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02-6611-0142-1
Sep 30, 2004

I had a costrochondral separation on one of the lower ribs while rolling and it took me off the mats for a few months, then i could only roll gently for a few months more, then I was back to normal rolling. But 1-2 years later I could still feel the injury if i flexed in certain directions - no pain, but I felt a weird little twinge, a sensation that it was still a weak spot, still had the potential for re-injury.

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Tyro
Nov 10, 2009
The timing is lovely because I'm deploying in a month and a half, this was my window to train a lot before a big question mark for the next year.

Hopefully there will be some dudes who want to grapple when I get where I'm going.

Mekchu
Apr 10, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Nestharken posted:

Don't have much to add, but these are super interesting from a layperson's perspective.

Yeah, I've found all this sort of stuff interesting as well as pedagogical practices/approaches.

I think just discussing and developing a concept of what role curriculum plays in jiu iitsu (really any sport) is kind of important. One of the things we all seem to comment on is some degree of poor education practice existing in jiu jitsu from our own anecdotes.

So like, any form of commentary is useful tbh.

02-6611-0142-1
Sep 30, 2004

Have any of you guys ever trained with Saulo or Xande? We have an opportunity to affiliate and it seems like a pretty good fit, but I want to make sure that they aren't assholes.

Xguard86
Nov 22, 2004

"You don't understand his pain. Everywhere he goes he sees women working, wearing pants, speaking in gatherings, voting. Surely they will burn in the white hot flames of Hell"
Friend trained at an affiliate and said saulo's visits were a highlight.

Second hand I know

Count Roland
Oct 6, 2013

It may not mean much but Saulo's book Jujitsu University is excellent.

knuthgrush
Jun 25, 2008

Be brave; clench fists.

Count Roland posted:

It may not mean much but Saulo's book Jujitsu University is excellent.

Michael Transactions
Nov 11, 2013

I live in Austin and visited Xande's school and it was good.

Mekchu
Apr 10, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Jack Slack did a twitter thread of good/recommended instructionals (most of which are grappling related)

https://twitter.com/JackSlackMMA/status/1645728722287247360

Tacos Al Pastor
Jun 20, 2003

Tacos Al Pastor posted:

Anyone recommend a good jiu jitsu spot to train in the southern Vermont, NW portion of Mass? I will be looking at real estate in the area and just wondering if there are any good places to drop in and train. Ill also be in Burlington for a day.

Ended up finding very little to nada in the southern portion of Vermont and eastern New Hampshire. Did roll with a blue belt that owned a gym in Brattleboro and a Brown belt that owned a gym in Keene, NH.

I guess there are still places in the country where Jiu Jitsu is a bit abyssmal.

Tacos Al Pastor fucked around with this message at 20:00 on Apr 11, 2023

Acinonyx
Oct 21, 2005
Vermont and NH are pretty bleak. The few people i know in south east NH make the trip over to Portland ME to train.

Defenestrategy
Oct 24, 2010

Does amateur wrestling exist outside of olympics/college/hs like are there wrestling schools for 20 year olds with little asperation?

knuthgrush
Jun 25, 2008

Be brave; clench fists.

Defenestrategy posted:

Does amateur wrestling exist outside of olympics/college/hs like are there wrestling schools for 20 year olds with little asperation?

USA wrestling is a thing, right? I seem to recall them representing wrestling clubs but I don't know if they're academic or not.

I'm not aware of any strictly wrestling gyms but I know of a few mma that have dedicated wrestling classes.

I wonder if the lack of popularity is due to how brutal the training can be?

knuthgrush
Jun 25, 2008

Be brave; clench fists.

I have the best coach. I'm going to a nearby gym tonight to get some rolls in with strangers to practice for the tourney this weekend. We just had this exchange.

Only registered members can see post attachments!

Michael Transactions
Nov 11, 2013

Acinonyx posted:

Vermont and NH are pretty bleak. The few people i know in south east NH make the trip over to Portland ME to train.

Sounds like a good place to open a school.

