|
Wibla posted:poo poo like this is souring me on the entire TrueNAS ecosystem. Sure, Scale is still under heavy development and isn't really to be considered as prod ready, but seriously? I agree the response in the linked issue seemed really weird, but this is not the "TrueNAS ecosystem". Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure this is a third party project with no relation to the TrueNAS developers. Seems like they do adopt the FreeNAS forums culture of being assholes, however.
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2023 22:20
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 09:03 |
|
|
Keito posted:I agree the response in the linked issue seemed really weird, but this is not the "TrueNAS ecosystem". Correct me if I'm wrong but I'm pretty sure this is a third party project with no relation to the TrueNAS developers. Seems like they do adopt the FreeNAS forums culture of being assholes, however.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2023 22:23
|
|
|
It's not part of iX, no, but there's all of like 10 official apps so if you want to do pretty much anything besides Plex or PiHole you're going to be using truecharts, and then you're stuck with it being run by these assholes.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2023 22:30
|
|
|
power crystals posted:It's not part of iX, no, but there's all of like 10 official apps so if you want to do pretty much anything besides Plex or PiHole you're going to be using truecharts, and then you're stuck with it being run by these assholes. You could just use a jail and install the package yourself. It's slightly less convenient than clicking a button though.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2023 22:34
|
|
|
power crystals posted:It's not part of iX, no, but there's all of like 10 official apps so if you want to do pretty much anything besides Plex or PiHole you're going to be using truecharts, and then you're stuck with it being run by these assholes. If you care about things being reliable the best thing is to use your nas as a nas and have another box for your compute needs. This has proven to be a reliable method with TrueNAS for me over the scale of a decade.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2023 22:40
|
|
|
You could also run whatever OS you want in a VM on top of truenas. It is a little more configuration effort than a second box because you have to set up a network bridge, but after that it'll be the same.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2023 23:06
|
|
|
VostokProgram posted:You could also run whatever OS you want in a VM on top of truenas. It is a little more configuration effort than a second box because you have to set up a network bridge, but after that it'll be the same. How would one set up a network bridge?
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2023 23:12
|
|
|
Just drop to terminal, disable k3s, enable Docker and then install Portainer. Updating might be a pain in the rear end, since you have to remember backing up and restoring docker.json across the update, then re-enabling Docker itself again. But that's still less drama than this TrueCharts poo poo. I just hope the TrueNAS devs aren't being assholes and set up unnecessary roadblocks with their Cobia release end of the year. They're already doing funny business like removing the exec flag from the apt tools and such.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2023 23:22
|
|
|
withoutclass posted:You could just use a jail and install the package yourself. It's slightly less convenient than clicking a button though. No jails on scale; which is debian based. I’ve moved all my compute to my router which doubles as a docker host, because goddamn does scales implementation of kubernetes suck.
|
|
#
?
Apr 12, 2023 23:53
|
|
|
Keito posted:Seems like they do adopt the FreeNAS forums culture of being assholes, however. The biggest reason that I will gladly continue to run using ZFS on Ubuntu and do everything via CLI first. The mentality that a lot of those projects share is loving toxic. Sad thing is they're all traceable back to ye olde m0n0wall and that had none of this bullshit going on.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 00:24
|
|
|
IMO, unless you **really** need multinode setups and HA (or just want to gently caress around with that stuff) you can and should just use docker or podman. I've personally been transitioning my container workloads off of a debian based OMV server with docker to a lighter and smaller coreos install which uses podman instead.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 00:31
|
|
|
BlankSystemDaemon posted:A used X10SDV-4C+-TLN4F would be a good board that should last a long time. This board looks awesome but looking on Ebay they are like 700+ each which is wildly out of budget. Is there a different place I should be looking because it otherwise checks all the boxes.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 01:35
|
|
|
I love those Xeon Ds but they always just were a bit too spendy for me, sigh.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 01:43
|
|
|
IOwnCalculus posted:The biggest reason that I will gladly continue to run using ZFS on Ubuntu and do everything via CLI first. The mentality that a lot of those projects share is loving toxic. I'm in the same boat reading what everyone is saying here. An Ubuntu server with zfs and docker ended up too easy.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 02:04
|
|
|
power crystals posted:What the hell is TrueCharts doing? "You need to reinstall all your apps now, because reasons. We will not explain why unless you join our support discord, maybe. Locked." TrueSharts
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 04:46
|
|
|
TrueCharts is cool but theres questionable decisions everywhere and xisystems has stepped back from unofficially supporting that project as a result. Like the PiHole app they supply is heavily modified to basically do reverse proxy stuff only and you really can't do much else with it without a lot of work and having the TrueCharts people scream "UNSUPPORTED" and refuse to help. It's pretty much a gamble if whatever app you're looking at is going to function the same way the original developer intended vs what the truecharts people want. I guess too they were caught modifying the license the original developers would use and just saying "oh yeah its BSD license its nbd" or somethin like that. They also make it extremely difficult to find out who originally made a given app as well. It's all v weird to me.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 04:57
|
|
|
I bought a 4 disk USB hard drive DAS thing. I formatted one of the drives as letter G: in Windows. Set some programs to point there. Then I plug in my phone, disconnect another USB hard drive, take my phone, etc etc, normal computer activity. I might have restarted the computer too. Now that USB DAS hard drive is saying it is drive J: and the connections I linked to it are broken. How do I get it to stop changing letters?
