UKMT Autumn 2022 - Get thee behind me, seitan.

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > UKMT Autumn 2022 - Get thee behind me, seitan.

fuctifino: Jun 11, 2001

Snowden is best to be ignored. He's irrelevant now.

In other news, everything is on hold until Brady is back from his holiday

https://twitter.com/BethRigby/status/1580982554588762112

# ? Oct 14, 2022 20:26

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# ? May 25, 2024 18:37

a pipe smoking dog: Jan 25, 2010; "haha, dogs can't smoke!"

Soylent Yellow posted:

Some of the theorising I've been seeing this afternoon is that they've convinced him it's a stepping-stone to number 10, and that he'll be annointed caretaker PM monday afternoon after the markets crater.

Yeah his plan is obviously Truss gets forced out over the weekend, he takes over and calls an election with the hope that he gets a new leader bounce and saves enough of the party that he can win an election in 4 or 5 years.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 20:28

BalloonFish: Jun 30, 2013; Fun Shoe

OwlFancier posted:

I am at least feeling validated that the view I've had more or less since halfway through may's term is being validated, that the party is institutionally on a course for the center of the earth and all they're doing is changing who is sitting on the top deck making brum brum noises.

Shame about all the alternatives and the fact we have to live with it but at least I'm right and that's what matters.

Although Brexit absolutely hosed Labour in the short term, I think it did serious but more hidden damage to the Conservatives too - like hairline cracks in a jet engine blade that slowly grow over the years until it suddenly fails and explodes without warning. The issue drove a wedge between the party's voters (asset-holding, economically insulated gammons) and its actual client base (finance and business). It has stayed afloat, politically and intellectually, by dedicating itself to certain specific cliques in its base, but each time it does so it drives away the other cliques, and that means that next time they try the same strategy they're shedding support from a smaller pool. They started off by going full-bore Get Brexit Done, ejecting the not inconsiderable part of their support that thought Brexit was madness, then they plucked for Hard Brexit, then for uncouth populist nationalism and extreme xenophobia, and now they're standing up for a tiny group of libertarian nutjobs. Each time they pick a course they seem to divide their support in half.

I don't think this article has been in the thread (if it has, apologies but I missed it), but it captures what a listless, shambling zombie the 2022 Conservative Party is and how bereft of purpose and morale it is:

https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/politics/article/conservative-conference-2022

It also has some brilliant turns of phrase

# ? Oct 14, 2022 20:28

Olpainless: Jun 30, 2003; ... Insert something brilliantly witty here.

fuctifino posted:

Snowden is best to be ignored. He's irrelevant now.

In other news, everything is on hold until Brady is back from his holiday

https://twitter.com/BethRigby/status/1580982554588762112

yeah, snowden is a loving asset now

on the other hand, i got to watch our local mp recently announce nottingham was going to go all in on fusion our area, so... what the gently caress, the brainworms are getting stronger in bradley

# ? Oct 14, 2022 20:30

Jaeluni Asjil: Apr 18, 2018; Sorry I thought you were a landlord when I gave you your old avatar!

OwlFancier posted:

what are the little grooved things on the table for?

To hold name cards in case anyone forgets who's Minister for Wonkery or whatever this week.

And those 'out of alignment' (albeit it's a curve) thingies are so annoying, someone needs to move them properly in to place.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 20:49

Pistol_Pete: Sep 15, 2007; Oven Wrangler

BalloonFish posted:

https://www.gq-magazine.co.uk/politics/article/conservative-conference-2022

This piece is basically the thread title as a long form article.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 20:55

fuctifino: Jun 11, 2001

https://twitter.com/Ed_Miliband/status/1580931307185401856

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:00

Tomberforce: May 30, 2006

Jaeluni Asjil posted:

To hold name cards in case anyone forgets who's Minister for Wonkery or whatever this week.

And those 'out of alignment' (albeit it's a curve) thingies are so annoying, someone needs to move them properly in to place.

Minister for Wokery according to fash dads nowadays.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:03

Tesseraction: Apr 5, 2009

fuctifino posted:

Snowden is best to be ignored. He's irrelevant now.

In other news, everything is on hold until Brady is back from his holiday

https://twitter.com/BethRigby/status/1580982554588762112

The Parthenonce

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:09

peanut-: Feb 17, 2004; Fun Shoe

a pipe smoking dog posted:

Yeah his plan is obviously Truss gets forced out over the weekend, he takes over and calls an election with the hope that he gets a new leader bounce and saves enough of the party that he can win an election in 4 or 5 years.

There�s some opportunity for the party to just hang absolutely everything round Truss�s neck and present a �fresh start� and hope everyone forgets about the preceding 12 years.

