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cock hero flux
Apr 17, 2011



seeing all of the ideas for changes that the community has put forward in the last few years has made me really glad that the game is dead and will never receive any further balance updates

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StealthArcher
Jan 10, 2010




Vaah posted:

I love reading Sniper nerf ideas. You'll never un-shot your head.

-Sniper removed from all games, replaced with fat scout

Annointed
Mar 2, 2013

Sniper op when bots are rampant and no one can organize an anti bot offensive.

AtillatheBum
Oct 6, 2010

Justice ain't gonna dispense itself.

cock hero flux posted:

seeing all of the ideas for changes that the community has put forward in the last few years has made me really glad that the game is dead and will never receive any further balance updates

100 times this. The only class that even remotely needs a change is spy and even then buffing spy will make people cry about them even harder than they cry about sniper.

Geight
Aug 7, 2010

Oh, All-Knowing One, behold me!
Honestly they could buff Spy a lot just by squashing bugs with the class, without even getting into actual design decisions.

Roth
Jul 9, 2016

Every proposed Sniper nerf has always been some godawful attempt to nerf quickscoping and making the thing that actually makes Sniper hard to deal with (charging up 100% shots from across the map while protected by three sentry guns and a pocket medic) even more appealing

Roth
Jul 9, 2016

So cool to add a tracer for missed sniper shots, thanks I had no idea he was standing on the 2fort battlements

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Just add damage falloff like basically every other gun in the game so you can't die in one hit from 3 countries over

You could probably scale the charge damage better but tbh if you're getting quickscoped and domed point blank the sniper deserves that one

Dabir
Nov 10, 2012

Abroham Lincoln posted:

Just add damage falloff like basically every other gun in the game so you can't die in one hit from 3 countries over

You could probably scale the charge damage better but tbh if you're getting quickscoped and domed point blank the sniper deserves that one

Crits ignore falloff. So do mini crits, so that's a stealth buff to the sydney sleeper.

drrockso20
May 6, 2013

Has Not Actually Done Cocaine

Roth posted:

Every proposed Sniper nerf has always been some godawful attempt to nerf quickscoping and making the thing that actually makes Sniper hard to deal with (charging up 100% shots from across the map while protected by three sentry guns and a pocket medic) even more appealing

I've almost never had issues with someone hanging back doing full charge shots(and only bad teams will have nests or pocket medics that far back) that takes too much time to pull off to really be able to ruin games, it's always been overly sweaty guys with too many hours on Sniper who can get 5 quick scope kills in almost as many seconds that are what ruin games(heck I'm an average at best Sniper and even I can occasionally pull off a 2 to 4 quick scope rampage that completely stuffs a push), hence why I lean so hard on getting rid of Quick Scoping

Not to mention that this would mostly neuter Sniper Bots and cheaters which is also nice

Abroham Lincoln
Sep 19, 2011

Note to self: This one's the good one



Dabir posted:

Crits ignore falloff. So do mini crits, so that's a stealth buff to the sydney sleeper.

Yeah just have that not apply to sniper rifles. It would probably need its own distance curve anyway

Roth
Jul 9, 2016

drrockso20 posted:

I've almost never had issues with someone hanging back doing full charge shots(and only bad teams will have nests or pocket medics that far back) that takes too much time to pull off to really be able to ruin games, it's always been overly sweaty guys with too many hours on Sniper who can get 5 quick scope kills in almost as many seconds that are what ruin games(heck I'm an average at best Sniper and even I can occasionally pull off a 2 to 4 quick scope rampage that completely stuffs a push), hence why I lean so hard on getting rid of Quick Scoping

Not to mention that this would mostly neuter Sniper Bots and cheaters which is also nice

It's an exaggerated joke that a good Sniper actively trying to win isn't running around going for quick scopes and playing risky. They're going to be hanging back in areas where they are well covered by their team, can safely charge up shots to instant kill anyone that comes in the sightline, and taking out critical picks at no risk to him. Quick Scopes are useful, but no good Sniper relies on them all the time.

Quick scoping in pubs is powerful because you can have three Medics all healing the Heavy to full leaving the rest of the 150 and under classes at the Sniper's mercy. I am one of those sweaty Sniper mains that loves to run around in pubs quick scoping because that's the most fun way to play the class. I have hundreds of hours on Sniper and Hale's Own Sniper Rifle and I still frequently get my poo poo kicked in against good Soldiers, Scouts, Spies, and Demoman players because quick scoping only does so much. Yeah, in theory I could make that point blank shot on a Scout or the Soldier rocket jumping in on me. I probably won't though, because it's very hard.

Everyone complaining about these insane quick scopes the Sniper gets will remember them because they are insane shots. You have probably forgotten the thousands of Snipers you've killed just by being 3 feet near them and pressing Mouse 1 because that's just normal.

