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Frank Frank posted:Counterpoint: never (ever) stop posting This is the doing crimes part of being gay?
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Aug 8, 2022 17:38
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Finishing up the latest Knowledge Fight where they break it all down with Mark and Bill. I got a really big laugh out of Roger Stone inserting himself into the mix, insisting Jones should sue Reynal, and now Mark or Bill claiming that Reynal could now sue Stone back for defamation now that he openly said that poo poo on Alex's show. I hope Mark and Bill are right about all of these morons being able to sue each other, because that's all loving funny.
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Aug 8, 2022 17:44
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Inzombiac posted:I watched Loose Change when I was 14 or so and got sucked in for a few months. Dozens of agencies and hundreds of people worked in tandem and total secrecy to destroy the WTC, but also couldn’t plant fake wmd’s in Iraq to keep the lie going.  OR IS THIS ALL PART OF THE GLOBALISTS PLANS? BUY DEHYDRATED FOOD IN A BUCKET YOU SWEATY HOGS
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Aug 8, 2022 17:45
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Lazyfire posted:The best part of Loose Change was when the kids who made it had to face down actual structural engineers who explained how incredibly wrong every one of their assumptions were. In a perfect world that would have been the end of the Jet Fuel Can't Melt Steel Beams theories, but in this reality you can just claim that the engineers are part of the NWO and WOULD say something like that. I actually kinda believed the conspiracy stuff to some extent until college just because Bush was so loving opportunistic about exploiting it that I couldn't help but think it was planned. Then I attended a structural engineering talk my freshman year where they went through the physics involved and put the Kibosh on that. But gently caress Bush regardless.
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Aug 8, 2022 17:46
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So I just want to confirm, but the cellphone data confidentiality stuff was not properly handled by Jones' team after the judge gave them a brief extension, right?
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Aug 8, 2022 18:21
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I think the judge said that any personal data WRT Medical was off limits. That's the extent of any 'extension' The prosecutors let the defense know they hosed up and they didn't reply in 10 days so the rest of it is fair game lol
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Aug 8, 2022 18:25
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FilthyImp posted:I think the judge said that any personal data WRT Medical was off limits. That's the extent of any 'extension' Didn't Reynal also still attempt to put a blanket-ban on all of it, even though he had just argued earlier for the ability to go through the information individually? Or am I mixing it up?
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Aug 8, 2022 18:30
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Loose Change had the benefit of inspiring Roose Change, so it’s hard to say if it is bad or not. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jsTVnZm9hFg E: drat that’s not the video I thought it was. Mr. Nice! fucked around with this message at 18:35 on Aug 8, 2022 |
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Aug 8, 2022 18:31
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Grand Fromage posted:Oh lol I forgot about that. I think there are Hoteps who aren't that crazy, but maybe the people who just believe historical misinformation and don't go in for the whole thing aren't really Hoteps. Notep true Hoteps? They also have some extremely strong opinions about the correct role of black women, iirc. (a) submit, b) don't date white men. but it's a-ok if we date black women) I mean, there is a slight kernel of truth to it in that a) black people were a thing in ancient Egypt, which tends to be overlooked, and b) there was a whole rear end dynasty who were probably what we would today call black  But.
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Aug 8, 2022 18:39
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Randalor posted:So I just want to confirm, but the cellphone data confidentiality stuff was not properly handled by Jones' team after the judge gave them a brief extension, right? The judge said "You've got a day" and said she would consider submissions under the court's standing order on Confidential materials (Confidential is a lower standard than privileged, but privilege had already been waived under TX rules, for things like business records). I'm not sure exactly what the effect of having something marked Confidential would be - except that presumably it would be harder for the public to see it. But the next day, Jones' team had a privilege log prepared - for things that they wanted to retro-actively declared privileged (not confidential). The judge pointed out that the privilege ship had sailed, and pointed out that nothing further was properly before her.
