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Charlz Guybon posted:It should be illegal to refuse government issued currency sure. but also the customer has to be willing to accept an IOU in lieu of change.
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Feb 4, 2023 11:08
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Making 500e denomination bills was a stealthy attempt by EU to gain the status of global reserve currency through the shadow economy because international criminal organizations really really love large denomination bills. 
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Feb 4, 2023 11:25
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Doctor Malaver posted:I understand the cashless trend and in 2023 it's nearly achievable. But in 2002 I don't think they had that in mind, and there were no €1 and €2 bills then either... Refusing 50€+ bills is just to avoid emptying the register to provide you the change, it's not a currency issue but a cash register stockpile one.
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Feb 4, 2023 13:09
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SlowBloke posted:Refusing 50€+ bills is just to avoid emptying the register to provide you the change, it's not a currency issue but a cash register stockpile one. Yeah, stores refusing to take a 50€ bill for a 1€ drink (or $/£) is the kind of thing that happens everywhere. Now, if you are buying 45€ worth of goods and they refuse a 50, that's just weird. Herman Merman posted:Things are a bit more nuanced than that, stores are allowed to refuse bills of large denominations since they come with an increased risk of forgery, theft and accidental loss. On the flip side of that, some places can also refuse 'nuisance payments', such as trying to pay the fine for a traffic ticket with a wheelbarrow full of coins.
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Feb 4, 2023 19:00
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Glah posted:Making 500e denomination bills was a stealthy attempt by EU to gain the status of global reserve currency through the shadow economy because international criminal organizations really really love large denomination bills. I think that they stopped issuing them exactly due to their nearly exclusive usage by criminal organizations?
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Feb 4, 2023 19:35
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AndreTheGiantBoned posted:I think that they stopped issuing them exactly due to their nearly exclusive usage by criminal organizations? Before ATMs got stricter limits on maximum retrieval amounts, the one from my bank loved to spit out 500€ bills when asking 500€+, which was super fun to manage. I think I once purchased a fancy tv or computer at a mediamarkt paying in 500€ bills due to that, with cashiers looking at me like i was from space or something. The_Franz posted:On the flip side of that, some places can also refuse 'nuisance payments', such as trying to pay the fine for a traffic ticket with a wheelbarrow full of coins. Article 11 of CEE 974/1998 has an hard limit of 50 coins, which has been ratified by every euro user. That didn't stopped a few enterprising individuals from attempting to pay speed fines and the like with one cent coins, like this one in 2011 https://attualissimo.it/macellaio-paga-una-multa-con-400-kg-di-monetine/ SlowBloke fucked around with this message at 20:12 on Feb 4, 2023 |
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Feb 4, 2023 20:00
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AndreTheGiantBoned posted:I think that they stopped issuing them exactly due to their nearly exclusive usage by criminal organizations? I once traveled to germany with 7000 euros in 500 dollars bills in my wallet. I bought a car with said money and drove it back to finland.
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Feb 5, 2023 13:23
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His Divine Shadow posted:I once traveled to germany with 7000 euros in 500 dollars bills in my wallet. I bought a car with said money and drove it back to finland.
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Feb 5, 2023 13:26
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We used to have 1000 USD equivalent bills prior to joining the Eurozone.
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Feb 5, 2023 13:29
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Switzerland still has 1000CHF bills (which many other countries do not like cause of corruption etc see above). It's mostly ok to use them for stuff like a few hundred up, but it obviously does depend on the size of the shop/cassa.
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Feb 5, 2023 13:36
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Belgium used to have a 10,000 francs bill (~€250). So not really weird imo. When I was in the US, I found $1 bills to be very impractical. I usually didn't need them and they took up a lot of space in my wallet because I had to fold them. Coins for denominations under 5 that you can buy small, everyday items with just feel sensible to me.
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Feb 5, 2023 13:46
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Honestly I feel a lot of that is inflation of car prices as a necessity of functioning in most countries as much as anything.
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Feb 5, 2023 13:48
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Doctor Malaver posted:Why doesn't Euro have €1 and €2 bills, like dollar has? The 5€ bill is the smallest and a bunch of everyday stuff costs less. 5€ is 38 kn and we had 10 kn and 20 kn bills which served the purpose well. Now I have a choice of either paying every small expense by card (not always possible), or carrying around a pouch of coins. It actually feels like a step back -- now that we've joined the European future etc, my wallet is bursting at the seams and my pockets are full of coins. We don't have so many strip clubs that it would matter. In Finland we also had mark coins up to 10 FIM which is about equivalent to 2 EUR. It would be weird to have notes with such useless denominations.
