|
Somberbrero posted:I like it well enough. It's all just build up, seems pretty normal to have a couple chapters of rising tension before the fight begins in earnest. It'll read better once completed, serial fiction can just be frustrating when you have to wait for the good stuff. I have to assume you're joking about measuring the quality of chapters in punches thrown. i've been reading the series as its come out for like 14 years in a row now, i'm well aware of how weekly pacing can skew things a bit, but we're getting literally nothing out of this. the situation is genuinely identical at the end of this chapter as it was at the start. the last three chapters in aggregate have kept the story at a standstill, and in the meantime the cool character moments we are are more bizarro nonsense woli moments morikawa loses his loving mind writing this character fsr, it's so off the rest of his quality
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 02:39
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 14, 2024 07:43 |
|
|
MonsterEnvy posted:It’s not. but I also started the series after the first Wally fight and did not have the same distaste for him that lots of the people in this thread have. (I read the fight but it was all at once rather than weekly) Yeah that's a big part of it. In a re-read this chapter would flit by in 30 seconds or so. Having to sit on it for 2 weeks is 
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 03:16
|
|
|
i hate to break it to y'all but 'two punches thrown in three chapters of fight' is not exactly unprecedented in the beginning of a match in this manga
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 03:50
|
|
|
The problem is that practically every chapter since Ippo got to Mexico, except for the brief but super good Ippo vs Volg interlude, has been constantly showing us all about how Wally's so wacky and unpredictable but is nevertheless incredibly good at boxing. So now we're just retreading that whole ground again. Hell, we've even seen it in the ring recently! So far this whole fight has been just Sendo vs Wally again, except instead of having Sendo throwing punches and cursing while Wally runs and jumps around, Ricardo is watching silently while Wally runs and jumps around and occasionally kinda sticks out his fist.
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 04:14
|
|
|
I dont know what exactly Ricardo is going to do here, but with how they're building it up it looks to be an even larger heartbreaking loss (mind the pun) than Date's. That or he's gonna get dumb'ed to death, which is its own shocking moment.
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 06:44
|
|
|
Wally is also insanely racist, which I'm just sort of choosing to overlook because this stuff happens sometimes in manga. I mean, he is literally a monkey guy from "the jungle" who loves bananas. I guess this is what Morikawa thinks Indonesians are like?
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 10:26
|
|
|
Ytlaya posted:Wally is also insanely racist You can’t remove that aspect from him as its his entire character so the manga is trying it’s best to pretty paint it. He’s calling himself a monkey, wearing a tail and his trainer had the ”WAR LEE (monkeyface)” jacket, at the same time they are name dropping Jakarta as a big city and trying to show more diverse knowledge of Indonesia. So it feels like the manga is trying to rebrand the blatant racism as a deliberate stage persona chosen by Wally and his trainer. I don’t know if it’s having any positive effect at all, but it’s interesting to see and at least shows Morikawa or an editor is aware of the problem. Bisse fucked around with this message at 10:56 on Sep 14, 2022 |
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 10:49
|
|
|
As for the pacing I think it's the usual HnI match intro pacing and there's stuff going on beyond punches thrown, namely Ricardo is taking a very interesting approach and reaction to Wally's antics. So far instead of getting frustrated or surprised and chasing after, he's standing still, keeping calm, analyzing and putting up his guard. I think this matching is going to keep feeling frustrating until Ricardo can land any kind of hit on Wally and show this isn't going to be another match with just the same bullshit as last time. If you looked at it as a real match with real people with real limitations, Ricardo would be clearly advantageous so far as Wally is wasting a lot of effort zooming around and loving around in the ring showing a lot of his cards, while Ricardo is mostly standing still, focusing and conserving energy. Bisse fucked around with this message at 11:03 on Sep 14, 2022 |
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 11:00
|
|
|
tbp posted:this genuinely has to be a contrarian take for the sake of it at this pt (note: not an actual accusation i'm just bewildered at the sentiment) I don't anticipate ippo chapters coming out and just read if I see them so it doesn't particularly bother me. It's the chapter length mostly that's the issue
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 11:47
|
|
|
Wally using the hide-behind-referee no jutsu has me in stiches. I haven't even finished to read the chapter, had to come post first.
