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I think a lot of people are just sick of forums war stuff. Some of us need to get better at letting poo poo go or at least compartamentalizing various threads or conversations we are having. I can disagree with you in the Ukraine thread, but agree with you in the econ thread then yuck it up with you in video game thread.
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Dec 15, 2022 22:40
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Brain Candy posted:my man, there doesn't have to be anyone going 'nyah nyah i'm going to go get those cspamers' in some elaborate plot and nothing mentioned requires one. please be a materialist Ah, my bad, I read Fly Molo's posts as implying exactly that and felt the need to refute the assertion.
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Dec 15, 2022 22:50
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i would've gone with "fly molobotomy" personally
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Dec 15, 2022 22:53
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if cspam moderation will be pivoting towards a posting ideology focused more on preventing animal cruelty, then i would suggest a name change for the sub itself. vegan spam equivalents are scarce so my first suggestion would be "C-QUORN"
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Dec 15, 2022 22:54
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Mr Hootington posted:I think a lot of people are just sick of forums war stuff. Some of us need to get better at letting poo poo go or at least compartamentalizing various threads or conversations we are having. I can disagree with you in the Ukraine thread, but agree with you in the econ thread then yuck it up with you in video game thread. Yeah! Lib and let die posted:i would've gone with "fly molobotomy" personally That's the operation Jeff keeps performing.
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Dec 15, 2022 22:55
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Brain Candy posted:but the 400% happens for reasons that have largely nothing to do with the individual qualities or virtues of the people making the decisions in the moment. this is how police think they aren't racist even as they arrest way more Black people, because liberalism has done this cool slight of hand where you're supposed to evaluate what you feel or believe instead of what you do brain candy is right. You mods are racist against the posters
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Dec 15, 2022 23:14
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Calibanibal posted:brain candy is right. You mods are racist against the posters Prejudice ✅ Power ✅
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Dec 15, 2022 23:27
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Calibanibal posted:brain candy is right. You mods are racist against the posters ah, but some posters are italian, so it's impossible to say if the racism is bad or good
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Dec 15, 2022 23:28
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Azathoth posted:That is my memory of how it shook out, though we didn't have a goal of "one for one" at any point. We read the threads and came up with what we came up with based on the posts people made, not out of some weird desire for parity. Azathoth posted:Ah, my bad, I read Fly Molo's posts as implying exactly that and felt the need to refute the assertion. az, i sincerely hope your job has nothing to do with numbers, or you're just having an off day. again, just for the record: cspam: bans: 14 permabans: 8 total # bans: 22 gbs: bans: 7 permabans: 2 total # bans: 9 that's +200% more bans for cspam and +400% more permabans. if you recall it was around equal and gbs got slightly more bans, your recollection is completely wrong. speculation about the reason why cspammers keep getting banned so much more often is beyond the scope of what i'm allowed to discuss, but the difference in outcomes is a plain material fact.  Weka posted:That's the operation Jeff keeps performing. exactly. every time i get banned it just makes me nicer
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Dec 15, 2022 23:33
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Calibanibal posted:brain candy is right. You mods are racist against the posters I prefer a more intersectional approach in my anti-poster bigotry
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Dec 15, 2022 23:34
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Brain Candy posted:my man, there doesn't have to be anyone going 'nyah nyah i'm going to go get those cspamers' in some elaborate plot and nothing mentioned requires one. please be a materialist tbh it's frustratingly difficult to discuss any such problems like this with the mods. even if multiple posters comment on problem moderation, the mods usually ignore the feedback or say they're on vacation or phoneposting, that's too much work to figure out, they'll check later. if you go the extra mile, gather the numbers, and do all of the legwork, they just ignore it. or say "no, that's not what happened." idk how to discuss a problem if they won't even admit that a problem exists
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Dec 15, 2022 23:45
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lobotomy molo posted:az, i sincerely hope your job has nothing to do with numbers, or you're just having an off day. again, just for the record: For the record, I was only referring to the big wave of bans and probes that we did, not to the life of the thread or whatever longer timetable you are using. I also have no interest in comparing numbers even if you list the times and bans, because I don't really care how GBS mods or doesn't mod. I'm not gonna put through more or less bans or probes because they put through more or less, and comparing the two is useless because of it.