Neeber
Nov 29, 2007
Thought I'd share this interesting video from an old training partner of mine https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jkdFeQhVmKk. Don't be fooled by the title - Jeff's hardly an "average" BJJ guy, he has a couple pro MMA fights under his belt including a win by RNC in OneFC - but I thought it was really fun watching him rolling at full speed with some super high level competitors including BOTH Miyao brothers.

Legit Businessman
Sep 2, 2007


Can the mayao brothers walk at this point, or have they continued their "not giving a gently caress about their own knees and ankles" strategy?

knuthgrush
Jun 25, 2008

Be brave; clench fists.

My registration for this weekend's tourney got canceled. No other old and skinny blue belts signed up besides me. I think my only option was to jump in with the 200lbs+ old dudes and that ain't gonna happen.

Still gonna go to support the gym, though. It'll be nice eating a big dinner while those cutting weight consider how they're gonna murder me at Sunday open mat.

Tacos Al Pastor
Jun 20, 2003

Legit Businessman posted:

Can the mayao brothers walk at this point, or have they continued their "not giving a gently caress about their own knees and ankles" strategy?

That is literally all those guys do is jiu jitsu 24/7. Imagine all that time devoted to figuring out how to NOT get your legs broken.

lovely tuna snatch
Feb 10, 2010

I forgot that I should notify my instructor to check up on me for a test to move from beginner class to regular one, so I did two rounds of the intro course (almost 40 sessions total) instead of one. Have been sparring for a while now but can't wait to start over and not understand anything in the learning classes. I guess I also need a gi now...

Tacos Al Pastor
Jun 20, 2003

lovely tuna snatch posted:

I forgot that I should notify my instructor to check up on me for a test to move from beginner class to regular one, so I did two rounds of the intro course (almost 40 sessions total) instead of one. Have been sparring for a while now but can't wait to start over and not understand anything in the learning classes. I guess I also need a gi now...

I still enjoy the beginner classes because you forget little details. I cant tell you how many times Ive seen someone go for an armbar from mount and then not pinch the knees.

Lid
Feb 18, 2005

And the mercy seat is awaiting,
And I think my head is burning,
And in a way I'm yearning,
To be done with all this measuring of proof.
An eye for an eye
And a tooth for a tooth,
And anyway I told the truth,
And I'm not afraid to die.
https://www.reddit.com/r/bjj/commen...nt=share_button

What a scumbag

Mekchu
Apr 10, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
gotta do anything possible to get that stupid piece of tin on a lanyard that costs $5 to make

Mekchu
Apr 10, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
So earlier this month I posted a really academic sounding paper that I wrote for a class about a kid's jiu jitsu class and analyzed it in terms of how the intended, enacted and experienced curriculum all worked or didn't work out.

I then was advised to take it down as it was verbatim what I was going to turn in and could have gotten into some tricky spots with plagiarism so then I took it down.

Anyway it's back now but I edited it down to make it less nerdy, easier reading, and also more "normal" to talk about.

Keep in mind it isn't a breakdown on what should or shouldn't be done, but more so analyzing the curriculum with regards to the theories and applications I was reading and learning about in my graduate studies class.


Mekchu posted:

OK here is the thing I wrote and then took down and edited a bit (thanks to CarlCX for the assist and Commonshore for suggesting I take it down until after it was turned in).













In the last March Grapple Hut post, I spent a good deal of time discussing curriculum concepts and how they can related to jiu jitsu. It just also happened to coincide with some work I was doing on that topic. This is an edited down analysis I did on a kid’s jiu jitsu program at my last jiu jitsu gym.

You may be asking, “why is this important and why is this worth reading?” The relevance of this paper is that designing a curriculum program is rather tricky and, this is the big part, even more tricky to ensure your students take away the intended learning you’re presenting them. This is a regular issue and problem that plagues most sports, and in jiu jitsu its a common thread of discussion.

So this is an honest and open look at a program I designed and enacted as the teacher and should serve as some food for thought.

Analysis of a Children’s Jiu Jitsu Program Curriculum Implementation

This is an analysis of the implementation of a kid’s jiu jitsu program’s curriculum at my jiu jitsu gym. The program was part of an expansion of classes available for children at my local gym, which we’ll call BJJ School. The curriculum was designed and implemented solely by myself. It was created to be a 16 week long program, with classes taking place two hours per week. The kid’s participating in the program ranged from the age of five years-old to ten years-old and had no prior experience.

