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GATOS Y VATOS posted:Like a $5-8k 100 mile EV sounds reasonable. But anything over that cost for that range is laughable. There's more to cars than a big battery. It isn't laughable.
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Jan 31, 2023 02:23
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Duck and Cover posted:It isn't laughable.   Now that’s comedy.
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Jan 31, 2023 02:37
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$26k after tax credit? There should be more of these, i't s a perfectly fine car for someone that lives somewhat centrally in a large city, especially as a second car. I drove my i3 for 4 years with zero issues, the one time when I even cut it close range wise was when we drove it over 40 miles on way in freezing weather on the highway because my in-laws wanted to see it and even then, made it to a DC charger with plenty of range to spare, and that is only because I didn't want to go slightly out of my way to charge basically half-way instead of 3/4 of the way. Batteries are too big on too many EVs, 100 miles is completely reasonable for most users.
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Jan 31, 2023 02:41
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Kirios posted:Okay look, I'm one of the first people to say range is highly overrated (My 40 kWh Leaf has had zero issues with it, and it reliably gets 150-160 miles), but the MX-30 is criminal. A 100 mile EV, in 2023?! What bullshit is this?! Mazda fanboy and apologist warning… They made 500 of them and sold them only in California afaik, which was exactly enough to satisfy a regulatory requirement. Mazda is a small car company with not a ton of resources (comparatively). They are sticking a rotary range extender in it, but the range is only projected to be like 160 ish? They are just now about to release their first PHEV in the US, so I’d more compare them to Subaru (who has nothing EV without Toyota’s homework). I speculate wildly that they will partner with Toyota for their tech in the latter half of the decade, I mean look they just released a new inline 6 ICE engine. Russian Bear fucked around with this message at 02:59 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 02:57
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Three Olives posted:$26k after tax credit? There should be more of these, i't s a perfectly fine car for someone that lives somewhat centrally in a large city, especially as a second car. I’m pretty sure it qualifies for $0 tax credit. Also the bolt ev is $26k before tax credits and has 260 miles of range.
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Jan 31, 2023 03:06
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Loucks posted:
Also just how a smaller battery is going to be cycling deeper and faster in the same conditions which will make it wear out much sooner than a larger battery.
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Jan 31, 2023 03:16
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AI is funny because depending on the question you ask everyone will say 99% of people don’t need range or utility and you should rent a vehicle for those use cases and you’re dumb for wanting those things but in another context it’s completely unacceptable
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Jan 31, 2023 03:21
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Indiana_Krom posted:Also just how a smaller battery is going to be cycling deeper and faster in the same conditions which will make it wear out much sooner than a larger battery. If you assume NMC cells and give it a conservative 2000 cycles before it degrades to “EOL” (still usable just loss of capacity) that’s still nearly 200,000 miles in a car designed to only go 100 miles per charge.
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Jan 31, 2023 03:37
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The MX-30s issues are that it isn't very efficient (especially in the cold) and can't charge very quickly. The original 28kWh Ioniq is a much better example of a small battery, cheapish EV
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Jan 31, 2023 03:38
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It's the exact same thing as all the compliance cars from the last decade.
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Jan 31, 2023 03:58
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GATOS Y VATOS posted:Like a $5-8k 100 mile EV sounds reasonable. But anything over that cost for that range is laughable. Like, a bicycle?
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Jan 31, 2023 04:09
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The MX-30 is a pure compliance car that you should just ignore because you can't buy one anyway.
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Jan 31, 2023 04:14
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Infinotize posted:AI is funny because depending on the question you ask everyone will say 99% of people don’t need range or utility and you should rent a vehicle for those use cases and you’re dumb for wanting those things but in another context it’s completely unacceptable Or maybe it's different people giving the different responses and not some hive-mind.
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Jan 31, 2023 06:00
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E: it's not a hive mind, it's a collection of the worst possible EV opinions in the world.
Elviscat fucked around with this message at 06:14 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 06:07
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Elviscat posted:E: it's not a hive mind, it's a collection of the worst possible EV opinions in the world. I liked the pre-edit post, but this is still a good thread title.
