at 07:30 on Jul 19, 2022

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Foul Fowl
Sep 12, 2008

Uuuuh! Seek ye me?

Cowcaster posted:

something awful posters have convinced themselves that dark souls 2 is the most popular and beloved soulsgame of all time because out of the 35 people who still post on this dead gay forum 30 people like it

it is the most popular and beloved soulsgame you son of a bitch

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