When looking at curriculum in the context of a jiu jitsu gym, the intended curriculum takes the form of the specific technique, or system of techniques, to be taught in a set order or chain so as to achieve desired results in a simulated sparring session or competition setting. The intention, in this case, was to achieve the following over the course of the program:

· Learning key English words and phrases (the students were ESL learners).

· Learn specific sequences of jiu jitsu techniques and chains.

· Develop related body mechanics and control.

· Encourage social development with regards to teamwork and discipline.

In the situation I was put in, no curriculum existed at the time of the establishment of the children’s jiu jitsu program, nor was there a curriculum designed for the adult’s program to base a children’s program off of. Therefore a new curriculum, designed by myself, was necessary. The aims for the program were shaped by what the head coach at BJJ School viewed as the base standards. Due to the autonomy given to me, I was also allowed to add in elements from external curriculum such as the Gracie University Bully Proof activities and games, as well as personal guidance via communique with other children’s coaches through a social network of jiu jitsu hobbyists.

Since I was the sole educator, it was my responsibility to track and maintain how effectively the intended curriculum was enacted during the lessons. Unbeknownst to me at the time, my preparation work for each of the training sessions followed the curriculum strategy framework as described by educational researchers Sherin & Drake. To summarize their findings, there are three phases of curriculum strategy; reading, evaluating, and adapting. Reading comes when the instructor reviews the written documents and goals as an overview prior to and during instruction. The evaluating stage comes when a teacher focuses on needs of the learners and deciding if the curriculum is appropriate. The third stage, adapting, happens when the instructor creates, replaces, or omits components from the curriculum during the instruction.

So, prior to each lesson I would review the written curriculum to ensure I knew what the goals for the day. Then, I would determine which of the techniques being focused on would be most suitable using what I understood of the abilities of the students displayed in previous lessons. Finally, I would then adapt the curriculum for that day by typically adding additional steps to the learning process to ensure a more clear line of knowledge was established.

Looking at the experienced curriculum of the students, in jiu jtsu it is typically seen in the form of the child developing a sense of deep understanding on the timing of using specific techniques such as leverage, pressure with their body, and allowing them to complete a desired technique efficiently. In addition to this, experienced curriculum can also apply to the mental and psychological development of the child, such as developing the ability to maintain a calm and focused demeanor during a competition after the experiences of sparring and competing over time. It was observed that the students’ ability to enact specific moves, typically ones the child preferred or found to be easier due to the shape of their body.

When looking at the curriculum, it is important to assess the alignment of goals as stated as part of the intended curriculum. Keeping in mind that there are opportunities for both alignment and misalignment to occur between the Intended-Enacted Curriculum it’s worth pointing out where such issue occurred for further improvements. One area of alignment was that the instruction of the techniques did follow the intended curriculum and its overall plan. For example, “shrimping” was taught as a basic movement and after the first lesson exposed them to it the children were able to competently perform it.

When it came to misalignment however, it noted that pacing and introduction of certain body mechanic techniques were too fast for the children to develop. Mostly in the sense that they were being given information overload. To combat this it became necessary to omit or adapt the curriculum so as to add in additional steps to teaching certain body mechanics.

Another challenge with alignment was the issue of a language barrier existing between myself and the learners. As a native English speaker, one of the intended focuses of the program was to do all instruction in English to allow for exposure to the language for the non-English speaking learners. This goal was mostly met, but there were numerous instances of the students clearly struggling to understand me. In turn this would cause confusion and an inability to perform the technique being shown to them. An example of this is rather than saying “use C grips”, I had to adjust the word choice I was giving the kids to be “Lego hands” as it was a concept they were more familiar with.

The issues with communication weren’t just seen in the intended-enacted curriculum relationship, and can also be seen in the enacted-experienced relationship. At times they struggled to understand and execute the shown techniques effectively. There was a clear lack of comprehension on the specific body mechanics they were asked to perform which would cause a child to struggle and then grow frustrated with.