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Aug 8, 2022 18:39
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mojo1701a posted:Didn't Reynal also still attempt to put a blanket-ban on all of it, even though he had just argued earlier for the ability to go through the information individually? Or am I mixing it up? He did contradict himself. IIRC, Reynal arguments were 1) He first wanted a blanket ban on the documents, on the theory that his "please disregard" was a proper clawback off all the documents despite not claiming any specific privilige or identifying documents. This failed 2) He asked for the trial to be delayed and that he should get an additional 10 days as a do-over. This failed 3) He claimed that the first time he heard about the documents was when they were presented to Alex in court, prompting the judge to go "but you sent me the email showing you were told before the trial" and he said that's not what he believes. This went nowhere Piell fucked around with this message at 18:55 on Aug 8, 2022 |
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Aug 8, 2022 18:40
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My understanding of the phone timeline is: -Reynal fucks up and sends it to the plaintiffs -Bankston emails back something like "Are you sure this was not sent in error?" -Reynal replies something like "please disregard. we will send you a new one" but didn't actually follow the appropriate steps to make it privileged nor did they prepare a new one. In a normal trial with otherwise competent lawyers who respect each other "please disregard" might have been enough. -10 days pass and plaintiffs are now free to use it. -Bankston drops his bomb during the trial. Reynal doesn't even object. -Reynal later asks the judge for 10 days from that moment to review what they had and ask for privilege on appropriate documents. -Judge says "how about you get that to me by the end of the day. you were supposed to turn a lot of this over a year ago you could have done this then." -Reynal realizes this is a nearly impossible task and just sort of gives a blanket "all of it, plz" which obviously the judge denies because we've already seen a few things that are clearly not. -Bankston wants to make sure he's backed up legally by the court so he gets the judge's permission to hand it over to relevant parties such as the Jan 6 committee. She's cool with it. It's already been sent to the CT lawyers because they have a shared document agreement. This is all from memory but I think it's close. edit to add: -Reynal ordered to appear in CT later in the month (17th?) to do some 'splainin' about why he had the medical records for all of the plaintiffs in that case. Tree Dude fucked around with this message at 19:00 on Aug 8, 2022 |
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Aug 8, 2022 18:51
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Oh okay, I wasn't sure if the phone evidence was free and clear now. Also, I still get a hearty laugh at Reynal trying to argue that Mark was violating the "spirit" of the law by wanting Alex's lawyers to follow the word of law. I mean, he's a lawyer, he should understand that the word of law is their bread and butter. Also, that he never actually gave a followup link like he said he was going to kind of puts a different light on the whole "spirit" of what he was trying to do.
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Aug 8, 2022 18:52
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https://twitter.com/JoshtheSandwich/status/1556011068543098883 We have all been there. Grand Fromage posted:Hoteps are a weird Black nationalist conspiracy thing. Basically the "Cleopatra was Black" people but there are various levels of crazy within it. Some are just people with confused knowledge of history, some are full on right wing nutcases and also think every historical figure in the world was secretly Black but it's been suppressed by the Globalists or whatever the gently caress. SalTheBard posted:So I was typing this out on my phone and deleted it, but now that I can type it on my computer here we go:
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Aug 8, 2022 18:59
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Tree Dude posted:-Bankston wants to make sure he's backed up legally by the court so he gets the judge's permission to hand it over to relevant parties such as the Jan 6 committee. She's cool with it. It's already been sent to the CT lawyers because they have a shared document agreement. I love the absolute amount of dotting every I and crossing every T that Bankston and the plaintiffs' lawyers went through, because not only does it make it that much harder for Jones to mount a proper defence, but it also shows exactly how
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Aug 8, 2022 19:01
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Randalor posted:Oh okay, I wasn't sure if the phone evidence was free and clear now. Andrew Torrez from Opening Arguments talked some recently about how a lot of what lawyers do day-to-day is based on having good working relationships with other lawyers. If you need a continuance because your Grandma died, the other side isn't going to fight you. If you accidentally send something over that you didn't mean to, the other side won't gently caress with you if you ask for it to be returned/destroyed. In a normal case, the "Please disregard" would have been enough for the lawyer to infer a good-faith request and return it. ~BUT~ After years of bad faith fuckery, the plaintiff's lawyers did not care to extend those courtesies. And the fact that the disclosure included things that Jones was required to have submitted in discovery was just the cherry on top.
