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 Oh hey, it's the number 10, Forward alley memorial Lounge and Recreation Center!
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Aug 7, 2022 21:05
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Fivemarks posted:I know people like to make a big hash about how the Federation is Arrogant and Full of themselves, but honestly I don't see it. What I do see is that you have empires like the Cardassians and Romulans who are absolutely full of themselves and are arrogant assholes. I mean the Federation DOES have an air of arrogance to it with how they talk to people and their "sophistication" of culture. They come across as know-it-alls who look down at other cultures who don't automatically see how great they are. That being said, some writers take it too far, DS9 writers especially. The whole the real evil is people liking the Federation conversation that pops up occasionally.
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Aug 7, 2022 21:09
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Mooseontheloose posted:I mean the Federation DOES have an air of arrogance to it with how they talk to people and their "sophistication" of culture. They come across as know-it-alls who look down at other cultures who don't automatically see how great they are. Counterpoint: the Root Beer scene is the best conversation ever had on camera about the Federation.
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Aug 7, 2022 21:14
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I wonder how many people who find the Federation arrogant would have a meaningful place in a society like that as they are now I mean I hardly come from a war torn country but the Federation still seems like a better place than anywhere I've ever lived
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Aug 7, 2022 21:19
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Tighclops posted:I wonder how many people who find the Federation arrogant would have a meaningful place in a society like that as they are now I find the Orville handles it a bit better where they show there is still medium and low brow tastes in their utopia. Federation culture in Star Trek feels a bit stalled. Which on the one hand is ok because, Star Trek is trying to view culture/science/technology via other aliens. However, when you tell stories of how your government handles tricky situations or your ideal situation, coming across as hectoring bores can feel off.
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Aug 7, 2022 21:23
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OcWikHPujaM
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Aug 7, 2022 22:00
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Tighclops posted:I just realized it would have sucked to be off duty and trying to get some sleep when this was happening if your quarters were right by the phaser array I would hope that in every situation where weapons and tractor beams etc. are used, there would be a red alert called so all Starfleet personnel are at battle stations and all civilians are in shelters
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Aug 7, 2022 22:09
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Star Trek: 20 Minutes of Shooting and Explosions
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Aug 7, 2022 22:23
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Mooseontheloose posted:I find the Orville handles it a bit better where they show there is still medium and low brow tastes in their utopia. Federation culture in Star Trek feels a bit stalled. Which on the one hand is ok because, Star Trek is trying to view culture/science/technology via other aliens. However, when you tell stories of how your government handles tricky situations or your ideal situation, coming across as hectoring bores can feel off.
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Aug 7, 2022 22:24
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Lt. Kramer, what is going on in there? It's the dorsal port quarter phaser array at attack pattern sierra, Jerry
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Aug 7, 2022 22:25
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Daniels' black time outfit in the 31st century and his weird haircut make him look like one of those aliens from Galaxy Quest got assimilated by the Borg 
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Aug 7, 2022 22:39
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some kinda jackal posted:Daniels' black time outfit in the 31st century and his weird haircut make him look like one of those aliens from Galaxy Quest got assimilated by the Borg In Season 5 we learn his real name is Teb 
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Aug 7, 2022 22:54
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Tighclops posted:I wonder how many people who find the Federation arrogant would have a meaningful place in a society like that as they are now It's more in how (particularly in TNG) the Federation is definitionally good and the non-aligned alien races only exist to be worse than them in some way, situations where the the Federation is wrong or the other guys actually have a fair point are vanishingly rare and does make the writing come off as smug and self satisfied in a very 90s end of history way.
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Aug 7, 2022 22:54
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Looking back Generations is such a massive miss for its potential. They had all the Braga/Moore notes that those two loved to build a story on. Friendship, time travel, weird nonlinear life experiences, high concept scifi plot, and Patrick Stewart to pull it off. That would have been the perfect time to explore Guinan/Picard when they had the chance. This weird relationship where past Guinan has spent years, possibly decades being Picard's best bud but Picard doesn't remember any of this yet. Then decades later seeks him out and gets a job as the mysterious bartender on his ship. Now finally he gets to live out that time, but all the while he has that date with the Armargosa system and the destruction of his ship. It would have been an incredibly Trek ending for Picard to return multiple times, each time failing because he tried to save the Enterprise, only to finally give up and let the Enterprise be destroyed as long as it means saving the day. Also the Vor'cha model existed already why why why didn't they use it? 