Despite the misalignment, there were also examples of proper alignment in the enacted-experienced curriculum relationship. This mostly came in the form of the students, during both sparring sessions and in competition, being able to perform several of the techniques they have been taught and had instruction on. There was also alignment between stated goals of the program when the students consistently showed good sportsmanship and behavior while at a competition.

A question you may now ask is, “What can be done to address misalignment?” One solution can be to perform a total reassessment of the curriculum from the start. Because the guidelines that were given were so vague, it implies that further detail may be necessary. Allowing for a more experienced instructor to guide me in the creation of the curriculum could have prevented any issues with introducing overly complicated techniques too early.

Similarly, the choice of focusing on giving instruction only in English to students who do not speak the language may need to be reversed. Teaching someone in their own native language leads to less confusion and breakdown in communication. As I mentioned, there were several issues with the students not understanding the instruction due to not having a strong understanding of English.

There is also an argument to be made that emphasis on the curriculum not being about jiu jitsu techniques per se, but focusing on body movement and body mechanic exercises instead. This is mostly based around research that shows children at certain ages benefit better from focusing exercise on specific body mechanics that a jiu jitsu class would not necessarily focus on. For more information on this I’d recommend you look at Sport For Life’s guidelines. This is an argument I think is valid as there were issues with kids struggling to perform certain body mechanics because they lacked the control or coordination skills needed. So they had to focus on developing those first, which interrupted the learning process of the jiu jitsu technique.

Finally, splitting the classes up from a singular class covering such a wide age range to allowing for multiple classes with each one having a specific age restriction would help. The rationale for this is that it would allow for sparring to occur between participants who are of equal size and strength, and for social development to occur on a more equal level between the students.

To summarize all of this, the process of implementing this program required a lot of work and consideration that, at the time, I was not fully aware of. There are so many theories and concepts at play when it comes to designing and introducing curriculum to a student that not everyone is aware of. While you may think that you want to eliminate any misalignment, that is utterly impossible. No matter what they will happen and there’s genuinely nothing you can do to stop that. However, when it comes to curriculum implementation it’s better to identify where the misalignment happens, why they happen, and what can be done to adjust your curriculum to lessen the negative effects.

Defenestrategy
Oct 24, 2010

Mekchu posted:

gotta do anything possible to get that stupid piece of tin on a lanyard that costs $5 to make

The entire bjj tournament scene is extremely stupid, but im not sure how youd reform it with out every coach taking a firm hand about it instead of just playing the game.
I do appreciate my coach is a savage in this regard. One of our former wrestlers who has excellent take downs told him he wanted to compete a few months in advance and my coach promotes him to blue right before the tournament registration cut off forcing dude to compete at blue in the gi division, even though coach could have promoted him on the podium or after.

Mekchu
Apr 10, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
https://www.flograppling.com/articles/10918770-flosports-announces-deal-with-adcc-as-exclusive-streaming-partner

ADCC is back on Flo now for 2024 after a whole 3 months with the UFC Fight Pass deal

:laffo:

Commonshore was right, this sport will never develop beyond its current level of niche because the people running it are idiots

Edit - Also, the guy who caused the event to be delayed, and was also really petty and lovely about stuff online (Seth from Fight2Win) had this to say



Mekchu fucked around with this message at 01:35 on Apr 28, 2023

Defenestrategy
Oct 24, 2010

Mekchu posted:

ADCC is back on Flo now for 2024 after a whole 3 months with the UFC Fight Pass deal

:laffo:

Commonshore was right, this sport will never develop beyond its current level of niche because the people running it are idiots

It's always astounded me that former? goon favorite tiny indy fed that could, Mountain State Wrestling could put on a television production every week with dudes probably paid not more than a sammich back in what 2015? and have better production than most BJJ live streams in TYOOL 202X

Tacos Al Pastor
Jun 20, 2003

Mekchu posted:

https://www.flograppling.com/articles/10918770-flosports-announces-deal-with-adcc-as-exclusive-streaming-partner

ADCC is back on Flo now for 2024 after a whole 3 months with the UFC Fight Pass deal

:laffo:

Commonshore was right, this sport will never develop beyond its current level of niche because the people running it are idiots

Edit - Also, the guy who caused the event to be delayed, and was also really petty and lovely about stuff online (Seth from Fight2Win) had this to say



If anyone thinks the production value and presentation of events is better handled at Flo then the UFC, then yes, they are indeed idiots. Moving it to UFC was going to increase exposure to the sport. But you have greedy indivuduals that are willing to pull the sport back to niche to line their own pockets. Having the UFC handle events would have been a giant evolutionary step forward for sub grappling.

