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Vengarr posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wymZGgjk-H4 Incredibly interesting from a professional pov, makes me wince the whole no combat layer with body armour though and all I hear is my troop Sgt and sqn SSM giving our CSS orders with no hero sleeves.
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Apr 12, 2023 02:36
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M_Gargantua posted:I still believe LaserPigs take that the Fulda gap scenario was western war planners jerking themselves off and that nothing like it would ever have happened The Fulda scenario was always a "it didn't really matter what we do here, they're a trigger force to activate MAD" kind of thing as far as NATO went
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Apr 12, 2023 02:45
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M_Gargantua posted:I still believe LaserPigs take that the Fulda gap scenario was western war planners jerking themselves off and that nothing like it would ever have happened The Fulda Gap absolutely would have been as far as Russia made it. Because all their tanks would have broken down, see?
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Apr 12, 2023 04:33
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Tunicate posted:According to Lunev 84 of the USSR suitcase nukes went missing at the end of the cold war, fortunately if they have gone this long without changing out the fissile material they should no longer be functional. If none of them has surfaced even in the unusable condition later it does bring up the question if they actually went missing, or when someone who wasn't on the take did the inventory, they found out that there were 84 less than what was paid for. After all, shameless grifting and endless corruption wasn't invented by Putin's regime.
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Apr 12, 2023 06:52
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Comrade Blyatlov posted:The Fulda Gap absolutely would have been as far as Russia made it. It wouldn't have been a complete turkey shoot - even though ATGMs would have demolished a lot of tanks/APCs, the Soviets had a *lot* aimed down that corridor. Doubtful the forces there could have held the pass for more than two or three weeks (at which point everyone would have started running low on munitions). On the other hand, there was no chance the Soviets would have ever even come close to achieving their war plan goals (reaching the Rhine on D+7, the English Channel/Pyrenees by D+14) without liberal use of nukes, which absolutely would have escalated into strategic targeting almost immediately. So the likely outcome would have been: lots of people dying, then millions more dying VERY quickly, and the remaining fighting being done over scraps of food with rocks.
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Apr 12, 2023 07:36
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If you are shocked by the beheading video, don't forget that you can help fighting this by donating money to the right places.
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Apr 12, 2023 10:22
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Sorry what?
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Apr 12, 2023 10:27
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Karate Bastard posted:Sorry what? Vahakyla posted:There’s a new swath of decapitation videos where Russian soldiers (?) are decapitating Ukrainians who are still alive. It's spreading on twitter, blurred but with sound. On autoplay. I'd recommend turning the volume down to preserve your mental wellbeing. Furthermore, russia must be defeated.
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Apr 12, 2023 10:36
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Sorry, wasn't clear. How will my donating money help? And what would right places be?
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Apr 12, 2023 10:42
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Karate Bastard posted:Sorry, wasn't clear. How will my donating money help? And what would right places be? Here's a suggestion https://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3994478 although I'd suggest to stay the hell away from the icrc This official one is fine https://u24.gov.ua/ Idk what the rules here are for supporting individual units, or orgs that collect for drones, etc. maybe we can get a comment on that before posting it. Dein Specht fucked around with this message at 11:20 on Apr 12, 2023 |
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Apr 12, 2023 10:57
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Ah alright, thanks. I thought you were talking about some specific anti-beheading group. This is probably because I'm not very clever.
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Apr 12, 2023 11:16
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Tuna-Fish posted:(A fiber laser can (within reason) produce any precise wavelength you want, and a prism refracts light depending on their wavelength. So you just make a whole lot of smaller lasers and stack them all on top of each other with a prism.) Then you just take 20 THELs and a bigger prism. Boom.
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Apr 12, 2023 11:26
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Dein Specht posted:If you are shocked by the beheading video, don't forget that you can help fighting this by donating money to the right places. who's idiot re-reg are you. I'm also going to use this post as a sidebar plug to remind people you're not doing jack-all by donating to combat operations. If you want to donate in a useful way find a relief fund for those displaced by the war.