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Feb 5, 2023 14:32
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We did have 10 FIM notes, 2 euro notes would be very handy IMO.
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Feb 5, 2023 14:35
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The 10 mk note was superseded by the 10 mk coin around 1990, not sure what the buying power of a 10 mk bill would've been around then though.
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Feb 5, 2023 14:41
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The deux-ro coin is a good coin.
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Feb 5, 2023 18:46
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His Divine Shadow posted:I once traveled to germany with 7000 euros in 500 dollars bills in my wallet. I bought a car with said money and drove it back to finland. I once withdrew 500 euro in zloty at a Polish airport, because I'm a dumb idiot who doesn't realize how badly that would gently caress up my wallet, and managed to lose both the money and my passport in the busride away from the airport to my hotel. To this day I hope that whomever found it had a whale of a time with the money they got.
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Feb 6, 2023 17:45
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An insane mind posted:I once withdrew 500 euro in zloty at a Polish airport, because I'm a dumb idiot who doesn't realize how badly that would gently caress up my wallet, and managed to lose both the money and my passport in the busride away from the airport to my hotel. 
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Feb 6, 2023 17:50
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An insane mind posted:I once withdrew 500 euro in zloty at a Polish airport, because I'm a dumb idiot who doesn't realize how badly that would gently caress up my wallet, and managed to lose both the money and my passport in the busride away from the airport to my hotel. Let me tell you I was paranoid with that money. It was very scary, but I am not sure what the alternative would be even today. But I doubt I will repeat the experience.
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Feb 6, 2023 18:15
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His Divine Shadow posted:It was very scary, but I am not sure what the alternative would be even today. Wire the money using SEPA transfer like normal people? Even the worse cheapskate banks here add a 1€ max fee in the worse case(most banks do it for free).
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Feb 6, 2023 18:18
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SlowBloke posted:Wire the money using SEPA transfer like normal people? Even the worse cheapskate banks here add a 1€ max fee in the worse case(most banks do it for free). Takes like days to come through
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Feb 6, 2023 18:33
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His Divine Shadow posted:Takes like days to come through SEPA Instant takes less than 10 seconds for sums not exceeding 15k euro. It was introduced 6 years ago.
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Feb 6, 2023 18:49
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cinci zoo sniper posted:SEPA Instant takes less than 10 seconds for sums not exceeding 15k euro. It was introduced 6 years ago. News to me, but I haven't actually ever needed to transfer that kind of money since 2004 when this happened.
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Feb 6, 2023 19:00
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cinci zoo sniper posted:SEPA Instant takes less than 10 seconds for sums not exceeding 15k euro. It was introduced 6 years ago. You will laugh, but some of the largest German banks still do not offer SEPA instant. As a customer your only reliable choice for larger private purchases is to hand over sketchy envelopes full of cash like you are a character on the Sopranos. It's loving wild sometimes that this country is considered developed
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Feb 6, 2023 19:23
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Celexi posted:where does she live in america so I can go get the thousands in quarters all over her sidewalk Kentucky, so Badger of Basra posted:Sorry but your American friend made that up to disguise her madness i say swears online posted:what on earth lol definitely plausible
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Feb 6, 2023 19:25
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GABA ghoul posted:You will laugh, but some of the largest German banks still do not offer SEPA instant. As a customer your only reliable choice for larger private purchases is to hand over sketchy envelopes full of cash like you are a character on the Sopranos. It's loving wild sometimes that this country is considered developed Don't tell me this is like DB, Sparkasse, and whatever was the collective name for Volksbanks/Genosses/etc.
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Feb 6, 2023 19:32
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His Divine Shadow posted:Takes like days to come through It takes one or two business days or you can do instant with a 5-10€ service surcharge here in Italy.
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Feb 6, 2023 19:49
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SlowBloke posted:It takes one or two business days or you can do instant with a 5-10€ service surcharge here in Italy. ...5-10 EUR? SEPA Instant fee here is 0.36 EUR.
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Feb 6, 2023 19:57
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cinci zoo sniper posted:Don't tell me this is like DB, Sparkasse, and whatever was the collective name for Volksbanks/Genosses/etc. No, those are actually pretty decent at keeping up with technology and experimenting with new sruff. It's DKB, a publicly owned and second largest direct bank in the country. ING, the largest direct bank, only started supporting them last year and had to be dragged screaming and kicking
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Feb 6, 2023 20:14
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https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/qanda_22_6273quote:Four years after the necessary technology was put in place to process euro payments instantly, it is apparent that the efforts of the European payments industry or Member States will not be sufficient to remove these obstacles throughout the EU in a timely fashion. Therefore, the Commission concluded that legislative intervention is necessary to unlock the full-scale network effects by connecting all payment service providers to instant payment technology, tackling high prices and frictions, and mitigating the risk of fraud or errors. Sounds like the banks hosed around long enough that the commission has become unhappy. That's usually something you'd want to avoid as an industry.