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Aug 8, 2022 19:09
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Makes me think that Jones' lawyer doesn't give much of a poo poo about winning. He's not putting up much of a fight. I'd wager that he knows Alex is turbo hosed and is just getting a paycheck and some publicity.
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Aug 8, 2022 19:10
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Randalor posted:Oh okay, I wasn't sure if the phone evidence was free and clear now. A lot of the legal system does run on "spirit of the law" stuff because laws are rarely black and white, simple things that can be evenly applied to all situations. Of course, when someone is a complete rear end in a top hat who has pissed off everyone in the courtroom, the judge isn't going to be lenient when the text of the law is "LOL get rekt!"
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Aug 8, 2022 19:10
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My understanding is Jone’s lawyer said “please disregard” to the accidental leak, but there’s nothing legally binding in that statement. It’s like being in a police interrogation and saying “I want a lawyer” or “I’m not speaking without an attorney”. The cop may be well aware of what you’re asking for, but if they want to play hardball they can choose to interpret it as a statement of fact or preference with no legal obligations and continue the interrogation. You have to actually say “I’m invoking my right to…” So “please disregard” is a polite request, but since they’d been jerking them around all trial, Mark was free to ignore it since he never declared it privileged, which IS the part that’s legally binding on Mark’s part.
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Aug 8, 2022 19:11
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Considering that the contents should have been handed over a year ago, and that said contents showed Jones perjured himself a lot, I think "spirit of the law" was hacked to death an set on fire long before the phone stuff was sent out.
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Aug 8, 2022 19:24
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My not-a-lawyer understanding is that you're just supposed to be more careful than that with your poo poo. And if you're not careful, then the only takesies-backsies you get is if you say something like, "I would like to claim privilege on mycrimes.txt as it contains sensitive information between myself and my client. I would also like to claim privilege on cookedbooks.xlsx as it actually contains sensitive medical or similar data not relevant to the case." Repeat for every single file sent, but probably in some kind of specialized form letter with a lot of stamps and seals on it. And in each case the reason has to be something the law actually cares about, as well as provably true. So "I would like to claim privilege on mynudes(1).jpg through mynudes(26).jpg because no one needs to see that" wouldn't necessarily be defensible. Because your actual step one is supposed to be "don't send the opposition anything I don't want them to have" and if you bungle that, that's on you to try and clean up that mess.
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Aug 8, 2022 19:32
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Devor posted:*Words about Spirit of law and not being a dick* Oh, I understand that fully, and like I said, considering Reynal never actually sent a followup link like he said, he can argue "Spirit of law" all he wants, it doesn't change the fact that he wasn't following the spirit of the law himself, especially considering how he was acting towards Mark the first few days.
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Aug 8, 2022 19:34
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Random Stranger posted:A lot of the legal system does run on "spirit of the law" stuff because laws are rarely black and white, simple things that can be evenly applied to all situations. Of course, when someone is a complete rear end in a top hat who has pissed off everyone in the courtroom, the judge isn't going to be lenient when the text of the law is "LOL get rekt!" One of the things I specifically remember in my (admittedly low-level) college business law course was that at least in Canada, a lot of our legal system does allow good-faith "spirit of the law" arguments, especially in civil disputes. Doesn't mean that you can't argue technicalities, but even our Charter has specific "reasonable" allowances for those reasons. I'm glad that US law isn't quite as rigid as it appears to a foreigner.