It�s pretty obvious already that her role is now to be a punching bag and the public target of blame for Tory MPs to pin everything on.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:13

Guavanaut: Nov 27, 2009; Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998; Toilet Rascal

BalloonFish posted:

The issue drove a wedge between the party's voters (asset-holding, economically insulated gammons) and its actual client base (finance and business). It has stayed afloat, politically and intellectually, by dedicating itself to certain specific cliques in its base

That reminds me a lot of Adam Smith. The actual one, not the Captain Capitalism poster that every institution named after him has on their bedroom wall.

Smith posted:

The whole annual produce of the land and labour of every country, or what comes to the same thing, the whole price of that annual produce, naturally divides itself, it has already been observed, into three parts; the rent of land, the wages of labour, and the profits of stock; and constitutes a revenue to three different orders of people; to those who live by rent, to those who live by wages, and to those who live by profit. These are the three great, original, and constituent orders of every civilised society, from whose revenue that of every other order is ultimately derived.

The interest of the first of those three great orders, it appears from what has been just now said, is strictly and inseparably connected with the general interest of the society. Whatever either promotes or obstructs the one, necessarily promotes or obstructs the other. When the public deliberates concerning any regulation of commerce or police, the proprietors of land never can mislead it, with a view to promote the interest of their own particular order; at least, if they have any tolerable knowledge of that interest. They are, indeed, too often defective in this tolerable knowledge. They are the only one of the three orders whose revenue costs them neither labour nor care, but comes to them, as it were, of its own accord, and independent of any plan or project of their own. That indolence, which is the natural effect of the ease and security of their situation, renders them too often, not only ignorant, but incapable of that application of mind which is necessary in order to foresee and understand the consequences of any public regulation.

The interest of the second order, that of those who live by wages, is as strictly connected with the interest of the society as that of the first. The wages of the labourer, it has already been shown, are never so high as when the demand for labour is continually rising, or when the quantity employed is every year increasing considerably. When this real wealth of the society becomes stationary, his wages are soon reduced to what is barely enough to enable him to bring up a family, or to continue the race of labourers. When the society declines, they fall even below this. The order of proprietors may, perhaps, gain more by the prosperity of the society than that of labourers: but there is no order that suffers so cruelly from its decline. But though the interest of the labourer is strictly connected with that of the society, he is incapable either of comprehending that interest or of understanding its connection with his own. His condition leaves him no time to receive the necessary information, and his education and habits are commonly such as to render him unfit to judge even though he was fully informed. In the public deliberations, therefore, his voice is little heard and less regarded, except upon some particular occasions, when his clamour is animated, set on and supported by his employers, not for his, but their own particular purposes.

His employers constitute the third order, that of those who live by profit. It is the stock that is employed for the sake of profit which puts into motion the greater part of the useful labour of every society. The plans and projects of the employers of stock regulate and direct all the most important operations of labour, and profit is the end proposed by all those plans and projects. But the rate of profit does not, like rent and wages, rise with the prosperity and fall with the declension of the society. On the contrary, it is naturally low in rich and high in poor countries, and it is always highest in the countries which are going fastest to ruin.

Of course, Smith writes in the day before the trade union hall or the board school (or the fear of the soviet), so assumes that of the three classes the workers have nothing to say that they haven't been told by one of the other two classes, but the exact same was true of the Brexit debate, we heard very little from workers' groups and far too much from the "landowners defective in tolerable knowledge" and "those who live by profit" classes. Endless Tory v. Whig debates.

Maybe this is/was the final gasp of trying to wedge the rival Tory landowner and Whig finance factions into one party out of fear of a bloc Workers' party in the 20th century, although I can't really see that splitting anywhere other than authoritarian social democracy with nationalist characteristics vs. useless liberalism at present. That or a voting system that doesn't automatically degrade to two parties.

(I enjoyed the article)

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:14

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

It's extremely funny that literally the only thing truss did was kill the queen and also the economy, and will likely otherwise be a total footnote.

0 to 100 and back to 0 again, all gas no brakes.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:15

fuctifino: Jun 11, 2001

I think she's spiteful enough to call a general election before she's finally ousted.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:17

Looke: Aug 2, 2013

everyone said that about Johnson lol

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:18

serious gaylord: Sep 16, 2007; what.

fuctifino posted:

I think she's spiteful enough to call a general election before she's finally ousted.

It still has to be voted on though right? The tories can just say no.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:20

Diet Crack: Jan 15, 2001

lmao I love how the solution of replacing an abject failure is to parachute another abject failure in place

Catharsis

https://twitter.com/JackHen16271194/status/1580433504802058240

Diet Crack fucked around with this message at 21:28 on Oct 14, 2022

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:23

Guavanaut: Nov 27, 2009; Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998; Toilet Rascal

Bold assumption that they have anything else to replace her with. The whole party is like a Napoleonic artillery battle in a swamp during monsoon. Another damp squib? Cool, load the next damp squib.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:25

fuctifino: Jun 11, 2001

serious gaylord posted:

It still has to be voted on though right? The tories can just say no.