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Apr 12, 2023 13:24
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Donations absolutely can help combat operations. I just got back from Kyiv after dropping off 4 pick-up trucks bought with donated funds raised via social media which are as we speak getting painted green and sent to front line units. Just make sure to give you money to local Ukrainian organizations and not large international NGOs. There is a huge lack of everything, especially in territorial defence units, which volunteer organizations play a huge role in alleviating.
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Apr 12, 2023 13:47
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Xakura posted:Yeah that covers jamming, but these are systems meant to cook any drone they see, right? Are you going to run tiny IFF transponders? That's one solution to a problem that has existed in aviation since at least World War I (that's the earliest aviation frat I'm aware of).
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Apr 12, 2023 13:51
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Hundlaser posted:Donations absolutely can help combat operations. I just got back from Kyiv after dropping off 4 pick-up trucks bought with donated funds raised via social media which are as we speak getting painted green and sent to front line units. Just make sure to give you money to local Ukrainian organizations and not large international NGOs. There is a huge lack of everything, especially in territorial defence units, which volunteer organizations play a huge role in alleviating. Donations can help combat operations true, but helping alleviate the misery that refugees are in is probably a better spend of your individual donation money. Most things that would actually help combat operations are beyond the scope of what an individual can afford/be able to obtain. Besides the fact that two sides hell bent on killing each other have never let money or lack thereof stop them from killing each other. VVV this too, if you're a US gov employee you can actually get in poo poo with the US government for donating to foreign orgs. orange juche fucked around with this message at 14:01 on Apr 12, 2023 |
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Apr 12, 2023 13:58
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Hundlaser posted:Just make sure to give you money to local Ukrainian organizations and not large international NGOs. Does not apply if you are a USG employee.
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Apr 12, 2023 13:58
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^^^ fair point, don't get yourself in trouble! Pardon but I beg to differ. Nobody's going to be crowdsourcing F-16s obviously, but many units are lacking basic things like boots, warm uniforms, and hygiene articles, as well as more advanced force multipliers like 4x4s, NVGs, and Mavic drones which are feasible to procure via donations. Whether you feel it is better to alleviate the suffering of refugees, or to improve the combat effectiveness of the UAF is a value judgement each person must make for themselves.
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Apr 12, 2023 14:06
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Hundlaser posted:Donations absolutely can help combat operations. I just got back from Kyiv after dropping off 4 pick-up trucks bought with donated funds raised via social media which are as we speak getting painted green and sent to front line units. Just make sure to give you money to local Ukrainian organizations and not large international NGOs. There is a huge lack of everything, especially in territorial defence units, which volunteer organizations play a huge role in alleviating. Is it true that the further you get east, the worse the equipment gets? Friends over there's told me there's a lack of drones, portable power, starlinks, night vision, demining equipment and so on.
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Apr 12, 2023 14:09
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The most legally safe and dollar for dollar effective way to improve the life of the victims of war via donations is to support displaced people, starving people, etc. $50 of support to feed people in Rohingya or Yemen or displaced people across Europe via NGOs makes a world of difference for kids and families compared to $50 sent to help crowdsource a a vehicle or to potentially violate ITAR with a local unregistered military supply group.
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Apr 12, 2023 14:11
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Dein Specht posted:Is it true that the further you get east, the worse the equipment gets? Friends over there's told me there's a lack of drones, portable power, starlinks, night vision, demining equipment and so on. Absolutely, and this is one of the major problems with the UNHCR, ICRC, et al. They just don't have robust distribution networks in eastern Ukraine in the areas most affected by the war, so supplies wind upp sitting in stockpiles in Lviv and Kyiv... The Ukrainian Red Cross does show up and do good work after Russian cruise missile strikes and such though.
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Apr 12, 2023 14:23
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InAndOutBrennan posted:Then you just take 20 THELs and a bigger prism. Boom. Doesn't work. The wavelength of a chemical laser depends on the properties of the chemicals you use, and you don't have enough freedom to adjust them. The breakthrough is specifically that the wavelength of a fiber laser depends on the dimensions of the fiber, and you can very precisely determine them, letting you produce thousands (... or millions) of small lasers that are all just very slightly different from each other.