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Aug 8, 2022 01:09
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Then they wouldn’t have been able to use all those shots from ST:VI.
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Aug 8, 2022 02:48
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There's that, and also I bet the Vor'cha shooting model wouldn't have been considered good enough for the big screen.
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Aug 8, 2022 02:56
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I'm pretty sure there's a line in generations that also says that it's a particularly old bird of prey lol Honestly it's pretty funny that that's the ship that took out the Enterprise
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Aug 8, 2022 03:15
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some kinda jackal posted:Daniels' black time outfit in the 31st century and his weird haircut make him look like one of those aliens from Galaxy Quest got assimilated by the Borg He was one of those aliens from Galaxy Quest, along with Sam Lloyd (RIP) and Rainn Wilson.
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Aug 8, 2022 03:20
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When Worf gets introduced in DS9, there's a line about what he's been doing "since the destruction of the Enterprise." I'm sure it would have been difficult to not be aware of the TNG movies happening when it aired, but I like to wonder if there was some fan who got into TNG in the early Netflix era and was watching through DS9, with no knowledge of the movies and thinking that they blew up the Enterprise off screen at some point and only Worf survived.
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Aug 8, 2022 03:26
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The Prime Directive is itself some condescending bullshit, if you aren't smart enough to invent FTL travel then you don't deserve to have the cure for cancer, basically. Your planet is about to be destroyed? Sorry, your race didn't get far enough in the tech tree for us to save any of you 
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Aug 8, 2022 03:32
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Marshal Radisic posted:He was one of those aliens from Galaxy Quest, along with Sam Lloyd (RIP) and Rainn Wilson. That sound you heard was my jaw hitting the floor
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Aug 8, 2022 03:36
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QuarkJets posted:The Prime Directive is itself some condescending bullshit, if you aren't smart enough to invent FTL travel then you don't deserve to have the cure for cancer, basically. i get the original point of the Prime Directive which I think was mostly don't meddle with the affairs of other planets and let cultures develop as naturally as possible. But Prime Directive stories are rarely done well. Picard was wrong in Pen Pals and the worf's human brother episode to let people die because that cosmos deems it so or the Enterprise episode where they don't help cure the aliens who are oppressing the other aliens. Ironically the one episode where the Prime Directive drama might of been good was the one where the admiral gives both sides of war weapons but that was bogged down in the magic native magic to make you younger.
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Aug 8, 2022 03:43
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Orville actually explained the Prime Directive in its latest episode better than Star Trek ever did. The Prime Directive makes perfect sense because the Federation is not Colonizers. You get a idea of what the Federation does with warp ready civilizations in that one episode where Riker gets captured by that planet. It shows a really clear thing that the Federation does actively pursue looking at prewarp civilizations.
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Aug 8, 2022 03:53
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Daniels was played by Matt Winston, son of Stan Winston.
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Aug 8, 2022 03:59
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I think the novel "Prime Directive" said that Starfleet will do things like discreetly adjust the trajectory of comets and asteroids that have a reasonable chance of striking a planet with intelligent life, assuming that intelligent life isn't advanced enough to see it with telescopes. (For reference, we had no idea there were planets past Saturn until the 19th century; some rare sightings of Uranus were considered either a very dim blue star or your ma's advertising) It would probably also be morally defensible to simply appear like the Star Brothers and roll over the joint in order to facilitate the well being of the actual individual living persons, and indeed it would be interesting to see that morality exercised somehow.
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Aug 8, 2022 04:02
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TNG Prime Directive is BS because it's like they don't even know what those words mean. They treat it like an inviolable creed with specific rules when really, based on the name, it would seem to be more of a general principle to be followed as best as one can. I like the general idea of "don't drop by a pre-warp civilization and give them a cheat code by dumping technology on them that they haven't naturally grown into". That's a solid concept. "Don't stop a meteor from wiping out a planet because they should've figured out how to stop it on their own" is sheer insanity. (To their credit, they generally show this as the wrong option, but the idea that it's even a question is stupid.)