Also let's not nerf a class because of bots. Fix the bot problem or go to a community server instead.

Jabor
Jul 16, 2010

#1 Loser at SpaceChem
Remember that you can dodge sniper shots exactly the same way you'd dodge in a scout 1v1. If you're running straight at the opposing sniper then it's very easy for them to quickscope you - if you're strafing then it gets harder, if you're unpredictably changing up your strafing then even a good sniper is very likely to miss. (And if you can close the distance well, you're gonna kill them before they get a second chance).

Roth
Jul 9, 2016

Jabor posted:

Remember that you can dodge sniper shots exactly the same way you'd dodge in a scout 1v1. If you're running straight at the opposing sniper then it's very easy for them to quickscope you - if you're strafing then it gets harder, if you're unpredictably changing up your strafing then even a good sniper is very likely to miss. (And if you can close the distance well, you're gonna kill them before they get a second chance).

Yeah, that feels like an often overlooked thing is that the Sniper gets one chance to land a very difficult to hit shot and if he misses he's pretty much guaranteed to be dead in the next two seconds.

LazyMaybe
Aug 18, 2013

oouagh

drrockso20 posted:

I've almost never had issues with someone hanging back doing full charge shots(and only bad teams will have nests or pocket medics that far back) that takes too much time to pull off to really be able to ruin games, it's always been overly sweaty guys with too many hours on Sniper who can get 5 quick scope kills in almost as many seconds that are what ruin games
that sniper deserves to roll the lobby just as much as the soldier tryhard 2 doors down does for putting in roughly 1/2 the effort

Roth posted:

So cool to add a tracer for missed sniper shots, thanks I had no idea he was standing on the 2fort battlements
obviously it doesn't matter there but it would be nice to have in situations where a sniper found some weird hosed up angle to shoot at people from and your buddy's head exploded from who knows what direction

it wouldn't be a huge deal but it would b nice

VideoGames
Aug 18, 2003
I like the throwing red tape recorder change - that was pretty cool effect to see. It might help teach engies about building placement too and not having everything so bunched up.

Snipers are great - I do not play sniper but they help teach me about going into lanes without checking my surroundings.

Sniper bullets are not nearly as frustrating as being hit across the map from random crit minigun bullets.

LazyMaybe
Aug 18, 2013

oouagh
minigun lasers are probably a good example of why crits should actually be at least somewhat subject to damage falloff, but they're also much funnier than sniper headshots

Teriyaki Koinku
Nov 25, 2008

Bread! Bread! Bread!

Bread! BREAD! BREAD!
I'm getting back into TF2 as my daily driver after bouncing off from Overwatch. Has anyone messed around with war paints? How do you normally get those? Are they unpacked from crates like Stranges/Unusuals?

Also, if I want to obtain my own Unusual (never got one before), is it more efficient to keep unboxing crates or just buy one off somebody on the Steam marketplace/trade servers?

Teriyaki Koinku fucked around with this message at 09:33 on Mar 1, 2023

8 Ball
Nov 27, 2010

My hands are all messed up so you better post, brother.
There are crates specifically for war paints, which also come in unusual and strange variants.

I unbox unusuals because I have a gambling problem, you are much better off just buying the exact unusual you want from another player

Teriyaki Koinku
Nov 25, 2008

Bread! Bread! Bread!

Bread! BREAD! BREAD!

8 Ball posted:

There are crates specifically for war paints, which also come in unusual and strange variants.

I unbox unusuals because I have a gambling problem, you are much better off just buying the exact unusual you want from another player

Okay, thanks. I love the idea of randomly coming across an Unusual from unboxing a crate, but I don't love the idea of constantly throwing money trying to chase a payout.

As far as trading for an Unusual, is it better to buy one directly on the Steam marketplace, buy from a third-party website, or trade in-game on a trade server? How do you avoid getting scammed when making a trade? I've heard of stuff like that happening in trades.

Also, do you normally trade items or keys for Unusuals?

RandolphCarter
Jul 30, 2005


Any good servers for someone trying to knock off 10 years of rust? Also anyone know someone with too much money that likes to buy unusuals?

Countblanc
Apr 20, 2005

Help a hero out!

RandolphCarter posted:

Any good servers for someone trying to knock off 10 years of rust? Also anyone know someone with too much money that likes to buy unusuals?

The Uncletopia servers are basically the gold standard for community servers these days, assuming you're cool with no random crits

https://uncletopia.com/servers

Roth
Jul 9, 2016

The Uncletopia servers are great though you may want to get ready for an rear end kicking if you're rusty.

I haven't really run into a whole lot of toxic players on there too.