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Apr 12, 2023 16:54
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Tuna-Fish posted:Doesn't work. The wavelength of a chemical laser depends on the properties of the chemicals you use, and you don't have enough freedom to adjust them. That's good, because then they can't just adapt their shields to the frequency.
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Apr 12, 2023 17:31
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It's also possible to donate directly to the Ukrainian government, who have set up separate funds for military and civilian use. I'm reasonably sure donating to the military one directly materially contributes to ending the war! https://bank.gov.ua/en/ (NB: I've had it pointed out to me before that if you're an employee of the USA government you might be in hot water for directly sending money to a foreign armed forces). Dein Specht posted:https://twitter.com/Havoc_Six/status/1645807758485118976 Okay, but what's the actual advantage of energy weapons over bullets, when it comes to shooting down drones? Does it actually need to be lasers (unproven on the battlefield) or would something that goes "bang" also do the job, but be more reliable?
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Apr 12, 2023 23:20
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Tuna-Fish posted:Doesn't work. The wavelength of a chemical laser depends on the properties of the chemicals you use, and you don't have enough freedom to adjust them. Then you just take slightly different prisms to jiggle the wavelengths before the big one. (seriously thanks, learned something today)
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Apr 12, 2023 23:35
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Hyperlynx posted:Okay, but what's the actual advantage of energy weapons over bullets, when it comes to shooting down drones? Does it actually need to be lasers (unproven on the battlefield) or would something that goes "bang" also do the job, but be more reliable? You don't need to expend million dollar missiles, or depend on Switzerland to provide you with ammunition. Both are good when your target only costs a few hundred dollars per unit and can be mass-produced or bought off Amazon. Israel's Iron Beam supposedly only costs $2 per interception, which is hard to beat for cost-efficiency (at least for the ammunition). That means you could also potentially intercept things like artillery shells cost-efficiently. You also avoid awkward situations like S-300 missiles missing their target and ending up in Poland.
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Apr 12, 2023 23:46
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Hyperlynx posted:It's also possible to donate directly to the Ukrainian government, who have set up separate funds for military and civilian use. I'm reasonably sure donating to the military one directly materially contributes to ending the war! Seems like it's a set of tradeoffs? - No drop or wind effects and effectively zero flight time seems nice when aiming at small targets high above you, but I guess bullets are less bothered by rain, snow and fog? - No ammunition seems fantastic; just hook it up to power and go. I bet the early versions will go through some (fragile, expensive, hard to make) spare parts, though. - You don't have to worry about the rounds (or worse, grenades) you're firing falling down on civilians - but I'd be a little bit worried about light scatter blinding someone looking at the spectacle, if there's anything shiny in the target? Best case, it's a box you hook up to power and service once a year that can shoot down anything it can see with no supplies.
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Apr 12, 2023 23:47
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Hyperlynx posted:Okay, but what's the actual advantage of energy weapons over bullets, when it comes to shooting down drones? Does it actually need to be lasers (unproven on the battlefield) or would something that goes "bang" also do the job, but be more reliable? If ww-2 style AA Flak guns were paired with modern radar fire control and aiming, they'd do pretty well against drones. They'd also be prone to running out of ammo, and getting re-purposed as AT guns if WW2 itself is any indicator. A THAAD or THEL style laser doesn't care where it's electricity comes from, and the consumables for solid-state lasers are basically a tiny amount of coolant and water/fuel/food for the folks maintaining it. In a lot of cases with the US MIC, it's easier to greenfield from scratch with new technology than it is to break out all the old WW2 pintle-mount M2s and Bofors guns they pulled off battleships and give them radar targeting. If it's gonna be a system made from whole-cloth, why not go with the new technology? Proximity fuzes and radar (helped) win WW2, having a technology advantage is a massive benefit. Plus, it seems to actually work fairly well based on the performance of the tech demonstrators we've seen. That being said, .50s and most other "hit the plane with a projectile" stuff won't work well against drones. A WW2 flak shell aimed by modern fire control may indeed be the solution. Fuzed exploding AA munitions that can be fired by pvt Snuffy without much effort. Basically what ATGMs have become compared to dedicated anti-tank field guns carted around by infantry. Using $4000 worth of AA shells instead of $1m worth of ballistic missile interceptor to take down a consumer Mavic drone would be a huge win. Same for all the MANPADS, using them on drones is a waste, if they can even hit them. We don't have many radar-guided AA cannons these days, but we DO have a bunch of lasers that can do the same thing for $2000 worth of fuel to provide electricity. So long as it actually works, technology is a hell of a thing. (I am very much theory crafting and know almost nothing outside of wikipedia articles about all that^)
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Apr 13, 2023 00:18
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Hyperlynx posted:It's also possible to donate directly to the Ukrainian government, who have set up separate funds for military and civilian use. I'm reasonably sure donating to the military one directly materially contributes to ending the war! All the stuff people have already posted, plus: zero time-of-flight.