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 13:29
|
|
|
Is as if Morikawa is making wally as unlikable as possible on purpose (him being annoying, for sure, it's part of his fight "plan". But unlikable?), So, if he gets *destroyed* then, yes, it was on purpose. Otherwise I guess the author does really think that super monkey boy (now with extra cockiness!) is a good character/boxer. Personally I'm leaning towards believing the later.
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 13:42
|
|
|
Hiding behind the ref is definitely illegal. Not that it matters
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 15:23
|
|
|
Rubellavator posted:Hiding behind the ref is definitely illegal. Not that it matters And who is in charge of calling the the fouls? The referee? Wally's plan is perfect!
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 16:06
|
|
|
full thoughts on why i'm, so far, not a fan and don't anticipate becoming one (because I was being a bit too terse i think before): woli just feels very incongruous with the rest of the story. he did before, but ESPECIALLY now. yes, there are fighters in the real world who are outrageously talented, even compared to their other world-class peers. woli takes this to the limit, ramping up his natural abilities to the extreme of what you might expect in a manga that is moderately grounded, for the most part. that, itself, isn't the end of the world for me. to expand on it - hawk never felt insanely annoying to see on the screen. he was as talented as woli and put in even less effort, but his character made it actually pretty satisfying. the reader knows the entire time he's acting like a dickhead that it's ultimately going to be his downfall, too. we get a really nice conclusion to the hawk storyline that introduces morikawa's main thesis for world class fights - the ideal boxer is someone who is talented, but works like a demon, someone who mixes technique and savagery. takamura is a "broken" character too, but the reader is more inclined to like him because we see the pure hell he puts himself through to even stand in the ring. in contrast, while "hard work and experience" beats woli the first time, too, we're flat out told that this wouldn't happen again. hell, it wasn't even believable with the way mori drew it the first time, ippo lightly grazes woli's abdomen like four times and the guy just completely collapses. the first fight was, without question, the worst in this entire manga. so he comes back, and he's not any worse for wear (like other genius characters that have returned, hayami). he's running rings around sendo and volg, two characters with a lot more meat to them, in a way that feels a little insulting. and we start to see the theme introduced back in the hawk fight come up again here - woli IS that perfect mixture of athletic ability, intuition, and now experience and technique, so maybe he can beat ricardo? his only "flaw" is a lack of violence inside of him, but the narrative tempers whether or not this is actually even an issue through ippo's words. so now we're left with this guy who almost feels like a fan fiction character - he's so good he can copy any technique, his reflexes are on par with itagaki at his best, he's incredibly strong, he fights in an unorthodox style, he's got a world class trainer, etc. just plop back in to the narrative to face ricardo (delaying the much more interesting sendo and ricardo fight). he treats boxing with such insane levity that it feels bizarre and annoying to me, especially because the overarching narrative for this whole part of the story is the deeply serious concerns ippo has regarding his health. but, as a reader, we might ask ourselves "why would ippo even loving bother" at this point - he's nowhere near as gifted as woli, he's way more injured internally than woli, and we all know woli isn't going to win this fight, so why should ippo even consider coming back to the ring? the incongruity combined with the snails paced chapters just get me kinda annoyed. the best resolution here, IMO, is for woli to start actually treating this like a boxing match, and i might change my tune. or maybe we can see ricardo just pick him apart with all this nonsense. but i really think the super gimmick fights should be reserved for the clown crew and not the FW world champions, i like the additional gravitas that's been present in the characters that revolve around ippo and he just sucks me right out of that so quickly that i can't help but want it to be over
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 16:08
|
|
|
Rubellavator posted:Hiding behind the ref is definitely illegal. Not that it matters Not just hiding, actively throwing punches around the ref's head! Rules just don't apply to him I guess.
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 18:23
|
|
|
Woli is the perfect synthesis of Takamura (talent), Ippo (love of boxing), and Aoki (stupid gimmicks). This is why he will win.
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 21:00
|
|
|
He'll win after Ricardo pushes him hard enough to try. It's your standard Orange Cassidy scenario.