Dieting Hippo
Jan 5, 2006

THIS IS NOT A PROPER DIET FOR A HIPPO
Another Uncletopia feature is fixed spread, so shotgun pellets will always hit in the same pattern when you fire.

RandolphCarter
Jul 30, 2005


Practicing against bots, trying to jog some muscle memory. Haven’t played an fps with a mouse in ages. Will try the uncletopia servers when I feel confident. Thank you.

khwarezm
Oct 26, 2010

Deal with it.

Teriyaki Koinku posted:

Okay, thanks. I love the idea of randomly coming across an Unusual from unboxing a crate, but I don't love the idea of constantly throwing money trying to chase a payout.

As far as trading for an Unusual, is it better to buy one directly on the Steam marketplace, buy from a third-party website, or trade in-game on a trade server? How do you avoid getting scammed when making a trade? I've heard of stuff like that happening in trades.

Also, do you normally trade items or keys for Unusuals?

Saying this as somebody who lucked into an unusual Cosa Nostra Cap with a great effect, do not open crates for unusuals, the odds are always against you if you are looking to cover the costs of the keys you spend to open the crates, you are better off just seeking out the particular hat and effect you want and buying it. Most unusuals go for a surprisingly low amount of keys these days, especially the ones that can technically still be unboxed from reasonably common crates. The super valuable ones are primarily from old crates that cannot be opened anymore which had unique effects that will never reappear, this particularly applies to the early series Halloween crates when you could get stuff like Knifestorm or Hellfire effects, these are older hats which will always have a very limited supply that will never get any higher, barring some possible glitch and duping chicanery if someone figures that out before Valve quashes it.

There are some crates that are still extant that can pop out very valuable hats and effects, especially the invasion update crates, the issue there is that those specific crates themselves are finite in supply and there will never be any new ones added to the game, so the cost of the crates themselves are very high in part because they are increasingly rare and because the prospect of unboxing the fabled Nebula Corona Australis (which goes for more than 3000 keys and is one of the most valuable items in the game) drives up the price of the crates further.

Its hard to know what the best approach is for buying unusuals, but generally if you aren't going for the super valuable stuff your best bet is probably to buy keys for prices lower than you would pay for them on the in-game store in a third party site (marketplace.tf is considered reliable and sells them for 2.05 dollars each) and then looking for some unusuals advertised on the classifieds on Backpack.tf. As I said you can see there are tons of very cheap unsuals you can pick up here, some of them go for less than 10 keys, which is a way better bet than potentially spending 120 keys unboxing crates for the same hat. If you want to be a bit more hands on you can also advertise that you are willing to buy an unusual on the same site for whatever amount of keys you are willing to throw at it. Basic buying and selling rules apply so you might have a better time spending less money but more time haggling with people for what you want if you show interest. You can use steam marketplace for less hassle, but the prices tend to be worse there overall in part because Valve takes a cut of its own that's not present in the reputable third party sites.

khwarezm fucked around with this message at 01:46 on Mar 2, 2023

Reiley
Dec 16, 2007


When I settled on what unusual I wanted (ghost tyrant) I went to a bunch of hat trading forums and made a post offering to trade custom artwork or in-game sprays, animated or otherwise, for the specific hat. One person actually bit, they were a former Soldier who switched mains to Demo and they were in some kind of design class. The timing lined up where I caught them in a week where they didn't have access to their computer and they had a graphic design project due by the end of the week to design a layout for a tri-fold brochure for some church. The deal was: if I did his homework for him he'd call it even and give me the Tyrant's Helm. We were both unsure if the other was about to scam us but I delivered a solid graphic design layout and he held up his end and paid me in my hat.

It was a one in a million gambit that paid off, but it was still better odds than pumping a bunch of keys into opening crates yourself.

drrockso20
May 6, 2013

Has Not Actually Done Cocaine
Of course how much you'll end up spending is also dependent on what kind of hat you're going for, if it's a single class hat you probably won't have to pay too much(assuming neither the hat or effect are particularly rare) while an all-class hat is going to be a bit more

khwarezm
Oct 26, 2010

Deal with it.

drrockso20 posted:

Of course how much you'll end up spending is also dependent on what kind of hat you're going for, if it's a single class hat you probably won't have to pay too much(assuming neither the hat or effect are particularly rare) while an all-class hat is going to be a bit more

Also hats for Scout and Soldier (the best classes :mmmhmm:) tend to be much more valuable on average than hats for a class like Heavy and Engineer (the worst classes :mmmhmm:), which tends to reflect the fact that classes popular in competitive among really dedicated players will see a lot more demand for high tier hats.

Oddly though, despite this Demoman hats are on the lower end of things price wise.