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Aug 8, 2022 19:34
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The dropbox link sent by Andino in error was Jones' CT defense attorney's entire hard drive backed up to dropbox. This means that there were confidential medical records, confidential depositions, and such in relation to this case along with the stuff phone Jones' phone. In addition, there was everything for all of his Jan 6th defendants because Pattis represents a bunch of those guys, too. e: edited to remove some info Mr. Nice! fucked around with this message at 20:09 on Aug 8, 2022 |
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Aug 8, 2022 19:37
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Old Kentucky Shark posted:There's some hope that he might be tried for perjury in the Connecticut case; he's already perjured himself in the deposition phase, since he also claimed to have no texts or emails about Sandy Hook in discovery there as well, and the CT AG is probably going to be a LOT less friendly than the TX AG. CT is deep blue, and the current AG ran on being an aggressive go-getter. Tong is probably salivating for this poo poo to get to him.
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Aug 8, 2022 19:38
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Tree Dude posted:-Reynal ordered to appear in CT later in the month (17th?) to do some 'splainin' about why he had the medical records for all of the plaintiffs in that case. This one is maybe more interesting than the timeline of events after the files were sent. The data Reynal uploaded in error had psychological files on the Sandy Hook parents suing Jones in Connecticut and other information that clearly came from Norm Pattis, the defense lawyer in the CT case. There was an agreement between the TX and CT systems that allowed for the plaintiffs to share specific information, but the defense was barred from doing the same. Either Reynal or one of the previous lawyers (I'm thinking it was Barnes) had direct contact with Pattis and was getting information that should have been exclusive to the CT case. That raises the question on what Reynal/TX defense had provided to Pattis in return. So if Reynal was talking to Pattis this whole time he may be hosed in CT. If a series of Infowars Texas lawyers were talking to the CT defense team THEY could also be hosed depending on how long this has been going on and who initiated contact.
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Aug 8, 2022 19:39
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PITY BONER posted:I was friends with a lot of Airmen back in the mid-2000s thanks to the constant turnover at the local coastal air/dock base bringing tons of FOB dudes to the local skateparks (where I made friends with them). Your post has me wondering what the percentage of military members were Loose Changers, Zeitgeisters, InfoWarriors, etc., back then, because it seemed like most of the servicemen I met were all believers in one form of political conspiracy or another. I know it was truly the zeitgeist (lol) to be into that stuff at the time, but it seemed exceptionally higher in military guys. I think it would probably depend on the service. My guess is that hoorah guys that went in to the Army and Marine Corps probably just wanted to kill
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Aug 8, 2022 19:55
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But will we ever find out who did that background check on Leonard Pozner? Also, the info has officially been handed over to the January 6 committee: https://www.cnn.com/2022/08/08/politics/alex-jones-january-6/index.html LET'S GO
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Aug 8, 2022 19:59
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Lazyfire posted:This one is maybe more interesting than the timeline of events after the files were sent. The data Reynal uploaded in error had psychological files on the Sandy Hook parents suing Jones in Connecticut and other information that clearly came from Norm Pattis, the defense lawyer in the CT case. There was an agreement between the TX and CT systems that allowed for the plaintiffs to share specific information, but the defense was barred from doing the same. Either Reynal or one of the previous lawyers (I'm thinking it was Barnes) had direct contact with Pattis and was getting information that should have been exclusive to the CT case. That raises the question on what Reynal/TX defense had provided to Pattis in return. So if Reynal was talking to Pattis this whole time he may be hosed in CT. If a series of Infowars Texas lawyers were talking to the CT defense team THEY could also be hosed depending on how long this has been going on and who initiated contact. Reynal is not supposed to have access to any CT files. He had access to Pattis’ entire file cabinet, effectively, and sent the key to the cabinet to Mark.
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Aug 8, 2022 19:59
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Oh poo poo they do have two years of texts. I had seen stuff that said it was only 6 months of texts.