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Aug 8, 2022 04:16
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Yeah, it's a step back from TOS where Spock burned out the Enterprise's engines trying to deflect an asteroid from hitting a planet.
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Aug 8, 2022 04:22
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Worf posted:I'm pretty sure there's a line in generations that also says that it's a particularly old bird of prey lol They needed that in there to set up the technobabble trick so the Enterprise could one-shot the Bird of Prey.
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Aug 8, 2022 04:23
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Detective No. 27 posted:When Worf gets introduced in DS9, there's a line about what he's been doing "since the destruction of the Enterprise." I'm sure it would have been difficult to not be aware of the TNG movies happening when it aired, but I like to wonder if there was some fan who got into TNG in the early Netflix era and was watching through DS9, with no knowledge of the movies and thinking that they blew up the Enterprise off screen at some point and only Worf survived. This happened to me - I'd seen the end of TNG, however never saw Generations and the first time I was made aware something happened to the Enterprise was in Way of the Warrior.
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Aug 8, 2022 04:42
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Mooseontheloose posted:i get the original point of the Prime Directive which I think was mostly don't meddle with the affairs of other planets and let cultures develop as naturally as possible. To further the irony, two of the best "...But the Prime Directive!" episodes happen on Voyager, "Blink of an Eye" and "Muse". I especially like the guy from Muse's take on the situation were Torres is like "It's too complicated to explain, so I'm not going to." and the dude's like "Well, there's people from across the ocean who are just as weird and alien to us as you are to me, so people from space seems just as logical. What's the big deal?"
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Aug 8, 2022 04:52
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Sir Lemming posted:TNG Prime Directive is BS because it's like they don't even know what those words mean. They treat it like an inviolable creed with specific rules when really, based on the name, it would seem to be more of a general principle to be followed as best as one can. Other flaws aside I did like the opening of Discovery RE: the prime directive. A bit too obvious about it but the only thing the inhabitants would have seen is two figures walk up to their well, do something, and then the water came back.
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Aug 8, 2022 04:53
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Mooseontheloose posted:I mean the Federation DOES have an air of arrogance to it with how they talk to people and their "sophistication" of culture. They come across as know-it-alls who look down at other cultures who don't automatically see how great they are. A lot of Star Trek tries very hard to counteract that mindset, but it's kinda natural to fall into with the utopian aspects of the Federation. And some star trek fans actually get mad when the Federation doesn't assert its superiority, which makes it harder to maintain a balance.
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Aug 8, 2022 06:15
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RacistsSuck posted:It’s weird that I don’t want carpet anywhere in my house but I definitely want it at work and on a starship. I worked in a building that had carpeting halfway up the walls but not on the floor.
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Aug 8, 2022 07:57
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V-Men posted:I worked in a building that had carpeting halfway up the walls but not on the floor. So the -D.
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Aug 8, 2022 08:01
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I would painstakingly recreate my own quarters in the holodeck and then exist in it normally for my alotted time, then return to my quarters.
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Aug 8, 2022 10:17
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How many times do you think Worf took a sleeping Alexander to a holodeck and told the computer to create their quarters and a holorgraphic Worf capable of parenting Alexander and then just walked out?
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Aug 8, 2022 10:56
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V-Men posted:How many times do you think Worf took a sleeping Alexander to a holodeck and told the computer to create their quarters and a holorgraphic Worf capable of parenting Alexander and then just walked out? Worf does a Star Trek insurrection holodeck ship move to trick Alexander into moving in with his grandparents It only takes one before it becomes wrong, admiral, it only takes one. Ship in a baby bottle? I'll have to workshop the name more...
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Aug 8, 2022 10:58
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Worfs face when he steps on Alexander's Klingon Lego set worf gave him, necessitating a blood transfusion Klingon children do not leave their toys on the floor
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Aug 8, 2022 10:59
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This thread is reminding me I haven't seen any TNG movie since it was out in theatres. For a split second I thought about remedying the situation but then .. eh, I'm good.
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Aug 8, 2022 11:08
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some kinda jackal posted:This thread is reminding me I haven't seen any TNG movie since it was out in theatres. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q4nceCmigAM watch this instead, its very good
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Aug 8, 2022 14:50
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