Unusual miscs are also extremely valuable compared to hats, partly because it means you can hypothetically have multiple Unusual items equipped simultaneously, and partly because some of them are technically glitched items which Valve "fixed" later on, making the existing ones very rare with no possibility of new ones legitimately coming into being again.

Conversely, some types of hats have comparatively depressed prices, notably the robot hats from the robotic boogaloo update which are generally not popular, though confusingly the actual effects from that update are popular which means the robocrates are quite a lot more valuable than most old crates.

khwarezm fucked around with this message at 02:54 on Mar 2, 2023

Jabor
Jul 16, 2010

#1 Loser at SpaceChem
Sixes has twice as many soldier mains than demo mains, so more demand.

Warpy
May 24, 2003


"KABOOOOM!"

khwarezm posted:

Saying this as somebody who lucked into an unusual Cosa Nostra Cap with a great effect, do not open crates for unusuals, the odds are always against you if you are looking to cover the costs of the keys you spend to open the crates, you are better off just seeking out the particular hat and effect you want and buying it. Most unusuals go for a surprisingly low amount of keys these days, especially the ones that can technically still be unboxed from reasonably common crates. The super valuable ones are primarily from old crates that cannot be opened anymore which had unique effects that will never reappear, this particularly applies to the early series Halloween crates when you could get stuff like Knifestorm or Hellfire effects, these are older hats which will always have a very limited supply that will never get any higher, barring some possible glitch and duping chicanery if someone figures that out before Valve quashes it.

There are some crates that are still extant that can pop out very valuable hats and effects, especially the invasion update crates, the issue there is that those specific crates themselves are finite in supply and there will never be any new ones added to the game, so the cost of the crates themselves are very high in part because they are increasingly rare and because the prospect of unboxing the fabled Nebula Corona Australis (which goes for more than 3000 keys and is one of the most valuable items in the game) drives up the price of the crates further.

Its hard to know what the best approach is for buying unusuals, but generally if you aren't going for the super valuable stuff your best bet is probably to buy keys for prices lower than you would pay for them on the in-game store in a third party site (marketplace.tf is considered reliable and sells them for 2.05 dollars each) and then looking for some unusuals advertised on the classifieds on Backpack.tf. As I said you can see there are tons of very cheap unsuals you can pick up here, some of them go for less than 10 keys, which is a way better bet than potentially spending 120 keys unboxing crates for the same hat. If you want to be a bit more hands on you can also advertise that you are willing to buy an unusual on the same site for whatever amount of keys you are willing to throw at it. Basic buying and selling rules apply so you might have a better time spending less money but more time haggling with people for what you want if you show interest. You can use steam marketplace for less hassle, but the prices tend to be worse there overall in part because Valve takes a cut of its own that's not present in the reputable third party sites.
this person is objectively wrong

just gamble on any and every crate you stumble upon.. it's fine and fun also you're really cool if you do it

RandolphCarter
Jul 30, 2005


Played a round of Mann vs Machine as medic. I forgot how fun medic is, still my favorite support role in any game.

ArfJason
Sep 5, 2011
whenever i go back to tf2 the three classes i always play are medic pyro and solly

VideoGames
Aug 18, 2003
Unusual effect haunted ghosts and cloud nine are my two favourite effects, but even better is you can get haunted ghost weapons so at least I can see those ghosts all the time. Just wish I could apply that paint to existing weapons.

ArfJason
Sep 5, 2011
friend of mine sends me clips of og xbox tf2 matches he finds. its such a cool thing. it got delisted but you can still play with people and with the series x poo poo you can play it at high resolution 60fps

RandolphCarter
Jul 30, 2005


Played a few rounds against real people today. I am very bad now, but I had fun.

Hihohe
Oct 4, 2008

Fuck you and the sun you live under


its still thursday where im at

https://twitter.com/theaveragef2p/status/1631267289239818243?s=20

RandolphCarter
Jul 30, 2005


Let’s say I can get my hands on a unusual blighted beak with the haunted ghost effect and wanted to sell it what would be a good price?

khwarezm
Oct 26, 2010

Deal with it.

RandolphCarter posted:

Let’s say I can get my hands on a unusual blighted beak with the haunted ghost effect and wanted to sell it what would be a good price?

If you put the work in you might be able to flip it for 600 dollars roughly (or in and around 300-350 keys). The fact that its a misc with a reasonably good first gen effect makes it very valuable.

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Zookeeper Steve
Jul 21, 2008
hi Team fortress 2 it's friday night for me here are some videos of people doing rocket jumps and stickybomb jumps. these are videos i clicked on as they appeared but they are very good. Enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcbtEZsbp4c
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p7Q8EX0atDA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1MfHCunH7xc
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zfEeeHv3wJs

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