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Aug 8, 2022 20:00
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Mr. Nice! posted:Reynal is not supposed to have access to any CT files. He had access to Pattis’ entire file cabinet, effectively, and sent the key to the cabinet to Mark. What's the reason why he wouldn't? I mean, isn't it the same defendant? IANAL so I don't know.
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Aug 8, 2022 20:01
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mojo1701a posted:What's the reason why he wouldn't? I mean, isn't it the same defendant? I would think the different plaintiffs would make it pointless to share information even if it is the same defendant.
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Aug 8, 2022 20:04
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Mr. Nice! posted:Oh poo poo they do have two years of texts. I had seen stuff that said it was only 6 months of texts. I would guess if it was the entire drive that they had individual files for each 6 month period. So Jones and crew may have technically been correct when they said there were six month in there from that period, they were just looking at one file. Or maybe there were individuals then also all the full history the individual were created from. If that’s the case, lol and lmao. 
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Aug 8, 2022 20:06
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Even if it were just 6 months of mails, I bet Alex Jones is the kind of person who bottom quotes, so there'd be mail threads going back much further in there.
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Aug 8, 2022 20:11
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SalTheBard posted:In fact I think i still have the CD he burned me of with a bunch of Alex Jones stuff on it somewhere. It's just a CD labled INFOWARS that I thought was the coolest poo poo ever. IIRC this was a big factor in the popularity and spread of LC. It hit right at the time CD-RW's became common-place. E: maybe not commonplace, but available for the common idiot conspiracist to procure, burn and mail off. Scam Likely fucked around with this message at 20:15 on Aug 8, 2022 |
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Aug 8, 2022 20:12
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KrunkMcGrunk posted:Jordan is ignorant about the eps by design. The setup is Dan listens to aj, and picks it apart for Jordan who reacts to what he's hearing. KF doesn't work without that. Ignorant about the world in general, not about the episodes. I do know how the show works. teen witch posted:Man I just do not understand the dollop. I like the concept, but it just doesn’t work. But that’s ok! Not everything has to be for me all the time. The Dollop isn’t a lesser show based on my opinions. If you haven't, at least listen to the episode called The Rube. It's one of the first ones (14 maybe?) and has never really been topped.
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Aug 8, 2022 20:13
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mojo1701a posted:
Fixed for you.
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Aug 8, 2022 20:13
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mojo1701a posted:What's the reason why he wouldn't? I mean, isn't it the same defendant? Reynal is not a lawyer for Jones in the CT case. The files in the CT case are subject to a protective order from the court. Reynal is not party to said protective order, so he shouldn't have any access to files covered by the protective order. The order does allow for plaintiffs counsel to share everything, though. There is no such provision for Reynal. As such, him having access to Pattis' entire file violates the protective order.
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Aug 8, 2022 20:17
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Scam Likely posted:IIRC this was a big factor in the popularity and spread of LC. It hit right at the time CD-RW's became common-place. I always knew about Loose Change and Zeitgeist, but had no idea it was produced by Alex Jones. I just thought it was some internet-based bullshit. In retrospect, I have a vague recollection of a roommate of mine mentioning something about learning about the Rothschilds and banking families or something from a movie, and I'm starting to wonder if these were the movies. Normally I'd say "yeah, sure" but he never mentioned it past this one moment, and IME conspiracy theorists are not the ones to keep this kind of poo poo to themselves. Scam Likely posted:Fixed for you.  Mr. Nice! posted:Reynal is not a lawyer for Jones in the CT case. The files in the CT case are subject to a protective order from the court. Reynal is not party to said protective order, so he shouldn't have any access to files covered by the protective order. The order does allow for plaintiffs counsel to share everything, though. There is no such provision for Reynal. As such, him having access to Pattis' entire file violates the protective order. That makes sense, but is there a reason why there's a protective order, even if it's not the same defence counsel?
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Aug 8, 2022 20:17
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"Pretend you're not sniffing your finger... pretend you're not sniffing your finger..."
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