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 05:43
|
|
|
Korean Boomhauer posted:TrueCharts is cool but theres questionable decisions everywhere and xisystems has stepped back from unofficially supporting that project as a result. Like the PiHole app they supply is heavily modified to basically do reverse proxy stuff only and you really can't do much else with it without a lot of work and having the TrueCharts people scream "UNSUPPORTED" and refuse to help. It's pretty much a gamble if whatever app you're looking at is going to function the same way the original developer intended vs what the truecharts people want. I guess too they were caught modifying the license the original developers would use and just saying "oh yeah its BSD license its nbd" or somethin like that. They also make it extremely difficult to find out who originally made a given app as well. It's all v weird to me. I know nothing of TrueNAS or TrueCharts but none of that makes TrueCharts seem cool.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 08:13
|
|
|
IOwnCalculus posted:The biggest reason that I will gladly continue to run using ZFS on Ubuntu and do everything via CLI first. The mentality that a lot of those projects share is loving toxic. Setting a jail up on TrueNAS, according to the documentation, seems to involve a heck of a lot of work. On FreeBSD 14-CURRENT, I add a file in /etc/jail.conf.d/ with: pre:jailname {
}
Then I clone a snapshot, which was made of the base system from the last update, into a new dataset, and start the jail. KKKLIP ART posted:This board looks awesome but looking on Ebay they are like 700+ each which is wildly out of budget. Is there a different place I should be looking because it otherwise checks all the boxes. $700+ does seem expensive, considering that it can be had for ~$880 new (with VAT). BlankSystemDaemon fucked around with this message at 12:03 on Apr 13, 2023 |
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 11:59
|
|
|
Fozzy The Bear posted:I bought a 4 disk USB hard drive DAS thing. I formatted one of the drives as letter G: in Windows. Set some programs to point there. You can go to Disk Management, right-click a drive and "Change Drive Letter...". The problem probably is that G: was the first free drive letter when you plugged it in. If you unplug it and plug something else it will also get G:. The solution is to change that drive to some higher letter, M:, T:, X:, whatever, then it will keep using that letter and no other drive will use it unless you plug in whole lot of USB sticks.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 13:00
|
|
|
Korean Boomhauer posted:TrueSharts  I don't want to do the VM thing because I have an existing VM running on that box and sometimes it just... stops, for a few minutes. VNC dies with it. Then it randomly comes back a few minutes later. What happened? Who knows. But I sure don't want to rely on that for everything else too. And yes, I did pick the app method because it was "clicking a button" because TrueNAS' storage support is genuinely great but boy TrueCharts is just a tire fire and is the epitome of all the worst of open source projects. At least the last time they made a random breaking change for unexplained reasons I switched everything to host storage so reinstalling should be easy, I just don't want to have to. If I was doing it over today, the "best" option would I guess be to run ESXi or whatever other hypervisor on the hardware itself and then pass the appropriate devices through to a TrueNAS VM running side by side with an "a bunch of random apps" VM, but that's also incredibly more complicated than I want to do for "a bunch of harddrives and also some basic applications". poo poo sucks.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 14:46
|
|
|
Isn't K3s basically a VM anyway?