I thought she had the power to go to the King and dissolve parliament? Something about not commanding the confidence of the house iirc. I believe other people can go to the King and claim they have the majority confidence, but I don't think any politician can genuinely claim that at the moment.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:27

Guavanaut: Nov 27, 2009; Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998; Toilet Rascal

He's still sulky that she wouldn't let him go to the big environment conference. lmao if she gets stuck piloting a zombie government and nobody will let her not until she ~~resigns~~ Chiltern Hundreds herself.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:33

Diet Crack: Jan 15, 2001

https://twitter.com/evolvepolitics/status/1580904191291457536

I know a light aircraft rental company..

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:37

fuctifino: Jun 11, 2001

Found all the legal stuff, and picked out what I think are the relevant subsections

https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/60646/election-rules-chapter6-draft_0.pdf

quote:

14. Governments hold office by virtue of their ability to command the confidence of
the House and hold office until they resign. A Government or Prime Minister who
cannot command the confidence of the House of Commons is required by
constitutional convention to resign or, where it is appropriate to do so instead, may
seek a dissolution of Parliament. When a Government or Prime Minister resigns it is
for the Monarch to invite the person whom it appears is most likely to be able to
command the confidence of the House of Commons to serve as Prime Minister and
to form a government. However it is the responsibility of those involved in the
political process � and in particular the parties represented in Parliament � to seek to
determine and communicate clearly who that person should be. These are the
principles that underpin the appointment of a Prime Minister and formation of a
government in all circumstances.

<snip>

quote:

17. If the Prime Minister and Government resign at any stage, the principles in
paragraph 14 apply � in particular that the person who appears to be most likely to
command the confidence of the House of Commons will be asked by the Monarch to
form a government. Where a range of different administrations could potentially be
formed, the expectation is that discussions will take place between political parties on
who should form the next Government. The Monarch would not expect to become
involved in such discussions, although the political parties and the Cabinet Secretary
would have a role in ensuring that the Palace is informed of progress.

18. A Prime Minister may request that the Monarch dissolves Parliament and hold a
further election. The Monarch is not bound to accept such a request, especially
when such a request is made soon after a previous dissolution. In those
circumstances, the Monarch would normally wish the parties to ascertain that there
was no potential government that could command the confidence of the House of
Commons before granting a dissolution.

19. It is open to the Prime Minister to ask the Cabinet Secretary to support the
Government�s discussions with Opposition or minority parties on the formation of a
government. If Opposition parties request similar support for their discussions with
each other or with the Government, this can be provided by the Cabinet Office with
the authorisation of the Prime Minister

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:37

Microplastics: Jul 6, 2007; It's what's for dinner.

Tesseraction posted:

The Parthenonce

When it comes to ancient Greece I think you can just use the original names for everything

# ? Oct 14, 2022 21:40

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

Guavanaut posted:

He's still sulky that she wouldn't let him go to the big environment conference. lmao if she gets stuck piloting a zombie government and nobody will let her not until she ~~resigns~~ Chiltern Hundreds herself.

I think I am now going to read this the same way I read "commit unalive" or other such absurd neologisms produced by algorithmic pressure on the language.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 22:25

Guavanaut: Nov 27, 2009; Looking At Them Tittys
1969 - 1998; Toilet Rascal

lmao

https://twitter.com/danwootton/status/1580870735966638081

a bloo bloo the globularists

bessantj posted:

I will never stop being amazed about how Rowling and the rest of the GC crew are so quick and happy to jump into bed with organisations that would like to take away the rights of not just trans people but gay people and women as well. As long as it hurts trans people.

Similarly, it is all globularists
https://twitter.com/MxVivianWulf/status/1576735420922368000

# ? Oct 14, 2022 22:25

Diet Crack: Jan 15, 2001

Guavanaut posted:

a bloo bloo the globularists

I know he was born a loving moron, but does he realise he's part of the MSM?