Mekchu
Apr 10, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
Grapple Hut Huddle, May 2023

THIS MONTH'S BIG GRAPPLING EVENTS

May 5 - ONE Fight Night 10 (Amazon Prime in USA)

ONE Fight Night 10 will have two pretty good match ups for grappling in terms of “this is what ONE sees as their version of grappling.” First up is Tye Ruotolo taking on former ONE LHW (225 lbs) champion and current ONE Middleweight (205 lbs) champion Reinier de Ridder in a ONE Middleweight (205 lbs) Grappling match.

Then in the first of three title fights for the night, ONE Flyweight Grappling champion Mikey Musumeci is facing off against Osamah Almarwai who actually has more mainstream grappling experience and isn’t just a random SAMBO guy sent out to face a leg locker without knowing any leg lock defense. Almarwai has won the 2022 IBJJF No-Gi World championship, IBJJF Pan No-Gi championship in 2022, and the IBJJF World Mater championship also in 2022. He was kinda busy, so this should be at least an interesting match as compared to the last time Mikey went out to compete in ONE.

ONE Fight Night 10 will have two pretty good match ups for grappling in terms of “this is what ONE sees as their version of grappling.” First up is Tye Ruotolo taking on former ONE LHW (225 lbs) champion and current ONE Middleweight (205 lbs) champion Reinier de Ridder in a ONE Middleweight (205 lbs) Grappling match.

Then in the first of three title fights for the night, ONE Flyweight Grappling champion Mikey Musumeci is facing off against Osamah Almarwai who actually has more mainstream grappling experience and isn’t just a random SAMBO guy sent out to face a leg locker without knowing any leg lock defense. Almarwai has won the 2022 IBJJF No-Gi World championship, IBJJF Pan No-Gi championship in 2022, and the IBJJF World Mater championship also in 2022. He was kinda busy, so this should be at least an interesting match as compared to the last time Mikey went out to compete in ONE.

May 18 - Tezos WNO 18: Meregali vs. Marinho (FloGrappling)

I would say this would be worth watching but I can’t really be asked to watch any of the WNO events. Mostly because they have silly/bad rules for viewing and also because the main event is going to be a gi match between Nicholas Meregali and Pedro Marinho at heavyweight. Also on the card is Rafael Lovato Jr. taking on Elder Cruz at light heavyweight, Jacob Couch facing off against Izaak Michell at middleweight, and Tubby Alequin (I wish that was a made up name) competing in a flyweight match against Alex Enriquez.

Honestly, does anyone actually watch WNO?



THE NEWS



You know when sports try to get super serious and say “we’re going to punish you if you do X or Y and we mean it” and they actually do what they said they’d do? Like in baseball when Shoeless Joe Jackson actually was banned from playing baseball ever again in a professional league because of the BlackSox Scandal? Or when the NFL will give out suspensions for PED abuse and actually stick to those suspensions? Yeah BJJ doesn’t have that.

Noted PED abuses Mica Galvao and Roberto ‘Cyborg’ Abreu were both popped by USADA for their violations and drug use and prohibited from competing by IBJJF (granted this was in IBJJF events specifically). Well they decided “eh, screw that” and went to compete in BJJ Stars over this past month for a shot at a $40,000 tournament championship.

Kind of defeats the purpose of having USADA involved in the sport now doesn’t it?



Speaking of Mica Galvao in that BJJ Stars event, he reached the quarter-finals and faced off against ADCC gold medalist and fellow PED abuser Kaynan Duarte. During the match, Galvao wound up having his MCL torn when Duarte reaped his knee going for a leg entanglement which resulted in a loud *POP* that could be heard on the broadcast. Duarte was disqualified and Galvao did decide to go on to the semifinals only to lose to Fellipe Andrew probably because he was competing with a knee that had involuntarily exploded.



