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It's pretty funny how much the Fireflies suck. They do not have a single scene in the entire season where they don't spectacularly gently caress everything up. Their every appearance featured a massacre of their own people. Marlene was pretty impressed with Joel's successful road trip. She lost five of her best guys or whatever. Then again, her guys can't take a piss without drowning a squad in sewage. I'm sure basic competence and self preservation must look like a superpower after a while.
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Mar 15, 2023 00:54
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CAR CRASH CRACKERS posted:Where in the game does it say/show he only has a BS? There is a degree you can see in the doctor's office that is for a BS in Biology. The date is from ~6 years prior to outbreak and it's from "Northern Utah Medical University." That is the only thing to go on. To me it at least suggests that he was pre-med and probably continued schooling after, but I'm not sure how much you're meant to pick it apart. It's not even like an artifact you pick up to look at, it's a background detail.
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Mar 15, 2023 01:00
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Hell, that might not even be his office
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Mar 15, 2023 01:04
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Maybe he's like the guy in New Vegas who has a theoretical degree in physics! 
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Mar 15, 2023 01:05
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I know I'll be packing my college degree in my go bag.
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Mar 15, 2023 01:07
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Mr. Prokosch posted:It's pretty funny how much the Fireflies suck. They do not have a single scene in the entire season where they don't spectacularly gently caress everything up. Their every appearance featured a massacre of their own people. Their two biggest accomplishments that I recall off the top of my head are giving baby Ellie away so that someone more competent can keep her safe, and blowing up a grain silo and destabilizing an entire human community. And that second one is apocryphal.
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Mar 15, 2023 01:11
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Ror posted:There is a degree you can see in the doctor's office that is for a BS in Biology. The date is from ~6 years prior to outbreak and it's from "Northern Utah Medical University." That is the only thing to go on. To me it at least suggests that he was pre-med and probably continued schooling after, but I'm not sure how much you're meant to pick it apart. It's not even like an artifact you pick up to look at, it's a background detail. If it’s dated 6 years prior to outbreak, then it stands to reason he would’ve also graduated med school and been 1-2 years into his residency before the outbreak started, assuming no breaks between his BS and starting med school. It also means that, after surviving the initial chaos, he could’ve been a practicing physician for the last twenty years. Now does that automatically mean he’s qualified to 1) conduct brain surgery and 2) understand cordyceps well enough to remove parts from Ellie and keep the cells alive and intact long enough to 3) develop a vaccine of sorts out of the material gathered on his first try…really depends on what he’s been focusing his medical practice on. But I think the most likely route to any sort of “realism” would be that he’s focused primarily on research on the cordyceps and since the surgery is going to kill Ellie anyways, he doesn’t need to be that skilled at brain surgery, just skilled enough to successfully remove the needed mass and develop a vaccine from it. Who cares how much you mangle the actual surgery if you planned on the surgery killing her anyways?
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Mar 15, 2023 01:13
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Nottherealaborn posted:If it’s dated 6 years prior to outbreak, then it stands to reason he would’ve also graduated med school and been 1-2 years into his residency before the outbreak started, assuming no breaks between his BS and starting med school. It also means that, after surviving the initial chaos, he could’ve been a practicing physician for the last twenty years. Now does that automatically mean he’s qualified to 1) conduct brain surgery and 2) understand cordyceps well enough to remove parts from Ellie and keep the cells alive and intact long enough to 3) develop a vaccine of sorts out of the material gathered on his first try…really depends on what he’s been focusing his medical practice on. But I think the most likely route to any sort of “realism” would be that he’s focused primarily on research on the cordyceps and since the surgery is going to kill Ellie anyways, he doesn’t need to be that skilled at brain surgery, just skilled enough to successfully remove the needed mass and develop a vaccine from it. Who cares how much you mangle the actual surgery if you planned on the surgery killing her anyways? I mean, you can survive an entire hemispherectomy, especially as a child. If he was capable and they had decent facilities, theoretically he shoulda been able to take out a pretty sizable chonk while still giving her a chance at some kind of recovery. Ellie's a little old for this, but it's conceivable.