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Apr 13, 2023 00:31
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Fair enough! (All I know is games, which that all matches up with. After all, Wolf Clan won their objectives at the Battle of Tukayyid because they mostly used laser weapons, while the other clans ran low on ammunition for their guns) 
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Apr 13, 2023 00:35
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Imagine that wargames general with lasers
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Apr 13, 2023 01:01
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Tiny posted:If ww-2 style AA Flak guns were paired with modern radar fire control and aiming, they'd do pretty well against drones. They'd also be prone to running out of ammo, and getting re-purposed as AT guns if WW2 itself is any indicator. I could also see a big benefit being the fact you can use it repeatedly with out "expending" the system. Not so much from a cost factor, but a purely electronics/supply chain factor. If you can "resupply" a laser/directed energy system with more power, you only need to worry about fuel, which any functioning military should have supply lines which cover it. Theoretically, it could also be tied into prime power if the power lines were up and running at that location. Firing a missile, or fused 12.7mm - 40mm shells, requires resupply of that ammunition along with the ripple effects of the supply chain. It's not just a matter of getting a new missile, sure early on when there are stockpiles it basically is, but munitions need to be replaced. That requires raw material, parts, labor hours, and shipping it all from the factories in a safe location, to theater ammunition supply point, then onto the end user. Once those munitions are expended, that's it, there's no reusing that shot, it's in a million pieces. A laser or DE weapon would maybe need some maintenance, but unless it's parts that need to be replaced after every dozen shots, the supply requirements are much much simpler. Hell, probably could throw that stuff in a smallish vehicle to drive it to where it's needed versus a more complex supply chain. Kinda the difference of driving a few ammo cans from one spot versus a 3 meter long missile. But much like you, I am just theory crafting.
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Apr 13, 2023 01:48
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Hyperlynx posted:Fair enough! Clan Wolf won because they were the Developer Designated Favorite Faction (commonly known as Ultramarine Complex).
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Apr 13, 2023 01:54
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All this talk about fancy weapons to shoot down drones and all I'm hearing is "load can".
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Apr 13, 2023 02:09
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not caring here posted:All this talk about fancy weapons to shoot down drones and all I'm hearing is "load can". Better pass out the tin helmets while you're at it.
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Apr 13, 2023 02:17
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The main thing I was wondering about was whether the lasers would be reliable enough, being new technology. Tiny's post was interesting, because if the prospective system is going to be new technology either way then that's not really a drawback. I mean sure, if it works as it's supposed to then it seems pretty clearly the better option.
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Apr 13, 2023 02:25
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Can anyone theorize how a microwave weapon could take out an incoming shell? Presumably it can't really impact the momentum? Could it somehow cook the fuse and/or HE payload in a way that makes it inert?
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Apr 13, 2023 02:37
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BeastOfExmoor posted:Can anyone theorize how a microwave weapon could take out an incoming shell? Presumably it can't really impact the momentum? Could it somehow cook the fuse and/or HE payload in a way that makes it inert? Heat.
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Apr 13, 2023 02:44
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BeastOfExmoor posted:Can anyone theorize how a microwave weapon could take out an incoming shell? Presumably it can't really impact the momentum? Could it somehow cook the fuse and/or HE payload in a way that makes it inert? Enough of it and anything will melt.
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Apr 13, 2023 02:52
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https://www.washingtonpost.com/national-security/2023/04/12/discord-leaked-documents/ Someone is going to prison for a long fuckin time.
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Apr 13, 2023 03:09
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