Next, this was meant to be brought up last month but I decided to sit on it until now. Recently in the USA, the ace of monetization Rener Gracie served as an expert witness in a lawsuit where a jiu jitsu student who was paralyzed after an accident during a sparring session sued their former coach over the incident. Gracie’s role was to serve as an expert witness as he was hired by the plaintiff’s legal team to do so, with reports being he received a hefty sum of money in the hundreds of thousands for his hours of testimony. Allegedly Gracie has donated that money to charity.

As part of his testimony, Gracie broke down the situation and the general need for safety when performing it. He also compared the gym’s protocols to his own Gracie University and gave information on how the defendant’s methods of safety and control were not adequate. The lawsuit ended with the jury awarding the plaintiff $46 million in compensation, though that doesn’t mean it’s just going straight to his pocket.



The final and more baffling bit of news is that the ADCC announced they are now returning to FloSports/FloGrappling for the 2023/2024 ADCC competition season with the World Championships being aired on Flo’s streaming service. This is just a few months after the UFC’s Fight Pass service announced an exclusive deal but that seems to now no longer be the case, likely as a result of the Endeavor purchasing of WWE, and announcing the UFC & WWE will form a new company.This is…lovely and bad. FloSports sucks in terms of its service in general, and that’s not getting into the whole “paying $30/month for streams that have the wrong audio/video feeds” aspect on top of the whole shady “we’re gonna pretend there’s no monthly subscription option only on FloGrappling but offer it on FloRugby etc. to trick people into buying a yearly subscription” that Flo has been doing for years now.

I like the ADCC as a competition, but highly doubt I’m going to put much effort towards watching the 2024 event.



PUTTING SOME ‘PEDs’ IN YOUR PEDAGOGY



Much like last month I’m going to take time away from discussing a specific technique and focus more on educational concepts and how they apply to jiu jitsu.

Again, this is a topic I feel is pretty vital and important for anyone to understand or at least be aware of when it comes to any form of learning. While last time I spoke about curriculum, this time I’m going to focus on pedagogy or how the information is taught. Both curriculum and pedagogy are vital in how well a learner can develop a sense of understanding of the information they’re being shown.

One important thing to know about pedagogy is that it involves much more than “just teaching” the material. A good instructor needs to ensure their method of teaching embodies the aims and purposes of the curriculum.

A common misconception is that a teacher can just “wing it” and teach without much forethought. In reality, the best forms of teaching are when there is a clear purpose or goal for the teacher to attain. Think about the often commented upon “My coach just watched a YouTube video 5 minutes before the class and taught that for the day” incident. There’s not much of a clear purpose or goal for the lesson.

Teaching effectively requires not only the teacher to clearly understand the goal, but for the student to know what the goal for the lesson is. This allows the student to be able to clearly know where the standard for the learnt material is going to be. When your coach is demonstrating the technique fully and explaining what the specific technique accomplishes, this is an example of that.


Memes like this do have some root in actual learning, even if they are sort of cringey and absolutely wrong in practice.


In general there are several forms of pedagogical approaches a coach can use to ensure the material is being learnt.

Collaborative pedagogy: Using a collaborative approach is where the instructor emphasizes group work and cooperative learning. Rather than everyone focusing on just what the coach says or shows for the technique, they allow the students to split up into groups with partners and drill the technique. Then, for example, Partner A notices something Partner B is doing and they work out why its happening and how it can help or hinder the execution of the technique. This is, in my opinion, one of the most common forms of learning in a jiu jitsu environment and is especially seen utilized at open mats. You’re still getting your instructor to provide assistance in the learning, but the problem-solving and collaborative work helps personalize the learning for the individual which in turns helps with retention.