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Jan 31, 2023 06:15
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Russian Bear posted:They made 500 of them and sold them only in California afaik, which was exactly enough to satisfy a regulatory requirement. https://www.mazda.it/modelli/mazda-mx-30/ It's sold globally, costing as much as conventional 400km range car from say stellantis.
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Jan 31, 2023 07:08
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EVS ARE DUMB TOYS FOR SOY CUCKS UNTIL THEY HAVE 500 RANGE, GO 0-60 IN 3.5 SECONDS, CAN PULL 3 ELEPHANTS , IN THE WINTER AND GIVE ME A BLOWJOB. I think smaller efficient evs are a good thing and people should be more open to buying them.
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Jan 31, 2023 08:13
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Yes there is definitely a market for small battery, efficient EVs and I don't think they necessarily have to be 'compliance cars'. The MX-30 isn't a good deal by any metric though - it's not particularly efficient, nor is it any cheaper than more capable cars. I suspect that that vast majority of them sold worldwide will be the mild hybrid version anyway.
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Jan 31, 2023 08:24
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Hybrids are cool and good and the outgoing Toyota CEO is totally right that we’re moving straight to EVs only because GM and Ford lobbied the poo poo out of the US for it.
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Jan 31, 2023 08:38
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I think the most important metric is that the MX-30 is ugly as gently caress. They must have been selling them in my area for a while because I’ve seen quite a few around. In some godawful colours like beef-poo poo brown.
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Jan 31, 2023 08:39
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Vegetable posted:Hybrids are cool and good Even if you believe that the Mazda mild hybrid system is still a let down - less than 3% improvement over the non-hybrid version
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Jan 31, 2023 08:49
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Never having to change your oil is cool and good
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Jan 31, 2023 09:21
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Are y'all not realizing the MX-30 is 35k or something? Yes a smaller cheaper EV would be fantastic to have. There's nothing even in the sub 25k range, let alone sub 20k. You could easily justify 100 mile range in those brackets. This thing is a travesty, and no it's not just a compliance thing. They are selling it at least around the US now. My local Mazda dealer has two of the 2023s (with a 5k markup. I guess they're hoping there's at least two Russian Bears around here to buy them?) right now. Even the 0-60 is a freaking joke.
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Jan 31, 2023 09:40
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dissss posted:The MX-30 isn't a good deal by any metric though - it's not particularly efficient, nor is it any cheaper than more capable cars. I suspect that that vast majority of them sold worldwide will be the mild hybrid version anyway. I know I might sound biased but the MX30 is bigger and costs more than my Jeep Avenger while having less range and boot space. I could understand smaller range on tiny cars like the Honda e or a Fiat 500 but it's hulking huge so there is plenty of room for batteries.
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Jan 31, 2023 11:00
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Vegetable posted:Hybrids are cool and good and the outgoing Toyota CEO is totally right that we’re moving straight to EVs only because GM and Ford lobbied the poo poo out of the US for it. Straight into EVs as opposed to what?
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Jan 31, 2023 11:44
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Elviscat posted:Straight into EVs as opposed to what? If it's Toyota, they want to push Hydrogen shite regardless of refueling sites.
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Jan 31, 2023 11:53
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That's why I'm wondering, H2 will never, and was never going to, overcome its storage and efficiency issues, PHEVs are cool, but are about mid-way between ICE and BEV in terms of CO2 emissions, and every one who has one just wants a full BEV. The best solutions, urban densification and expanded mass transit, well you might as well ask the genie to fix the climate problem directly, and I doubt the CEO of Toyota was arguing for less cars. So that leaves shilling hydrogen, because Toyota can't admit they lost their commanding lead in low emissions vehicles to everyone else because they insisted on investing in a technology that was dead the second the lithium ion battery was created, and will never be seen outside a few pilot projects in the US.
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Jan 31, 2023 12:07
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Vegetable posted:Hybrids are cool and good and the outgoing Toyota CEO is totally right that we’re moving straight to EVs only because GM and Ford lobbied the poo poo out of the US for it.