# ? Oct 14, 2022 22:27

OwlFancier: Aug 22, 2013

Everyone thinks they're a brilliant free thinking rebel, especially when they regurgitate the most unimagintive, incurious takes they have been spoon fed since birth.

terfs or journalists take your pick

# ? Oct 14, 2022 22:32

Deathslinger: Jul 12, 2022

Guavanaut posted:

a bloo bloo the globularists

# ? Oct 14, 2022 22:38

fuctifino: Jun 11, 2001

https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1580707653973516288

# ? Oct 14, 2022 22:40

Rarity: Oct 21, 2010; ~*4 LIFE*~

fuctifino posted:

https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1580707653973516288

Lmao

# ? Oct 14, 2022 22:46

Dabir: Nov 10, 2012

https://twitter.com/spaceysoupy/status/1580977302720028673

And there it is. The soup slingers are taking donations - in crypto - despite being backed and run by billionaires. It's a grift even if it's not an op.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 23:02

josh04: Oct 19, 2008; "THE FLASH IS THE REASON
TO RACE TO THE THEATRES"
_{This title contains sponsored content.}

That seems pretty weak.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 23:04

Noxville: Dec 7, 2003

fuctifino posted:

https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1580707653973516288

Lol if the replies are to be believed this is because Labour�s candidate was a vocal supporter of BJP, in a majority Muslim ward. I�m assuming Labour wanted to try to poach Hindu votes from the Tories and effectively said �who else you gonna vote for?� to Muslims and got this response.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 23:11

learnincurve: May 15, 2014; Smoosh

Ahh that dude can gently caress off.

Aileen Getty is a long time AIDS campaigner and was for years before she discovered she was HIV positive herself. She runs several charitable foundations but we all know why he�s calling her �controversial�.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 23:15

forkboy84: Jun 13, 2012; Corgis love bread. And Puro

learnincurve posted:

Ahh that dude can gently caress off.

Aileen Getty is a long time AIDS campaigner and was for years before she discovered she was HIV positive herself. She runs several charitable foundations but we all know why he�s calling her �controversial�.

Because she is an heir to the Getty oil fortune?

Like, I don't really know how involved in that line of work any of the current Getttys are, seems a reach, but that's clearly what's being gotten at.

forkboy84 fucked around with this message at 23:28 on Oct 14, 2022

# ? Oct 14, 2022 23:26

TACD: Oct 27, 2000

fuctifino posted:

https://twitter.com/BritainElects/status/1580707653973516288

hm, dunno about all these people voting for the Greens. don't they realise they're not a viable contender? they should be voting labour to keep the tories out!

# ? Oct 14, 2022 23:27

Dabir: Nov 10, 2012

learnincurve posted:

Ahh that dude can gently caress off.

Aileen Getty is a long time AIDS campaigner and was for years before she discovered she was HIV positive herself. She runs several charitable foundations but we all know why he’s calling her “controversial”.

Do we?

# ? Oct 14, 2022 23:30

learnincurve: May 15, 2014; Smoosh

forkboy84 posted:

Because she is an heir to the Getty oil fortune?

Granddaughter and she�s been giving her share away to her own foundations for decades, including to aids research in the 80s and 90s. She�s not a young woman.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 23:30

forkboy84: Jun 13, 2012; Corgis love bread. And Puro

Noxville posted:

Lol if the replies are to be believed this is because Labour�s candidate was a vocal supporter of BJP, in a majority Muslim ward. I�m assuming Labour wanted to try to poach Hindu votes from the Tories and effectively said �who else you gonna vote for?� to Muslims and got this response.

If there's one thing I'd hoped Labour would have learned after Scotland in 2007, & former mining & industrial communities in 2019 is taking their voters for granted isn't a winning strategy.

OK, that's a lie, I'm glad they refuse to learn

# ? Oct 14, 2022 23:31

kingturnip: Apr 18, 2008

forkboy84 posted:

If there's one thing I'd hoped Labour would have learned after Scotland in 2007, & former mining & industrial communities in 2019 is taking their voters for granted isn't a winning strategy.

OK, that's a lie, I'm glad they refuse to learn

Labour will never learn about anything that happened after 1997

# ? Oct 14, 2022 23:41

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# ? May 25, 2024 18:37

Tesseraction: Apr 5, 2009

https://twitter.com/hendopolis/status/1581024792257662976

quote:

Kwarteng: 'Sacking has bought Truss a few weeks'

More on that Times piece, which the newspaper has splashed on for tomorrow morning�s edition.

It says that Kwasi Kwarteng, who was Liz Truss� chancellor until Friday lunchtime and a key ideological ally believes his sacking and her reversing her budget has only bought her a few weeks.

The article reports that Truss told Kwarteng he had to go to restore market confidence.

A source told the Times: �Kwasi thinks it only buys her a few more weeks,� a source said. �His view is that the wagons are still going to circle.�

Even inside Downing Street senior officials believe it is a matter of time before she is forced out of office. �Senior civil servants are now openly talking about her going,� one Whitehall source said. �They think she�s had it.�

Imagine getting all the way to being Prime Minister of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland, successor state to the British Empire, and being a dead man walking less than 40 days in due to your own hubris, incompetence and vacuous stupidity.

# ? Oct 14, 2022 23:49

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