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Mar 15, 2023 01:19
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Thundercracker posted:Hell, it's an achievement to have a game script that doesn't suck. Something recent high budget games have been failing utterly. Trying to ask for another LoU is extremely high bar. Give us a Disco Elysium or a Planescape: Torment, something that does something that you don't see in TV at all Probably be really expensive to do Torment not as an animation though I guess
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Mar 15, 2023 02:14
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I think both of those stories are ones that actually use the structure of the game in a way that doesn't lend itself to being adapted, DE especially. That game is in a part personality-political quiz and CYOA mashed together. Also just logistically so much of the game is internal dialogue and thoughts, there are ways to film that sort of thing but for an entire series I'm not sure how well it would hold up.
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Mar 15, 2023 02:35
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Khanstant posted:I almost never watch a show while not also doing some other activity. It would feel bananas to me to just sit and watch and do nothing with my hands. That is basically sleeping. lmao
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Mar 15, 2023 02:47
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Khanstant posted:I almost never watch a show while not also doing some other activity. It would feel bananas to me to just sit and watch and do nothing with my hands. That is basically sleeping.
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Mar 15, 2023 02:48
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Khanstant posted:I almost never watch a show while not also doing some other activity. It would feel bananas to me to just sit and watch and do nothing with my hands. That is basically sleeping. Do you learn another language on tape while you're sleeping too? Khanstant posted:I think both of those stories are ones that actually use the structure of the game in a way that doesn't lend itself to being adapted, DE especially. That game is in a part personality-political quiz and CYOA mashed together. I think whatever DE adaptation Amazon may be trying is going to end up looking like the Guy Ritchie Sherlock Holmes fight scenes except we get to see Harry gently caress up everything instead. GoutPatrol fucked around with this message at 03:07 on Mar 15, 2023 |
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Mar 15, 2023 02:58
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I have adhd before someone drops that. It sucks and I hate it and I basically don’t watch much because of it. But idk, I love movies and art so I just think half watching it is a disservice unless you’re just consuming content without discussing it or whatever
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Mar 15, 2023 02:59
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WoodrowSkillson posted:an issue i have with nearly all zombie related media is the steadfast refusal to show people adapting to the threat by how they are dressed. humans are not very good at biting through clothing, even relatively light stuff. Quick silly aside: humans have unusually efficient jaw muscles, we beat out every primate except chimps and gorillas. The main reason we don't shred stuff is bc our teeth buckle before our jaw muscles give out and that's uh, probably not something zombies worry about. Don't hang onto those jorts is what I'm saying https://www.discovermagazine.com/the-sciences/who-are-you-calling-weak-human-jaws-are-surprisingly-strong-and-efficient
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Mar 15, 2023 03:43
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I don't see it as a disservice, the best art inspires me and makes me want to make things and making art while consuming art is tops imo. Plus for every art I appreciate there's a billion more I won't get around to, double-fisting means getting hosed up on twice as much art. Not to mention I gotta be at work for 8-9 hours a day, nice to have something on while working and at the machines that have media on them.
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Mar 15, 2023 05:28
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Jerusalem posted:Marlene had zero reason to expect Joel and Ellie to find them, when they left (the other side of the country, if I have the geography right?) all he was supposed to do was take her to a building in old Boston and hand Ellie over, and when Marlene finally got there herself she found a bombed out ruin filled with corpses. About the only thing she'd have to go on then was that he was looking for Tommy, and that he MIGHT have taken Ellie with him (unlikely, based on her prior interactions with him), and she only had a rough idea of where Tommy last was (and Joel only found him because he got lost!), no idea that Tommy would give them directions to a hospital (already abandoned) or that Joel would continue to try and get Ellie to them. Why does the patrol even take them into custody? Are they in the habit of doing that every time they see a man and a teen girl walking together and cracking puns? What would they have done after the flashbang and the KO if Joel and Ellie had just been scavenging the SLC ruins and wandered too close to the the hospital? e: Sorry, just thinking out loud here. The Firefly M.O. is loving stupid. Platystemon fucked around with this message at 08:12 on Mar 15, 2023 |
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Mar 15, 2023 07:26
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thebardyspoon posted:Yeah tagging their mark on stuff in their own base is a little odd. Maybe the reason the dudes in the hospital were such crap shots is they were the PR division? Very gung ho about branding, less so about practicing their tactics and ability to shoot.   Contents: Firefly piss? Mr. Prokosch posted:It's pretty funny how much the Fireflies suck. They do not have a single scene in the entire season where they don't spectacularly gently caress everything up. Their every appearance featured a massacre of their own people. I was thinking to myself “what is the most competent action the Fireflies are ever known to have underaken”? The best I can come up with is that they got a Chrysler product running for a few hundred miles before breaking down, and they did this more than twenty years after it come off the assembly line. 