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 15:35
|
|
|
Matt Zerella posted:Isn't K3s basically a VM anyway? EDIT: He says he thinks he started using the term "high value but lovely virtualization" around 2002-2003. BlankSystemDaemon fucked around with this message at 16:34 on Apr 13, 2023 |
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 15:48
|
|
|
Saukkis posted:You can go to Disk Management, right-click a drive and "Change Drive Letter...". Thank you, I guess that's the price I pay vs using a real NAS
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 16:23
|
|
|
Matt Zerella posted:Isn't K3s basically a VM anyway? Its an orchestration scheme for single or multinode setups that uses an integrated lightweight database rather than the resource intensive etcd one for k8. It can use either containerd or docker as its container runtime (though docker is in the process of being depreciated)
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 16:30
|
|
|
K3S is Kubernetes compiled into a single, fat, then slimmed down binary basically and intended originally for use with Rancher, a K8S distribution essentially. It's pretty solid for running a single node K8S machine, which is what I'm trying to do professionally instead of using options like Nomad or systemd's runc daemon support. Docker has been deprecated in K8S for a year or two now as a supported container runtime. crio, containerd, etc. are all what people used in prod in general anyway. priznat posted:I love those Xeon Ds but they always just were a bit too spendy for me, sigh. But really now that I've come across 512 GB of PC4 RDIMMs and like 30 TB of older SSDs for free I'm trying to figure out how I can make good use of it for a combination storage and compute server now. Pretty sure that even for a 120 TB+ ZFS server I probably don't have much use for more than 256 GB of RAM so that leaves another 256GB of RAM for either two pizza boxes or a decent EPYC machine (intending on doing some media file analysis and research hobby projects with GPUs).
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 17:14
|
|
|
Or you can finally build a machine where it's definitely safe to turn on ZFS dedup.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 17:23
|
|
|
necrobobsledder posted:K3S is Kubernetes compiled into a single, fat, then slimmed down binary basically and intended originally for use with Rancher, a K8S distribution essentially. It's pretty solid for running a single node K8S machine, which is what I'm trying to do professionally instead of using options like Nomad or systemd's runc daemon support. Are the xeonD 1500s plentiful on ebay now? I should have a look, they'd make a great nas build. I have an 8700k I am moving to but a deal on an older -D would be awesome. I hadn't even looked at getting a used/older one. Just when they were newish I looked at the new prices and was always like nahhh
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 17:33
|
|
|
priznat posted:Are the xeonD 1500s plentiful on ebay now? I should have a look, they'd make a great nas build. I have an 8700k I am moving to but a deal on an older -D would be awesome. I hadn't even looked at getting a used/older one. Just when they were newish I looked at the new prices and was always like nahhh edit: Computer viking posted:Or you can finally build a machine where it's definitely safe to turn on ZFS dedup. necrobobsledder fucked around with this message at 17:59 on Apr 13, 2023 |
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 17:52
|
|
|
Computer viking posted:Or you can finally build a machine where it's definitely safe to turn on ZFS dedup.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 18:07
|
|
|
You're also committing to forever use that pool on machines that have that much RAM. What if you're poorer in the future
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 18:08
|
|
|
BlankSystemDaemon posted:Until the 1000x speedup gets implemented by some company that needs it, I'm not sure any workload justifies dedup, because it necessitates SHA512 checksums which would need to be offloaded to make them fast enough.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 18:21
|
|
|
Can't you get pcie QAT accelerators?
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 18:25
|
|
|
Looks like it but it may be vendor locked https://www.ebay.com/itm/384467704084
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 18:59
|
|
|
necrobobsledder posted:QAT supports SHA512 and I believe all versions of ZFS can offload to QAT now. Thing is that would be Intel-only and I'm more interested in EPYC for the lower $ / core / watt / performance given I'm going to be doing a lot of AV1 and HEVC transcoding to archival-ish quality levels. Zen 3 (and Zen 1 + 2, though they should be avoided for other reasons) support SHA256 operations, which I believe OpenZFS should be capable of taking advantage of. necrobobsledder posted:Looks like it but it may be vendor locked https://www.ebay.com/itm/384467704084 At least in FreeBSD, this is done via qat(4) which integrates with crypto(9) - and if I'm reading the code right it should be taking advantage of that? BlankSystemDaemon fucked around with this message at 19:49 on Apr 13, 2023 |
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 19:46
|
|
|
Well this is certainly confusingquote:/* Is it possible that ZFS has its own statically linked library for SHA256? Kind of confused here. It makes a huge difference obviously if we'd have to rely upon the ZFS devs to support QAT or other crypto accelerators rather than the routines supplied by other system-wide libraries.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 20:10
|
|
|
necrobobsledder posted:Well this is certainly confusing OpenCrypto exists to make it so that there's a standard KPI that can be used to develop against, and to avoid code-reuse. I thought Linux was intending to support it, but apparently not? Unfortunately, I'm having difficulty determining if it's supposed to work based on the code, and it might not be simple to find someone with the daughterboard to test on. More annoyingly, it looks like the SHA extensions in Intel and AMD processors are only supporting SHA256 according to the instruction table I linked earlier - which lines up with the dmesg from one of my systems.
|
|
#
?