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 21:09
|
|
|
Ytlaya posted:Wally is also insanely racist, which I'm just sort of choosing to overlook because this stuff happens sometimes in manga. No he's noted as being eccentric in general. Like he lives on a small jungle island in Indonesia, and we see Indonesians reacting oddly to him cause he's a wierdo. We have seen other Indonesians they are not any weirder then anyone else. (Except Papaya Dachiu who is basically Aoki)
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 21:18
|
|
|
Monaghan posted:Not just hiding, actively throwing punches around the ref's head! Rules just don't apply to him I guess. The refs in this are so bad they deserve to be used like props.
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 21:27
|
|
|
I honestly forgot how much I hated Woli’s super punch out wacky poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 21:35
|
|
|
This is how you know Morikawa hungers to restore the Empire of Japan and destroy Indonesia
|
|
#
?
Sep 14, 2022 21:47
|
|
|
Lamebot posted:The refs in this are so bad they deserve to be used like props. Just like real boxing then
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 09:42
|
|
|
-Surely hitting Ricardo with a banana bunch was against the rules. -Wait, where did he get those coconuts from? -Just because he put a glove in his foot doesn't make it less of a kick. Feel free to guess more phrases we're likely to see in the following chapters.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 09:43
|
|
|
The kick I can see happening.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 09:49
|
|
|
trucutru posted:-Surely hitting Ricardo with a banana bunch was against the rules. "He calls it the Rear View!"
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 10:04
|
|
|
I figured this would happen so I decided I was gonna wait for the fight to be over and just binge.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 12:40
|
|
|
I have sentenced Wally to death
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 14:30
|
|
|
Some parts are a little silly but Wally is using strategy against Ricardo.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 15:24
|
|
|
Woli uses his invisible punch to try to cut Ricardo but he manages to tilt his head back and gets his mustache shaven clean. Then Woli is sacrificed to Huitzilopochtli on top of the Templo Mayor for blasfemy, as it usually happens in Mexico.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 16:08
|
|
|
I do like the last few panels of Wally not doing anything but taunting Ricardo into doing something since it's very clearly laid out he prefers to download what his opponents do in order to just counter it. If Wally does nothing and Ricardo does nothing who will flinch first. In fact I hope this "do nothing" strategy goes so far to the last round that Ricardo gets desperate and HAS to finally make the first move since Wally's punch "technically" landed. Or it hilariously goes to decision and judges are shown to be hilariously corrupt, like in real boxing  and award phantom punches to Ricardo to have him win again
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 17:07
|
|
|
the eyecut fights are always the worst, but looks likely
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 17:21
|
|
|
UnderFreddy posted:the eyecut fights are always the worst, but looks likely A referee that stops the unbeaten super champ title fight on home ground over an eye cut is even more unbelievable than Woli climbing the ropes to do a shooting star elbow drop. (which, granted, he will do)
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 17:30
|
|
|
Jiro posted:
When was the last time a decision happened in this series again? I think Miyata had one in his favor?
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 18:11
|
|
|
Flesnolk posted:This is how you know Morikawa hungers to restore the Empire of Japan and destroy Indonesia Well I mean that and literally having the Japanese soldiers be the good-guys in the post-WW2 flashback arc saying "Lousy yanks, we'd beat them in a fair fight!"
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 20:56
|
|
|
Nilbop posted:Well I mean that and literally having the Japanese soldiers be the good-guys in the post-WW2 flashback arc saying "Lousy yanks, we'd beat them in a fair fight!" Salty about nukes, they were pretty imbalanced in the 1940s metagame.
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 21:07
|
|
|
Don't start nuttin, won't be nuttin - Franklin Delano Roosevelt
|
|
#
?
Sep 15, 2022 21:19
|
|
|
Nilbop posted:Well I mean that and literally having the Japanese soldiers be the good-guys in the post-WW2 flashback arc saying "Lousy yanks, we'd beat them in a fair fight!" I was just shitposting at first but yes, you're 100% right; plus in general all but two or so non-Japanese characters are portrayed as basically subhuman
|
|
#
?
Sep 16, 2022 03:57
|
|
|
Think that might be reaching
|
|
#
?
Sep 16, 2022 03:59
|
|
|
instantaneous muscle movement
|
|
#
?
Sep 16, 2022 04:01
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 14, 2024 07:43 |
|
|
SyntheticPolygon posted:Think that might be reaching Oh it is, the most evil foreign characters have been Hawk and Sakaguchi, and there have been Japanese people that have acted just as bad as them.
|
|
#
?
Sep 16, 2022 05:26
|
|