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Mar 15, 2023 08:13
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Platystemon posted:Why does the patrol even take them into custody? Are they in the habit of doing that every time they see a man and a teen girl walking together and cracking puns? I would assume they'd take them into custody to interrogate them to find out if they're alone or an advance party for a larger group that they need to be worried about v  v
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Mar 15, 2023 08:41
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I guess. It seems to me that it would be more more effective to either observe Scavenger Joe and Scavenger Ellie from afar, or approach them like adults, ask some questions, and maybe suggest that they scavenge in some other direction. I mean, if the Fireflies are going to accept their answers and let them go, what’s the point of concussing them? It’s all very game-y. Platystemon fucked around with this message at 09:21 on Mar 15, 2023 |
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Mar 15, 2023 09:13
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Starting to feel like 95% of the "gamey" comments wouldn't be made if they didn't know it was a game first. People ambush other people it has happened in a million other movies not about videogames.
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Mar 15, 2023 09:25
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I may have used different words. It’s a contrived plot device for the villain to incapacitate the protagonists so that the villain may deliver a monologue in their lair, but it is a plot device that is not unique to video games.
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Mar 15, 2023 09:37
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Hell, in the game Ellie drowns in an underpass and Joel’s trying to revive her when a couple of patrol dudes show up and smash him in the head while he’s doing CPR. She’s unconscious for the entire thing, she doesn’t even know they found them till she wakes up in the car after. The whole throwing grenades at a guy and a kid thing they used here is just nuts.
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Mar 15, 2023 10:31
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Yeah it was dumb as gently caress
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Mar 15, 2023 11:07
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Sentinel Red posted:The whole throwing grenades at a guy and a kid thing they used here is just nuts. I just read it as them being ex-cops heyoo.
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Mar 15, 2023 12:44
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It wasn't a murder grenade, just some knock out gas or something.
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Mar 15, 2023 12:53
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I thought it was a flashbang..
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Mar 15, 2023 13:31
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Yes it was a flashbang, it wasnt an actual frag grenade with shrapnel lol. Was intended to disorientate and it did its job. They lost 5 people getting there, probably it's incredibly rare they come across anyone friendly and they're being hunted by Fedra, isn't odd they decided to disable and capture two trespassers just to be safe rather than walking up for a chat.
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Mar 15, 2023 14:35
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I kind of liked the idea that Ellie's immunity was a question mark -- maybe this is a random mutation, maybe she has some rare underlying condition that cancels out the cordyceps. Not everything in a story needs a pat conclusion. Ellie being "Blade but for zombies" feels like a bad cliche.
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Mar 15, 2023 16:05
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It still is a question mark. Even the viewer can't be sure with what was shown, and I doubt the writers, given their medibabble, actually have an idea of the mechanics of it because it isn't important. What we were shown could also be irrelevant regarding immunity, and Ellie could've been born immune if her mother wasn't attacked, no real way to know.
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Mar 15, 2023 16:27
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Martman posted:From the point of view of the viewer, he's totally Some Guy. We haven't been shown anything to establish any amount of credibility in his scientific guesses. They do lay that exact groundwork, Marlene tells Joel exactly how her immunity works (Ellie has a cordyceps fungus in her and it sends out a chemical signal that stops any outside spores from from taking hold) and how they intend to make it into a vaccine, and there is no reason to really doubt what she says. The show even specifically has Marlene say "He thinks there could be a cure" like they aren't 100% sure but they believe this is the right path. Also, Joel says "But cordyceps grows in the brain" which is telling us exactly why she has to die and also cementing that Joel knows the only chance for a cure would end with her dying. Although honestly I would like a flashback episode that showed the perspective of FEDRA/Firefly at their "peak" along with doctors doing research into a potential vaccine while poo poo is going down outside. Tumble fucked around with this message at 17:21 on Mar 15, 2023 |
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Mar 15, 2023 16:28
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spacing in vienna posted:Ellie being "Blade but for zombies" feels like a bad cliche. Even worse, it's 100% lifted from The Girl With All The Gifts.