Apr 13, 2023 20:32
|
|
|
Looking at something like this for an Unraid setup. Primary uses will be NAS/jellyfin server & host for dog/nanny cam, eventually may add some home energy monitoring stuff etc. CPU AMD Ryzen 5 5600G 3.9 GHz 6-Core Processor (or Intel equivalent, what's better for me?) Motherboard ASRock B550M-ITX/ac Mini ITX AM4 Motherboard Memory Patriot Viper 4 Blackout 64 GB (2 x 32 GB) DDR4-3600 CL18 Memory Storage 4x Seagate 5 TB 2.5" 5400 RPM External HDD (from Costco, shucked) Storage MSI SPATIUM M470 1 TB M.2-2280 PCIe 4.0 X4 NVME Solid State Drive Case Fractal Design Ridge Mini ITX Tower Case (case needs to be small enough to fit in available living room space and pretty enough to be acceptable to wife) Power Supply be quiet! SFX L Power 500 W 80+ Gold Certified Fully Modular SFX Power Supply I have two concerns that I hope this thread can help me with: 1) is this hardware sufficient for streaming/transcoding 4k video? 2) how low can I get idle power consumption? From what I can tell the answer to #1 is likely yes. As for #2, pcpartpicker says this kind of setup is going to pull ~250W and that is just way too much for something I want to leave running 24/7. I've read that some significant power savings can be had by selecting 2.5" HDDs, which could require shucking (I don't mind). Is it possible to build a NAS/home server with hardware beefy enough to transcode 4k but which also sips power when idle? I'd love to be around 25W at idle, could live with 50W, but 100W+ is a dealbreaker considering the criminal rates SDGE charges these days. (1W running 24/7/365 is about $5 per year) Any major cost saving opportunities I'm missing here? bawfuls fucked around with this message at 18:13 on Apr 14, 2023 |
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2023 17:27
|
|
|
1. The easy way to save power when transcoding 4k is to use hardware transcoding options such as in the newer Intel CPUs like Alder Lake and Raptor Lake. The i3-12100T is an excellent option there and I'm not 100% sure how good AMD's transcoding is but I tend to use AMD when I'm not going to use hardware encoding such as for encoding experiments. 2. You can get 5400 RPM drives to idle or even stop when using unRAID that won't be really possible with a ZFS RAIDZ setup which should save a lot of power in theory depending upon usage patterns. To help ensure lowest power usage you'll want to have a PSU rated somewhere around maybe 40% higher than the expected target load and to pay a little more for at least gold or platinum rated PSUs (there's no point in the craziness for titanium here IMO). For example, if you're targeting 100w usage when transcoding + reading from drives you should be somewhere near 150w. Thing is, there's not exactly a lot of PSUs rated that low with gold / platinum certs. Each fan uses some power as well, so you'll want to have larger fans with higher CFM spec and higher static pressure as well to keep air moving across the drives (this is likely going to result in louder fans, let's be honest). For reference, I've got a i3-4130 CPU with 2x8GB of UDIMMs along with 16 various SATA drives in a DAS + 8 more local running about 280w across a 800w Supermicro 1U PSU and a 400w ATX PSU. This is going to be lower once I properly integrate everything together into the same chassis with the i5-12400 that I undervolt and power limit and get rid of 8 of the drives. If power usage is a real big deal, I'd spend extra on higher density drives (16TB+ currently), reduce the number of drives to maybe 6, use unRAID, use the lightest feature motherboard possible, drop to the lowest PSU capacity reasonable (probably going to be around a 300w if you don't use weird micro and pico PSU oddballs), and tune something like an i3-12100T or maybe even the Comet Lake i3 to even lower. That should get you down to probably less than 35w during most media use cases. I saw someone on a German forum that got their i3 down to maybe 10w idle including their motherboard but I think they did some crazy mods to make it so low.
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2023 18:05
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 28, 2024 09:03 |
|
|
If you're me: Mac Studio/Mini connected to a Thunderbolt enclosure, running OpenZFS. The compute part will idle at 7-13W and it can easily transcode many 4K streams simultaneously. Intel/AMD power consumption just looks ridiculous these days.
|
|
#
?
Apr 14, 2023 18:10
|
|