Explicit instruction: This form of instruction involves a clear, direct teaching of a specific skill or skills as well as knowledge. In the context of jiu jitsu, this is typically seen when your instructor breaks down the technique into smaller and more manageable chunks or steps. You’d likely then drill that several times in a row until you felt comfortable understanding the steps of the technique. This is also where the instructor would likely spot flaws in your execution and provide guidance or assistance. Much like collaboration, this is one of the most common forms of learning in jiu jitsu.

Critical pedagogy: This is a form of pedagogy that is rarely, if ever, utilized. Specifically this approach to learning focuses on challenging the power structures and encouraging a student to think critically about social issues related to the topic. So for jiu jitsu it would be more about discussing or learning about the history or culture of the sport and the related issues involved with it. This is actually a pretty useful form of learning as it allows you to relate what you know about jiu jitsu and apply it to more broader issues such as power, privilege and justice.

Place-based pedagogy: When using this method of pedagogy, your instructor is emphasizing connecting your learning to the local environment and community. For jiu jitsu this would likely be seen int he form of again exploring the history and traditions of jiu jitsu in that specific area or country where the gym is located. This isn’t not a very common approach when it comes to jiu jitsu but is still somewhat useful to know about and can be used but is more for a academic or non-bio mechanical understanding.

Caring pedagogy: This final approach, much like its name implies, is one that emphasizes empathy and compassion in the teaching, and emphasizes the emotional and social needs of students. When relating this to jiu jitsu, this would likely be where the gym is created to provide a safe and supportive and caring learning environment. One such place that students would feel comfortable sharing their experiences and concerns with their instructors and fellow students. In this form of pedagogy, a jiu jitsu coach would be using supportive language and positive reinforcement to help students feel valued and respected, and encourage students to develop their own sense of self-worth and confidence through their training. This is pretty common in most gyms, though there are elements of the inverse of this where a more harsh and demeaning approach towards pushing students to do better is employed.

Some Final Thoughts

Now that we’ve explored some pedagogical approaches we should also make mention of some final points about teaching in general.

When teaching, it is vital to understand the importance of validity when teaching. What this means is that there is a need for teachers to be able to reflect on their current pedagogical practices and assess how well their methods are working.

Additionally, when talking about teaching it is also important to note that there is no adequate definition of “quality teaching.” Sure there is some idea or sense of what is or is not good teaching but there is not a set standard. The primary influence on learning is quality teaching, but “quality” may mean something different to different people. Instead its important for a student to develop meaningful experiences when learning, which in turn leads to better retention of the information.

This is only just scratching the surface on the role of pedagogy and how best to utilize it in the context of jiu jitsu but should offer some insight into how you see it used regularly in a class without realizing it or understanding how and why it can be utilized to develop a better learning environment.

Try to think of how your gym’s instruction works and what are the ways the teacher actively passes on their knowledge to you. Which approach do they utilize? Why? What could they do to improve their teaching? These are all questions people should be asking as we try to improve the educational practices in jiu jitsu.

Mekchu fucked around with this message at 02:59 on May 3, 2023

Defenestrategy
Oct 24, 2010

Question: knowing what you know about jits culture would you say that its actually a good thing that critical pedagogy is rarely done in jits. Do you really want most coaches to wax poetic with lovely opinions?

Mekchu
Apr 10, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS

Defenestrategy posted:

Question: knowing what you know about jits culture would you say that its actually a good thing that critical pedagogy is rarely done in jits. Do you really want most coaches to wax poetic with lovely opinions?

i'm about to go to bed so i can't really talk in length/depth on it right now but that's not necessarily all critical pedagogy is. "critical" means to not just blindly accept X or Y as fact and actively analyze what is being taught or said in this context and also why such a thing exists or happens. thus, you wouldn't be waxing lovely opinions (yes i know that would most likely happen in this sort of setting). so, say you're talking about the history of the gracies. why did they have the access to maeda et al to begin with over some other family? what power structures did they take advantage of both knowingly and unknowingly? how is it that only they had the name/branding involved that led to ~gracie jiu jitsu~ and all the stuff they did in rio back in the 1950s or 60s or whenever it was exactly? that's what you'd be critical of in your discussion. this isn't a 'person gives opinions and there's no debate/critical analysis of it' because if that were the case then you're not engaged in a critical analysis of the topic.