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Mar 15, 2023 16:34
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Tumble posted:They do lay that exact groundwork, Marlene tells Joel exactly how her immunity works (Ellie has a cordyceps fungus in her and it sends out a chemical signal that stops any outside spores from from taking hold) and how they intend to make it into a vaccine, and there is no reason to really doubt what she says. So maybe my suggestion didn't really solve that problem, that's true. If they want us to feel confident that there's absolutely, positively no other way though, it would not be hard to give something concrete even if farfetched to show that. Otherwise you're still resting on "well why would the fireflies do this if it was that dumb" and my answer is "because they're that dumb" Martman fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Mar 15, 2023 |
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Mar 15, 2023 16:37
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i feel like the speed of the immunity transfer wouldn't have been an issue if they'd show'd the baby and the bite and then cut to marlene walking in with the cord cut
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Mar 15, 2023 16:54
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Martman posted:The fact that that path could lead to a vaccine is not establishing that it's the only path. There is no good reason to think their scientists have enough info to know that. Any reasonable person would want to study her for as long as they possibly could before jumping to that insane conclusion.
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Mar 15, 2023 16:55
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Alhazred posted:Even worse, it's 100% lifted from The Girl With All The Gifts. Probably a good movie recommendation for those in this thread who haven't seen it. I'm not making any judgement or comparison, it's just a good movie with some parallel themes.
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Mar 15, 2023 17:53
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Last of Us came out June 2013, but it was a pretty massive development and took at least a few years The Girl With All The Gifts (the book) was published in June 2014, but was based on a short story the author had released in 2012. I dunno it seems like just one of those weird coincidences where parallel ideas come out at once, but if anything certain plot beats seem like they could have been inspired the other way around. Also I didn't know that author was the same Mike Carey who wrote Lucifer and other comics e: https://www.goodreads.com/author/7177350.M_R_Carey/questions quote:M.R. Carey Hi Zafir. I hadn't heard of The Last Of Us until after I'd finished writing GIRL (which is probably just as well). Martman fucked around with this message at 18:16 on Mar 15, 2023 |
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Mar 15, 2023 18:10
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Khanstant posted:It still is a question mark. Even the viewer can't be sure with what was shown, and I doubt the writers, given their medibabble, actually have an idea of the mechanics of it because it isn't important. What we were shown could also be irrelevant regarding immunity, and Ellie could've been born immune if her mother wasn't attacked, no real way to know. We definitely know that Ellie's immunity is because her mother was bit in-between Ellie being born and having the umbilical cord cut
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Mar 15, 2023 18:13
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Martman posted:The fact that that path could lead to a vaccine is not establishing that it's the only path. There is no good reason to think their scientists have enough info to know that. Any reasonable person would want to study her for as long as they possibly could before jumping to that insane conclusion. Yeah at the very least they should've added a ticking clock element. "Her antibody count is waning, she is losing her immunity, we need to cut her open now." Or "she got mortally wounded when the firefly patrol apprehended her, her survival chance is 10%, we need to cut out her brain now before she dies" Anything to justify killing the golden goose
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Mar 15, 2023 18:30
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You definitely don't, Ellie could've already been immune. If it is from the bite in-between there's still a ton of variables, and it could still end up not being because of just the bite alone. The writers can of course say it's whatever they want, but with what's shown and more importantly, what the characters in-universe have seen, it's not a forgone conclusion. Setting up a mushie in the maternity ward for the optional sacrificial child-immunity package wouldn't work (unless they writers said it would, then okay then gotta get heavy duty shocks for my disbelief)
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Mar 15, 2023 18:33
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