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Feb 6, 2023 20:37
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cinci zoo sniper posted:...5-10 EUR? SEPA Instant fee here is 0.36 EUR. It depends on the bank really, some will penny pinch you to death with a fee on any wire transfer and then surcharge for instant. My daily driver bank account is free wire with 1,5€ surcharge for instant but i pay a monthly fee to remove any charges so, unless i splash out with lots of wires/activities, the overall wire expense might get in that range. Keep in mind that we do pay a 1-3€ service fee even to pay taxes so banks bleeding us dry are normal. GABA ghoul posted:ING, the largest direct bank, only started supporting them last year and had to be dragged screaming and kicking ING and Fineco(an Italian equivalent) love to claim on ads to be the smartest and best in the business when they take weeks to process wires, cost a fortune and have their home banking look like i'm doing data entry on a as-400 with buttons scattered everywhere and no clear sense of purpose. SlowBloke fucked around with this message at 21:44 on Feb 6, 2023 |
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Feb 6, 2023 21:38
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I have worked with banks in the past and even before instant sepa, there was a way to get it to process more or less immediately with a swift message, however you'd have to call the receiving bank and convince them to look it up and not do the standard " we haven't received anything, will post when it shows up we promise." because banks love interest free loans, or to charge people for overdraft, which in the EU is based on APR. So yeah, banks have no interest in fast transfers in the EU as they love their zero % short term loans, interestingly this has never been an issue in America and even with instant Fedwire, which banks fo offer and now same day ach but banks also have zelle that they own for that purpose for small amounts and customers prefer as $0 cost. Celexi fucked around with this message at 01:32 on Feb 7, 2023 |
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Feb 7, 2023 01:28
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My mums side of the family used to pay almost everything by cash. I remember her buying a new car, worth just a bit less than I took home in a year, in euro bills. Went to the bank with a stealthy grocery bag, and then to the dealer with the bag under her arm, head on a swivel. Totally not suspicious. The time after that she paid digitally, but kicking and screaming. What if the bank, or the dealer, went bankrupt in the hours between the transfer and getting the keys? What if evil hackers waited until just then to hijack her transactions? What if the clerk receiving the funds just embezzled the funds? It was bizarre. Really had to step over her own shadow there.
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Feb 7, 2023 12:57
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Lord Stimperor posted:My mums side of the family used to pay almost everything by cash. I remember her buying a new car, worth just a bit less than I took home in a year, in euro bills. Went to the bank with a stealthy grocery bag, and then to the dealer with the bag under her arm, head on a swivel. Totally not suspicious. My grandmother was the same, but she was old enough to actually see her government collapse which is probably the biggest predictor for distrusting electronic money.
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Feb 7, 2023 13:09
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Feb 7, 2023 13:16
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VictualSquid posted:My grandmother was the same, but she was old enough to actually see her government collapse which is probably the biggest predictor for distrusting electronic money. I mean paper money doesn't fare all that well with government collapses either.
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Feb 7, 2023 17:21
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If bank transfers were unreliable the entire economy would implode catastrophically faster than you can say "SEPA Lastchriftmandatserklärung". Governments will get really heavy handed to make sure ordinary people's bank transactions are working and safe.
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Feb 7, 2023 19:21
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my grandmother paid twice the price of a plane ticket instead of giving her number over phone to the airline after she said she wouldn't online. in portugal btw
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Feb 9, 2023 01:59
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Looks like the US inflation reduction act is having a big effect on the behavior of investors and looks like the europeans are still too dumb to catch on. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6QDLhOt9sYI
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Feb 26, 2023 12:24
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His Divine Shadow posted:Looks like the US inflation reduction act is having a big effect on the behavior of investors and looks like the europeans are still too dumb to catch on. Europeans get it quite well, the EU legal structure requires unanimity to poo poo out something similar, and this is where German conservatives have hosed over everyone basically, in after the BFC. I hope a German goon can further expand on this, but tldr; version is that they have a constitutional clause against state borrowing now, which lends itself to Germany having to be dragged over coals for anything pertinent. If this was a matter of qualified majority, we would've already blasted out our equivalent because it's otherwise kind-of difficult to compete with Biden simply giving hundreds of billions away.
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Feb 26, 2023 13:19
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