can it be abused by insane weirdos? yes, but so can any of the other forms of pedagogy listed

do i think it is still a useful form of teaching even if there are some insane weirdos who try to use it for their own hosed up stuff? yes, because being critical of any form of information you're presented is useful and necessary for a variety of reasons.

the pedagogical practice itself isn't the problem, its the person trying to distort it from what its meant to do to suit their own personal interests.

tldr: personally, i think its useful as a method of teaching in general (outside of jiu jitsu) but its less the culture of jiu jitsu not being adequate for that form of pedagogy, and more so the material/focus of jiu jitsu knowledge being less reliant on that form of teaching than anything. jiu jitsu as a whole rarely allows for critical analysis of itself internally due to group think etc. because most of the time the people who are in charge at gyms are incurious and lack the critical thinking skills with regards to this sort of thing. imo.

Mekchu fucked around with this message at 16:43 on May 2, 2023

Marching Powder
Mar 8, 2008



stop the fucking fight, cornerman, your dude is fucking done and is about to be killed.
hope you don't mind me chiming in about jits pedagogy. it is really interesting, and with all things i think there's value in a broad exploration.

explicit instruction is generally the most efficient way to get the most amount of people to absorb the goal amount of information and perform it to an acceptable standard. the nature of this instruction usually means that with sufficient class size there are going to be people who aren't able to keep up and people who will disengage due to a lack of challenge. if you're teaching a class in this method and just wanted to be the best teacher ever, try and account for this.

collaborative learning would also be something i'd recommend. like the dds getting a group of people who learn and develop in similar ways can theoretically provide massive leaps forward in skill acquisition and competence, but there is an inherent danger of tunnel vision and losing touch with the jits world at large.

critical pedagogy i'd probably liken to the explosion of leglocks. gracie jits thought leg locks were without honour or whatever and then someone went 'hang on, i just want to win' and then a massive revolution began. especially as you begin to develop mastery, you may lose sight of why you do what you do. always try and interrogate and re-interrogate the way you roll.

mostly though, i think the caring pedagogy is the most important. better they rock up to training at all than train in the most efficient way. always look out for your peeps.

Mekchu
Apr 10, 2012

by Jeffrey of YOSPOS
To add to what I said last night, you're also not meant to just take in what your coach says as the gospel truth as that is not being critical of the information either. You, the student, are also meant to be part of that critical analysis of what is being taught. Its a form of conversation so to speak. Which again isn't as common in bjj/sports circles due to incurious people not really being willing or conditioned to do that, as most sports begin from a point of X authority must be listened to no matter what. You see it in baseball, football, etc. with head coaches being in total authoritative control over all aspects of what is being taught.

It isn't just on the teacher's end, but it is up to the teacher to build/foster a learning environment that supports such approaches to learning.

Mekchu fucked around with this message at 23:59 on May 2, 2023

Count Roland
Oct 6, 2013


Can someone help me understand this chart?

FastestGunAlive
Apr 7, 2010

Dancing palm tree.
Would you prefer a video, a roll, or a demonstration to help explain it?

Defenestrategy
Oct 24, 2010

FastestGunAlive posted:

Would you prefer a video, a roll, or a demonstration to help explain it?

Id like an article please.

Jack B Nimble
Dec 25, 2007


Soiled Meat
Two weeks later, you'll remember this percentage of a technique based on how you interacted with it. The worst is reading and watching videos, the best is drilling and teaching.

Count Roland
Oct 6, 2013

Ah, I thought it was retention meaning attendance, not retention of the material taught. Cool, cool.

Though lol at retaining 50% of what I drilled in the past two weeks. I'm lucky to remember what I drilled the previous class.

Defenestrategy
Oct 24, 2010

Jack B Nimble posted:

Two weeks later, you'll remember this percentage of a technique based on how you interacted with it. The worst is reading and watching videos, the best is drilling and teaching.

ah well this is chart can't be right, because I remember nothing of what I teach but I can tell you exactly how Xande Ribero would have screwed up any given move in jiujitsu university.

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Jack B Nimble
Dec 25, 2007


Soiled Meat
I'm just guessing :shrug:

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