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Jan 31, 2023 13:50
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Electric cars are a net negative on the environment in the developing world. Hybrids make far more sense there. Even in the developed world hybrids would be a massive improvement over ICE cars and it’s pretty wild to be cutting them out of any climate mitigation strategy. The science pans out — a hybrid+EV world is only slightly worse for the environment than an EV-only worked, and it has massive upsides in affordability.
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Jan 31, 2023 16:12
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The 2024 Hyundai Ioniq 6 gets an official EPA range of 361 miles https://arstechnica.com/cars/2023/01/the-2024-hyundai-ioniq-6-gets-an-official-epa-range-of-361-miles/ Is Dr. Gitlin still around? I hope he can spill the beans and not make us wait until April for the embargo. That seems ridiculous. mobby_6kl fucked around with this message at 17:11 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 17:06
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mobby_6kl posted:The 2024 Hyundai Ioniq 6 gets an official EPA range of 361 miles Even without a tax credit that thing seems like a pro buy for us sedan-preferrers. But it's Hyundai so I'd imagine they'll be on sale in my state sometime around... 2027.
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Jan 31, 2023 17:09
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Front end looks like a 2004 Tiburon.
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Jan 31, 2023 17:11
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Vegetable posted:cars are a net negative on the environment 
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Jan 31, 2023 17:29
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mobby_6kl posted:The 2024 Hyundai Ioniq 6 gets an official EPA range of 361 miles That's an astoundingly efficient car, and at a motortrend estimated price of $55K for the long range version, they're not even really taking a bath on the batteries. Heck of an improvement to the Ioniq 5 with the same battery capacity. Hyundai has clearly figured out this EV thing. pre:Model EPA Range MSRP $/mile range kWh $/kWh wh/mi Lucid Motors Air 516 $154,000.00 $298 118 $1,305 229 Mercedes-Benz EQS 427 $102,310.00 $240 107.8 $949 252 Tesla Model S 375 $104,990.00 $280 100 $1,050 267 Ioniq 6 (Est) 361 $55,000.00 $152 77.4 $711 214 Mercedes-Benz EQS SUV 333 $105,400.00 $317 107.8 $978 324 Tesla Model X 332 $120,990.00 $364 100 $1,210 301 BMW iX xDrive50 324 $84,100.00 $260 105 $801 324 GMC Hummer EV 320 $110,295.00 $345 205 $538 641 Ford F-150 Lightning 320 $70,000.00 $219 98 $714 306 Tesla Model Y 318 $65,990.00 $208 75 $880 236 Rivian R1T 314 $73,000.00 $232 135 $541 430 Cadillac LYRIQ 312 $62,990.00 $202 100.4 $627 322 Kia EV6 310 $41,400.00 $134 77.4 $535 250 Hyundai IONIQ 5 303 $39,950.00 $132 77.4 $516 255 BMW i4 eDrive40 301 $55,900.00 $186 83.9 $666 279 Ford Mustang Mach-E 300 $43,895.00 $146 70 $627 233
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Jan 31, 2023 17:34
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mobby_6kl posted:The 2024 Hyundai Ioniq 6 gets an official EPA range of 361 miles Every Ioniq6 youtube review did show very weird range data with Hyundai being very coy about it in the press packages.
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Jan 31, 2023 17:39
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bird with big dick posted:Front end looks like a 2004 Tiburon. It’s not attractive
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Jan 31, 2023 17:55
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The Ionic 6 is the best looking EV outside of the Audi Etron GT imo. I really like everything about it. It's also refreshing to see a new Sedan take a chance on interesting design.
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Jan 31, 2023 18:25
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Yeah, to each their own, but I think the Ioniq 6 looks fantastic. Edit: I just looked at the photo in the linked article, and in white the front does look a little doofy. I think it looks more sleek/modern in darker colors, and the rear looks great regardless.
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Jan 31, 2023 18:26
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e: You know what, actually, this maybe isn't appropriate. Nevermind.
cruft fucked around with this message at 18:54 on Jan 31, 2023 |
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Jan 31, 2023 18:38
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I’d definitely buy a 100mile range car if it was reasonably crash safe and under 10k. I’d charge it at work for free! Then I’d get crushed like a bug by someone on Route 18 eager to get to a mall.
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