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Dec 15, 2022 23:52
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the blood debt must be paid, fair and balanced, or the gods of posting will visit their wrath on both forums
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Dec 15, 2022 23:54
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pouring one out for the fallen posters [excepting the ones that did something illegal, sex crimed, or bashed a poor dog's brain in]
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Dec 15, 2022 23:56
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I don't think there even was any dogs
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Dec 16, 2022 00:03
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Azathoth posted:For the record, I don't really care huge revelation free larry, post the sexpig pms, remove majorans buttons
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Dec 16, 2022 00:05
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Azathoth posted:For the record, I was only referring to the big wave of bans and probes that we did, not to the life of the thread or whatever longer timetable you are using. I also have no interest in comparing numbers even if you list the times and bans, because I don't really care how GBS mods or doesn't mod. I'm not gonna put through more or less bans or probes because they put through more or less, and comparing the two is useless because of it. but you’re an admin? you should care how other forums moderate. unless you’re a cspam-only admin, that’s absolutely within your purview. that’s certainly not how other admins act. okay, that’s very disappointing to hear but thank you for the honest answer. i don’t know how moderation on SA will ever improve if the old bad lowtax standard of “mods can do whatever they want in their feifs, I don’t care if problems exist, I just don’t ever want to hear about them” is still the SOP. if we can’t discuss or compare moderation itt and you don’t care what we think, all bans are justified, then what is there to provide feedback about?
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Dec 16, 2022 00:07
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and sorry, if you’re still confused about what timetable I was discussing it’s listed in my first post. god bless
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Dec 16, 2022 00:08
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Cuttlefush posted:I don't think there even was any dogs cant call it a dog anymore after what that goon did. just a bloody smear on the lawn
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Dec 16, 2022 00:17
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lobotomy molo posted:but you’re an admin? you should care how other forums moderate. unless you’re a cspam-only admin, that’s absolutely within your purview. that’s certainly not how other admins act. I am not obligated to care about GBS and I stopped reading threads there quite a while ago when the OSHA and Schadenfreude threads got boring. If a GBS mod needs help with something, I'm happy to oblige, usually running a longer probe or ban, I'm happy to look it over but otherwise no, I mostly stick to politics forums. It isn't exactly helpful for me to have in depth opinions on how to moderate somewhere I don't really post. As for feedback, I do listen to your feedback, but just because you have a particular perspective, that does not mean that I must automatically agree. I will always consider what you have to say but I'm sorry, I just don't find your arguments compelling.
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Dec 16, 2022 00:17
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Phone posted:huge revelation
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Dec 16, 2022 00:18
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lobotomy molo posted:tbh it's frustratingly difficult to discuss any such problems like this with the mods. even if multiple posters comment on problem moderation, the mods usually ignore the feedback or say they're on vacation or phoneposting, that's too much work to figure out, they'll check later. if you go the extra mile, gather the numbers, and do all of the legwork, they just ignore it. or say "no, that's not what happened." you can't, unfortunately you're asking someone to re-evaluation something they already think they know. and that only happens after overwhelming evidence, typically over a long time. partly because if it wasn't true your mind would be so open the wind would whistle through it and partly because at the physical level that takes significant energy to rewire everything; it literally makes people tired, which is just the feeling you get when you evaluate something as taking too much energy to do https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dN8Z7y_QcwE
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Dec 16, 2022 00:21
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brain candy is right. mods are already all the time eating from the trashcan of ideology
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Dec 16, 2022 00:28
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Azathoth posted:I am not obligated to care about GBS and I stopped reading threads there quite a while ago when the OSHA and Schadenfreude threads got boring. If a GBS mod needs help with something, I'm happy to oblige, usually running a longer probe or ban, I'm happy to look it over but otherwise no, I mostly stick to politics forums. It isn't exactly helpful for me to have in depth opinions on how to moderate somewhere I don't really post. you misread my post 3 times then ended the discussion with “I don’t care, no comparison is valid” so what is there to discuss? poster feedback doesn’t matter, the bans will continue until morale improves. this is an excellent example of how mod feedback typically goes: Azathoth posted:Ah, my bad, I read Fly Molo's posts as implying exactly that and felt the need to refute the assertion. posters assertions that a problem exists get ignored or refuted, and the feedback ends. no problems get fixed, which is why the moderation on SA is so dysfunctional.
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Dec 16, 2022 00:30
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nah I think it’s cool and good that feedback threads get created, people provide a feedback, and it gets closed with a note saying that everything is great “no action items, see you next quarter” the purpose of a system is what it does lol
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Dec 16, 2022 00:38
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Brain Candy posted:you can't, unfortunately tbh I’m beginning to wonder if that’s just a systemic problem with how SA moderation is structured. going back to the lowtax era, posters get ignored by mods, mods get ignored by admins, and admins get ignored by the head admin until obvious problems become huge festering shitshows. one-person irregular authoritarian decision-making processes mean any serious reassessment or changes are reliant on one person changing their mind again and again, which is exhausting and unpleasant, so the system trends towards policy stagnation and conservatism. i don’t remember the exact line, but in a history podcast about the collapsing Ming dynasty it was something like “nothing was so corrosive for the regime’s legitimacy as the wild swings between absentee rulers and sudden poorly-considered kneejerk responses.”
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Dec 16, 2022 00:45
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I'm always going to put forward what I think is best, but I do my best to listen and take what I am told to heart about mistakes or alternative ways of doing things. We've had circular discussions about this on many occasions and at the end of the day, I think you and I have very different ideas about how to mod C-SPAM. I just don't know that there's a common ground we can find on this.
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Dec 16, 2022 00:49
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Azathoth posted:I went ahead an ungassed the Stewie Griffin thread. As an avid Family Guy fan since the very beginning, I have been enjoying it and would hate to see the forums lose it. Lmfao he gassed the stewie griffin thread? Majorian brother if you're going for a Flavius style meltdown at least do something funny.
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Dec 16, 2022 00:57
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Holy crap Lois
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Dec 16, 2022 01:00
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Azathoth posted:I'm always going to put forward what I think is best, but I do my best to listen and take what I am told to heart about mistakes or alternative ways of doing things. We've had circular discussions about this on many occasions and at the end of the day, I think you and I have very different ideas about how to mod C-SPAM. I just don't know that there's a common ground we can find on this. whatever you do, don’t evaluate why you were promoted up the chain
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Dec 16, 2022 01:01
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Pablo Nergigante posted:Holy crap Lois this is just like that time I got gassed on an internet forum
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Dec 16, 2022 01:03
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AnimeIsTrash posted:Lmfao he gassed the stewie griffin thread? Majorian brother if you're going for a Flavius style meltdown at least do something funny. Hey Azathoth while you're here what criteria are you using to select mods and how did it recommend Majorian. Honest question
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Dec 16, 2022 01:06
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Woah, woah, woah, woah, woah This is not my batman glass
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Dec 16, 2022 01:07
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some plague rats posted:Hey Azathoth while you're here what criteria are you using to select mods and how did it recommend Majorian. Honest question For Majorian, he did a good job as IK of the U/R thread. Overall, we look at threads that don't have mods reading them, then look at the most frequent posters and see who we think would be good. Overall, I think Majorian has done a good job as a mod and that the U/R thread is much better for him being a full mod and being able to see reports. This little spat with AiT being an exception, of course, but I think he will learn from it.
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Dec 16, 2022 01:12
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ah, a dartboard. nice.
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Dec 16, 2022 01:14
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Azathoth posted:For Majorian, he did a good job as IK of the U/R thread. Overall, we look at threads that don't have mods reading them, then look at the most frequent posters and see who we think would be good. Overall, I think Majorian has done a good job as a mod and that the U/R thread is much better for him being a full mod and being able to see reports. This little spat with AiT being an exception, of course, but I think he will learn from it. !remindme 2 months
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Dec 16, 2022 01:16
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Maybe you should pick mods or iks from people who aren't the top posters in megathreads? There are a lot of posters who's brains are complete mush because they only post about politics. People get frustrated about mods in this subforum because they're always picked from a very specific subset of the community, and then these mods always feel like they gotta impose their will on whatever threads they deem bad. It doesn't really seem healthy that there are people who think that the glenn thread was a containment zone, or that there are a few mods who think the same. O_o
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Dec 16, 2022 01:22
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Why doesn't mods get/request PTO when they should?
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Dec 16, 2022 01:22
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Azathoth posted:I'm always going to put forward what I think is best, but I do my best to listen and take what I am told to heart about mistakes or alternative ways of doing things. We've had circular discussions about this on many occasions and at the end of the day, I think you and I have very different ideas about how to mod C-SPAM. I just don't know that there's a common ground we can find on this. there can be no common ground found until you free sexpig by night
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Dec 16, 2022 01:42
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ted hitler hunter posted:Why doesn't mods get/request PTO when they should? This is part of why we have pushed to have a lot more mods, and why we just added more. When I came on back in October of last year, there were periods early on where I was the only mod who was not at least partially away, and that creates a powerful disincentive to step away. I have done some of the dumbest poo poo of my tenure when I didn't feel I could step away and was stressed by life outside the forums. Now, we actively encourage mods to take time away, either from the forums entirely, or just from mod stuff. I hope that posting is still fun for every mod, I'd never tell them to not post if they like it. Getting people to do it remains an ongoing effort.
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Dec 16, 2022 01:44
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